College administration bribery scandal

overedge

Mayor of Carrot City
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25,952
I wasn’t saying simple mistake. Simple mistakes don’t lead to Jail.
You said "mistake" and I was responding to that. And some "simple mistakes" do lead to jail, such as thinking you're not drunk enough to drive safely and then running over someone.
 

becca

Well-Known Member
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You said "mistake" and I was responding to that. And some "simple mistakes" do lead to jail, such as thinking you're not drunk enough to drive safely and then running over someone.
Mistake doesn't mean simple mistake... And being drunk and running over and injurying someone isn't a simple mistake in the sense it costs some one else's life. It may be less premediated but it is far more injurying.

But even someone who does that should be rehabilitated after they’ve done their time.

I am not saying she shouldn't be punished for her crime.
 

overedge

Mayor of Carrot City
Messages
25,952
Mistake doesn't mean simple mistake... And being drunk and running over and injurying someone isn't a simple mistake in the sense it costs some one else's life.
The mistake is in thinking you're sober enough to drive. That is simple. The consequences may not be simple, but it's the initial decision is simple.

In any case, Huffman was part of a scheme that lasted months if not years and involved multiple deliberate frauds. Not the same thing at all as making a one-time decision even if bad consequences weren't intended.
 

becca

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19,418
The mistake is in thinking you're sober enough to drive. That is simple. The consequences may not be simple, but it's the initial decision is simple.

In any case, Huffman was part of a scheme that lasted months if not years and involved multiple deliberate frauds. Not the same thing at all as making a one-time decision even if bad consequences weren't intended.
I am not excusing her behavior and she should face jail.
 

MacMadame

Cat Lady-in-Training
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Except Huffman herself only made one decision... to buy an SAT boost for her daughter. The fact that she was part of an immense web of lies including people she had no idea existed, doesn't make her decision more complicated.
 

AxelAnnie

Well-Known Member
Messages
11,174
Mistake doesn't mean simple mistake... And being drunk and running over and injurying someone isn't a simple mistake in the sense it costs some one else's life. It may be less premediated but it is far more injurying.

But even someone who does that should be rehabilitated after they’ve done their time.

I am not saying she shouldn't be punished for her crime.
What do you mean by "should be rehabilitated" after they do their time?

What a world that would be if people came out rehabilitated after being in jail. The recidivism rates would say otherwise.

I would argue that getting behind the wheel when you are drunk is premeditated. You (not you, you....but the general you) surely didn't plan to run someone over............but running someone over IS a logical and known consequence of driving drunk.
 

Japanfan

Well-Known Member
Messages
21,434
The mistake is in thinking you're sober enough to drive. That is simple. The consequences may not be simple, but it's the initial decision is simple.
It may be less premediated but it is far more injurying.
In my experience people who drive under the influence know they shouldn't be on the road and wouldn't pass a breathalyzer test, but figure they can get away with it. And most of the time, they can. It's split-second judgment decisions that are most at risk, and unless traffic conditions are particularly bad (which they aren't late at night when a lot of people drive home from the pub), drivers won't have to make such decisions. So they can get away with it 9 out of 10 times - leaving of course the one time they won't.
 

Prancer

Your Overlord
Staff member
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Totally. Whether it's acting or not, at least she seems to be taking this seriously. *And* she apologized.
I would give her the benefit of the doubt here because I would hope she has realized the damage she has done to her children. Taking responsiblity for what she did and apologizing are necessary steps for her relationship with them.

Lori Loughlin's daughters don't seem to have the character to see that need, so maybe she doesn't see it in that light, but she owes it to them anyway.

The amounts of money involved in these bribes (typically $15,000 to $250,000) aren't nearly enough to make the pertinent colleges and universities sit up and take notice.

