IOC's decision: (clean) Russian athletes can compete under neutral flag at PyeongChang Olympics

[casken]

Seems like when Bukin was absent 2013-2014 it was because he was a test subject for the doping method used in Sochi and he wasn’t actually injured at all its just they had to keep him out of competition and international testing but not Russia testing.

To be clear, based on this info, the suggestion is that S&B withdrew from 2014 JW to avoid Bukin being tested? That's the only event they withdrew from that season.

 

[vesperholly]

To be clear, based on this info, the suggestion is that S&B withdrew from 2014 JW to avoid Bukin being tested? That's the only event they withdrew from that season.

He also competed at Skate Canada and Nebelhorn that fall. Do GP events do testing?

 

[RoseRed]

Hopefully when the IOC names the official list these two will either be on it (because someone seemed to say that the IOC might add more names after the initial invitation list, don't know if that is true), or we'll at least have an explanation. Following this story in a few different places, I've seen several rumours/suggestions about why they might have been banned.
1. That their names were included in that lab database that someone mentioned, which wouldn't guarantee doping, but would cast a lot of suspicion on an athlete
2. That Bukin's issue has to do with possibly unapproved medication for either epilepsy or chronic bronchitis
3. That Bukin's issue has to do with S/B's participation at the 2013 Universiade in Russia, which was apparently used as a kind of "dress rehearsal" for Sochi, in terms of doping
4. That Stolbova's issue has to do with possibly being the female gold and silver medalist mentioned in that one report with urine samples with DNA from two people and impossible salt readings
5. That there was some type of admin error, or that they are under suspicion for any of the above reasons, so it just took/will take slightly longer to approve them

I'm not saying that any of this is true; it's just speculation/rumours that I've seen, but since we probably won't actually hear anything for a few days, I just wanted to keep track of everything being said.

I hope they haven't done anything wrong and they will be able to compete in the end.

I don't necessarily agree with everything the IOC has done or the way they've handled things, but I think it's important to keep in mind that Russia engaged in unprecedented state-sponsored doping scheme, which is a super serious thing and a full on ban would have been an understandable decision (even though I'm happy that didn't happen for the sake of the Russian figure skaters). Russia has more fault here than anyone else. And they also risked a lot of athletes health by putting them on all sorts of drugs with unknown health risks.

 

[Tinami Amori]

To be clear, based on this info, the suggestion is that S&B withdrew from 2014 JW to avoid Bukin being tested? That's the only event they withdrew from that season.

in that case, Stepanova would not be invited too.... by logic.

 

[Debbie S]

He also competed at Skate Canada and Nebelhorn that fall. Do GP events do testing?

I think I read that they test the winners and choose another skater at random.

 

[DobrinFan]

I thought they tested all the medalists and if it's a pairs/dance team only 1 member of said team. Then it's random for the rest of the field.

 

[Debbie S]

I thought they tested all the medalists and if it is a pairs/dance team only 1 member of said team. Then it's random for the rest of the field.

You may be right. It was at least 10 years ago that I read that, could have changed.

 

[DobrinFan]

You may be right. It was at least 10 years ago that I read that, could have changed.

I looked it up and it depends on the competition.
http://www.isu.org/docman-documents...munications/14604-isu-communication-2117/file

 

[topaz]

We'll find out who will be invited but I think we'll never be given the list of all the athletes who may be involved. Personally, I think the doping happened all across Russian athletics, i.e figure skating, speed skating, tennis, track and field, etc. For example, Maria Sharapova who lives in the US; has a non Russian team and STILL test positive for meldonium. Maria had been taking the drug which was not banned at the time but STILL an performance enhancing drug for over 10 years. Dr Anatoly Skalny, the Russian doctor who originally prescribed Sharapova’s medication. When she first were prescribed meldonium and other meds she was a minor, 16 years old.

So I feel the "medication prescribing" by several Russian doctors and the system has effected many athletes over the years. The odds that Stolbova and Bukin did not know they have been prescribed performance enhancing drugs throughout their lives is pretty strong.

IOC and Russia probably cut a deal and it's very possible that some athletes were included in that deal without their knowledge.

I will be anxious to see if Russia will be banned for upcoming olympics.

 

[Lovemyvike]

I don't know what to make of this whole ordeal, except that I'm really sad for Ksenia and Ivan. And completely gutted for Fedor and Alexandra. Especially Fedor. The timing seems really... suspect.

 

[caseyedwards]

We'll find out who will be invited but I think we'll never be given the list of all the athletes who may be involved. Personally, I think the doping happened all across Russian athletics, i.e figure skating, speed skating, tennis, track and field, etc. For example, Maria Sharapova who lives in the US; has a non Russian team and STILL test positive for meldonium. Maria had been taking the drug which was not banned at the time but STILL an performance enhancing drug for over 10 years. Dr Anatoly Skalny, the Russian doctor who originally prescribed Sharapova’s medication. When she first were prescribed meldonium and other meds she was a minor, 16 years old.

