Pairs Discussion Thread 2017-18--"Two Skating as One"

Mad for Skating

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Any word on whether they will compete another season?

I believe one more year!

Vanessa will turn 31 at the beginning of this season so I can see why she might retire, but isn't Morgan like 27? He could go another few years with a different partner. Although I will say that seeing Morgan without Vanessa would be WEIRD, and I'm not sure if anyone could replicate their unique chemistry. It would be very interesting to see him with a different partner.
 

aftershocks

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Cross-posting from ISU Congress thread re the new pairs rules changes. Also, finally 20 pairs can advance again to the fp at Worlds. No-brainer :duh:

I'm reading the SYWTWFS summary of day 4 and the pairs are now allowed to do lifts with more than 3.5 rotations? And they can do show style moves where the guy is swinging his partner around, by holding her just by her neck/feet/hands, which also used to be illegal? And all lifts in FS must be from different groups in FS (also in seniors) so no more programs with 2 lasso lifts?
Whoah. Those are pretty significant changes! :watch:

Wowza! Wowzers! :watch: :encore: I can't wait to see the creative possibilities this may unleash!

Well, there was a lot of excitement surrounding James/Cipres' 2016-2017 Earned It sp. There was the boffo 'leap of faith' move suggested by Jeremy Barrett that he used to perform with Caydee Denney:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rEWL-Mb8XI

Here's former partners Castelli/Tran in an exhibition during which the 'swinging partner by the neck move' is sexily demonstrated starting in a sequence of moves at 2:20. The entire program is fun to watch, with some other exciting moves at 1:24 and 1:52 :swoon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVAqIyTNpCU

This blast from the past of hot sexy chemistry and cool moves is a big reason why I continue to love watching this former pair. The entire program is thrilling, especially check out the upside down, leg split entry into the 'Look, Ma, no hands' move at 2:05, and the variation swing move at 3:18 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsS7n3Vpybs

And here's another inventive exhibition from the same pair: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOB8Jhydk44

The headbanger move by J/C at 3:58 in this exhibition is fabulous, but maybe their ending 'no-hands spinning with partner on top of head' move might be taking things too far. ;) I think they're the only pair who are doing that particular variation move in exhibition: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCpQoT2r7Uw

A lovely demonstration of lifts and cool moves by a young adagio pair team, Artem & Darya Fadeevs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_19_xzwaIg :inavoid:

And this adagio couple: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n11UbueyVFc :watch:

Here's an interesting article I missed in the lead-up to the Olympics which actually foreshadows the pairs rules change, with a focus unsurprisingly, on James/Cipres and Savchenko/Massot discussing the revolutionary influence of ice dance on pairs programs that 'mix heart with cool dance grooves and acrobatics':
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...-era-with-disturbed-dance-moves-idUSKCN1FY0BH
 

aftershocks

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Definitely one more year at least. Vanessa posted on Twitter that they've just finished their free skate choreography, working with Charlie White: https://twitter.com/VanessaJamessk8/status/1004488022270889985 No news on music yet, though.

Interesting. I wonder did J/C get to talking with Charlie on tour or something and they mutually decided to work together? Or did Charlie approach them with an idea? What else has Charlie done in terms of choreo? I know he worked with Vincent Zhou last season, but Zhou didn't keep the program because the music wasn't quite right for him and the way his team approached putting it altogether like paint by numbers wasn't the best.

I haven't heard that J/C announced their sp yet. Perhaps they worked with John Kerr, Barrett and Fontana again on their sp? I hope.
 

RoseRed

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Interesting. I wonder did J/C get to talking with Charlie on tour or something and they mutually decided to work together? Or did Charlie approach them with an idea? What else has Charlie done in terms of choreo? I know he worked with Vincent Zhou last season, but Zhou didn't keep the program because the music wasn't quite right for him and the way his team approached putting it altogether like paint by numbers wasn't the best.

I haven't heard that J/C announced their sp yet. Perhaps they worked with John Kerr, Barrett and Fontana again on their sp? I hope.
On tour where? When have they been on the same tour recently?
 

aftershocks

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On tour where? When have they been on the same tour recently?

Of course I don't know if they've ever toured together. I'm speculating and asking questions. It's possible that when Vanessa asked for music ideas from fans, Charlie may have had an idea and contacted them. Or who knows, they could have talked sometime ago about working together some day. Until and unless they explain how they hooked up, it's unknown.
 

Sylvia

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mpal2

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Has Charlie done choreography before? I'm seeing his name a lot lately.
 

aftershocks

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^^ Yep @mpal2, my question is how much has Charlie done before? I know he's had a lot of interest in working with skaters even before he stopped competing eligibly, e.g., on edgework. I know Charlie did some choreo for Vincent Zhou last season, but Vincent's coaching staff didn't really approach the experience effectively because they were more intent on Vincent rotating multiple quads rather than focusing on a cohesive program. Ultimately, the music chosen in a paint by numbers way did not work for Vincent (he couldn't keep up with the tempo) and they didn't keep that program.

