They were so different.
Torgashev debuted his self-choreographed short program to "Bloodstream" by Tokio Myers (incorporates a version of Debussy's "Clair de Lune" in the beginning) at the Peggy Fleming Trophy last night. If anyone finds a link to a fan cam, please post.Andrew Torgashev getting 9.5s for PCS from judges! What is this program? I wanna see it!!
I've posted a link to the rules ( http://broadmoorskatingclub.com/peggy-fleming-artistic-trophy/ ) in this post in the Broadmoor Open competition thread (ETA: Kiss & Cry section requires an account upgrade/subscription as of 6/30/19): https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/threads/2019-broadmoor-open-june-25-29-peggy-fleming-trophy-6-28-aerial-challenge-6-29.105745/page-4#post-5603204Apparently men and women compete against each other in this "artistic free program". I wonder what are the tech rules?
The rules for a Peggy Fleming Trophy program are a bit different to rules for an IJS SP, and required spins are different:Andrew’s choreography is so stunning, that I got so lost in it I completely forgot about the technical elements. I had to go back watch and purposefully watch to see if all three spins were in the program or not-it just flowed so well together, the spins disappeared.
For those who are better at identifying IJS spins, do his spins meet the requirements to get level four? One of the spins is surprisingly short, but he does these outrageous butterflies (I think that’s what they’re called?), I was wondering if he managed to meet the requirements in a super creative way, or if he will need to adjust the spins for regular competition. Does anyone know?
I agree that early season competitions are not indicative of how a skater will fare over the course of a season. But this program by Andrew definitely shows growth, confidence and maturity. While Andrew has always been a lovely artistic skater with wonderful skating skills, he has previously lacked confidence and competitive consistency.Um, what Andrew Torgashev has everyone else been watching to think that this is such a dramatic artistic improvement?
This program reminded me so much of his FS to Roxanne, which he has been skating for two years now. The step sequence in that program is stunning.
As a semi-long time fan, I think everyone should get on the Andrew T. train, but be forewarned it may be a bumpy ride. Great one comp, the next, a struggle. I'd love for that to be done, but I'll believe it when I see it.
And of course, as a longer time (but not by much) Jason fan, any comp where Jason and Andrew T. finish one two is .
As @el henry has observed, Andrew has always been gifted artistically, and blessed with great skating skills too. The real difference I think we are seeing in this latest performance, is in maturity, confidence-level, and overall growth as a person and an athlete. He was always good with musical interpretation, but this program takes it up a notch. Added to that, Andrew choreographed it himself, another sign of confidence and maturity, as well as huge talent that he's always possessed.Wow Torgashev has really improved artistically with the new program!
And there's no doubt we know the reason why that occurs. At least, the rules have been changed to encourage more focus on artistry (but rules changes are always a work-in-progress). Meanwhile, it's not Nathan's fault that he's focused on giving the sport what it demands in order for him to win. He's also showing creativity as much as he can, where he can within reason, since as we know, quads take up a great deal of mental and physical energy.There's a reason I always like Nathan's SPs more than his FS - he has space for choreography and expression when he's limited in the jumping. Can he have good artistry? Absolutely. Does he drop a lot of it to cram in quads? Definitely.
Who said anything about Nathan being a victim! Are you just trying to drum up a useless argument or what?I’m not sure what your point is. Nathan isn’t a victim here. He made a conscious choice to focus on jumps at the expense of other things because he wants to win. I don’t think he deserves extra credit for trying to show a little “artistry” despite having to contend with all those big, bad quads, any more than we give extra credit to guys who land quads in practice but not in competition.
Please stop with the eye rolls and don’t tell me what I should or shouldn’t talk about.Who said anything about Nathan being a victim! Are you just trying to drum up a useless argument or what?
Of course he made a 'conscious choice,' based on what the sport has demanded in this current climate. Obviously, the sport rewards jump difficulty. Nathan is a talented jumper and he loves to jump, and he wants to win! So he focused heavily on mastering quad revolutions, which necessarily takes focus and energy away from choreo and aesthetics. That does not mean he has no artistic chops, which is the point of showing people who denigrate that aspect of his skating, what Nathan has done in the past with a gorgeous, artistic competitive program as a junior. Note the enormous praise by the CBC commentators, including Kurt Browning, who knows whereof he speaks. For that matter, no one should be ignoring what Nathan has been able to accomplish creatively as a senior.
At junior Worlds in 2015, Nathan was still learning jump mastery and he needed to develop more power, which obviously happened. He currently continues to possess musicality and his own unique grace and creativity, so he's not ignoring aesthetics. He just can't spend the time he might wish on aesthetics, particularly in his fps, because he must heavily focus on the jumps to build enough points to win. What do fans want these skaters to do? Stop with the complaining and criticizing already! That's my point.
Who said squirt about giving Nathan 'extra credit'? Just give him due credit, or stop talking about him altogether.
It's not the system's fault either. Nathan chooses to focus on quads. That's his prerogative. He could skate programs with more artistry and performance if he wanted to, and maybe not win, but he doesn't. That's certainly his choice, but I don't have to like it or think that the current scoring system forced him to do it that way. And for what it's worth, I felt his junior program was just OK in terms of artistry, not some shining beacon of budding creative genius.Meanwhile, it's not Nathan's fault that he's focused on giving the sport what it demands in order for him to win.
I don't know that "inane and useless" is what's happening, but if you want nothing but sunshine and light, stick to the fan threads. There's nothing wrong with critical analysis of skaters and their programs, not all of which is going to be positive.I actually came to this thread earlier today to talk about something positive, not to engage in back-and-forth bickering. I really do not understand why we can't relax and be happy for the skaters, and share positive thoughts about some of the programs we are looking forward to seeing this coming season, instead of falling into inane and useless arguments over nothing.
I’m actually not interested in feuding with anyone.Perhaps posters could take personal feuds to PM.
"Portrait of a Skater - Camden Pulkinen" also was posted on USFS' YT channel on July 9: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY2GUozR6sUUS Figure Skating just made a nearly 3 minute video about Camden Pulkinen. This Instagram post contains a brief excerpt (full link on their Instagram TV). Anyone know if this is part of a series or if they’ve done one on Tomoki, Alexei, Andrew T, or other rising stars? I’m kinda curious as to why it was made
Vincent's "Moments of the Season" video ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irn38cPz-Ak ) is embedded in this July 11th article about him (more to come in the August/September issue of SKATING magazine): https://usfigureskatingfanzone.com/news/2019/7/11/figure-skating-ever-searching-for-more-zhou-takes-on-new-challenge.aspxUSFS just posted this brief video about Vincent, but it is stylistically quite different from the one with Camden:
thank you for posting this!"Portrait of a Skater - Camden Pulkinen" also was posted on USFS' YT channel on July 9: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY2GUozR6sU
I don't know if there will be similar videos forthcoming.
Vincent's "Moments of the Season" video ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irn38cPz-Ak ) is embedded in this July 11th article about him (more to come in the August/September issue of SKATING magazine): https://usfigureskatingfanzone.com/news/2019/7/11/figure-skating-ever-searching-for-more-zhou-takes-on-new-challenge.aspx