"No one knows Mirai's mirai" Nagasu cheer thread

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

When I think about it, I still fume about how Mirai was screwed out of her spot in 2014.

Which is why I am loving her post - skate recaps on YouTube from the US Classic last week. You can tell this year it is all or nothing for her, and furthermore, I love that she doesn't give two f**** anymore about the USFSA.

 

[mag]

Mirai was not "screwed out of her spot in 2014." She never had a spot to be screwed out of. From what I have heard, all the athletes were well aware of the "body of work" rule.

 

[giselle23]

Mirai was not "screwed out of her spot in 2014." She never had a spot to be screwed out of. From what I have heard, all the athletes were well aware of the "body of work" rule.

How very cheery of you to post this on the Mirai cheer thread!

 

[kwanatic]

How very cheery of you to post this on the Mirai cheer thread!

Granted this is a Mirai cheer thread, we do have to be realistic about the situation in 2014. I was absolutely heartbroken for Mirai but the truth was she just hadn't done enough to earn the trust of the federation to send her to Sochi. The spark she showed at nationals that year was too little too late. It was somewhat of a precedent not to chose the 3rd place finisher at nationals that year but Ashley was the obvious choice because of what she'd done for the 3.5 years leading up to the Sochi Olympics. It's easier to forgive one off competition than it is to bet on one strong competition.

However, the past is the past and it's obvious Mirai has learned from it. Since 2014 the evidence is clear that she has been working on her skating. She's been top 5 at nationals the last 2 years in a row and she's showing that she wants it more than ever. She has a strong coach behind her (remember she didn't even have a coach last time) and she's been making steady improvements year over year. Unlike last time she has a very strong case for one of those spots.

I don't know why but I really feel like she's going to get one of those spots this time. She's looking strong early and that's a good sign as it usually takes her a while to get going. I'm hoping her GPs go well and she kills at nationals and gets one of those spots. She's been working hard and she definitely deserves it this time. It's just up to her to make it happen.

 

[bardtoob]

And 4 years later Mirai has 3A and who else has made such a technical leap

 

[Coco]

I don't have issues with Ashley being taken over Mirai, an argument could have been made for either skater in 2014. My beef was with Polina going over Mirai. As I recall, Polina never had such high PCS as 2014 Nationals, at least not until 2016 Nationals.

 

[bardtoob]

I remember prior to 2014 that Mirai's coach moved away, and she was not able to follow. I also remember Gracie leaving her coach and going to Mirai's coach ... Leaving Mirai with no top level coach because if she couldn't move to Palm Springs, then she certainly couldn't move out of state since Nicks and Rafael were not available.

... I also always thought that the benefit of team Polina at the Olympics was that the US had an additional credentialed Russian speaking coach, Polina's mom.

 

[Sasha'sSpins]

I don't have issues with Ashley being taken over Mirai, an argument could have been made for either skater in 2014. My beef was with Polina going over Mirai. As I recall, Polina never had such high PCS as 2014 Nationals, at least not until 2016 Nationals.

I was going to say but you beat me to it. It was never Ashley but Polina's 'body of work' that I had a problem with versus Mirai. Also, Imo Nagasu should have placed 2nd that year not 3rd.

Anyway - I hope Mirai goes out guns blazing this GP season and Nationals no matter what happens - and with her head held high.

 

[aftershocks]

Mirai was not "screwed out of her spot in 2014." She never had a spot to be screwed out of. From what I have heard, all the athletes were well aware of the "body of work" rule.

That's your opinion, which is not written in stone. Mirai placed third at 2014 U.S. championships, but she skated well enough to have placed second overall (so even her third place is debatable). In any case, her third place showing is the 'spot' that is being referenced. The 'body of work' rule was set in stone last year by USFS. Prior to that it wasn't completely well-defined, and generally skaters who medaled at Nationals were sent to Worlds and Olympics, with some exceptions most often related to medical byes. Of course that year, Ashley and Gracie were considered shoo-ins to make the team due to their high level accomplishments. Ashley made the GPF that season, and Gracie didn't (although Gracie was highly favored by USFS and she had been advised to work with Frank Carroll -- so it was the beginning of their coaching relationship which started out in promising fashion).

