Bobrova and Soloviev out of Worlds

[Sylvia]

Oct. 22, 2015 blog post/press release re. mildronate (meldonium) being added to WADA's 2016 Prohibited List: http://www.cleancompetition.org/Blo...NG-DRUG-TO-BANNED-LIST-AFTER-PCC-FUNDED-STUDY

Excerpt: This special research project was conducted by five scientists led by Dr. Mario Thevis, who reviewed and tested thousands of urine samples stored at the WADA lab in Cologne, Germany in order to identify how many athletes may be using the substance for its potential performance-enhancing characteristics rather than its intended medical purpose. The study results showed that the use of mildronate was not limited to a particular sport or group of sports, but was found in a wide range of samples.

I looked up meldonium on PubMed (main source for medical journal articles), and there were only 2 articles related to sports.
...
The other dealt with the testing methods used to detect it after it was used by an athlete: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25847280

For @Yazmeen and anyone else interested, the second scientific study on meldonium or Mildronate (published April 5, 2015 by Dr. Thevis et al.) can be read here: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/dta.1788/full
Excerpts from the end:

Mildronate, an approved drug with multiple indications besides its anti-ischemic properties, is known to have a positive effect on the endurance performance of athletes, improves rehabilitation after exercise, protect against stress and activates CNS functions. ...

Furthermore, the present study indicates the wide prevalence of Mildronate in international elite sports and demonstrates the alarming extent of administered dosages, finding more than 180 cases of Mildronate use within numerous different sport disciplines and urinary concentration levels of more than 1 mg/mL. Additionally, the easy access to Mildronate from numerous online shops certainly plays an important role for the widespread use in international elite sports. Under medical and pharmacological aspects as well as to preserve the integrity of sport the ban of Mildronate from sport is deemed indicated.

 

[Sylvia]

http://www.newsweek.com/russian-parliament-calls-emergency-doping-meeting-435114
Excerpts:

Russia’s parliamentary sports authority has called an emergency meeting over the doping scandal that has plagued Russian tennis No. 1 Maria Sharapova and four other Russian athletes this week.
...
Lawmakers from the Committee on Physical Education, Sport and the Youth will hold a special meeting to discuss the new reports on Thursday, committee head Dmitry Svyshtev told sports news site R-Sport.
Russian officials are assembling a group of sports experts to give their advice at the meeting and journalists have also been invited to sit in on the talks.

Russian President Vladimir Putin’s spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, told news site Lenta on Wednesday that doping was not only a Russian problem and urged the media not to politicize the scandal.

http://www.bigstory.ap.org/article/...s-sharapova-doping-case-doesnt-reflect-russia

Russian President Vladimir Putin's spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters Wednesday that the meldonium cases shouldn't be "projected onto all of Russian sport" and do not "cast a shadow on Russian sport, on the amazing achievements of our athletes."
Sharapova and the others who have tested positive are "individual athletes, individual situations."

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Does anyone think that Soloviev knew she was taking it? Because if not I would be soooo pissed. Its his career too she could be playing with.

When it comes to doping I still remember when Kyoko said someone showed up at her door at like 3 am and she refused to do it. She wasnt taking anything but the fact they come to your house at that time of day!

 

[Sylvia]

Soloviev was quick to defend Bobrova on his Instagram on Monday (re-posting from earlier in this thread):

TRANSLATION " - https://www.instagram.com/p/BCqKsNjnWcx/
Let's all support Katya! I am sure and convinced she could not have made such gross mistake, especially after what we've been through after the Olympics. God sees all, and let him punish all who is trying to bring us down with such dirty methods, instead of a fair competition out on the ice. I know Katya is not guilty, we will not give up easily and we will prove it. We are stronger than you think....

ETA:

When it comes to doping I still remember when Kyoko said someone showed up at her door at like 3 am and she refused to do it. She wasnt taking anything but the fact they come to your house at that time of day!

It was more like 10:30 or 11 pm.

 

[Susan M]

If she'd felt tired, had a couple of shots of espresso that energized her and then performed brilliantly, would the coffee be considered performance-enhancing?

