Canadian Pairs 2019/2020 Season News and Updates

Andora

Skating season ends as baseball season begins
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11,265
I completely understand why people aren't wowed by Lubov and Charlie. I agree with dissension over reusing a jazzy SP dress for another jazzy SP - I think that can be distracting. Charlie looked a mess, nothing they did really stood out, etc. etc. It's hard to compare their first outing to I&M's first, though. Moscovitch was just SO improved skating with Ilyushechkina, and many fans were just excited to see her on the ice again. Expectations are massively different this time. Even some of the biggest issues I have, such as the lift, etc., I see potential still. When Blilodeau lifted Seguin, the big complaint was lack of stretch, dynamism, "oomph." That's already not a problem with I&B - he just has to figure out how to overcome being compared to a phenomenal lifter in Dylan.

I rarely like pairs in their first year unless they have something really memorable or great programs, like Duhamel & Radford or Ilyushechkina & Moscovitch, so I'm not worried yet. I didn't dig Sale & Pelletier until their second year. Suuuuuch dreadful programs when they started.

Watch out for Brasseur & Bardei though, damn. Their LP gets boring quickly, but they definitely get your attention.
 

Vase

Active Member
Messages
128
I completely understand why people aren't wowed by Lubov and Charlie. I agree with dissension over reusing a jazzy SP dress for another jazzy SP - I think that can be distracting. Charlie looked a mess, nothing they did really stood out, etc. etc. It's hard to compare their first outing to I&M's first, though. Moscovitch was just SO improved skating with Ilyushechkina, and many fans were just excited to see her on the ice again. Expectations are massively different this time. Even some of the biggest issues I have, such as the lift, etc., I see potential still. When Blilodeau lifted Seguin, the big complaint was lack of stretch, dynamism, "oomph." That's already not a problem with I&B - he just has to figure out how to overcome being compared to a phenomenal lifter in Dylan.

I rarely like pairs in their first year unless they have something really memorable or great programs, like Duhamel & Radford or Ilyushechkina & Moscovitch, so I'm not worried yet. I didn't dig Sale & Pelletier until their second year. Suuuuuch dreadful programs when they started.

Watch out for Brasseur & Bardei though, damn. Their LP gets boring quickly, but they definitely get your attention.
I’m looking forward to Evelyn and Trennt, she has so much determination and can deliver. I like the program changes, they are not afraid to try something new.
 

Sylvia

Wishing I could go back to the Lake Placid JGP
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59,574
First Challenger assignments for the pairs as listed on Skate Canada's website today:

LORI-ANN MATTE / THIERY FERLAND (Salt Lake City)
CAMILLE RUEST / DREW WOLFE (Salt Lake City)
NADINE WANG / FRANCIS BOUDREAU-AUDET (Salt Lake City will be their international debut together; ETA a trivia note: Wang was originally assigned to compete here last year with her previous partner, Spencer Howe)

KIRSTEN MOORE-TOWERS / MICHAEL MARINARO (Nebelhorn)
They are listed in the SP starting order for the North York Summer Skate tomorrow, along with Walsh/Michaud.
 
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wickedwitch

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Messages
14,633
I rarely like pairs in their first year unless they have something really memorable or great programs, like Duhamel & Radford or Ilyushechkina & Moscovitch, so I'm not worried yet. I didn't dig Sale & Pelletier until their second year. Suuuuuch dreadful programs when they started.
I have the complete opposite opinion. S/P clicked as a team for me from the first second of their SP. Even if their programs weren't the best, their natural charisma, chemistry, and synchronization showed from the beginning. I don't think D/R or I/M ever showed pair-ness to that extent.

And off to watch baby S/P from the 1998 GP on youtube right now.
 

Rock2

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3,616
I’m looking forward to Evelyn and Trennt, she has so much determination and can deliver. I like the program changes, they are not afraid to try something new.
Wait, what? What did I miss? What are they skating to?
 

Sylvia

Wishing I could go back to the Lake Placid JGP
Messages
59,574
Wait, what? What did I miss? What are they skating to?
We'll find out if they skate their SP tomorrow night at North York Summer Skate.