There was every reason for Mirai to anticipate making the Olympic team after how well she skated. She was not perfect, but I felt she deserved to be in second place, and that there was some manipulation of the scoring in both sp and fp. My opinion is that Polina who skated very well, was still a bit over-scored, especially in her senior debut. Everyone has their opinion, and it was a tough situation. But the final decision did 'screw over' Mirai, no matter how some people now like to remember the details.

... she just hadn't done enough to earn the trust of the federation to send her to Sochi... Since 2014 the evidence is clear that she has been working on her skating... I really feel like she's going to get one of those spots this time. She's looking strong early and that's a good sign as it usually takes her a while to get going. I'm hoping her GPs go well and she kills at nationals and gets one of those spots. She's been working hard and she definitely deserves it this time. It's just up to her to make it happen.

You know, there are very different opinions about that volatile and extremely emotional set of circumstances from 2014 @kwanatic. I realize what you are saying, but I disagree with you in some respects. Everyone has their perception and view of what happened and why amongst all those involved (skaters and officials). However, I disagree with trying to paint it as Mirai's fault that she didn't make the Olympic team that year, or that she didn't do enough! She did enough on the ice. She was at that point and she has been out of political favor with some members of USFS for a number of reasons, with many of those reasons being out of her control. Kudos to Tom Z for agreeing to coach Mirai when some busybodies told him he shouldn't.

Mirai has moved on and she has shown some grit for even being where she is today, and for being as strong and fit as she is mentally and physically. I'm not sure what you mean by suggesting that Mirai previously did not work on her skating? Are you basing your negative comments off of rumors, or do you have some actual proven facts you can lay out? Why do you think she deserves it now, and not in 2014?

I do agree with you that it is Mirai who must make things happen. She did have an opportunity last season that she was unable to grab. There is certainly a lot that's possible to tweak her about, as there is for most skaters. But for Mirai on here, she's one of those skaters who get worked over pretty regularly in a way that's habit-forming. Personally, I'm just going to watch, root for Mirai and for all the skaters I enjoy, and try to reserve overly harsh judgments of Mirai, especially regarding what hasn't happened yet.

Anyone here who is intent on the infectious habit of over-criticizing Mirai and harshly judging her to some never reachable standard, please go do it somewhere else, and not in her cheer thread! Please and thank you.

 

[bardtoob]

Hmmm ...

Wow! Mirai was really good in 2014 US Nationals SP.

OMG! Mirai's 2014 US Nationals LP looks better than I remember! Scott said she looked winded and like she was conserving energy, but now, to me, it looks like she was controlling her breathing to stay focused. Whoever was coaching Mirai was doing a good job.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

It's mind-boggling but wonderful at the same time, elite skaters like Caroline Zhang, Mirai, and Ashley are a major part of the conversation leading into 2018, ten years after they made their debut at the national senior level.

How they have been able to maintain that kind of intensity, drive, and focus for the last ten years, is a testament to their talent, and of course, grit.

 

[aftershocks]

Hmmm ...

Wow! Mirai was really good in 2014 US Nationals SP.

OMG! Mirai's 2014 US Nationals LP looks better than I remember! Scott said she looked winded and like she was conserving energy, but now, to me, it looks like she was controlling her breathing to stay focused. Amy Evidente was doing a good job.

^^ Thanks, but I don't think Evidente was still working with Mirai by then. She didn't have a coach at that point. Heck, if Mirai had been 'in favor' at that point in time, a sp delivered like that could/ should have landed her even in first place! It's just that USFS was 'all-in' on promoting Gracie Gold, understandably, but still. I had the impression that TPTB in U.S. fed were hoping to anoint Gracie and therefore the judges seemed much more casual about where Ashley was positioned (since it was clear Ashley would make the team regardless -- they just seemingly preferred not to send Ashley as U.S. champion, despite the fact she was the only U.S. lady to make GPF two years in a row). Plus, Ashley made a mistake in the sp, which gave them the opportunity that was seemingly relished, to mark her down which kept her a distance away from Gracie in the scoring. However, with Ashley's stature, I felt she was pushed down a bit too much in the sp marks. It was apparently expected that Ashley would skate up in the fp, but unfortunately Ashley succumbed to enormous pressure in the fp.