I did a quick check on line and saw that Yale's endowment is about $29 billion, Stanford's is about $25 billion, and even U.S.C.'s is about $4.6 billion. All of these institutions can and do get donations of $250,000 or more that don't come with the obligation to admit any particular student, let alone one who would not be able to get in on her own.
Yeah, if you can't fund a new building or something similar, don't even bother. Didn't some article posted upthread say something about at least four million and that would only get a really competitive kid in?
 

becca

Well-Known Member
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19,418
What do you mean by "should be rehabilitated" after they do their time?

What a world that would be if people came out rehabilitated after being in jail. The recidivism rates would say otherwise.

I would argue that getting behind the wheel when you are drunk is premeditated. You (not you, you....but the general you) surely didn't plan to run someone over............but running someone over IS a logical and known consequence of driving drunk.
I don’t think our system encourages rehabilitation. Other countries do.
 

becca

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19,418
Then why did you say that "we all make mistakes"? That sure sounds like an excuse for her behaviour.
Because while I don’t think I would do what she did I know that I have made my own bad decisions.

I face the consequences and I move on. I am not okay with what she did but if she faces the consequences which she seems willing to do I am willing to say okay move on.

I am not arguing she should get a free pass and not go to jail.

I think it’s a pretty big deal and her reputation will never be the same but I think frankly it’s a problem in our society that we make it difficult for people to reform.

Lori right now I feel different about because she is not expressing willingness to face the consequences for her actions. And please let me make clear I think those parents deserve jail time.
 

Vagabond

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12,782
Didn't some article posted upthread say something about at least four million and that would only get a really competitive kid in?
I remember something along those lines, but I suspect that the amount of the :bribe: would vary with the institution's acceptance rate and endowment.
 

AxelAnnie

Well-Known Member
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11,174
Because while I don’t think I would do what she did I know that I have made my own bad decisions.

I face the consequences and I move on. I am not okay with what she did but if she faces the consequences which she seems willing to do I am willing to say okay move on.

I am not arguing she should get a free pass and not go to jail.

I think it’s a pretty big deal and her reputation will never be the same but I think frankly it’s a problem in our society that we make it difficult for people to reform.

Lori right now I feel different about because she is not expressing willingness to face the consequences for her actions. And please let me make clear I think those parents deserve jail time.
I am surprised that Lori Laughlin who has built a career o sweet innocence is not contrite .
 

taf2002

Fluff up your tutu & dance away.....
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My niece's kid was an exemplary child. She had several national titles in cheerleading, including solo, duo, & team. She also had straight A's all thru school & besides that is beautiful. She was offered scholarships from all over the country but she turned them down because she didn't want to cheer in college. She wanted to go to Texas A&M but was put on a wait list because the freshman class was full. She went to their adjunct school for a year & then was able to transfer to the main campus. She graduated with a 4.0 average & was a leader all thru her college years. She is likely an example of the type of students who didn't get into their preferred college because of this cheating.

I don't know if Texas A&M was part of all this or if she was denied entrance because of cheating but when you think about real people like her who were hurt by this it makes it even more disgusting. It's not a simple mistake. It hurt many people & for those who deserved an elite college & didn't get one, it probably hurt their earning capacity all their lives.
 
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missing

Well-Known To Whom She Wonders
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My guess is students who applied to one elite college applied to more than one elite college, and not all colleges, elite or otherwise, are involved in this particular scandal. If those same students are rejected by all the elite colleges they applied to, then perhaps they're not capable of success at an elite college. I know I wouldn't have been.

I think of this as an entertaining kind of scandal. It involves rich people, celebrities, name brand colleges, the SATs, and photoshopping, any one of which would be sufficient, but all in combination is close to irresistible. But I don't think it's a one size fits all scandal, and I doubt that the worthy students who were turned down by the affected colleges have gone on to lead miserable penniless lives.
 