ETA from the Quebec Summer Championships thread in Kiss & Cry:
I missed the seeing the first 2 junior pairs of the 2nd [FS] group & only saw:
2nd Kelly Ann Laurin / Loucas Éthier (I liked them & hope they get a JGP assignment)
4th Camille Perreault / William St-Louis (showed some good things for a new team)
Glad to see them both listed for JGP #5 in Gdasnk, Poland.
 
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Rock2

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3,616
We'll find out if they skate their SP tomorrow night at North York Summer Skate.
Based on the quote I captioned I thought this was known bc the comment suggested approval of the changes they have made etc
 

aftershocks

Well-Known Member
Messages
16,036
I’m not sue the music choice this year, but find they are not afraid to change things up.
In what way though? They appear to me to be searching for a defining style and trying things out, rather than so much not being afraid to change things up.

While I enjoy watching Trennt and Evelyn, I don't think they are particularly well-matched physically. Temperamentally and emotionally, they are fine together though and they also share chutzpah, ambition, and generally good consistency. Plus, they have a lot of backing and fed support. In addition, they are fortunate to have been on the rise at a time when Canadian pairs discipline was thinning out and transitioning with retirements and splits over the course of a new quad. So last season, Trennt & Evelyn garnered some excellent competitive opportunities they may not normally have had as a team who recently moved from juniors to seniors. Plus, they managed to make a fairly decent showing internationally overall, albeit I think their marks were sometimes pushed up a bit more than warranted. But that's due to backing and Canadian fed political clout and pairs rep.

With the new Canadian teams that have been formed, it will be interesting to see how everything shakes out over the course of the new season. Trennt & Evelyn are talented and generally consistent, but so far, I haven't seen explosive elements from them. Right now, they are still trying to develop a signature style. It's too bad that so many talented skaters have to prove themselves on a dime usually, in order to gain traction, momentum, and full backing.

Having fed support provides competitive opportunities, which are needed to improve, grow and get to the next level. But it's clearly necessary to show well and prove yourself pretty much out-of-the-gate, as we see that the best teams at the recent Quebec competition were selected for the SLC Challenger event.
 
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Dobre

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6,066
Dylan was/is so massive. I think having seen him lift or throw a partner would make it pretty much impossible for one to watch said partner with another partner without having that former image in the back of one's mind.

Anyway, I'm open to seeing how Charlie & Liubov develop their own strengths as a team. (I haven't seen them skate yet, and I think part of the reason I haven't rushed to do so is that I don't mind giving them time to sort out that relationship a bit before my own first impressions).
 

aftershocks

Well-Known Member
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16,036
There's really a lot to unpack. :lol:

Luba/Charlie have veteran experience and name recognition, so they will definitely have the backing going forward, and the time to work things out. As I said earlier, I think they look well together. It's useless to look back at their previous partnerships at this point to contrast and say what was better. There's no point. At the moment, Luba/Charlie need a chance to get used to each other and to find out who they are together, without comparisons to what existed in the past with different partners. It might be a good idea to go look at the past partnership Youtube videos if you wish to reminisce. As we know, Dylan was unfortunately injured, and ready to retire. Sadly, Julianne suffered a concussion and she subsequently experienced setbacks for several seasons.

Julianne & Charlie came up from juniors and made a great impression immediately. They were off-beat and magical together, and that had a lot to do with some creative music choices. Then in their sophomore senior season they struggled a bit with their music choices, but they were still a very strong, competitive team. But then came Julianne's injury -- they missed Worlds twice as Julianne tried to recover, which also meant their training time suffered off-and-on. But wonderfully for them, they made the 2018 Olympic team, and that was the milestone swan song for their partnership. I guess Charlie hung in there until he felt things were simply not working in a way that would help them advance as a viably competitive team.

