Eric Radford and Vanessa James to compete in pairs together for Canada

[hanca]

Did Eric on instagram imply that they will keep competing? Sounds like they may keep training for 1 more year to 2023. Maybe even 2026 if the Canadian pairs scene is so weak. They really have no competition.

There's really no show skating left in North America except for a small handful of shows on SOI (assuming they're even invited....currently only KMT/MM are invited as top pairs team). Competing in ISU competitions is best way to make money.

Only if you medal.

 

[hanca]

Despite my snark, I actually like J&R and think they look good together. If they're going to continue next year, they should embrace their story as Black woman skating with an out gay man and skate to Queen Latifah's "Walk the Dinosaur"

I also liked how they look on the ice together. Aesthetically very pleasing. I just wish they skated better.

 

[MacMadame]

Oh, good Lord... can the Jamie Sale discussion stay in the Trash Can? She is completely irrelevant to the current Canadian Pairs discussion.

Unless she also decides to stage a comeback!

I can't imagine that Eric's back holds out for four more years. And since he's already got a world title and an Oly bronze, why push it?

The original goal was to skate in shows. Maybe they can do something over the summer to make money and then see if they want to try again to compete closer to the Fall.

 

[Carolla5501]

I was really disappointed. I expected this pair to be much better than they are. I don’t know if it was Covid, age, what, but if you look at the individuals expect more from the combination. oh well

 

[Yazmeen]

I was really disappointed. I expected this pair to be much better than they are. I don’t know if it was Covid, age, what, but if you look at the individuals expect more from the combination. oh well

I felt the same way - they just didn't appear to gel together well at all.

 

[Dr.TylerPhD]

I was really disappointed. I expected this pair to be much better than they are. I don’t know if it was Covid, age, what, but if you look at the individuals expect more from the combination. oh well

Yes, it's a strange situation where you might even argue he's the best male pairs skater in Canada, and she's now the best female pairs skater in Canada, but they somehow become worse when placed together. When the announcement first happened, I think people thought they would be competing for medals at best, middle of the pack, at worst. Instead, they are outside of the top ten which is worse than probably many expected.

Sadly, they also finished fairly close to MT&M, so it was probably best to send them, but there is now a sense seeing the results that it was ultimately a selfish opportunity to get another Olympic experience. How would they even be announced at shows considering they have absolutely zero titles?

 

[Former Lurve Goddess]

Yes, it's a strange situation where you might even argue he's the best male pairs skater in Canada, and she's now the best female pairs skater in Canada, but they somehow become worse when placed together. When the announcement first happened, I think people thought they would be competing for medals at best, middle of the pack, at worst. Instead, they are outside of the top ten which is worse than probably many expected.

Sadly, they also finished fairly close to MT&M, so it was probably best to send them, but there is now a sense seeing the results that it was ultimately a selfish opportunity to get another Olympic experience. How would they even be announced at shows considering they have absolutely zero titles?

As "Canadian Olympians" which sounds pretty good to general audiences.

 

[soogar]

I’m not really sure why they need titles together since they both have titles and recognition. They can be announced and Radford Olympic medalist and James world medalist. Elena Bechke said that they hadn’t been together long enough to gel as a couple. They’ve only been together for a year. They are a beautiful pair and it’s not unique that pairs skaters and ice dancers switch partners. Enbert was skating with Medvedeva, Usova skated with Platov and others switched as well.

 

[MacMadame]

As "Canadian Olympians" which sounds pretty good to general audiences.

Or with their separate titles as the announcers did at the Olympics.

 

[Rhumba d’Amour]

As "Canadian Olympians" which sounds pretty good to general audiences.

“Canadian Olympians” who might—depending on how the Valieva situation shakes out—end up with an Olympic bronze medal in the Team Event.

 

[hanca]

I was really disappointed. I expected this pair to be much better than they are. I don’t know if it was Covid, age, what, but if you look at the individuals expect more from the combination. oh well

So did I. In fact, I was tempted to post here asking for opinions about why they are not better. And it would be a question meant seriously, because with their past I did expect better. (But then I decided not to post it because certain posters would bite my head off!)

 

[Lemonade20]

Having the right partner is more than just talent. They need chemistry as well, and I think that's what is lacking between R/J. They seem so disconnected from each other. Imagine if Moir & Virtue came back with new partners!

 

[tony]

The jump elements aren't the big problem. It's the constant missing of level 4 (or often even level 3) with just about every other element. The programs are set up in a way to be slow, to not have to do the elements specifically to a strong beat of the music/be choreographically exactly in time, and there isn't much choreography anyways. Yeah, they need more time to gel but they also don't need to lose levels every single time out when the program really is just going from element to element.