Zemgirl

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My niece's kid was an exemplary child. She had several national titles in cheerleading, including solo, duo, & team. She also had straight A's all thru school & besides that is beautiful. She was offered scholarships from all over the country but she turned them down because she didn't want to cheer in college. She wanted to go to Texas A&M but was put on a wait list because the freshman class was full. She went to their adjunct school for a year & then was able to transfer to the mail campus. She graduated with a 4.0 average & was a leader all thru her college years. She is likely an example of the type of students who didn't get into their preferred college because of this cheating.

I don't know if Texas A&M was part of all this or if she was denied entrance because of cheating but when you think about real people like her who were hurt by this it makes it even more disgusting. It's not a simple mistake. It hurt many people & for those who deserved an elite college & didn't get one, it probably hurt their earning capacity all their lives.
I would be surprised if A&M was a part of this scandal - it's a good school, but the scandal seems mostly to involve Ivies and private colleges, doesn't it?

I'm not sure what happened in the case of your niece's kid. As a straight A student, wasn't she in the top 10% of her class and thus eligible for automatic admission to the Texas university of her choice?
 

Vagabond

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If those same students are rejected by all the elite colleges they applied to, then perhaps they're not capable of success at an elite college. I know I wouldn't have been.
That may have been true at some point in the past, though heaven knows when that was, given admissions quotas that worked against Jewish and non-white applicants, the historically numerous single-sex colleges, preferences for athletes (even at those elite colleges) and children of alumni, and other forms of discrimination at one time or another.

A quick check for current acceptance rates at some elite priivate colleges and universities yielded this:

Harvard 4.5%
Columbia 6%
Yale 6.7%
Pomona 8%
Duke 8.6%
Pennsylvania 9%
Chicago 9%
Brown 9.5%
Swarthmore 12.5%
Amherst 13%
Bowdoin 14.9%
Rice 16%

These are overall rates and thus ignore differences between schools (arts and sciences, engineering, etc.) within the same university. Someone could easily apply to all twelve of these and not get into any while still being good enough to earn honors at any of them had he been admitted.
 
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Lucy25

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2,639
What bothers me about Lori Loughlin is that in multiple articles it mentions how she lives a faith-based life, and that she is using her faith to get through this situation. Why didn’t that faith guide her against cheating for her daughters? I am never critical of other’s faiths, as it is none of my buisiness, but this is so hypocritical to me.
 

AxelAnnie

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11,174
Lucy25...Hypocritical.......Ya think?
I don't see your comment as being critical of faiths...........just calling out someone who says one thing and does another.

Though...she evidently has faith in the power of her checkbook.
 

Prancer

Your Overlord
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These are overall rates and thus ignore differences between schools (arts and sciences, engineering, etc.) within the same university. Someone could easily apply to all twelve of these and not get into any while still being good enough to earn honors at any of them had he been admitted.
Not only is that true, but elite colleges also offer a lot of student support. Universities are judged in part by their graduation rates. Once you are in an elite university, a lot of effort will be put into getting you through if that's necessary for you.

That doesn't mean that you will enjoy the experience or that it will be enough to get the job done, but it's not like there aren't a lot of people who maybe don't have the resumes to get into an elite college who couldn't succeed in one. Think of all the children of the elite who get in as legacies and/or with big donations; they don't just get in--they graduate. Jared Kushner, for example, is reputed to have been a mediocre student in high school. But a 2.5 million dollar (tax deductible) donation to Harvard, and he was in. And now he is a Harvard graduate.

It was Harvard, after all, where the concept of the Gentleman's C was born.
 

becca

Well-Known Member
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19,418
My niece's kid was an exemplary child. She had several national titles in cheerleading, including solo, duo, & team. She also had straight A's all thru school & besides that is beautiful. She was offered scholarships from all over the country but she turned them down because she didn't want to cheer in college. She wanted to go to Texas A&M but was put on a wait list because the freshman class was full. She went to their adjunct school for a year & then was able to transfer to the mail campus. She graduated with a 4.0 average & was a leader all thru her college years. She is likely an example of the type of students who didn't get into their preferred college because of this cheating.