So I feel the "medication prescribing" by several Russian doctors and the system has effected many athletes over the years. The odds that Stolbova and Bukin did not know they have been prescribed performance enhancing drugs throughout their lives is pretty strong.

IOC and Russia probably cut a deal and it's very possible that some athletes were included in that deal without their knowledge.

I will be anxious to see if Russia will be banned for upcoming olympics.

Russia refuses to ban banned athletes and cut off funding for them! It just announced all banned athletes will get 100% support and funding as if they were competing! It must be seen as a bribe to keep quiet. Russia and all Russians must be totally banned until it stops funding banned people. Russia will be banned from Tokyo until it stops funding banned people.

 

[Deleted member 40371]

We'll find out who will be invited but I think we'll never be given the list of all the athletes who may be involved. Personally, I think the doping happened all across Russian athletics, i.e figure skating, speed skating, tennis, track and field, etc. For example, Maria Sharapova who lives in the US; has a non Russian team and STILL test positive for meldonium. Maria had been taking the drug which was not banned at the time but STILL an performance enhancing drug for over 10 years. Dr Anatoly Skalny, the Russian doctor who originally prescribed Sharapova’s medication. When she first were prescribed meldonium and other meds she was a minor, 16 years old.

So I feel the "medication prescribing" by several Russian doctors and the system has effected many athletes over the years. The odds that Stolbova and Bukin did not know they have been prescribed performance enhancing drugs throughout their lives is pretty strong.

IOC and Russia probably cut a deal and it's very possible that some athletes were included in that deal without their knowledge.

I will be anxious to see if Russia will be banned for upcoming olympics.

People still go on about Meldonium, it is getting tiring ... it is explained a bizzilion times already ...

 

[Vash01]

I saw a petition on change.org to the IOC to allow Stolbova and Bukin to participate in the 2018 Olympic Games.

 

[MarieM]

This was found in the russian press: https://iz.ru/699940/2018-01-25/mok-mozhet-snova-sokratit-spisok-rossiiskikh-sportsmenov-na-oi-2018

It is looking likely that all medalists from Sotchi (and I will keep writing it like that for whoever has problems with it) will not be invited. So for Figure Skating, it might add Bobrova and Soloviev to the "refused" athletes.
I so hope Bukin will gain the right to go, because if Bobrova isn't there either, the team's competition will be in shambles.
And they are also saying that all coach who were in Sotchi won't be invited either. That means no Mozer for Tarassova/Morozov.

Waiting till the 28 is crazy long.

 

[Eisfee]

This was found in the russian press: https://iz.ru/699940/2018-01-25/mok-mozhet-snova-sokratit-spisok-rossiiskikh-sportsmenov-na-oi-2018

It is looking likely that all medalists from Sotchi (and I will keep writing it like that for whoever has problems with it) will not be invited. So for Figure Skating, it might add Bobrova and Soloviev to the "refused" athletes.
I so hope Bukin will gain the right to go, because if Bobrova isn't there either, the team's competition will be in shambles.
And they are also saying that all coach who were in Sotchi won't be invited either. That means no Mozer for Tarassova/Morozov.

Waiting till the 28 is crazy long.

This is so weird...
I just can't...

 

[TAHbKA]

It's fun for the Swedish biathlon

No Mozer would also mean DellaMonica/Guarize are there without a coach; will Hekalo be allowed to come or will Tarasova/Morozov and Zabijako/Envert be there with Szelkowy only?
Come to think of it - if all the Sochi coaches are not allowed - no Tutberidze (Lipnitskaya. Sorry, Medvedeva, Zagitova), no Buyanova (Sotnikova, sorry Sotskova), no Zhulin (Bobrova/Soloviev, so sorry Bobrova/Soloviev), no Alexeeva (Sinitsina/Zhiganshin, sorry Zahorski/Gureiro), so, basically, Kolyada, Aliev and Astakhova/Rogonov get to go there with their coaches?

 

[MarieM]

What a mess.

 

[Marta24]

What a mess
Did the Russian Fed even nominate a second alternative for dance or just Zagorski/Guerreiro?

 

[Eisfee]

What a mess
Did the Russian Fed even nominate a second alternative for dance or just Zagorski/Guerreiro?

I guess only Z/G...

 

[MarieM]

What a mess
Did the Russian Fed even nominate a second alternative for dance or just Zagorski/Guerreiro?

I think in the june list, they had Lobodova/Drodz, but didn't confirm them in the later final list.

