2018-2019 Canadian Ladies News and Updates!

Rock2

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Austman was sent the wrong message with a 65 in her SP at nationals. That program wouldn't fool international judges and would be hard pressed to get even ten pts less. Her presence is undeniable but her SS and TR especially are average at best. Not much run out on landings and spins aren't overly impressive in speed or position. All very nice but very average.

Let's see what 4CC judges say.
 

mag

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I agree. I feel like Canadian judges are concerned about spots for 2020 and are letting that cloud their judgement. There were some lower ranked skaters trying and landing some difficult 3/3’s. They may not have the polish of Austman, but they won’t get that polish if they held down. Austman’s polish comes from self confidence not from specific skills. That confidence comes from people believing in you, exposure to international competition, and funding for extra lesson time. It is also way easier to look polished when you aren’t trying anything difficult and have very basic easy programs.

Chartrand, Mallet, and Austman are probably not the future. This doesn’t mean they should be held down when they skate well, it just means that there should be a level playing field. Judges don’t need to pick the future; they need to mark what is put out on the ice at each comp and future will take care of itself. When Schumacher does footwork into her 3F in the short and lands it cleanly she should get the corresponding GOE. When Austman does basic crossovers into her 3Sal in the short she too should get the corresponding GOE. When Mallet lands her 2A with great speed and runout she should get the corresponding GOE. Programs with difficult turns and moves between elements should get a higher a transition score than programs filled with cross overs. It is not rocket science.
 

fsfann

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I agree. I feel like Canadian judges are concerned about spots for 2020 and are letting that cloud their judgement. There were some lower ranked skaters trying and landing some difficult 3/3’s. They may not have the polish of Austman, but they won’t get that polish if they held down. Austman’s polish comes from self confidence not from specific skills. That confidence comes from people believing in you, exposure to international competition, and funding for extra lesson time. It is also way easier to look polished when you aren’t trying anything difficult and have very basic easy programs.

Chartrand, Mallet, and Austman are probably not the future. This doesn’t mean they should be held down when they skate well, it just means that there should be a level playing field. Judges don’t need to pick the future; they need to mark what is put out on the ice at each comp and future will take care of itself. When Schumacher does footwork into her 3F in the short and lands it cleanly she should get the corresponding GOE. When Austman does basic crossovers into her 3Sal in the short she too should get the corresponding GOE. When Mallet lands her 2A with great speed and runout she should get the corresponding GOE. Programs with difficult turns and moves between elements should get a higher a transition score than programs filled with cross overs. It is not rocket science.
This was my concern with Nic Nadeau. Don't get me wrong... I really enjoy his skating and am a big fan, but I felt his FS marks were too high compared to others such as Roman Sadovsky etc who have much more complicated/intricate programs...
 

Colonel Green

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There were some lower ranked skaters trying and landing some difficult 3/3’s. They may not have the polish of Austman, but they won’t get that polish if they held down.
"Trying" being the operative word; Bausback and Gran both UR'd (and in Gran's case had a bunch of other rough elements), they weren't held down.
 

mag

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"Trying" being the operative word; Bausback and Gran both UR'd (and in Gran's case had a bunch of other rough elements), they weren't held down.
I need to go back and watch again. If I am not mistaken you watched them all live, yes? That is obviously better than by video. In the cases of Austman, Gran, and Bausback I have seen them live many time becaus they compete locally where I am so it is possible that, like some judges, I know what they can do rather than what they did do.

I will watch again and then we can discuss further.
 

RoseRed

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I haven't broken it down element by element to see if I agree with all the scores, but Bausback and Gran both have serious PCS weaknesses imo. And both had messiness in their FS, so I wasn't surprised by the placements.
 

Moustaffask8r

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This was my concern with Nic Nadeau. Don't get me wrong... I really enjoy his skating and am a big fan, but I felt his FS marks were too high compared to others such as Roman Sadovsky etc who have much more complicated/intricate programs...
feel the exact same! Plus quality of skating, Sadovsky is beautiful!!
 

Rafter

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Austman was sent the wrong message with a 65 in her SP at nationals. That program wouldn't fool international judges and would be hard pressed to get even ten pts less. Her presence is undeniable but her SS and TR especially are average at best. Not much run out on landings and spins aren't overly impressive in speed or position. All very nice but very average.

Let's see what 4CC judges say.
My feeling on Austman is that she just strokes around setting up the jumps (which aren’t even the harder triples!!!!). WAY too much telegraphing and not enough connecting steps and choreo. I’ve never understood Skate Canada’s love fest regarding Austman. Maybe because of her glam look?
 

Rafter

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This was my concern with Nic Nadeau. Don't get me wrong... I really enjoy his skating and am a big fan, but I felt his FS marks were too high compared to others such as Roman Sadovsky etc who have much more complicated/intricate programs...
Perhaps but Nadeau does have excellent skating skills and ice coverage.
 

Japanfan

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This was my concern with Nic Nadeau. Don't get me wrong... I really enjoy his skating and am a big fan, but I felt his FS marks were too high compared to others such as Roman Sadovsky etc who have much more complicated/intricate programs...
There was time when Nadeau was seen as 'the next one' and I would think he would have been judged favorably because of it.
 

ChiquitaBanana

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Perhaps but Nadeau does have excellent skating skills and ice coverage.
Performance, yes. Lack in control of his landings and extension. As for SS, I fell he is one centimeter near a fall in his steps. He is so much going "out" to reach the public that he lacks in his inner self-control, poised, centering/balace, whatever you call it. That's why he can put the house on fire and then having bad skates. Not a matter of technique.
 