Until recently, caffeine was on the WADA banned products list. There was a threshold below which it is OK, but too much and it was considered a doping violation. I'm not sure why but they recently took it off the banned list and added it to the "monitoring" list instead. In the US caffeine (above some level) is prohibited by the NCAA doping rules (college sports).

 

[poths]

Until recently, caffeine was on the WADA banned products list. There was a threshold below which it is OK, but too much and it was considered a doping violation. I'm not sure why but they recently took it off the banned list and added it to the "monitoring" list instead. In the US caffeine (above some level) is prohibited by the NCAA doping rules (college sports).

Excess caffeine was used a masking agent, hence the ban. Same with modafinil which is intended for narcolepsy, but hides the use of steroids/human growth hormones.

I would hedge my bets that mendonium has long been used as a masking agent itself. To those who still insist that "Drugs don't make you land triples etc.", you're wrong. Practice and strong bodies not injured through vigorous training - that's how triples are landed. Those parameters are facilitated through PEDs.

 

[ballettmaus]

If she'd felt tired, had a couple of shots of espresso that energized her and then performed brilliantly, would the coffee be considered performance-enhancing?

Sure, it would be considered that. But the point was not if something's legal or illegal but that Averbukh claimed she was tired, took the drug then performed brilliantly not due to the (a) drug. Maybe it was not the (a) drug, maybe it was, fact is, she did not opt for coffee, she opted for a drug and I doubt she did so because she didn't expect it to have any effect. And since I would assume she expected an effect, she went for something that would help her boost her performance (more reliably than coffee ) What she asked for and what she received may be two very different matters. I just don't agree with Averbukh's argumentation because whether it was the (a) drug or not which helped her skate brilliantly, if she indeed asked for something because she felt tired, she displayed intent to enhance her performance through a substance and one she would otherwise not be in need of. (because, again, I doubt she'd ask for something if she didn't expect results)

 

[Xela M]

Excess caffeine was used a masking agent, hence the ban. Same with modafinil which is intended for narcolepsy, but hides the use of steroids/human growth hormones.

I would hedge my bets that mendonium has long been used as a masking agent itself. To those who still insist that "Drugs don't make you land triples etc.", you're wrong. Practice and strong bodies not injured through vigorous training - that's how triples are landed. Those parameters are facilitated through PEDs.

But B&S were just injured for a whole bloody year! And no, a strong body is not enough to land a triple

 

[peibeck]

I don't think Bobrova was ever really worried about landing triple jumps in competition as an ice dancer.

 

[Sylvia]

And here's its big news item:

Up to 490 athletes may have taken meldonium during Baku 2015 European Games, research from the British Journal of Sports Medicine claims.

For those interested in reading details - Meldonium use by athletes at the Baku 2015 European Games (Manuscript accepted for publication in BJSM on 7th March, 2016): http://blogs.bmj.com/bjsm/2016/03/0...to-ms-maria-sharapovas-failed-drug-test-case/
Excerpt from the Abstract:

Results: Meldonium was declared as imported into Azerbaijan by 2 of 50 National Olympic Committee medical teams at the Games, but athletes from 6 countries declared the use of meldonium. Only 23 of the 662 (3.5%) athletes tested between 8 – 28 June 2015 declared the personal use of meldonium, which included 13 competition winners. However, 66 of the total 762 (8.7%) of athlete urine samples analysed during the Games and during pre-competition tested positive for meldonium. Meldonium use was detected in athletes competing in 15 of the 21 sports during the Games.

Conclusion: This study highlights the widespread and inappropriate use and prescribing of this prescription drug in a generally healthy athlete population. Subsequent to these findings, WADA has included meldonium as a prohibited substance on the 2016 List of Prohibited Substances.

 

[BrightSkates]

But B&S were just injured for a whole bloody year! And no, a strong body is not enough to land a triple

Yes, strong body is not enough but I don't understand why nobody points it out - meldonium according to the studies it also "enhanced activations of central nervous system (CNS) functions". That is exactly what skaters need to practice precisely and endlessly with increased reaction time and sharpness jumps, spins and those complicated dance patterns and movements until they become reflexes. Adding that it extended stamina and shortened recovery time and you have perfect PED. For the very same reason Adderall is also prohibited in competition.

