ISU has cancelled 2021 Europeans, ISU Grand Prix Final, World Junior Synchro; Stockholm Worlds still on for now

skategal

Bunny mama
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7,659
There are posters on this board and people in the world that will still be in the same place in September that they are now, thinking skaters either shouldn't travel at all and/or competitions should be shut down completely.

So I don't see how splitting between two events in late 2021 would be a better idea than waiting a few months to hold off cancelling Worlds and potentially pushing it back a month or two if need be.

Pushing everything to a later date, whether it's one sole event or between two events, still presents a risk of Canadians supposedly deciding they don't want to go. Then what?
I didn’t say one word about Canada. :lol:

I honestly don’t care if Canada does or doesn’t go to Worlds or how or even if we do or don’t qualify for Olympics.

I agree pushing worlds back is a good idea but seems hard to do.

Some athletes need to qualify for Olympics some how so just trying to get ideas out there.
 

tony

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I didn’t say one word about Canada. :lol:

I honestly don’t care if Canada does or doesn’t go to Worlds or how or even if we do or don’t qualify for Olympics.

I agree pushing worlds back is a good idea but seems hard to do.

Some athletes need to qualify for Olympics some how so just trying to get ideas out there.
I didn't say you said one word about Canada, so okay.... But part of this thread and a big part of another thread focus on Canada and the potential repercussion of not sending a team, hence why these talks of qualifying outside of Worlds even came up.

I threw out an idea a few times, but someone, somewhere is still going to decide in September-December that no one should be doing anything besides traveling from home to the rink (or perhaps sitting at home and doing nothing at all) and/or skaters should have events canceled 3 months ahead of time so they can save money on training. I have a strong suspicion than most, if not all skaters are thrilled that they still have a chance to go to the rink and train in an otherwise boring start to the year.

ETA- the logic to me should be A) see if Worlds can be pulled off in March with safety all-around, as many other sports have been able to do thus forth. If not, B) push it back a month or two-- see where everything is at then. If that doesn't work, then C) figure out an early-season qualifying process, but this is pushing things close to the wire and assuming one, two, however many qualifying events will be able to go on without problem.
 

skategal

Bunny mama
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7,659
We’ve moved on to Japan not going now. Keep up. LOL.. (j/k)

Not sure what other countries are doing re: vaccinations but both Canada and USA have both said that everyone who wants a vaccine will have it by September so I assume travel will okay by then?
 

tony

Well-Known Member
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9,746
We’ve moved on to Japan not going now. Keep up. LOL.. (j/k)

Not sure what other countries are doing re: vaccinations but both Canada and USA have both said that everyone who wants a vaccine will have it by September so I assume travel will okay by then.
...So now that Canada and the USA will be completely vaccinated but other countries may not be, events around the world can go on as planned? ;)

And RE: Japan. That's why I brought up the point of two of the biggest names in Japanese skating having to internationally travel to get to Nationals, and maybe even more. This is something that really isn't talked about in terms of the danger of international travel/airports that some try to present. They were allowed into/out of the country then (without problems?) as far as I saw.
 

skategal

Bunny mama
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7,659
...So now that Canada and the USA will be completely vaccinated but other countries may not be, events around the world can go on as planned? ;)
No but the :argue: on FSU would be significantly reduced.:lol:

Re: Japan and Canada.

Canada indicated they may not send skaters to Worlds but sends them to the Netherlands bubble.

Japan hasn’t said a peep about Worlds but won’t send skaters to the Netherlands bubble.

And I have no idea what any of this means?!?! If anything.

I’m glad they didn’t cancel Worlds. I don’t see the point to do it this early when there is still a shot it could happen.
 

missing

Well-Known To Whom She Wonders
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4,028
Philip Hersh, who could give some of us at FSU a lesson or two, just tweeted the following:

Philip Hersh
@olyphil

·
38m

The only way @ISU_Figure can try to have the World Championships safely is a one-strike-and-you-are-out policy for every country about masking and social distancing regulations. That means an entire nation’s athletes go home if there is a violation by an athlete or coach.

2/that doesn’t mean you throw people out if someone’s mask slips beneath his or her nose once. But after one warning, you get the boot.
 

Dave of the North

Well-Known Member
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5,623
Philip Hersh, who could give some of us at FSU a lesson or two, just tweeted the following:

Philip Hersh
@olyphil

·
38m

The only way @ISU_Figure can try to have the World Championships safely is a one-strike-and-you-are-out policy for every country about masking and social distancing regulations. That means an entire nation’s athletes go home if there is a violation by an athlete or coach.

2/that doesn’t mean you throw people out if someone’s mask slips beneath his or her nose once. But after one warning, you get the boot.

Phil, you're too soft, everyone should triple mask at the least and stay 3 meters apart. And you have to wear floor-length plastic outfits, including when competing. And have a test every 15 minutes. And get vaccinated by all available vaccines. Spray them all with industrial bleach.
 