I don't know if Texas A&M was part of all this or if she was denied entrance because of cheating but when you think about real people like her who were hurt by this it makes it even more disgusting. It's not a simple mistake. It hurt many people & for those who deserved an elite college & didn't get one, it probably hurt their earning capacity all their lives.
I never said it was a simple mistake and I said they need jail. Saying something needs jail means well there should be a punishment.
 

Simone411

Well bleffing Covfefe! Clippy's flipping over P/C!
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15,653
I truly believe that Lori thought she could do anything given her celebrity status. That included her believing that she wouldn't do any jail time and something was mentioned yesterday on GMA that Lori thought she could actually buy or bribe her way out of any jail time. She didn't believe she would ever go to jail in other words.

Because of that denial, she and hubby rejected the plea deal thinking there was no way they would go to jail. I don't care how much money she has or how "innocent" she may appear or whether she's a celebrity or not. You do the crime then you do the time.

She's not any different than Martha Stewart or even my ex-box that embezzled. He thought he could pay his way out of federal prison because he was worth mega millions. He spent 5 years in federal prison, paid his fines and reimbursed the USDA, and still came out worth 36 million. He had about 56 million when he went in. He thought he could do anything he wanted because of his money and his name. He soon learned it didn't quite work like that. The thing is that my ex-boss went faithfully to church and was a deacon at his church.

This is exactly what happened with Lori. She let that status and her money go to her head making her believe she could do anything she wanted to. I guess I see it that way because of what my boss did, and because of his greed, we all lost our jobs because he had to shut the business down. He admitted that all his money made him even greedier.
 

taf2002

Fluff up your tutu & dance away.....
Messages
22,804
My guess is students who applied to one elite college applied to more than one elite college, and not all colleges, elite or otherwise, are involved in this particular scandal. If those same students are rejected by all the elite colleges they applied to, then perhaps they're not capable of success at an elite college. I know I wouldn't have been.

I think of this as an entertaining kind of scandal. It involves rich people, celebrities, name brand colleges, the SATs, and photoshopping, any one of which would be sufficient, but all in combination is close to irresistible. But I don't think it's a one size fits all scandal, and I doubt that the worthy students who were turned down by the affected colleges have gone on to lead miserable penniless lives.

You are the 1st person I've seen who was entertained by this.

I never said it was a simple mistake and I said they need jail. Saying something needs jail means well there should be a punishment.
I'm not sure why you're quoting me. My post had nothing to do with anything you've posted.
 

missing

Well-Known To Whom She Wonders
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2,442
You are the 1st person I've seen who was entertained by this.



I'm not sure why you're quoting me. My post had nothing to do with anything you've posted.
I can't apologize for being entertained by what I think of as a miniscule scandal compared to the horrors that are going on throughout the world these days, but I do apologize for using your post as my entryway.
 

missing

Well-Known To Whom She Wonders
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2,442
UCLA knew of a cash for admissions deal as far back as 2014.

The young woman’s admission to UCLA as a recruited athlete — and her parents’ subsequent $100,000 donation pledge to the school’s athletics program — were detailed in an internal investigation the university completed in July 2014, a year after she began taking classes.



The confidential report, reviewed by the Los Angeles Times, shows that years before the current college admissions scandal, UCLA knew of allegations that parents were pledging donations to its athletic program in exchange for their children being admitted to the university in violation of rules prohibiting the practice.
 

kwanfan1818

I <3 Kozuka
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31,551
That's a different scheme though: it went to the school's athletic program. It didn't go to individual coaches.
 

MacMadame

Cat Lady-in-Training
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29,116
Have been seeing a lot to headlines about "Aunt Becky" this weekend including one that the show she was fired from just got renewed for another season (without her) and that got me to thinking. Hallmark was pretty quick to fire her and I didn't see any public support from her castmates either. Makes me wonder what she was like to work with.
 

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