 

[Katha]

Yes, my understanding was that it also can have a psychological effect? So if you get used to those effects adding to your mental strength etc. at practices and/or competitions, it might be difficult to wean yourself off it? So yeah, perhaps it might make the difference between being sharp enough to hit that level 4 step sequence or not.

Though of course I don't really have an understanding beyond my own reading and interpretations of what is available on the substance.

 

[Sylvia]

Meldonium Ban Hits Russian Athletes Hard: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/10/s...-russian-athletes-maria-sharapova-doping.html

Until the fall, Russian teams had used the drug regularly and openly, viewing it as a remedy for fending off exhaustion and heart problems. Most team coaches would keep a supply, administering it along with other standard vitamins.
“I’ve been working for 20 years; we could never imagine that it would be included as a doping substance,” said Sergei Sheremetiev, a physician with Russia’s ski-jumping team.
Created as a treatment for heart conditions in 1975, meldonium is widely available from Russian pharmacies without a prescription, selling for $3 to $10 for about 40 capsules. It can also be purchased online.

Sheremetiev said: “It’s a good drug. Until they banned it, we used it in many types of sport: hockey, skiing — in those where there’s pretty serious strain.”
...
Until the ban, Sheremetiev said, he had given the drug to his own athletes about twice a year.
...
The Russian trainers and officials said they were obeying the ban on meldonium, but they insisted the drug — despite its benefits — should not be considered a performance enhancer. Sheremetiev and other team physicians said it was merely for restoring physical fitness. But WADA has disagreed. The body’s president, Craig Reedie, in an open letter to The Independent, wrote that meldonium was “a big concern because it’s clear that people are abusing the drug.”

 

[IceAlisa]

I would hedge my bets that mendonium has long been used as a masking agent itself.

I don't think so. It is in itself a performance enhancing substance. It's an anti-ischemic medication, suggesting that it improves blood flow. And there's the CNS function enhancement, whatever that means.

 

[MsZem]

To those who still insist that "Drugs don't make you land triples etc.", you're wrong. Practice and strong bodies not injured through vigorous training - that's how triples are landed. Those parameters are facilitated through PEDs.

I've never understood why it's considered a bad thing for athletes to be able to put more effort into training without getting injured. So long as this can be done without having a detrimental effect on their health, I personally have no problem with it. Obviously you and, more importantly in this case, WADA, disagree.

I also don't see why athletes should avoid interventions that are not against the rules just because they might some day be banned. Let's take this outside the context of doping - I see it as similar to those full body swimsuits that later got banned. There is nothing wrong with using means that are allowed to make the most of your talent and training, but once something is banned, of course it is against the spirit of fair play to use it. Not to mention stupid. Maybe athletes and trainers thought that Meldonium would not be so conspicuous as a swimsuit - a costly mistake, as it turns out.

 

[Vagabond]

I've never understood why it's considered a bad thing for athletes to be able to put more effort into training without getting injured.

http://www.boston.com/sports/other_...eroid_use_by_young_women_troubling/?page=full

The moment she first plunged the needle of a steroid-laden syringe into her body, Cindy Olavarri knew she had thrust everything into peril: her health, her reputation, her quest for Olympic glory.

"I knew it was cheating," Olavarri said in an interview, 21 years after she tested positive for anabolic steroids and was dumped from the US cycling team just before the 1984 Olympic Games in Los Angeles. "I looked at them in my hand, and once I decided to take them, I knew I had lost my integrity."

*snip*

"My biggest regret is that I'll never know whether I could have made the Olympic team without steroids," she said. "When you cheat and alter your body that way, you don't know what's real and what's the drug."

And the athlete's legacy is tarnished.

"Unless you become rich in your sport, all you have when you retire are the memories," Olavarri said. "You want to feel proud of what you did, and in my case that's very difficult to do."

That's why.

And it doesn't matter what aspect of performance it may enhance. Steroids, meldonium, it's all the same.

 

[MsZem]

http://www.boston.com/sports/other_...eroid_use_by_young_women_troubling/?page=full

That's why.