Meanwhile, Polina was the up-and-coming new darling phenom, who unexpectedly performed exceedingly well in the sp. But she didn't perform so well as to necessarily be marked as high as she was in both programs. In the fp, both Gracie and Polina fell once. Although, Mirai was criticized for moving slowly at some points in the fp with a determined look on her face, she did not fall or make any egregious errors. Ashley faltered in a way she could not afford, especially being in 4th place after the sp.

Of course, the status quo excuse has been that Mirai did not have a coach, and that she was unreliable, and whatever else the rumors and gossip were. To be honest, I think Mirai was in the doghouse with USFS for many years after she did not live up to being the second coming of Michelle Kwan. And that's a heavy load for anyone to carry around, and have to constantly defend against and try to shed, especially when it's not of your making.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

^^ Thanks, but I don't think Evidente was still working with Mirai by then. She didn't have a coach at that point. Heck, if Mirai had been 'in favor' at that point in time, a sp delivered like that could/ should have landed her even in first place! It's just that USFS was 'all-in' on promoting Gracie Gold, understandably, but still. I had the impression that TPTB in U.S. fed were hoping to anoint Gracie and therefore the judges seemed much more casual about where Ashley was positioned (since it was clear Ashley would make the team regardless -- they just seemingly preferred not to send Ashley as U.S. champion, despite the fact she was the only U.S. lady to make GPF two years in a row). Plus, Ashley made a mistake in the sp, which gave them the opportunity that was seemingly relished, to mark her down which kept her a distance away from Gracie in the scoring. However, with Ashley's stature, I felt she was pushed down a bit too much in the sp marks. It was apparently expected that Ashley would skate up in the fp, but unfortunately Ashley succumbed to enormous pressure in the fp.

Meanwhile, Polina was the up-and-coming new darling phenom, who unexpectedly performed exceedingly well in the sp. But she didn't perform so well as to necessarily be marked as high as she was in both programs. In the fp, both Gracie and Polina fell once. Although, Mirai was criticized for moving slowly at some points in the fp with a determined look on her face, she did not fall or make any egregious errors. Ashley faltered in a way she could not afford, especially being in 4th place after the sp.

Of course, the status quo excuse has been that Mirai did not have a coach, and that she was unreliable, and whatever else the rumors and gossip were. To be honest, I think Mirai was in the doghouse with USFS for many years after she did not live up to being the second coming of Michelle Kwan. And that's a heavy load for anyone to carry around, and have to constantly defend against and try to shed, especially when it's not of your making.

So many of the top ladies have had to walk through fire at some point, Nagasu, Zhang, and Wagner, included. It's sad to think it was Gold's turn last year, too.

Here's hoping everyone brings their A Game to San Jose!

 

[aftershocks]

So many of the top ladies have had to walk through fire at some point, Nagasu, Zhang, and Wagner, included. It's sad to think it was Gold's turn last year, too.

Here's hoping everyone brings their A Game to San Jose!

Ah yes, no one escapes the fire ... and everyone deals with putting out the flames and dealing with the pressure differently. It's not just a tough sport. Quite often, it's an impossible sport. But still we watch, and still young athletes dream...

 

[giselle23]

Granted this is a Mirai cheer thread, we do have to be realistic about the situation in 2014. I was absolutely heartbroken for Mirai but the truth was she just hadn't done enough to earn the trust of the federation to send her to Sochi. The spark she showed at nationals that year was too little too late. It was somewhat of a precedent not to chose the 3rd place finisher at nationals that year but Ashley was the obvious choice because of what she'd done for the 3.5 years leading up to the Sochi Olympics. It's easier to forgive one off competition than it is to bet on one strong competition.