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Dobre

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Not sure what other countries are doing re: vaccinations but both Canada and USA have both said that everyone who wants a vaccine will have it by September so I assume travel will okay by then?
Including kids? If, yes, do you have a link? The last update I read about kids was a speculation that students may not be done at the start of the next school year, but that was back in December.

Not raining on any parades here. I do feel like a fall Worlds would be a pretty safe bet based on what we've heard from health experts about timelines. But I've not heard any projections about a timeline for kids, since testing was only to begin this month, so I am curious if there has been an update on them.
 

skategal

Bunny mama
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7,659
Including kids? If, yes, do you have a link? The last update I read about kids was a speculation that students may not be done at the start of the next school year, but that was back in December.

Not raining on any parades here. I do feel like a fall Worlds would be a pretty safe bet based on what we've heard from health experts about timelines. But I've not heard any projections about a timeline for kids, since testing was only to begin this month, so I am curious if there has been an update on them.
That is how they are phrasing it here but I do suspect that it will be ages 12+ as there are no clinical trials started yet, that I’m aware of, for the 1-11 year olds.

I read the other day that Pfizer expects to have their clinical trial results for ages 12-17 in time so that those ages can be vaccinated by the start of school.
 

carriecmu0503

Well-Known Member
Messages
346
Including kids? If, yes, do you have a link? The last update I read about kids was a speculation that students may not be done at the start of the next school year, but that was back in December.

Not raining on any parades here. I do feel like a fall Worlds would be a pretty safe bet based on what we've heard from health experts about timelines. But I've not heard any projections about a timeline for kids, since testing was only to begin this month, so I am curious if there has been an update on them.
Do you know anything about how athletes train? You can't just have a world championships whenever you want. Athletes are NOT in world level competition shape all year. It is not possible. Skaters use the summer to train and get new programs. Early fall competitions are tune-ups. Athletes work to peak at the end of the season. You canNOT expect an athlete to be in WC shape in fall, and to stay in that shape for nationals and through the Olympics. It is just not realistic. Even elite athletes are actual humans, not robots.
 

Dobre

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9,916
Do you know anything about how athletes train? You can't just have a world championships whenever you want.
Oh, I realize. It's totally against a regular figure skating schedule. And how much harder to throw that in on top of an Olympic season.

Fact is, though, that Worlds may be cancelled. I assume it will be up to Sweden and depend on the situation there in March.

If Worlds is cancelled in March, then you're not left with great options. No matter which way you slice it. Try to move it to April or May? In which case--if it doesn't happen--you have ruined the athletes' ability to prepare for a fall qualifier. Design a whole different qualification system? Or try to piece together two completely contradictory ones? We'll be bickering over it for 20 years. Move Worlds to the fall? Forces all the athletes to have to train the same way those preparing for Nebelhorn will have to do anyway. Allows you to keep the same qualifying system.

I see why, of course, the ISU and athletes who have been training hard all season would like to have it in March. We can't control this disease. There has to be a plan B.
 

Karen-W

Well-Known Member
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6,127
Why are people talking about worlds being cancelled on the day it was announced that worlds isn't cancelled and that they are moving forward with it?
Because, hope springs eternal for those who believe that it is all but inevitable that Worlds WILL be cancelled. This is the slow-mo redux of March 2020 where instead of the "will Worlds be cancelled" saga playing out over less than a 3-week window it's being played out over a 3-month window. This thread will have another 25 pages before we hit the middle of March, mark my words. :rofl: :drama: :yikes:
 

aka_gerbil

Rooting for the Underdogs
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2,785
Why are people talking about worlds being cancelled on the day it was announced that worlds isn't cancelled and that they are moving forward with it?
Last year, the decision wasn’t made until right before worlds was supposed to happen. The YNW situation is always changing and we don’t know what things will be like in March. I don’t think it’s out-of-place to keep in mind the situation could shift between now.
 

Dobre

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9,916
Skater A attempts a quad combination 20 times during a season. Skater A successfully completes the quad combination 2 times during that season.

The coach suggests having a Plan B in case Skater A should miss his quad combination during the long program at Worlds.

"Why are you talking about me missing the combination at Worlds?" complains Skater A. "I'm going to skate it perfectly at Worlds because that is what I am visualizing and planning to do! If you suggest I might miss it then that must mean you don't really want me to land it correctly."

"No, it means I want you to be as successful as you can be," says the coach. "The best way to be successful is to see the possibilities and have a plan."

"I don't want to have a Plan B until after I have proof that Plan A won't work," says Skater A. "That would be bad karma."

What happens at Worlds?
 

