Cipres accused of sexual misconduct

[thvu]

Anyone receiving an unsolicited sexual photo is within rights of feeling assaulted. A gay guy I knew as a teen told me much later that his dad made him look through Playboy to “change his mind” and that’s pretty awful as well.

I'm curious how others react to this. I see this and I think - child abuse.

 

[believed]

Background article in USA Today new Dec 13th

The Backstory: Stories of sexual abuse would remain hidden without journalists

Olympic sports have a troubling pattern when it comes to young athletes alleging abuse and adults denying it. Our journalists surface these stories.

www.usatoday.com

Thank you for this link. This article states that Christine Brennan received the tip on August 10 and then spent August until December investigating the story - talking to the parents, the tutor, and the therapist.

 

[Japanfan]

To defend @Japanfan - there are indeed trans activists who take it to an extreme, attacking The Vagina Monologues for being transphobic and insisting on the right of biological men to be in women’s’ safe spaces like women’s shelters.

Thanks, but I'm not sure what I'm being defended for?

I said there may be women who prefer private female-only bathrooms (excluding male-to-female trans) because they have been sexually abused or harassed. Having a biological male in the bathroom or what was previously a biologically gendered space could be traumatizing/frightening to these women. And I noted that problem is dealt with well here by giving trans persons their own bathroom, often shared with disabled. Now, if that's a problem for trans, I'll listen.

And that I prefer 'Women and Gender Studies' to 'Gender and Women Studies'. Or better, that women retain their own discipline 'Women's Studies'.

'Gender and Women's Studies' puts women second (remember The Second Sex?). Every time women make an advancement (e.g. their own academic discipline), they get sidelined or pushed back. This is brilliantly documented by Susan Faludi in her book 'Backlash: The War Against American Women'. At present we are in time of particularly important advancement for women. Will it be different it that has no backlash? I hope so, but doubt it.

I am not addressing trans issues directly in any of the posts above. My focus is on women. One has to pick one's battles.

I do think that women who have been women biologically since birth have experienced the world differently than someone who at least started in a male body, but this is OT.

That was the case made by a facility here called 'Rape Relief and Women's Shelter'.

A man who identified as female wanted to volunteer at the facility, but was rejected because he would still have experienced male privilege and entitlement growing up. And therefore truly could not emphasize with or support female victims of rape. IIRC the man took the facility to court, and lost.

 

[nimi]

Thanks, but I'm not sure what I'm being defended for?

I said there may be women who prefer private female-only bathrooms (excluding male-to-female trans) because they have been sexually abused or harassed. Having a biological male in the bathroom or what was previously a biologically gendered space could be traumatizing/frightening to these women. And I noted that problem is dealt with well here by giving trans persons their own bathroom, often shared with disabled. Now, if that's a problem for trans, I'll listen.

And that I prefer 'Women and Gender Studies' to 'Gender and Women Studies'. Or better, that women retain their own discipline 'Women's Studies'.

'Gender and Women's Studies' puts women second (remember The Second Sex?). Every time women make an advancement (e.g. their own academic discipline), they get sidelined or pushed back. This is brilliantly documented by Susan Faludi in her book 'Backlash: The War Against American Women'. At present we are in time of particularly important advancement for women. Will it be different it that has no backlash? I hope so, but doubt it.

I am not addressing trans issues directly in any of the posts above. My focus is on women. One has to pick one's battles.




That was the case made by a facility here called 'Rape Relief and Women's Shelter'.

A man who identified as female wanted to volunteer at the facility, but was rejected because he would still have experienced male privilege and entitlement growing up. And therefore truly could not emphasize with or support female victims of rape. IIRC the man took the facility to court, and lost.

OMG so much misgendering and misconceptions here that I don't even know where to start... @Japanfan, if you are actually interested in more in-depth discussion about this subject (that has nothing to do with Ciprès) maybe message me? I don't want to totally derail this thread.

Thank you @Sedge for posting the Backstory! It does clear up some things.

 

[Vagabond]

Step away from the thread overnight, and it goes down the drain.... ?‍

I feel sorry for the girls and for Vanessa James.

 

[nikjil]

Background article in USA Today new Dec 13th

The Backstory: Stories of sexual abuse would remain hidden without journalists

Olympic sports have a troubling pattern when it comes to young athletes alleging abuse and adults denying it. Our journalists surface these stories.

www.usatoday.com

Great article. I would highly recommend She Said by the two NY Times journalists who broke the Harvey Weinstein story. It’s a great read and really explains the amount of work serious journalists do before they break a story like this.