However, the past is the past and it's obvious Mirai has learned from it. Since 2014 the evidence is clear that she has been working on her skating. She's been top 5 at nationals the last 2 years in a row and she's showing that she wants it more than ever. She has a strong coach behind her (remember she didn't even have a coach last time) and she's been making steady improvements year over year. Unlike last time she has a very strong case for one of those spots.

I don't know why but I really feel like she's going to get one of those spots this time. She's looking strong early and that's a good sign as it usually takes her a while to get going. I'm hoping her GPs go well and she kills at nationals and gets one of those spots. She's been working hard and she definitely deserves it this time. It's just up to her to make it happen.

When someone states that something that is clearly an opinion--and still a matter of debate--is wrong, it is not "cheery."
Take it to another thread.

 

[nguyhm]

And just look at Mirai now, gun blazing with a beautiful 3A at her age and after what she's been through - broken hearted and in tears in 2014, lackluster and boot issues in 2015 yet she never gave up, went to worlds in 2016 (ironically enough in place of Polina) and placed among top 10. 2017 was another test, so close yet slipped away again but then she moved on and excelled with the 3A and went down in history as one of the few ladies delivering it at an international lSU sanctioned competition (did I already say at "her age"). Excited for Mirai but still holding my breath (a little less than years before). Her perseverance alone is admirable and redemption is "sweet". Go Mirai

 

[bardtoob]

Mirai was in the doghouse with USFS for many years after she did not live up to being the second coming of Michelle Kwan.

And who has lived up to being Michelle Kwan

 

[aftershocks]

And who has lived up to being Michelle Kwan

^^ Ah yes, no one, which is sadly and unfortunately the point of course (and probably the reason for your bookend ).

And mayhap by now, hopefully, a very hard lesson learned by USFS?

 

[kwanatic]

I'm not sure what you mean by suggesting that Mirai previously did not work on her skating? Are you basing your negative comments off of rumors, or do you have some actual proven facts you can lay out? Why do you think she deserves it now, and not in 2014?

Anyone here who is intent on the infectious habit of over-criticizing Mirai and harshly judging her to some never reachable standard, please go do it somewhere else, and not in her cheer thread! Please and thank you.

As this is a Mirai cheer thread I'm not going to incite the anger of the thread by going into a detailed response as to why I didn't disagree with the decision that year.

I will say that my comments were in no way intended to be negative but, I can see how dedicated fans may have taken offense to them. It was just my opinion and obviously you have a different opinion. However I would like to note that an opinion that is contrary to your opinion does not make that opinion negative; it's just a different opinion. BUT as this is a Mirai cheer thread and I want to respect that, from now on I will remember to leave my constructive criticism and opinions at the door. This isn't the place for it.

I'm a fan of Mirai and I'm proud of her. She's grown a lot over the past few years and I feel like she's in the perfect position to peak at the right time. I'm cheering her on hard this year.

 

[bardtoob]

BUT as this is a Mirai cheer thread and I want to respect that, from now on I will remember to leave my constructive criticism at the door. This isn't the place for it.

And here I was writing 200+ words about how to fix this season's LP choreography sequence in the Mirai Cheer Thread, thinking that was constructive criticism.

https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/th...agasu-cheer-thread.98454/page-33#post-5133397

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

And here I was writing 200+ words about how to fix this season's LP choreography sequence in the Mirai Cheer Thread, thinking that was constructive criticism.

It's an easy place to go to, I guess. Only because we want her to do well, and maximise her potential.

On top of that, IJS is such a layered system with so many details to consider, politics not withstanding.

 

[kwanatic]

And here I was writing 200+ words about how to fix this season's LP choreography sequence in the Mirai Cheer Thread, thinking that was constructive criticism.

https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/th...agasu-cheer-thread.98454/page-33#post-5133397

Touche'. That's definitely constructive criticism. Good changes too!

