The Dance Hall 5: Ice Dance Fans 2017-2018

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clairecloutier said:
It will indeed be interesting, when P/C and V/M go head-to-head ... but it will only happen once, at the GP Final. And the GPF can be a weird event.

I still vividly recall D/W beating V/M at the 2009 GPF -- but it was only silver in Vancouver.

Then there was the year (2015-16?) when Weaver/Poje won the GPF really convincingly--and didn't even make the podium at Worlds.

Not to mention what happened with the Shibs last year. At 4CCs, they were legitimately close to V/M. Then at Worlds, it was like they were miles away again, according to the judges anyway! Still scratching my head about that one.

Whatever happens at this year's GPF, I'm going to take with a big grain of salt. ;)
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You might need a big wine chaser with that
 
clairecloutier said:
It will indeed be interesting, when P/C and V/M go head-to-head ... but it will only happen once, at the GP Final. And the GPF can be a weird event.

I still vividly recall D/W beating V/M at the 2009 GPF -- but it was only silver in Vancouver.

Then there was the year (2015-16?) when Weaver/Poje won the GPF really convincingly--and didn't even make the podium at Worlds.

Not to mention what happened with the Shibs last year. At 4CCs, they were legitimately close to V/M. Then at Worlds, it was like they were miles away again, according to the judges anyway! Still scratching my head about that one.

Whatever happens at this year's GPF, I'm going to take with a big grain of salt. ;)
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You inspired me to look up the medalists of all the GPF, and this past season and the 1999-2000 season were the only times that podium at GPF was exactly the same as it was at Worlds. It never happened for the Olympics. 2014-2015 was close in that it had all of the medalists but with 1st and 3rd switched, and 2011-2012 had all of the medalists but with 1st and 2nd reversed.
 
RoseRed said:
- How do the lower ranked US teams look? Only 3 of H/B, P/B, M/C and the Parsons will go to 4CC. And how do Soucisse/Firus compare to them, since they'll be at 4CC for Canada?
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That's the plotline I'm really interested in this season too. With the WISA teams now finally seniors, it'll be very interesting to see how the 4-7th place US teams get ranked at Nationals. Based on the very limited data, the Parsons are in pretty good position. H/B solidly defeating M/R in the FD was a good result for them too. This is a super important season for H/B as they have the most to lose if they end up behind two of the other 3 teams.

Soucisse/Firus were adored by the judges at Finlandia-- I was pleasantly surprised. It's almost like "So soon?!" They are adorable :)
 
firstflight said:
That's the plotline I'm really interested in this season too. With the WISA teams now finally seniors, it'll be very interesting to see how the 4-7th place US teams get ranked at Nationals. Based on the very limited data, the Parsons are in pretty good position. H/B solidly defeating M/R in the FD was a good result for them too. This is a super important season for H/B as they have the most to lose if they end up behind two of the other 3 teams.

Soucisse/Firus were adored by the judges at Finlandia-- I was pleasantly surprised. It's almost like "So soon?!" They are adorable :)
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I really love Soucisse/Firus. I have followed Firus with his diff. partners for quite a few years and really like him. So this is a new partnership but they did really well at challenge although their marks did not reflect. Gilles/Poirier were there and were really overmarked (almost perfect) which left them way behind. They had mistakes at Cdns so I was really surprised and happy that they were named to cdn team & were given GP's.
 
They were given the Skate Canada host pick -- they were quite low on the SB and WS lists and thus not about to earn any spots outright -- and given the very small number of remaining senior teams in Canada with any international experience whatsoever, it was presumably only between them and Sales/Wamsteeker, who finished behind them at Nats.
 
marbri said:
Canada is weak in mens (no matter how great I think Chan he can't beat math), volatile in ladies (look at Daleman in Finland), and Duhamel/Radford took a big dip last season and at this stage aren't looking great imo. It will be interesting to see how W/P do on the GP circuit. I was hoping they would capitalize on their result last season to make a strong argument to split team event with V/M for a chance at a medal but I'm not overly optimistic based on their programs and ###'s from ACI.
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If Canada wanna a bigger chance for Gold medal, I don't think W/P will be in. As much as I like W/P, I just feel they're likely to crack under pressure. Canada has a lot of uncertainty, the performances of men, ladies and even pairs can be unpredictable. Ice dance is relatively reliable. So SC might wanna bet on V/M for both SD and FD.

I do think team event this time is more exciting than in Sochi. Back in 2014, Gold for Russia is almost a sure thing for all kinds of reasons. But now Canada, Russia and US all have a chance. It really depends on the skaters' performances, and also other teams' choices. For example, if China don't send their best pairs, it might be advantageous for Canada and Russia, but not for US. So there is a lot of factors to affect the results.
 
firstflight said:
That's the plotline I'm really interested in this season too. With the WISA teams now finally seniors, it'll be very interesting to see how the 4-7th place US teams get ranked at Nationals. Based on the very limited data, the Parsons are in pretty good position. H/B solidly defeating M/R in the FD was a good result for them too. This is a super important season for H/B as they have the most to lose if they end up behind two of the other 3 teams.