 

[cocotaffy]

Step away from the thread overnight, and it goes down the drain.... ?‍

I feel sorry for the girls and for Vanessa James.

Well from the start of this conversation and seing the highly polarizing subject matter, there was a fat chance this thread wouldn't go down the drain if we're honest. But hey, it still worth debating over and maybe get some things across.

 

[Mad for Skating]

I'm 17, and I've received plenty of random messages from creepy older guys through both Twitter and Instagram. I only post selfies occasionally on Instagram stories, and I don't even post any photos of myself on Twitter, but I've had 3 or 4 men send me random DMs saying "I want to get to know you" or "I want to be friends!" One of them even continued trying to talk to me after I told him I was underage and it would be illegal in my country (he said he was 23). I literally just use my Twitter to talk about skating, movies, music, and human rights.
My user pic has never been my actual face (usually I use a photo of one of my favorite skaters), so I'm assuming they think it's me. But I've never done anything to provoke them to "slide into my DMs". It's completely random. Thankfully, I've never received any pics, but it's still disgusting.
Imagine if it was actually a guy you knew, who trained at your rink. It makes me sick to think of it.

 

[Vash01]

I felt sorry for Vanessa right from the start of this thread.

 

[Aerobicidal]

A man who identified as female wanted to volunteer at the facility, but was rejected because he would still have experienced male privilege and entitlement growing up. And therefore truly could not emphasize with or support female victims of rape. IIRC the man took the facility to court, and lost.

If someone identifies as female, they are not a man. This is one step away from saying people claim they're trans in order to get volleyball scholarships.

And "emphasize [sic] with" . . . Aren't you an editor for a living?

 

[chantilly]

I'm curious how others react to this. I see this and I think - child abuse.

I do too. There are still conversion camps that are legal in the US and I think Canada.

 

[meggonzo]

I felt sorry for Vanessa right from the start of this thread.

How do we know that Vanessa wasn't aware of the situation?

 

[barbarafan]

I do too. There are still conversion camps that are legal in the US and I think Canada.

What????? can you pls display your sources for any indication of a conversion camp in Canada!!

 

[RoseRed]

What????? can you pls display your sources for any indication of a conversion camp in Canada!!

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/conversion-therapy-what-you-need-to-know-1.5209598

 

[maatTheViking]

Rather, I was referring to a girl/woman seeing biological male [in a restroom]

how would anyone know this person was assigned male at birth? I don’t get it

Please understand that my post didn't reflect any negative views of trans - I don't have any. My focus is on women.

Trans women are women. Sorry but if you have focus on women, it’s also on trans women. Feminism should include ALL women.

 

[AxelAnnie]

I'm curious how others react to this. I see this and I think - child abuse.

Yes, from 2019 we see this as child abuse. Thirty years ago we did not. Medical advances, societal advances and comprehension, understanding, etc have advanced both our reactions and thinking.....hopefully.

 

[AxelAnnie]

how would anyone know this person was assigned male at birth? I don’t get it

No The penis is like a little clue.

 

[MacMadame]

Having a biological male in the bathroom or what was previously a biologically gendered space could be traumatizing/frightening to these women. And I noted that problem is dealt with well here by giving trans persons their own bathroom, often shared with disabled. Now, if that's a problem for trans, I'll listen.

(1) If you are in a bathroom with people wearing clothes, then all you would see is a woman. Maybe you like to go to nudiest bathrooms but in all the bathrooms I go to, I have no idea the state of anyone's genitals.
(2) Yes, it's a problem for trans people to be forced to go to some special bathroom for a host of reasons

Or better, that women retain their own discipline 'Women's Studies'.

Trans women are women so Women's Studies includes them.

However, we are talking about an academic discipline and you can't talk about the history of Women and Women in Society without talking about the issues of gender so including gender in the name is accurate and academics should be accurate.

how would anyone know this person was assigned male at birth? I don’t get it



Trans women are women. Sorry but if you have focus on women, it’s also on trans women. Feminism should include ALL women.

SO MUCH THIS.