 

[Tinami Amori]

This was found in the russian press: https://iz.ru/699940/2018-01-25/mok-mozhet-snova-sokratit-spisok-rossiiskikh-sportsmenov-na-oi-2018

It is looking likely that all medalists from Sotchi (and I will keep writing it like that for whoever has problems with it) will not be invited. So for Figure Skating, it might add Bobrova and Soloviev to the "refused" athletes.
I so hope Bukin will gain the right to go, because if Bobrova isn't there either, the team's competition will be in shambles.
And they are also saying that all coach who were in Sotchi won't be invited either. That means no Mozer for Tarassova/Morozov.

Waiting till the 28 is crazy long.

The newspaper is "IZVESTIYA" old time Soviet Newspaper (means "news"). The article is written as a speculation of what is the worst that can happen, and not a fact yet. The title is "IOC might do..."

 

[MarieM]

Thanks. But those rumors have been there from the beginning, about the IOC not wanting any Sotchi medal winners. IMO, if a rumour is around for that long, someone must have told it all along with good cause.

I would be crushed if true

 

[Ka3sha]

What a mess
Did the Russian Fed even nominate a second alternative for dance or just Zagorski/Guerreiro?

From what I read on Russian boards, the first list was sent before Nationals.
That means: B/S, S/B, SinKats (who were in Sochi and are injured), Z/G.. Probably (and hopefully) that have added Popova/Mozgov after Nikita’s injury to that list, but no one knows for sure

 

[MarieM]

They haven't. On the list there was only 4 teams. No Popova.

 

[Tinami Amori]

From what I read on Russian boards, the first list was sent before Nationals.
That means: B/S, S/B, SinKats (who were in Sochi and are injured), Z/G.. Probably (and hopefully) that have added Popova/Mozgov after Nikita’s injury to that list, but no one knows for sure

They haven't. On the list there was only 4 teams. No Popova.

Maybe on the final list..

I have the original long list in pdf format for all athletes. It was prepared either in Spring or Summer 2017, when the Russian side knew the "gist" of what will take place in November. The figure skaters' list is huge, and includes even names like Lipnitskaya, Volosozhar/Trankov, and pretty much EVERY skater who was a member of the Federation before August 2017 announcements.

 

[iris81]

This article contains short interview of Ludmila Velikova https://svpressa.ru/sport/article/191205/
She says that several years ago Ksenia Stolbova had some issues with a medication, that was recommended to her because of her health problems, it contained something illegal. But later she was cleared from suspicions that she was using stimulators and everyone thought all this was forgotten...

— Года два или три назад, уже после Сочи-2014, у Ксении возникли проблемы со здоровьем. Лекарство, которое ей рекомендовали, содержало, как оказалось, некое количество запрещенного в спорте препарата, — рассказывает Людмила Великова. — Но при проверке подозрения в использовании ею стимуляторов были сняты. Все думали, забыто. Увы…

 

[Anyasnake]

They are saying the same thing here : https://www.sports.ru/others/skiing/1059584102.html
Same sources apparently.

Honestly, while it has to be confirmed on the 27th or 28th, this is a mess. We are 2 weeks away from the Opening Ceremony and less than 3 away from the team event. What in the world...

 

[Andrey aka Pushkin]

4. That Stolbova's issue has to do with possibly being the female gold and silver medalist mentioned in that one report with urine samples with DNA from two people and impossible salt readings

Just to be exact, and I would suggest you change your post.

The aforementioned double medalist from Sochi (either Stolbova or someone else) didn't have urine samples with wrong DNA and impossible salt readings, but rather scratches on the bottle, or whatever it's called. Also, the same unnamed medalist was checked, and it was found that there was nothing else suspicious about her probe, neither she was in the lists provided by Rodchenkov.

Admit, it's really not the same.

 

[MarieM]

Maybe on the final list..

I have the original long list in pdf format for all athletes. It was prepared either in Spring or Summer 2017, when the Russian side knew the "gist" of what will take place in November. The figure skaters' list is huge, and includes even names like Lipnitskaya, Volosozhar/Trankov, and pretty much EVERY skater who was a member of the Federation before August 2017 announcements.

The list was in June, and they had not submitted anyone else for ice dancing (top 5 at nationals + Drodz). No Popova on that list then, no Popova added later on.
After Nationals, they only sent a revised list with 3 teams, and Popova WASN'T in that list either.
That means, if both Bukin & Bobrova are being left out of the games, only Zahorski/Guerreiro can go.

If that happens, that will be sad for all involved. And IMO, so unfair.

 

[Anyasnake]

The list was in June, and they had not submitted anyone else for ice dancing (top 5 at nationals + Drodz). No Popova on that list then, no Popova added later on.
After Nationals, they only sent a revised list with 3 teams, and Popova WASN'T in that list either.
That means, if both Bukin & Bobrova are being left out of the games, only Zahorski/Guerreiro can go.

If that happens, that will be sad for all involved. And IMO, so unfair.

Why in the world wouldn't they add at least a 2nd alternate ? No sense, whatsoever. No P/M or even Nikita... (well Nikita would have been out probably in that case anyway).