Sylvia

Off season is club competition season!
Messages
65,012
Skate Canada published their 2021 ISU WORLD FIGURE SKATING CHAMPIONSHIPS SELECTION CRITERIA document 2 days ago on their website ("The Skate Canada High Performance Development Committee will nominate to the CEO the selection of athletes no later than February 24, 2021."):

ETA that I've posted the selection criteria & relevant scores in the Canadian Men's news thread (maybe others can tackle the other 3 disciplines ;)): https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/th...n-men-news-updates.107060/page-4#post-5947192
 
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Karen-W

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6,127
For those who are worried about the ISU protocols, I invite you to take a look at the World Short Track Skating Championships team announcement. The bubble seems like it very closely matches the one the USFS had at both SkAm and Nationals. It states, explicitly, that all member delegations must have a negative PCR test before they're even allowed to enter the Netherlands, then another one once they arrive (hotel room isolation until the test results come back). They are providing all of the transportation to and from the airport and will not allow anyone to enter the bubble after March 1. I expect that we'll see similar measures from Stockholm for FS Worlds and all will be just fine in another 7 weeks. I should probably request some time off work so that I can mess with my sleep patterns and devote my full attention to the event. ;-)
 

misskarne

Handy Emergency Backup Mode
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20,632
Philip Hersh, who could give some of us at FSU a lesson or two, just tweeted the following:

Philip Hersh
@olyphil

·
38m

The only way @ISU_Figure can try to have the World Championships safely is a one-strike-and-you-are-out policy for every country about masking and social distancing regulations. That means an entire nation’s athletes go home if there is a violation by an athlete or coach.

2/that doesn’t mean you throw people out if someone’s mask slips beneath his or her nose once. But after one warning, you get the boot.
The only problems I foresee with this are:

1) It needs to be no-warnings. It would only take one person being irresponsible, especially if that person comes from a country where this is not under control, and suddenly the 'rona is being passed around like wildfire.

2) If the ISU made such a policy, it would need to have the balls to enforce it, since Russia will probably run out of warnings on Day 1.
 

Miezekatze

Well-Known Member
Messages
15,636
Tons of sports are holding international competitions right now, I don't know why this is such a drama with figure skating.

If it get's cancelled, it would certainly be because of travel issues and not because of the actual holding of the event.

Reading this thread, one gets the impression skaters are the most undiscipled and unprofessional people out there, in comparison to track and field athletes, soccer players, ski jumpers, alpine skiers, handball players, tennis players, ... :shuffle:
 

anonymoose_au

Well-Known Member
Messages
149
track and field athletes, soccer players, ski jumpers, alpine skiers, handball players, tennis players, ... :shuffle:
My main issue is with the exception of handball all those are outdoor sports. Now if they were going to hold the FS World's on an outdoor rink I probably wouldn't worry.

Plus is there even going to be quarantine at all? If not even proper mask wearing at all times is unlikely to prevent someone getting the Rona. If fully-trained nurses can't avoid it I can't see how even the most well-behaved skaters could avoid it 😑
 

Karen-W

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Messages
6,127
My main issue is with the exception of handball all those are outdoor sports. Now if they were going to hold the FS World's on an outdoor rink I probably wouldn't worry.

Plus is there even going to be quarantine at all? If not even proper mask wearing at all times is unlikely to prevent someone getting the Rona. If fully-trained nurses can't avoid it I can't see how even the most well-behaved skaters could avoid it 😑
Why does there need to be a quarantine? Anyone allowed in the bubble is going to have to provide a negative PCR test prior to arrival and have another one upon arrival, with them isolating in their hotel room until the test results are returned. This is not so contagious that just looking at someone causes transmission. Besides, all the people who are lax about the mask-wearing and social distancing are probably already carrying the antibodies.
 

MsZem

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15,560
My main issue is with the exception of handball all those are outdoor sports.
Okay. There's also been gymnastics (last month), darts, wrestling, and judo - which are certainly not outdoor sports. And the latter two are contact sports!

ETA: also badminton going on right now. Sorry for forgetting you, badminton!

Plus is there even going to be quarantine at all? If not even proper mask wearing at all times is unlikely to prevent someone getting the Rona. If fully-trained nurses can't avoid it I can't see how even the most well-behaved skaters could avoid it 😑
Healthcare workers are exposed to more infectious people and have to get quite close for certain procedures. Skaters... do not. They are at considerably lesser risk for CV than many people who are out there working.

Of course, skaters are not essential workers, and if they were facing the same risks, it would be unacceptable to hold events. But there are now multiple examples of international competitions being held successfully. The US held two major competitions this season, and while they did not involve international travel, you did have people flying in from different parts of a very big country and not one that was dealing with CV all that well. It's doable, but there will have to be strict procedures in place and a one strike you're out approach to anyone not playing by the rules - same as with doping.
 
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Ka3sha

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7,806
ISU calendar for 2021/22 Grand Prix Calendar:
1. Skate America
Oct,22-24
2. Skate Canada
Oct, 29-31 (Vancouver)
3. Cup of China
Nov, 5-7
4. NHK Trophy
Nov, 12-14
5. Internationaux de France (Grenoble)
Nov, 19-21
6. Rostelecom Cup
Nov, 26-28 (Moscow)

ISU Grdand Prix Final
Dec, 9-12 (Osaka, Japan)

Asian Open Figure Skating Trophy (Oct, 13-17) is an official Olympic test event.


(info from the same Russian journalist's telegram channel
https://t.me/lapidarnst/830 )
 

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