And it doesn't matter what aspect of performance it may enhance. Steroids, meldonium, it's all the same.

How does that address what I wrote? Obviously if you believe that using a substance is wrong, you'll feel bad about having taken it. And if you do something against the rules and know it represents an unfair advantage, that will be a problem. My question remains whether anything and everything performance enhancing should be considered wrong to begin with, regardless of whether it has adverse implications for health or not.

 

[hanca]

Where do you draw the line? Massage also helps muscle recovery, so in theory it can be considered as something that enhances performance. Good nutrition is also helpful, enhances performance. Good sleep too. Protein too. So will the poor athletes in future be forbidden to have a massage, or eat healthy so that they don't have advantage over someone else who may sleep not well? Or be forbidden to have any protein?

 

[Vash01]

The next 'substance' being banned: coffee. In fact this could even spread into the academics which is a highly competitive field. Coffee gives unfair advantage to those who use it to stay awake or to energize themselves.

Next in line : Meditation. This improves focus, concentration and efficiency, thus giving a very unfair advantage to those who practice it. It is difficult to detect in the body but a study of brain waves indicates that there could be reliable tests to prove that the use of meditation improved the research of a few people who otherwise may not have been able to publish quality research.

It's late at night and I am still awake. May be my meditation 'drug' is giving me these insane ideas.

 

[Tinami Amori]

The next 'substance' being banned: coffee.

What will never be banned is "chifir" (чифир) - high concentration of black tee (Ceylon or Indian). You take 5 bags of black tee, to 1/3 regular cup of hot water, an let it sit for 15 minutes. Let it chill, then gulp it. Cheap and free..... and 3 hours of uplift (then when it wears out, you feel it wearing out, but for 3 hours, for 1.50 USD, you get what no expensive drug or substance can give you)...

 

[allezfred]

Where do you draw the line? Massage also helps muscle recovery, so in theory it can be considered as something that enhances performance. Good nutrition is also helpful, enhances performance. Good sleep too. Protein too. So will the poor athletes in future be forbidden to have a massage, or eat healthy so that they don't have advantage over someone else who may sleep not well? Or be forbidden to have any protein?

Glad to see you have moved on from periods and are now saying that proper sleep and nutrition are now equivalent to taking medicine not prescribed for purpose.

 

[SmallFairy]

Elite sport is not healthy in the first place, let's just ban it all!

 

[marbri]

I can't believe some people want to compare manufactured unnatural substances injected (or injested) into a human body to eating fruit and veggies and having someone give your back a rub.

 

[MsZem]

I can't believe some people want to compare manufactured unnatural substances injected (or injested) into a human body to eating fruit and veggies and having someone give your back a rub.

I'm not a fan of slippery slope arguments, but if the main reason given for banning certain substances is that they can be performance enhancing, I think it's fair game to look at what else might be seen as performance enhancing, yet isn't banned.

I'm sure there are those who will disagree, however.

 

[marbri]

I just think it's ridiculous. I get that you disagree and I understand it's all about the debate for some people BUT I just can't take such nonsense seriously.

 

[MsZem]

I just think it's ridiculous. I get that you disagree and I understand it's all about the debate for some people BUT I just can't take such nonsense seriously.

I think it's fine to say that some comparisons aren't really applicable. But it's clear that different participants in this discussion are looking at different criteria when it comes to what should or shouldn't be banned. Ultimately, though, only WADA's criteria are really relevant in this case.

 

[kittyjake5]

From periods to coffee. I love FSU!

 

[MsZem]

From periods to coffee. I love FSU!

Yet no mentions of Michelle Kwan or purple. Very disappointing.

(or not, since who wants Kwan to be linked to a thread about doping, right? )

 

[Xela M]

I just find it funny that all of Russian sport is apparently based on melonium (it's apparently being given to children too) but Russia's results in nearly all endurance sports have been subpar or average at best (and the less said about Russian soldiers' results in Afghanistan the better)

 

[Loves_Shizuka]

From periods to coffee. I love FSU!

Yet no mentions of Michelle Kwan or purple. Very disappointing.

There have been posts about "spots for next year" though

FSU