Great Skaters who never made it to the Olympics

nylynnr

Well-Known Member
Messages
694
I just read that Kim Navarro gave birth to her second daughter a few days ago, so I'm reminded to add Navarro & Bommentre.
 

essence_of_soy

Well-Known Member
Messages
4,734
I'm happy that Rudy Galindo was able to resurrect his singles career after he and Yamaguchi split up.

Reading his autobiography, it surprised me to learn that he gave up singles when their success as a pair was really taking off, both to show the USFSA and Carole Yamaguchi how serious he was about his commitment to the team.

(I always thought being pressured to do that seemed a little bit unjust, given that Kristi was still able to compete in singles).

I'm thinking if they had stayed together, that they would have won bronze in Munich, and silver in Albertville.
 

VGThuy

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,482
Kristi (and her team) probably felt that she needed to really focus solely on singles to have a shot at winning the OGM there given the competition. Plus, between ladies and pairs, we all know where Kristi had more of a shot winning a gold medal. Given how celebrated a gold medal in ladies singles is in the U.S. compared to pairs, well, I guess it seemed like a no-brainer at the time despite it negatively affecting Rudy. But in the end, Rudy had a pretty magical career out of that disappointing break up.
 

misskarne

Handy Emergency Backup Mode
Messages
17,871
I’d edit Max out as a great skater , namely because of his resolve to REFUSE to learn to SKATE
One could argue that his determination to improve his PCS actually cost him a chance at the Olympics as it dropped his consistency a little.
 

rfisher

Looking for the next avatar
Messages
58,039
Majorov. His own OC refused to send him although he was consistently top 10 at Europeans and met all the qualifications for the Olympics.
 

Amy L

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,979
Majorov. His own OC refused to send him although he was consistently top 10 at Europeans and met all the qualifications for the Olympics.
He placed 14th in Sochi. The Swedish Fed didn't allow him to go in 2018, however, because he already had his chance previously and he didn't do well enough for them to send him again.
 

bardtoob

Clichy Competitive Audition Protocol Auditor
Messages
13,322
Kristi (and her team) probably felt that she needed to really focus solely on singles to have a shot at winning the OGM there given the competition. Plus, between ladies and pairs, we all know where Kristi had more of a shot winning a gold medal. Given how celebrated a gold medal in ladies singles is in the U.S. compared to pairs, well, I guess it seemed like a no-brainer at the time despite it negatively affecting Rudy. But in the end, Rudy had a pretty magical career out of that disappointing break up.
Kristi had zero shot at the OGM, although a bronze was conceivable ... Until figures were completely eliminated ... And all of a sudden Kristi was 2nd in the World behind Midori Ito, given that the top four at 1990 Worlds were:

1. Ternary
2. Ito
3. Holly Cook
4. Yamaguchi

Of course, it was known that Tonya was capable of beating Kristi, but Tonya had never been to Worlds.
 
Last edited:

VGThuy

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,482
I’m sure they all knew figures were going to be eliminated before they were. Interestingly, in her TSL interview, Kristi said she felt she still would be competitive with figures because she felt as if she knew she was improving on them and would be better once 1992 hit,
 
Last edited:

bardtoob

Clichy Competitive Audition Protocol Auditor
Messages
13,322
I’m sure they all knew figures were going to be elimonsted before they were. Interestingly, in her TSL interview, Kristi said she felt she still would be competitive with figures because she felt as if she knew she was improving on them and would be better once 1992 hit,
Team Trenary, including her coach, Carlo Fassi, Olympic Champion Maker and master politiker, were shocked. I think it was assumed that figures were going to be 10% of the overall score into the 1992 Olympics, not totally eliminated.

I adore Kristi, but I don't believe her figures could ever be that good because she weighted so little and was not muscular at all, which would have effected the quality of her tracings.

Let's be real ... Holly Cook beat Kristi Yamaguchi at 1990 WORLDS because of figures. Also, Ternary won Worlds with a disastrous SP because of figures. How can anyone claim figures weren't her weakness after that.

Also, Kristi was only 5th at 1990 Nationals in figures:

1. Trenary
2. Cook
3. Harding
4. Kerrigan
5. Yamaguchi

In other words, whenever Yamaguchi would have been sent to a Worlds or Olympics up to that point, it was known that at least one or two other skaters from her own team would be better than her at figures. That plus international competition would have made it so she was always coming from behind in figures and was never guaranteed a win in the SP or LP because of Harding, Ito, and even Trenary.
 
Last edited:

Enchanted

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,349
He placed 14th in Sochi. The Swedish Fed didn't allow him to go in 2018, however, because he already had his chance previously and he didn't do well enough for them to send him again.
It was the Olympic Committee, not the federation that refused to send him in 2018.
 

VGThuy

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,482
Team Trenary, including her coach, Carlo Fassi, Olympic Champion Maker and master politiker, were shocked. I think it was assumed that figures were going to be 10% of the overall score into the 1992 Olympics, not totally eliminated.

I adore Kristi, but I don't believe her figures could ever be that good because she weighted so little and was not muscular at all, which would have effected the quality of her tracings.

Let's be real ... Holly Cook beat Kristi Yamaguchi at 1990 WORLDS because of figures. Also, Ternary won Worlds with a disastrous SP because of figures. How can anyone claim figures weren't her weakness after that.