Rafter

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Performance, yes. Lack in control of his landings and extension. As for SS, I fell he is one centimeter near a fall in his steps. He is so much going "out" to reach the public that he lacks in his inner self-control, poised, centering/balace, whatever you call it. That's why he can put the house on fire and then having bad skates. Not a matter of technique.
He does have good edges and can get at max speed with very few crossovers. That’s one thing I love about Nic. I agree he seems maybe too focused on reaching out.
 

Rock2

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Gran is such an interesting case. She was all the talk when in novice but she looks like she has grown a foot since then. She's got to be 5 ft 8....?

I'm super impressed by the fact she got a lot of jumps back with this brand new body, but to me that's about where it ends. For now her skating and spins are slow and void of energy. On TV she looks like she skates slower than I can walk.

No GoE to be had anywhere, while the lack of SS and TR would drag all the marks down on the PCS side.

But it's not at all over for her. She does have a base to work with. What I'm watching for now is can she turn herself into an athlete? She technically is one now but the mentality needs to come with it. Her body type works if she can direct her skating toward the Koster or Phaneuf aesthetic of regalness and power that belies her stature. If she sees herself less an 'athlete' and more a 'pretty skater' then we have another Jennifer Robinson on our hands. No criticism there as she'll grind out a few decent accomplishments, but I'd be far less excited about prospects internationally over both the short and long term.
 
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mag

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@Rock2 Gran is a very interesting case. She has lovely jumps when she is on, but she is really going to need to build some serious muscle! Muscle would also help with the injuries she seems to be plagued by. She is actually closer to 5’10”. I saw her a while back standing next to another skater who is listed at 5’11” and there wasn’t a huge difference in height. I think the first part of her short this year was definitely the right way to go. Now if she can work hard on her core muscles and speed I think she has serious potential.

I would love to see what Mark Pillay could do for her. He is really good with long lean skaters and creates strong programs with good lines.
 

Sylvia

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From this Canadian Press article: https://www.thechronicleherald.ca/n...nadas-team-at-the-world-championships-277358/

The other [Worlds] spot could go to Aurora Cotop, who won silver on Saturday evening, but doesn't have the technical score needed to qualify for the world championships. Skate Canada will send her to an international event in Germany next month [Bavarian Open] in an effort to get the score needed.
Skate Canada has entered Cotop in the Bavarian Open along with five ladies in the Adv. Novice event: Kaiya Ruiter [N1], Mélaurie Boivin [N2], Melody Zhu [N4], Doriela Lugo-Mayrand [N5] and Vienna Harwood [N7]. Ruiter landed 3T+3T, 3S and 3Lo cleanly in her winning FS at Canadians, while Zhu, Lugo-Mayrand and Harwood attempted 3Lz and/or 3F in their programs.
 
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mag

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Skate Canada has entered Cotop in the Bavarian Open along with five ladies in the Adv. Novice event: Kaiya Ruiter [N1], Mélaurie Boivin [N2], Melody Zhu [N4], Doriela Lugo-Mayrand [N5] and Vienna Harwood [N7]. Ruiter landed 3T+3T, 3S and 3Lo cleanly in her winning FS at Canadians, while Zhu, Lugo-Mayrand and Harwood attempted 3Lz and/or 3F in their programs.
So what about the bronze medalist? Seems a bit nasty to leave her off the list considering she also placed in the Skate Canada Summer Series (and I think also placed last year as well so she is definitely consistent.)

ETA: Sorry @Sylvia I am not really asking you. Just wondering aloud.
 

Sylvia

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Skate Canada sent novice skaters to Egna Spring Trophy last year so maybe they'll do it again?

In the past haven't singles skaters often been chosen for Skate Canada's National Development Camp based on their technical (jumping) abilities rather than Nationals placement?
 

mag

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Skate Canada sent novice skaters to Egna Spring Trophy last year so maybe they'll do it again?

In the past haven't singles skaters often been chosen for Skate Canada's National Development Camp based on their technical (jumping) abilities rather than Nationals placement?
Could be. I just find it amusing that we sending a skater to 4CC’s who has up to loop, but the novice silver medalist who, I believe has up to loop and is 7 or 8 years younger, doesn’t get to go with the big novice group for her first international.
 

Sylvia

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^^^ Don't forget that Larkyn Austman landed a 3F cleanly in her Challenge FS back in December. :D (I didn't think you were referring to Véronik Mallet who is still in injury comeback mode.)
 

mag

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^^^ Don't forget that Larkyn Austman landed a 3F cleanly in her Challenge FS back in December. :D (I didn't think you were referring to Véronik Mallet who is still in injury comeback mode.)
Yes, you are right. Still, Emily Millard is 14 and Larkyn is 20 or 21?

I do understand SC having a set criteria of required jumps, I just think if you are going to send N1,2,4,5, and 7, some consideration should be given to the message that sends to N3, especially considering she has done so consistently well the last two seasons. The extra $ cost is not that much when you are sending such a large team, but the cost to Millard’s confidence could be considerable. I feel like this is an area where SC often messes up and is purposely unaware of the message they are sending.
 

ChiquitaBanana

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Yes, you are right. Still, Emily Millard is 14 and Larkyn is 20 or 21?

I do understand SC having a set criteria of required jumps, I just think if you are going to send N1,2,4,5, and 7, some consideration should be given to the message that sends to N3, especially considering she has done so consistently well the last two seasons. The extra $ cost is not that much when you are sending such a large team, but the cost to Millard’s confidence could be considerable. I feel like this is an area where SC often messes up and is purposely unaware of the message they are sending.
The criteria are set up well before the season starts and are well-known by coaches. It is not like it is a big surprise.
 

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