Bobrova and Soloviev out of Worlds

[semogal]

I find this very scary. She admits to using this heart medication in the past even though she has no heart condition? What a sad commentary that an athlete wants to win so badly that they are willing to use medication to give them an edge (and with the blessing of coaches and doctors). What about possible side effects down the road? She could be risking her long-term health for short-term gain. I feel bad for them but yet also hope that this serves as a wake up call to other athletes. Such a sad end to their career if the 4 year ban is imposed.

 

[Coquelicot14]

But Dmitri doesn't seem to think it was a mistake. He specifically said people are trying to shut them up in an unfair fight.

I doubt W&P, P&C, C&L, C&B or the Shibs or any of their federations would single out Bob/Sol to shut out in that race for Worlds/Olympic Gold. That would make no sense

Why B&S then and not S&K? B&S are higher ranked on the team, needed to bring back 3 spots. So more people can compete next year...
S&K are not a medal threat...

Makes no sense.

I am leaning towards this being an unfortunate mistake on someone's part. Whose? That remains to be seen.

 

[sk9tingfan]

PEDs = cheaters. Got caught. Banned. No sympathy.

ITA. Shades of East Germany

 

[morqet]

Why B&S then and not S&K? B&S are higher ranked on the team, needed to bring back 3 spots. So more people can compete next year...
S&K are not a medal threat...

Makes no sense.

I am leaning towards this being an unfortunate mistake on someone's part. Whose? That remains to be seen.

Clearly S/K & Marina did it Looked to be headed to Russian no 1 status until they mess up the FD at Nats, so they have to find some other way to remove their rivals...

 

[Tinami Amori]

My uncle was a doctor (heart specialist) in Moscow. Sadly, many many, many meds are fake because everything is being stolen.

did he work at the Bakulev Centre?.. there is an old poster here on FSU who's uncle designed a heart-valve unit for this centre, and my grand-father designed certain mechanics/automations for various equipment.... wow! what a small world!

 

[Xela M]

did he work at the Bakulev Centre?.. there is an old poster here on FSU who's uncle designed a heart-valve unit for this centre, and my grand-father designed certain mechanics/automations for various equipment.... wow! what a small world!

Unfortunately, I'm not sure where he worked. I could find out. He switched to pharmacy/drugs testing a long time ago and now works for Raifarm

 

[Erin]

But even if one does take a harder line on doping than I do, I think it's still possible to feel for Bobrova. People make mistakes, and in this case, it's a mistake that hurts only her and her partner (well, and their fans, but that's not the same level of investment).

Well, my first response was just to feel sorry for her...but then I started feeling like a hypocrite because if she were a track & field athlete, I'd be saying throw the book at her. Hence the mixed feelings...

 

[jenji124]

So unfortunate.

 

[Xela M]

If they are banned for this Olympic cycle, could Dima's career still be rescued? Could he team up with someone else? I'm just devastated the career of such an amazing dancer could end over this

 

[Marta24]

If they are banned for this Olympic cycle, could Dima's career still be rescued? Could he team up with someone else? I'm just devastated the career of such an amazing dancer could end over this

I guess it depends if he can even imagine himself with someone else. He has skated with Bobrova for 15 years, they went through several ups and downs. I can only imagine how hard this must be for him

 

[Xela M]

I guess it depends if he can even imagine himself with someone else. He has skated with Bobrova for 15 years, they went through several ups and downs. I can only imagine how hard this must be for him

I love Katia, but he was always so much more talented than her. He's a dream partner

 

[Tinami Amori]

Unfortunately, I'm not sure where he worked. I could find out. He switched to pharmacy/drugs testing a long time ago and now works for Raifarm

ah... i am sorry, not familiar with Raifarm... probably something new and advanced.

 

[Xela M]

ah... i am sorry, not familiar with Raifarm... probably something new and advanced.

It's a drugs testing/licencing company

 

[maatTheViking]

I can only see 3 explanations:

- She intentionally doped herself, and hoped she wouldn't get caught, and is now lying.

- A mistake were made. Either by the doctor, the person who helped the doctor, the person who supplied the doctor, the shipper, the labeller, the medicine production. (I include 'the doctor was clueless about the WADA change' here).

- Some conspiracy involving someone intentionally doped her to get rid of them at worlds and/or wanting to destroy their career.

Which of these sound more likely? hmm...