Therefore, that's not a good example of what Charlie can do. So, who else has Charlie choreographed for?

Haven Denney (who rarely posts on social media) thanked Charlie White yesterday for choreographing her and Brandon Frazier's programs (plural): https://www.instagram.com/p/Bjs81CPls-h/?taken-by=havendenney1028

Morgan Cipres' IG post mentioned that White was with their group in Florida for 2 weeks: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjsLXJ2B0YA/?taken-by=morgan2477

Cool. Perhaps the coaching staff recruited Charlie to come down and spend time working on programs for their top teams. Perhaps John Kerr is busy and not around as often. I don't think that Kerr ever made the new Florida Hospital Center Ice rink his home base.

In any case, the article I linked earlier continues to resonate re the fact of ice dance influence on pairs choreography, since Charlie is another ice dancer turned choreographer who is shaking things up. Pasquale Camerlengo is working on choreo for both of Cain/LeDuc's programs this season. Also, Shae Lynn Bourne is obviously one of the pioneer choreographers who is a former ice dancer. Shae Lynn of course has worked with a number of singles skaters. And she collaborated with Shae Zukiwsky on the choreo for Tarah/Danny's Swan Lake fp (which hopefully they are keeping this coming season). In their latest blog update, Tarah & Danny said they are working with Shae Lynn Bourne and Shae Zukiwsky again on a new sp.

And, now I see it's confirmed on T/D's website they are keeping the Swan Lake fp for next season:
http://figureskatersonline.com/kayne-oshea/programs/
 
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Sylvia

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Has Charlie done choreography before? I'm seeing his name a lot lately.
... my question is how much has Charlie done before?
Discussed here: https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/th...-a-wonderful-world.99259/page-34#post-5372438

Looks like Benoit Richaud choreographed programs (plural) for the Knierims: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjnUCNJjS-I/?taken-by=benoitrichaud
Alexa commented: "Can’t wait to enhance the programs as the season progresses."
 

AngieNikodinovLove

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Looks like Benoit Richaud choreographed programs (plural) for the Knierims: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjnUCNJjS-I/?taken-by=benoitrichaud
Alexa commented: "Can’t wait to enhance the programs as the season progresses."

Do we know what the programs are yet?

And can you refresh my drink for Pride, what are some of the recent programs he has choreographed??

ADDED LATER: hmmmm, if he gave Toth Carmen, Bradie Tennel R&J.... I guess i can only assume The Knierims have POTO and Scherezade?
 
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aftershocks

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Robin Szolkowy is organizing his "First International Pair Skating Camp" in Engelberg, Switzerland in July: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjAy3v8jl1L/?taken-by=robin_szolkowy

Hey, that's cool. And the venue sounds lovely too.

And once again, the article I linked earlier about ice dance moves revolutionizing pairs programs is apt, as the influence of ice dance on pairs choreo continues apace: Camerlengo choreographing both programs for Cain/LeDuc. Charlie White choreographing both programs for Haven/Brandon, and fp for French pair James/Cipres. Dubreuil/Lauzon choreographing for Deanna/Nate. John Kerr choreographing for Italian pair Della Monica/Guarise. Shae Lynn's choreo for Kayne/O'Shea...
 

AngieNikodinovLove

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@AngieNikodinovLove Recent Benoit Richaud programs, aside from the two you've mentioned:
- Mai Mihara 2017-18 SP (Libertango)
- Kaori Sakamoto 2017-18 SP and FS (Moonlight Sonata & Amélie)
- Bradie Tennell 2017-18 FS (Cinderella)
- Ivett Toth 2017-18 SP (AC/DC)
- Michal Brezina 2017-18 FS (Human)

Thanks guys.

People bemoaned Bradie's Cinderella... was it just b/c a Disney piece for someone more mature? or because his choreo? because I did like Kaori's choreo.

I see he didnt do any pairs or dance so then are The Knierims his first?

I WAS SO HOOOOPPPINGGGGGGGG whoever choreographed Savchenko & Massot's programs would be doing the Knierims.........

Other than Kaori...none of those programs above stood out to me.... :(
 

aftershocks

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I WAS SO HOOOOPPPINGGGGGGGG whoever choreographed Savchenko & Massot's programs would be doing the Knierims.........

John Kerr choreographed S/M's sp That Man (which they went back to for the Olympics). Chris Dean choreographed S/M's fp La Terre Vue du Ciel.

Chris Dean is likely selective about who he works with, and John Kerr is apparently busy... If I'm not mistaken, didn't Alexa & Chris try working with Chris Dean last season, but then went back to their previous season's programs? Was it Dean or someone else? @Sylvia to the rescue. :saint: Thanks in advance. :)
 

barbarafan

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Hey, that's cool. And the venue sounds lovely too.