Soucisse/Firus were adored by the judges at Finlandia-- I was pleasantly surprised. It's almost like "So soon?!" They are adorable :)
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I think they increased their PB by 17+ points from the US Classic. I was very happy for them.

Looking at the skater Canada field, Virtue/Moir, Hubbell/Donohue and Weaver/Poje are clearly ahead of S/F. Smart/Diaz, Loboda/Drozd and Hawayek/Baker all have CS scores in the same range as S/F, though H/B did beat them by a good bit at the US Classic. Still if H/B make a major error, as they are prone to do, they're beatable for S/F. Kaliszek/Spodyriev scored lower in their only CS so far, but their PB is within the same 150's range. Agafonova/Ucar have a 160's PB (from Tallinn trophy), but we haven't seen them this season. So below the top 3, a lot can happen. Top five is a possibility for S/F if they skate really well. That would be great for them.
 
I think we must see what the Shibs, Chock & Bates, and Cappellini & Lanotte have in store for this season. Six world medals in that group right there, and we have seen nothing. Nor do we have an obvious home favorite top dance team like at the last three Olympic Games. I love that the Olympics are in a neutral dance country.

Curious: I wonder if all the top European dance teams will go to Europeans in Russia.

firstflight said:
Soucisse/Firus were adored by the judges at Finlandia-- I was pleasantly surprised.
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The caller was Canadian so I am waiting for a better idea of how Soucisse & Firus will fair in the larger picture (which we probably won't see at SC). At the moment their FD is been there/done that mid-90's Fred & Gingeresque; but they have time to grow. They have been getting the levels, which is a good sign for them. Improvement from last season.

4CCs will be a good test for Soucisse & Firus as well as the young U.S. teams. I am curious if any of Muramoto & Reed, Wang & Liu, and Min & Gamelin will decide to attend. My guess is no, since they would have to travel from North America just like the North American dance teams competing at the Olympics. The Asian teams could use the World Standing points, but I don't know how likely it is that they will all continue after this season. I assume yes for Wang & Liu and probably for Min & Gamelin as both are new, young teams. Muramoto & Reed seem to just be getting started, but he's been to two Olympics already. So we'll see. I would love to see M&R compete at 4CCs this season because their current scores indicate they would have a legitimate shot to become the first Asian dance team to medal at 4CCs. (Only Canada & the U.S. have medaled in dance at Four Continents).

allezfred said:
US Ladies not as strong as they used to be and uh pairs.
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Pairs is definitely the U.S.'s weak point. This Challenger season, though, is proving that the U.S. team isn't the only one who could lose to the French & Italians. Pairs is becoming a real question mark all around.
 
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Dobre said:
Muramoto & Reed seem to just be getting started, but he's been to two Olympics already. So we'll see. I would love to see M&R compete at 4CCs this season because their current scores indicate they would have a legitimate shot to become the first Asian dance team to medal at 4CCs. (Only Canada & the U.S. have medaled in dance at Four Continents).
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I am really curious about their plans. He is 28 yo and she is 24 yo, I really like them, I hope they stay at least for another cycle. If they continue to grow and become popular in Japan, they will get sponsors and may not have to worry too much about money, although considering that the Reed family had 3 skaters competing and Alison has been jumping from country to country, maybe money is not much of a problem for them.
 
Dobre said:
4CCs will be a good test for Soucisse & Firus as well as the young U.S. teams. I am curious if any of Muramoto & Reed, Wang & Liu, and Min & Gamelin will decide to attend. My guess is no, since they would have to travel from North America just like the North American dance teams competing at the Olympics. The Asian teams could use the World Standing points, but I don't know how likely it is that they will all continue after this season. I assume yes for Wang & Liu and probably for Min & Gamelin as both are new, young teams. Muramoto & Reed seem to just be getting started, but he's been to two Olympics already. So we'll see. I would love to see M&R compete at 4CCs this season because their current scores indicate they would have a legitimate shot to become the first Asian dance team to medal at 4CCs. (Only Canada & the U.S. have medaled in dance at Four Continents).
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I doubt it, especially since they'll all be doing the team event (probably, as long as S. Korea ends up with a spot), which is a lot sooner than the individual dance event. None of the Asian dance teams who did the team event in 2014 did 4CC that year.
 
PurpleRain said:
B/S? Really? NOPE. Not gonna happen. Their SD is one of the worst I've seen this season. But again, politics politics politics.
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They were third in the FD last year. I don't want them to be third really, even though I really like Soloviev, but they're still in the race.