Let's keep in mind that neither Luba or Charlie competed last season, and that's a huge factor. Not only are they a new pairing, but they are getting back into skating after a year of not competing. That does put a new pairing behind, so they have to catch up in that respect, in addition to finding a workable rhythm with each other. Add to that the necessity of finding the right music. Their sp music is not terrible, as someone termed it. I think it's just safe and bland. Plus, it invites comparisons to Luba's Buble selection when she and Dylan first debuted. For that reason alone, they should have gone in a different direction.

ITA with @Dobre regarding the fact we are all reacting to our first impressions. Unlike @Dobre, I don't mind checking out a pre-season debut performance whenever pre-season videos are available. :fan:
 

Vase

Active Member
Messages
128
@aftershocks
I know they came together at a low time for Canadian Pair, but to me they have stepped up and delivered, even after some disappointing results.
I think they are maybe not your typical pair match. But that’s what makes it exciting.
Purkiss seems to know her athletes and I am a fan.
Last year at Nationals everyone expected 1st place go to MT/M but W/M delivered and deserved their placement.

Scoring is something that happens in the sport. Charlie and Lubov’s Skate this past weekend didn’t look like it deserved a point less then Mike and Kirsten’s National score. They gave Charlie bonus for his touchdown on triple toe.
Im looking forward to watching tomorrow and we can agree to disagree,
 

aftershocks

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16,036
As you can see @Vase, I'm not downing Trennt & Evelyn at all. They have definitely succeeded beyond a lot of people's expectations, and they have a charm and a gung-ho enthusiasm about them. They manage to get the job done because they appear to have a great deal of belief in themselves and in each other. As I said, they match well emotionally and temperamentally, but not as well physically, IMHO.

Up against equally talented and better physically matched teams with more explosive elements, the main thing E&T would have going for them is their confidence, consistency, and political backing. Still, I'm not one to declare what skaters can or can't do. Athletes write their own stories, and so we'll see what happens. As ever, I wish there were more opportunities for every team to develop to their full potential, but the windows of opportunity are extremely narrow.

ETA: Re Canadian Nationals, didn't Kirsten & Michael win overall though? And I believe Kirsten had some physical setbacks, plus K&M's programs weren't quite as memorable as their previous season's. Again, the future outlook for Canadian pairs is going to be interesting to follow with all the new partnerships and jockeying for position.

Dylan was/is so massive.
Do you mean strong and muscular? Dylan doesn't seem that tall to me. He is muscularly built, but you make it sound as if he was a linebacker! ;)
 
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blue_idealist

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2,562
Do you mean strong and muscular? Dylan doesn't seem that tall to me. He is muscularly built, but you make it sound as if he was a linebacker! ;)
I've seen DM in person and I was surprised how small he actually was. He looks much larger on television. He IS muscular, though, his frame is just not super-large.
 

dramagrrl

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1,760
Very nice choreo of KMT/MM's SP! I love her dress.

I think the Elton John SP will work for W/M once they get more mileage on it. It needs a lot more oomph than they gave it this time out.
 

Rock2

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3,616
Brooke and Brandon’s triple twist at North York was insane.
Holy crap!

This was the only junior team I was excited about from last year (other than Zach Daleman plus whomever), in terms of seeing a path to good international ranking down the road.

The big question marks were skating skills and growth, which is most interesting for this pair because of his young age. We usually watch to see what junior girl will do and how that will affect the team, but in this case the eyes are on him just as much for physical development. Totally heading in right direction.

She lands throws like a boss and they have a sbs triple so good results are possible on JGP this year.
 

bluebonnets

can you hear me now?
Messages
146
Eric Radford will be in Ottawa on Friday, August 23, for a panel discussion on diversity in sports as part of the public service pride week. The event is being hosted by Innovation, Science, and Economic Development Canada. Participation is possible both in person or via webex. There's nothing on either eventbrite pages that indicates otherwise, so I imagine it's available to the general public and not restricted to public servants.
 

Vase

Active Member
Messages
128
The big question marks were skating skills and growth, which is most interesting for this pair because of his young age. We usually watch to see what junior girl will do and how that will affect the team, but in this case the eyes are on him just as much for physical development. Totally heading in right direction.
I agree, they are headed in the right direction, but if I remember correctly seeing her parents at Nationals, they are quite tall, Brandon’s not so much. Her long legs tell me she may have lots of growing to come.
In Ladies and pairs a lot of girls with looks to be potential are young and another year could say a lot.
 