Also, Kristi was only 5th at 1990 Nationals in figures:

1. Trenary
2. Cook
3. Harding
4. Kerrigan
5. Yamaguchi

In other words, whenever Yamaguchi would have been sent to a Worlds or Olympics up to that point, it was known that at least one or two other skaters from her own team would be better than her at figures. That plus international competition would have made it so she was always coming from behind in figures and was never guaranteed a win in the SP or LP because of Harding, Ito, and even Trenary.
The rational thinking may be on your side, but champions often are people who don't listen to other people telling them what's a likely result for them. Kristi winning over Ito and Harding even without figures is more impressive the more I think about it. Her skating actually holds up to IJS standards as well with all the transitions and content she had in her programs and even having spin variations. She knew she didn't have the 3A so she went for the most difficult 3/3 she could do, a still impressive to this day 3Lutz/3Toe with an attempt at a 7 triple program with a 3Lutz near the end. She most likely would hit 6 because of that Salchow being inconsistent. With Kristi focusing on singles solely, unlike at 1990 Worlds where she was doing both and splitting her time instead of focusing solely on one discipline, if she felt she would have and could have improved in figures, even if most of us think the judges wouldn't let that happen, then maybe she actually would have. It's that mindset that she could do it, even if the odds were against her, combined with her focus, discipline, and work ethic that has made Kristi a champion.
 

bardtoob

Clichy Competitive Audition Protocol Auditor
Messages
13,322
The rational thinking may be on your side, but champions often are people who don't listen to other people telling them what's a likely result for them.
I think Kristi would have won singles at the 1994 Olympics had figures not been eliminated before the 1992 Olympics.

I also do my best to talk about figure skating as if it is a sport and respect its history and acknowledge ALL the skaters, not just those abruptly helped by the ISU, which decided that the type of training its top competitors were doing for 10+ years in preparation for competition at the highest level was a waste of time.

Had figures not been eliminated, Kristi would have been in the running for bronze in Singles or Pairs, but not gold because the former Soviets dominated pairs and Kristi was not as good as Trenary in presentation and figures and not as good as Midori in jumps. Also, we simply can not forget Harding soundly beat Kristi at 1991 Nationals and international judges were willing to give Tonya top marks even if she was early in the skate order, as seen in the 1991 Worlds SP when Tonya skated 3rd of 30.

However, Kristi was rock sold mentally, and held it together at the 1992 Olympics in comparison Midori, Nancy, and Tonya.
 
Last edited:

VGThuy

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,482
Had figures not been eliminated, Kristi would have been in the running for bronze in Singles or Pairs, but not gold because the former Soviets dominated pairs and Kristi was not as good as Trenary in presentation and figures and not as good as Midori in jumps. Also, we simply can not forget Harding soundly beat Kristi at 1991 Nationals.
I just don't know how you know that for sure. I think there are tons of variables at play, and we really don't know what Kristi could have done. We do know Midori being better at jumps didn't help her beat Kristi in a time where figures was eliminated, so it should have been easier for Midori to beat Kristi. I also think it's ironic that Midori won her only Worlds with figures and then lost the next Worlds because of figures. I say if Midori could do it, then why not Kristi? If Kristi could manage to win the SP and LP (like she did at 1991 Worlds and Olympics and 1992 Worlds), then she could afford a slightly lower placement in figures if the ones way ahead of her in figures dropped in the SP and LP. That was also a real possibility.
 

bardtoob

Clichy Competitive Audition Protocol Auditor
Messages
13,322
I just don't know how you know that for sure.
Because of Kristi's placement at 1990 worlds in both singles and pairs.

We do know Midori being better at jumps didn't help her beat Kristi in a time where figures was eliminated, so it should have been easier for Midori to beat Kristi.


I say if Midori could do it, then why not Kristi? If Kristi could manage to win the SP and LP (like she did at 1991 Worlds and Olympics and 1992 Worlds), then she could afford a slightly lower placement in figures if the ones way ahead of her in figures dropped in the SP and LP.
Well, Midori was mowed down and injured by Laeticia Zamboni Huber at 1991 Worlds.

Also, the magic formula for Midori winning worlds was 6th in figures and 1st in the SP and LP. However, Trenary could win figures and beat Kristi in the SP even with only a 3T-2T and the LP with only 3S, 3T, and 3F. Plus, Trenary had Carlo Fassi in her corner.
 
Last edited:

VGThuy

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,482
Kristi wasn't the same skater in 1990 as she was in 1991 and 1992. It's pretty clear by just watching the videos. And we always have ideas of what's going to happen, but competition always turns out differently. None of us know what Kristi was capable of doing even with figures. Without figures, people underestimated her ability to win against Midori and Tonya. Which is my point. Sure, conventional wisdom would maybe say you're right, but conventional wisdom isn't absolute truth.
 

bardtoob

Clichy Competitive Audition Protocol Auditor
Messages
13,322
@VIETgrlTerifa this has been a fun off season discussion :)

... I found it very enjoyable and a nice break from the other off season craziness.

And, yes, Krist did, in fact, prepare herself to walk to the top of the Olympic podium if the opportunity arose, and it did and she stepped up :)

You are also right that she was only not going to win "in probability" only. There was a chance for Kristi to win, even if how was unclear.

Watch at 7:20 to the end ...
 
Last edited:

VGThuy

Well-Known Member
Messages
29,482
I LOVE that Midori performance. I really wish Midori and Tonya were able to replicate their best performances in Albertville. I also wish Kristi did her 1992 Nationals or Worlds LP performance as well. I think that probably could have been the best Ladies LP ever even if only those three skated well because they were just that legendary to me. I still think Tonya should have at least placed third in the LP in Albertville with her actual skate there.
 

Japanfan

Well-Known Member
Messages
21,238
Depends on what the purpose of competition is.

If the Olympics is more about participation and inclusion, then 3 per country sounds fair because the aim is to include as many countries as possible; and 3 is the domination number because a country can at most sweep the entire podium and not more.

If the Olympics is more about having the best competitors, then qualification should be strictly merit based instead of country based.
It is more about participation and inclusion. As it should be.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top