Eric's been surprisingly sturdy with his SBS jumps, but we can all see that those lifts have become more difficult for him.

 

[hanca]

Having the right partner is more than just talent. They need chemistry as well, and I think that's what is lacking between R/J. They seem so disconnected from each other. Imagine if Moir & Virtue came back with new partners!

I didn’t have a problem with their chemistry. It is not their chemistry (or lack of it) that gives them low scores.

 

[kwanfan1818]

If they don't have good lines, speed, unison, excellently skated elements, and high levels, why would they be doing any better than they are doing now, without the distractions of chemistry, drama, one partner being so compelling that they mask the weakness of the other?

 

[soogar]

They don't need ultra difficult elements to be an appealing show team.

 

[hanca]

If they don't have good lines, speed, unison, excellently skated elements, and high levels, why would they be doing any better than they are doing now, without the distractions of chemistry, drama, one partner being so compelling that they mask the weakness of the other?

I am not saying that they should be marked better for what they are doing. I am saying that they should be doing better - their skating should be better. I am not claiming that they have been robbed, I am just surprised thatbtwo such a high level skaters did not managed to gel faster to produce better skating.

 

[PRlady]

I am not saying that they should be marked better for what they are doing. I am saying that they should be doing better - their skating should be better. I am not claiming that they have been robbed, I am just surprised thatbtwo such a high level skaters did not managed to gel faster to produce better skating.

I loved Vanessa but she was really flukey before moving to Florida. With the Sounds of Silence program they took a giant leap forward. It might be too late for another transformation but then look what happened to Ryuichi.

 

[Rafter]

I’m not sure Radford at his more advanced age has the cardiovascular capability to do a 4 minute program at high speed with tons of transitions etc. Maybe he needs to call Eteri and the creepy Russian doping doctor.

 

[miffy]

It’s normal to take time to gel and gain consistency in pairs. There are exceptions like S/M and V/T but they didn’t have a break from competing. They also both teamed up at the start of an Olympic cycle, not right at the end.

There’s a big difference between show lifts and elements and level 4 lifts and elements and we can see they struggled to get level 4s consistently. I’d like to see if a full season (hopefully without illness) would make a difference, but of course we might not get that opportunity.

I think it’s been great to see Vanessa back anyway, and I think Eric looks way hotter than he used to despite the dull costumes

 

[Frau Muller]

I’m not sure Radford at his more advanced age has the cardiovascular capability to do a 4 minute program at high speed with tons of transitions etc. Maybe he needs to call Eteri and the creepy Russian doping doctor.

LOL, “Creepy” has no shame! I was just rewatching the Beijing pairs finals and noticed that he was in the front-Center of the audience cheering his team, waving the ROC flag, etc. He was practically the Keegan of ROC, minus the huge flag. This dude is not hiding.

Back to thread topic:
I’ll be pleasantly surprised if J/R continue past this upcoming Worlds.

 

[kwanfan1818]

It was certainly true that with their prior partners they were evenly matched results-, experience-, and ability-wise, and then add in personal sympatico plus deciding to to compete after they worked with each other, but I'm still not sure why the expectations were that high for this season, and certainly not once they debuted. He's not 100% physically, and it's rare for a Pairs man to compete at his age. James was never overly refined, but not enough to be an interesting contrast to him like Duhamel was, and he looks sloppier to me. If they weren't going to bring charisma, chemistry, and maturity -- the things that Battle of Blades is known for, since that's pretty much all they have to work with with their hockey partners, at least in the beginning -- then they'd need to bring something crisp, new, and/or dynamic to the table, even if they fell all over the place trying. Which they didn't. His taste lies firmly in line with the music he writes, so I'm not at all surprised that their programs were snooze-worthy.

For me, they met expectations, once it was clear Walsh/Michaud were not near (and couldn't be in) peak condition at the beginning of the season: they made it to the Olympics. If W/M had been well and had been able to come out fighting and building on Worlds 2021, I wouldn't have expected J/R to have been at Beijing.

 

[Former Lurve Goddess]

It was certainly true that with their prior partners they were evenly matched results-, experience-, and ability-wise, and then add in personal sympatico plus deciding to to compete after they worked with each other, but I'm still not sure why the expectations were that high for this season, and certainly not once they debuted. He's not 100% physically, and it's rare for a Pairs man to compete at his age. James was never overly refined, but not enough to be an interesting contrast to him like Duhamel was, and he looks sloppier to me. If they weren't going to bring charisma, chemistry, and maturity -- the things that Battle of Blades is known for, since that's pretty much all they have to work with with their hockey partners, at least in the beginning -- then they'd need to bring something crisp, new, and/or dynamic to the table, even if they fell all over the place trying. Which they didn't. His taste lies firmly in line with the music he writes, so I'm not at all surprised that their programs were snooze-worthy.