I think that program has really good bones...best she's had in a while. The music suits her and I loooove her dress! Main thing she's lacking right now is speed (which you mentioned). The impact is somewhat loss when she doesn't cover the ice as well. I'm hoping as the season progresses and she gets more settled into the program they can add those little extra movements and moments to make it special.

 

[bardtoob]

I think that program has really good bones...best she's had in a while. The music suits her and I loooove her dress! Main thing she's lacking right now is speed (which you mentioned). The impact is somewhat loss when she doesn't cover the ice as well. I'm hoping as the season progresses and she gets more settled into the program they can add those little extra movements and moments to make it special.

Being "delicate" like the character is not her friend when trying to project to an arena and audience. She needs to really reach and skate with power . . . also skating slow is not friendly to her jumps.

 

[Jammers]

It's mind-boggling but wonderful at the same time, elite skaters like Caroline Zhang, Mirai, and Ashley are a major part of the conversation leading into 2018, ten years after they made their debut at the national senior level.

How they have been able to maintain that kind of intensity, drive, and focus for the last ten years, is a testament to their talent, and of course, grit.

It also sadly says about the lack of top quality young skaters who should have taken over by now for the US.

 

[Spun Silver]

^^ Being delicate is not Mirai's thing. Never has been. She should create her own character. I've never seen MS (not a big musical fan) but assuming its story line is similar to Madama Butterfly, Mirai should do an alternative feminist Butterfly who boots Pinkerton's ass out of Japan and celebrates her own ability to overcome pain and live her life. Doesnt that sound more like Mirai?

I love Mao's (and Mao and Jeff's) versions too, but they are not for our girl.

 

[aftershocks]

Touche'. That's definitely constructive criticism. Good changes too!

I think that program has really good bones...best she's had in a while. The music suits her and I loooove her dress! Main thing she's lacking right now is speed (which you mentioned). The impact is somewhat loss when she doesn't cover the ice as well. I'm hoping as the season progresses and she gets more settled into the program they can add those little extra movements and moments to make it special.

Yep, those of us who enjoy Mirai's skating want her to succeed, and so yes it can be frustrating to have seen her not do as well as her huge talent would seem to dictate over the years. Nationals 2014 was definitely a volatile, highly emotional situation all-around for a lot of skaters and fans. For Mirai, it followed from her devastation of the previous season. So for her to skate so well, and then to be pushed out of going to the Olympics obviously because she wasn't favored and not because she didn't skate well, was definitely unfair. And everyone knows it was unfair too. That's why so many skaters and fans rallied to support her during that upsetting episode. I'm sure she made some mistakes at times, but honestly I blame the adults involved more than Mirai, and especially those who pettily gossiped and tried to undermine her when she first had the opportunity to train with Tom Z. I realize that her mistakes and her less than stellar results gave her a poor reputation, and also that TPTB did not want to see her go to the Olympics without a coach in 2014.

The thing is that it's not Mirai's fault for having family issues and maturing issues to deal with during an important time in her development as a young skater. Plus, she clearly was not working with the right coach for her, and that was a large part of the problem that the adults involved need to learn from. When a coaching situation is not working, why force it down a young skater's throat? Mirai was so uninspired and so wrongly packaged for a few years there. She was not/is not Michelle Kwan and there should not have been an attempt to place her in that box. It didn't fit.

I'm glad for Mirai that she seems happy in her own skin now, and that she's been flourishing under Tom Z. Of course, she still has a lot of issues to work out. I just hate the erroneous categorizing of skaters based on politics and often faulty rep that goes on in this sport. If Mirai could just own who she is, and put it all together, she's clearly one of the best in the world, capable of taking it all. It's she who has to believe in herself and to release each and every last chip on her shoulder, as well as the nerves and anxiety which are probably a large reason for the occasional two-footing and URs (as @Jozet recently pointed out in U.S. ladies thread in GSD).

Oh well, I'm gonna just breathe and release myself from holding expectations for any of my fave skaters, and just try to enjoy the ride this season. No matter what, I'm sending so much love and happy vibrations to Mirai, cuz she inspires love.