And once again, the article I linked earlier about ice dance moves revolutionizing pairs programs is apt, as the influence of ice dance on pairs choreo continues apace: Camerlengo choreographing both programs for Cain/LeDuc. Charlie White choreographing both programs for Haven/Brandon, and fp for French pair James/Cipres. Dubreuil/Lauzon choreographing for Deanna/Nate. John Kerr choreographing for Italian pair Della Monica/Guarise. Shae Lynn's choreo for Kayne/O'Shea...
and I/M had Dubreuil for their short programs.
 

Sylvia

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If I'm not mistaken, didn't Alexa & Chris try working with Chris Dean last season, but then went back to their previous season's programs?
Christopher Dean choreographed a Chaplin-themed FS for the Knierims last season but they ended up going back to Ghost at Champs Camp. IIRC, they had left open the possibility of returning to Chaplin in the future, but that was well before they made their coaching change.
 

aftershocks

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Christopher Dean choreographed a Chaplin-themed FS for the Knierims last season but they ended up going back to Ghost at Champs Camp. IIRC, they had left open the possibility of returning to Chaplin in the future, but that was well before they made their coaching change.

Yes, thanks. I thought it was Chris Dean, but I didn't know what music or theme. I recall hearing that Chris & Alexa weren't finding the choreo easy to execute, and Dean was a bit frustrated too regarding their edgework abilities (unsurprising for an ice dance choreographer). Actually, Dean is not an easy choreographer to work with. He's done excellent programs for many skaters and ice dancers though. Gilles/Poirier come to mind, with some of their early competitive programs together choreographed by Dean.

and I/M had Dubreuil for their short programs.

Yep, Dubreuil also worked on programs for Julianne & Charlie I believe.
 

misskarne

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Katia and Harley are moving to Montreal to be coached by Gauthier!

Well! See you soon Australia. Katia and I are moving our main training base to montreal from this weekend to work with Richard Gauthier and his coaching team. But firstly, we want to thank Nina Mozer for everything she has done. Nina started our pair team and has taught us good discipline. A big, big thank you for letting us skate in Moscow. We are extremely grateful to Andrei and Galina Pachin. Their vision and commitment is why we were able to start at all. Andrei and Galina believed we could be a good pair and helped build our careers. We are very thankful to both of them for all they have done. We are excited and motivated to start new opportunities and to keep pushing ourselves. Our short program choreography starts next week with Julie Marcotte in Montreal and the following week with Massimo Scali in Detroit for our free program. Really looking forward to it all. @owi_aus @nswinstituteofsport@iceskatingaustralia @johnwilsonblades@edeaskates
 

aftershocks

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So add Massimo Scali to the mix of former ice dancers choreographing for pairs skaters. :) Good luck to Katia and Harley.

Oh, and of course, I have to add that the pairs discipline has also influenced dance moves too, including pairs combo spin and some angular moves and off-angle slides we see in ice dance programs.
 
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Mad for Skating

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Cross-posting from ISU Congress thread re the new pairs rules changes. Also, finally 20 pairs can advance again to the fp at Worlds. No-brainer :duh:



Wowza! Wowzers! :watch: :encore: I can't wait to see the creative possibilities this may unleash!

Well, there was a lot of excitement surrounding James/Cipres' 2016-2017 Earned It sp. There was the boffo 'leap of faith' move suggested by Jeremy Barrett that he used to perform with Caydee Denney:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rEWL-Mb8XI

Here's former partners Castelli/Tran in an exhibition during which the 'swinging partner by the neck move' is sexily demonstrated starting in a sequence of moves at 2:20. The entire program is fun to watch, with some other exciting moves at 1:24 and 1:52 :swoon: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nVAqIyTNpCU

This blast from the past of hot sexy chemistry and cool moves is a big reason why I continue to love watching this former pair. The entire program is thrilling, especially check out the upside down, leg split entry into the 'Look, Ma, no hands' move at 2:05, and the variation swing move at 3:18 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JsS7n3Vpybs

And here's another inventive exhibition from the same pair: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOB8Jhydk44

The headbanger move by J/C at 3:58 in this exhibition is fabulous, but maybe their ending 'no-hands spinning with partner on top of head' move might be taking things too far. ;) I think they're the only pair who are doing that particular variation move in exhibition: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCpQoT2r7Uw

A lovely demonstration of lifts and cool moves by a young adagio pair team, Artem & Darya Fadeevs:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O_19_xzwaIg :inavoid:

And this adagio couple: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n11UbueyVFc :watch:

Here's an interesting article I missed in the lead-up to the Olympics which actually foreshadows the pairs rules change, with a focus unsurprisingly, on James/Cipres and Savchenko/Massot discussing the revolutionary influence of ice dance on pairs programs that 'mix heart with cool dance grooves and acrobatics':
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...-era-with-disturbed-dance-moves-idUSKCN1FY0BH

Can we just take a minute to admire that stunning gala Castelli/Tran did? Even if the results never quite came together for them, I'm going to thank them for teaming up simply to bless us with that gala.
 

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