Colonel Green

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4,264
KMT and Michael didn't do the free, so we just got Evelyn and Trennt's "One" program, which I think is really beautiful. Could be something special. The twist was one of the better ones I've seen from them. Very rare jump error from Trennt, and Evelyn took a really bad Pogosplat on the second throw.


McIntosh and Toste's winning free skate, much better than the unfortunate outing earlier in the summer. The twist wasn't quite as high this time, but the catch was better.


Andrew and Daleman's second place program, now with costumes. I almost think this program should throw in a piece of more recognizable Aladdin music at first, because as it stands it comes across like a generic Middle Eastern music program until the instantly-recognizable "A Whole New World" cues in at the end.

 

haribobo

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Messages
7,894
Summer comp scores

SENIOR PAIRS
Walsh/Michaud 171.9
Ruest/Wolfe 170.79
Brasseur/Bardei 167.71
Matte/Ferland 156.05
Wang/Boudreau-Audet 150.16

JUNIOR PAIRS
McIntosh/Toste 140.72
Andrew/Daleman 137.58
Panetta/Mimar 134.53
Laurin/Ethier 134.50
Levesque/Hudon 129.95
Perreault/St-Louis 126.06
Carle/Farand 121.26
Derenisky/Eberl 119.28
 
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Rock2

Well-Known Member
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3,616
I have mixed feelings about what I'm seeing from the pairs so far this summer. What I have been hoping to see are good programs and some signs of technical progress, even if there are flaws in execution at this point of the season.

MT/M look like they have returned to comfortable programs for them but I don't yet see what's going to make them a podium contender at world's. Looks like they have plateaued on the twist and in their jumping elements so they'll need to count on a PCS bump internationally to move up. Dunno.

W/M are progressing further with the twist than I thought they would so there's that. I'm looking for a second strong sbs jump and throw. Last year they were planning sbs 3L and 3ZTh before abandoning both. No sign of a return. Long program is a bit of an upgrade but I think we learned last year they don't rock out all that well so I'm not seeing a ton of potential with their short internationally. At least the audience will enjoy the music.

Zach Daleman is looking more and more comfortable as a pair boy every time I see him. I'm convinced he's going to have a good career in the discipline. Andrew is a good match for now, but I think the longer term potential lies in her ability to acquire jumps. There's time.

I think domestically the pairs events will be a thrill to watch but for now I'm not expecting much internationally. We'll see.
 

Bladesonice3792

New Member
Messages
4
I have mixed feelings about what I'm seeing from the pairs so far this summer. What I have been hoping to see are good programs and some signs of technical progress, even if there are flaws in execution at this point of the season.

MT/M look like they have returned to comfortable programs for them but I don't yet see what's going to make them a podium contender at world's. Looks like they have plateaued on the twist and in their jumping elements so they'll need to count on a PCS bump internationally to move up. Dunno.

W/M are progressing further with the twist than I thought they would so there's that. I'm looking for a second strong sbs jump and throw. Last year they were planning sbs 3L and 3ZTh before abandoning both. No sign of a return. Long program is a bit of an upgrade but I think we learned last year they don't rock out all that well so I'm not seeing a ton of potential with their short internationally. At least the audience will enjoy the music.

Zach Daleman is looking more and more comfortable as a pair boy every time I see him. I'm convinced he's going to have a good career in the discipline. Andrew is a good match for now, but I think the longer term potential lies in her ability to acquire jumps. There's time.

I think domestically the pairs events will be a thrill to watch but for now I'm not expecting much internationally. We'll see.
Wow, that’s quite a negative perspective. I’ve heard these kids spend 5+ hours everyday training and it’s too bad you have the audacity to put these teams down. For most of these skaters it’s their first competition of the year, there programs are still evolving and their technical elements will only improve with repetition. I really hope none of these skaters read these harsh statements that an inexperienced observer feels the need to post.
 
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