 

[AxelAnnie]

I'm 17, and I've received plenty of random messages from creepy older guys through both Twitter and Instagram. I only post selfies occasionally on Instagram stories, and I don't even post any photos of myself on Twitter, but I've had 3 or 4 men send me random DMs saying "I want to get to know you" or "I want to be friends!" One of them even continued trying to talk to me after I told him I was underage and it would be illegal in my country (he said he was 23). I literally just use my Twitter to talk about skating, movies, music, and human rights.
My user pic has never been my actual face (usually I use a photo of one of my favorite skaters), so I'm assuming they think it's me. But I've never done anything to provoke them to "slide into my DMs". It's completely random. Thankfully, I've never received any pics, but it's still disgusting.
Imagine if it was actually a guy you knew, who trained at your rink. It makes me sick to think of it.

Social media IMO is a very dangerous place. Anyone can say anything. Of course men are responding to you, trolling, seeing how far they can take something. It is naive to think otherwise.

On a social media site you can be whoever you want to be, say whatever you want to say with absolutely no accountability for your actions. You can hurt, bully, tease, pretend and send disgusting pictures. When one says the pictures are unsolicited it is only partially correct. Sure one did not say....O send me a picture of your privates. But by engaging in conversations with people you do not know you leave yourself open for whatever you get.

Now, this has nothing to do with the 13 year old girl, this is not blaming the victim, nor condoning nasty pictures. Simply a statement of fact. Social media has changed society.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Well from the start of this conversation and seeing the highly polarizing subject matter, there was a fat chance this thread wouldn't go down the drain if we're honest. But hey, it still worth debating over and maybe get some things across.

I have learned stuff. Hopefully things get across in on all sides of the issues.

 

[barbarafan]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/conversion-therapy-what-you-need-to-know-1.5209598

Thanks....you freaked me out. They are trying to make a national ban on conversion therapy but the jurisdiction is provincial and territorial at this time. Apparently not all provinces have put a ban on this although you cannot find a proper therapist who would do this. Any places or therapists who have done this have done so in secret and apparently it is very hard to detect.

 

[skatemomaz]

No The penis is like a little clue.

only if you are looking into the closed stall and then you are fcuking invading another person's privacy.

 

[AxelAnnie]

only if you are looking into the closed stall and then you are fcuking invading another person's privacy.

True. I think I was extrapolating into Gym Showers.....well except for leaving the toilet seat up, and hearing pee coming from a stall with feet (which you can see under the door) facing the wrong way.

IMO bathrooms, showers, etc should require you to match with the plumbing you currently have.

 

[Sparks]

This is ignorant and disgusting. I have two trans friends. One is now a woman, one is now a man. If my woman friend went into a men's bathroom, she'd be scared. If my man friend went into a woman's bathroom, he'd scare the women.
There is NO WAY TO KNOW what someone's original "plumbing" is.

 

[AxelAnnie]

This is ignorant and disgusting. I have two trans friends. One is now a woman, one is now a man. If my woman friend went into a men's bathroom, she'd be scared. If my man friend went into a woman's bathroom, he'd scare the women.
There is NO WAY TO KNOW what someone's original "plumbing" is.

Are you talking about after re-assignment surgery? In which case you would be correct.

 

[Sparks]

Dear Lord. Educate yourself. Surgery isn't the only way someone transitions. You are too caught up in genitalia. That says a lot about you.

 

[TAHbKA]

Social media IMO is a very dangerous place. Anyone can say anything. Of course men are responding to you, trolling, seeing how far they can take something. It is naive to think otherwise.

А fake account for the waze rides application. It doesn't have my name, it doesn't have my gender, it doesn't have my age and the only picture there is is of a dandelion. Received at least 3 sleazy messages from men (ok, perhaps they were a really lame artificial intelligence projects, but still..)

 

[Judy]

А fake account for the waze rides application. It doesn't have my name, it doesn't have my gender, it doesn't have my age and the only picture there is is of a dandelion. Received at least 3 sleazy messages from men (ok, perhaps they were a really lame artificial intelligence projects, but still..)

yup I have my FB on every restriction and don’t use Twitter, Instagram etc although that’s just because fb is enough for me. Teenagers etc are more at risk.

 

[MsZem]

How did this become a thread about the experiences of trans women?

Who are women, obviously - though ones with a different set of experiences than those who were raised and socialized as women (not that there is a uniform experience for women of any kind).

 

[antmanb]

True. I think I was extrapolating into Gym Showers.....well except for leaving the toilet seat up, and hearing pee coming from a stall with feet (which you can see under the door) facing the wrong way.

IMO bathrooms, showers, etc should require you to match with the plumbing you currently have.

You’re a disgusting ignorant excuse for a human being.