H/D is my favourite american team, but I don't really like their program this year. They use silence + percussion too much (I like the idea of the beginning of their FD for example, but it's too long). But I have to say that among all the team we've seen, they're one of the more prepared and "readier" by now.
I think we're underestimating C/B too much. They have killer lift, Chock used to have great SS and she keeps getting better.. I wish this team could change coach. Go to Camerlengo maybe.
I don't know about the Shibs. They seem to go the same road as last year, working maybe too much on music and having too many side events that might distract them. I know they'll have program that suit them and they'll still have great technique, but...
And C/L are still in the race. They made mistake on the SD that kept them out of the last group in 2016 and 2017, but if they are perfect they have a chance. The problem with them is that considering their skating, they can't make mistake.
W/P didn't seem ready at all in ACI (twizzles...) and G/P are not on the level of the other contender yet I think.
 
We have not yet discovered all the programs, it is complicated to give a favorite for the bronze medal.
Grand Prix will be very interesting, not all ice dancers who can get 3rd place (for me, S/S, C/B, H/D, B/S and W/P) will be able to qualify for the Grand Prix final (except for a huge surprise). I don't know if S/S, C/B, H/D, W/P (and V/M) will participate in the four continents, but B/S, C/L (and P/C) will most certainly make the European championships. I still think that the podium in the Grand Prix final will be very close to the one we will have at the olympics games
 
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GreenGan said:
I don't know about the Shibs. They seem to go the same road as last year, working maybe too much on music and having too many side events that might distract them. I know they'll have program that suit them and they'll still have great technique, but...
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I was thinking the same, but they did not do WTT or skating shows in the off season and their vacations were literally only 2 days in Las Vegas. Maybe that will compensate it, they are very organized with their schedules. C/B changed programs, I suppose that they spent more time than they expected creating their programs.
 
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For Europeans, I think every top teams will go. First, it's Ice Dance and missing a competition on purpose is a mistake (the more showing, the better). Second, Moscow ! A ISU competition in RUSSIA, just before Olympics... I wouldn't want to miss that if I were a skater. That's A TON of visibility. And a lot of coverage leading into Korea.

Now... I know it's not everybody's opinion but C/L beat B/S at Euros last year, with a mistake in the Free (The controller was indeed Italian). I thought B/S edged them on this competition, and vice-versa for Worlds where C/L skated lights out but not B/S... who got 3rd place. How important is it for B/S to win against C/L before the Games ? (Assuming C/L is going of course).
 
Anyasnake said:
How important is it for B/S to win against C/L before the Games ?
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If B/S want the medal at the Olympics, it is better that they beat C/L at the Europeans ... at home. (The title I do not think but the silver medal should be for them)
 
Her costume isn't that different from a lot of the outfits one sees in ballroom dancing. If she isn't covered enough then I am sure she will receive a costume deduction but is vulgar really the right word to be using for these ladies?

Now the program itself is pretty dull.
 
MarieM said:
S&K IMO are done. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04shyEwmKHE
They have regressed so much since test skates. It's so obvious.
They can't do the pattern anymore, they are slower, and really, there is nothing latin here. And her costume is vulgar on her.
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What is your definition of "vulgar"? I thought the dress was fine. It's not like she's wearing boob tassels and a pair of assless pants. Sadly, the dress was the only thing keeping my attention in that program.
 
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S/K's SD is so personality-less. They also have one of the more unmusical pattern steps out there from a potential top 10 team I've seen. I'm sure it'll improve later on. I feel like them and B/S have constructed their SDs where there's like only half a minute or so of actual fast music at the very end so it seems tacked on.
 
Zhulin's teams have his typical disaster SDs.:blah:

In regards to S&K's SD, the transitions are so sloppy. I know it's still early in the season, but Zoueva really did know how to choreograph for them better than Zhulin does. She somehow made it seem like they had a little bit of polish.
 
nimi said:
Not a fan of SinKats but I rather watch this program and listen to this questionable music edit than the StepBuk one...
(A very low bar, admittedly.)
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Problem is that considering their SD got worse, I was thinking their FD would be great. But no. This program also hasn't progressed one tiny bit in three weeks. And that should be worrying.
 
maya1985 said:
We have not yet discovered all the programs, it is complicated to give a favorite for the bronze medal.
Grand Prix will be very interesting, not all ice dancers who can get 3rd place (for me, S/S, C/B, H/D, B/S and W/P) will be able to qualify for the Grand Prix final (except for a huge surprise). I don't know if S/S, C/B, H/D, W/P (and V/M) will participate in the four continents, but B/S, C/L (and P/C) will most certainly make the European championships. I still think that the podium in the Grand Prix final will be very close to the one we will have at the olympics games
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I don't think any of them will do 4CC.
 
From what I've seen so far, the programs from the Juniors are better than the ones from the Seniors. The Senior FDs have honestly been underwhelming.

The Italian Junior Grand Prix Event just finished and I have to say... I really like Polishchuk and Vakhnov's FD... Yes, another Swan Lake but it's good! Lots of power into the twizzles and lifts were steady. They have potential. Another FD I really like is the one from Sofia and Igor. Super, super unique material... Plus Carreira and Ponomarenko's really lovely FD... On the side note, surprise surprise! Another Canadian team is doing Moulin Rouge and they actually won the bronze at Italy today! Can't wait for JGPF!
 
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