 

[kwanatic]

Yep, those of us who enjoy Mirai's skating want her to succeed, and so yes it can be frustrating to have seen her not do as well as her huge talent would seem to dictate over the years. Nationals 2014 was definitely a volatile, highly emotional situation all-around for a lot of skaters and fans. For Mirai, it followed from her devastation of the previous season. So for her to skate so well, and then to be pushed out of going to the Olympics obviously because she wasn't favored and not because she didn't skate well, was definitely unfair. And everyone knows it was unfair too. That's why so many skaters and fans rallied to support her during that upsetting time. I'm sure she made some mistakes at times, but honestly I blame the adults involved more than Mirai, and especially those who pettily gossiped and tried to undermine her when she first had the opportunity to train with Tom Z. I realize that her mistakes and her less than stellar results gave her a poor reputation, and also that TPTB did not want to see her go to the Olympics without a coach in 2014.

The thing is that it's not Mirai's fault for having family issues and maturing issues to deal with during an important time in her development as a young skater. Plus, she clearly was not working with the right coach for her, and that was a large part of the problem that the adults involved need to learn from. When a coaching situation is not working, why force it down a young skater's throat? Mirai was so uninspired and so wrongly packaged for a few years there. She was not/is not Michelle Kwan and there should not have been an attempt to place her in that box. It didn't fit.

I'm glad for Mirai that she seems happy in her own skin now, and that she's been flourishing under Tom Z. Of course, she still has a lot of issues to work out. I just hate the erroneous categorizing of skaters based on politics and often faulty rep that goes on in this sport. If Mirai could just own who she is, and put it all together, she's clearly one of the best in the world, capable of taking it all. It's she who has to believe in herself and to release each and every last chip on her shoulder, as well as the nerves and anxiety which are probably a large reason for the occasional two-footing and URs (as @Jozet recently pointed out in U.S. ladies thread in GSD).

Oh well, I'm gonna just breathe and release myself from holding expectations for any of my fave skaters, and just try to enjoy the ride this season. No matter what, I'm sending so much love and happy vibrations to Mirai, cuz she inspires love.

ITA.

Mirai has had a tough road, that's for sure. Honestly I think that's the reason she is so loved, because she has gone through so many up and downs and yet continues to keep fighting. Her struggles and perseverance have really endeared her to so many people.

When you think about it, missing that spot in 2014 could have been a final blow for her. She could have hung up her skates then and there or just spiraled down into a deep depression (a la Gracie, bless her heart ) and never recovered. The fact that Mirai picked herself up and kept going is so commendable and truly speaks to her strength as a person. I so admire her for that. I love her attitude going into this season. Her "nothing to lose" mentality is exactly what she needs. Now is the time to put it all on the table and just go for it.

I really do have a good feeling about Mirai but, like you, I'm trying to keep all of my expectations in check for everyone this season...as best as I can anyway. Despite my "let the chips fall where they may" stance for this season I already know I'm going to be a wreck. I'll probably need a defibrillator to watch the U.S. and Japanese nationals this year. Every time someone jumps my heart is going to stop

 

[bardtoob]

I'm trying to keep all of my expectations in check for everyone this season...

Yeah, I need to keep mine reeled-in. Inspired by Michelle Kwan, I am just taking it one competition at a time.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

From A to Z: Does the reward outweigh the risk?
Coach provides argument for why protégé Nagasu should try triple axel

http://web.icenetwork.com/news/2017/09/22/255539012

JUST LOVE the Rupaul tweet about Mirai!!!!

(Side note: I can also share with you that Mirai and I have had several conversations about learning a quad -- especially on days when her triple axel is feeling easy and floating and the timing is effortless. It would be a quad toe, if she so chooses.)

Team USA skater Starr Andrews recently tried and landed a downgraded triple axel in her free skate program at Junior Grand Prix Austria. As the barriers begin breaking, it is only a matter of time before consistent triple axels are achieved in the ladies event.

 

[bardtoob]

4T ... Let's not try now. Maybe next June.