For me, they met expectations, once it was clear Walsh/Michaud were not near (and couldn't be in) peak condition at the beginning of the season: they made it to the Olympics. If W/M had been well and had been able to come out fighting and building on Worlds 2021, I wouldn't have expected J/R to have been at Beijing.

Plus Julie Marcotte has bad taste in music and insists on creating bland heteronormative pairs programs.

 

[Coco]

Seriously, I think her styling did them no favors. I wonder how many Canadian skaters are going to stay competitive through the Montreal worlds in 2 years? I could see a lot of them staying for that, or at least trying to.

 

[Xela M]

Music was very dull, but the best thing about their performance was Vanessa's dress. It was very pretty

 

[hanca]

I’m not sure Radford at his more advanced age has the cardiovascular capability to do a 4 minute program at high speed with tons of transitions etc. Maybe he needs to call Eteri and the creepy Russian doping doctor.

Zhang was older, Zoe Jones too. Obviously that doesn’t mean that Radford has to be like them, but it is not impossible.

 

[antmanb]

It’s normal to take time to gel and gain consistency in pairs. There are exceptions like S/M and V/T but they didn’t have a break from competing. They also both teamed up at the start of an Olympic cycle, not right at the end.

There’s a big difference between show lifts and elements and level 4 lifts and elements and we can see they struggled to get level 4s consistently. I’d like to see if a full season (hopefully without illness) would make a difference, but of course we might not get that opportunity.

I think it’s been great to see Vanessa back anyway, and I think Eric looks way hotter than he used to despite the dull costumes

I was going to say exactly the same thing - pairs taking three seasons to gel as a partnership is generally the norm. Savchenko/Massot are definitely not the norm and watching back four years later with none of the emotion you can see in the programmes that he is still the weaker skater and he never quite fixed his posture.

James/Radford have had a pretty good outing as a pair for their first season. They are lucky that they got the triple twist so quickly and easily as that is usually the element that takes time. I think Eric's skills are the ones that are taking longer to come back. His footwork in some of the lifts was scarier than Marinaro's and he doesn't seem to have the same smoothness and flow to his basic skating....that or maybe he appeared to be better than he was with Duhamel out there with him on the ice

 

[Xela M]

I was going to say exactly the same thing - pairs taking three seasons to gel as a partnership is generally the norm. Savchenko/Massot are definitely not the norm and watching back four years later with none of the emotion you can see in the programmes that he is still the weaker skater and he never quite fixed his posture.

James/Radford have had a pretty good outing as a pair for their first season. They are lucky that they got the triple twist so quickly and easily as that is usually the element that takes time. I think Eric's skills are the ones that are taking longer to come back. His footwork in some of the lifts was scarier than Marinaro's and he doesn't seem to have the same smoothness and flow to his basic skating....that or maybe he appeared to be better than he was with Duhamel out there with him on the ice

Yes their twist was one of their better elements. Maybe better than he had with Meagan? Still nowhere near the spectacular ones that Savchenko/Massot or Volodozhar/Trankov got straight from the get go. But at least it's not awful like the one KMT/Marinaro have.

It's their extremely slow skating, the very awkward ugly lifts and her jumping that were hard to watch

 

[hanca]

I was going to say exactly the same thing - pairs taking three seasons to gel as a partnership is generally the norm. Savchenko/Massot are definitely not the norm and watching back four years later with none of the emotion you can see in the programmes that he is still the weaker skater and he never quite fixed his posture.

I am curious what are you basing that estimate on? Volosozhar/Trankov did not need three years, neither did Savchenko/Massot. And if we look at Antipova/Maisuradze, within two years Maisuradze and the coach turned a junior singles girl with no international competitive experience into a senior pairs girl with whom he placed eight at worlds. So considering that Antipova was starting a completely new discipline, plus being junior, plus having no competitive experience and yet within two years they were eight at worlds, then I would expect two times world champion and Olympic bronze medalist partnering with a world bronze medalist to gel faster and produce better results after a year. 12th is just unexpectedly low result for me.

 

[Xela M]

For Volosozhar and Trankov - Russia took the best skaters from each of the two pairs teams and teamed them up to create a brilliant team. Maybe Vanessa and Eric were the weaker ones in their respective teams