EDIT: removed weird. I guess in could be a straight forward, logical conspiracy.

 

[LarrySK8]

The Russians are cheaters. Simple.

 

[millyskate]

I can only see 3 explanations:

- She intentionally doped herself, and hoped she wouldn't get caught, and is now lying.

- A mistake were made. Either by the doctor, the person who helped the doctor, the person who supplied the doctor, the shipper, the labeller, the medicine production. (I include 'the doctor was clueless about the WADA change' here).

- Some weird conspiracy theory where someone intentionally doped her to get rid of them at worlds and wanted to destroy their career.

Which of these sound more likely? hmm...

That really depends what context you're evolving in. Your feelings are clear by the use of the terms "weird conspiracy theory" but I wouldn't be surprised at all.
Remember that poisoning political rivals has happened in recent Russian (and Ukrainian) history. By comparison this wouldn't be all that extreme.

I'm not saying it happened. My gut tells me it wasn't her taking the product deliberately but of course I have no clue what happened. A mistake may be the most likely cause. But to dismiss all consideration of ill-intent as fanciful is IMO not a reflection of the context.

 

[Xela M]

The Russians are cheaters. Simple.

Of couse the Americans, the Chinese, the Brits etc don't dope

50 medals in swimming plus countless athletics medals are all won honestly of course, just like the Tour de France is always won by super clean athletes

 

[cocotaffy]

The Russians are cheaters. Simple.

 

[Coquelicot14]

I can only see 3 explanations:

- She intentionally doped herself, and hoped she wouldn't get caught, and is now lying.

- A mistake were made. Either by the doctor, the person who helped the doctor, the person who supplied the doctor, the shipper, the labeller, the medicine production. (I include 'the doctor was clueless about the WADA change' here).

- Some weird conspiracy theory where someone intentionally doped her to get rid of them at worlds and wanted to destroy their career.

Which of these sound more likely? hmm...

I vote B

That really depends what context you're evolving in. Your feelings are clear by the use of the terms "weird conspiracy theory" but I wouldn't be surprised at all.
Remember that poisoning political rivals has happened in recent Russian (and Ukrainian) history.

Great! More conspiracy theories. Lol.

 

[Xela M]

I can only see 3 explanations:

- She intentionally doped herself, and hoped she wouldn't get caught, and is now lying.

- A mistake were made. Either by the doctor, the person who helped the doctor, the person who supplied the doctor, the shipper, the labeller, the medicine production. (I include 'the doctor was clueless about the WADA change' here).

- Some weird conspiracy theory where someone intentionally doped her to get rid of them at worlds and wanted to destroy their career.

Which of these sound more likely? hmm...

It would have been insane and suicidal for Bobrova to knowingly take a banned drug when she knew she was highly likely to be tested (presuming her reason for taking the drug would have been to win a Euros medal). All medalists get tested, so it makes no sense.

There is nothing weird about conspiracy theories in Russian sport

 

[maatTheViking]

What really annoys me with doping - and with not-doping (the use of non-banned performance enhancing substances) is that it enlarges the discrepancies between large and small federations, large and small countries, rich and poor countries. Not only does US and Russia have a larger talent pool to begin with, they have a much better chance of having the knowledge and money to help atheletes with drugs (either finding loopholes, masking or bribing). And I don't think Russia is worse than many other countries in this respect.

 

[Rae35]

Zhulin's quote.

"It's the worst possible time to test positive for a banned drug," the R-Sport agency quoted Zhulin as saying.

"The doping scandal in the country's athletics is in its full swing. RUSADA is out of business. This is absolutely the wrong time," he said.

 

[Xela M]

What really annoys me with doping - and with not-doping (the use of non-banned performance enhancing substances) is that it enlarges the discrepancies between large and small federations, large and small countries, rich and poor countries. Not only does US and Russia have a larger talent pool to begin with, they have a much better chance of having the knowledge and money to help atheletes with drugs (either finding loopholes, masking or bribing). And I don't think Russia is worse than many other countries in this respect.

That's true.

It's well-known on here that I'm a not a fan of what's happening in Russia at the moment and I have no words to describe how much I despise Putin, BUT... I firmly believe Russia is being "exposed" right before the Rio Olympics as part of the on-going Cold War and that doping of Americans and the Chinese (amongst other feds) is more advanced than in Russia

 

[Yazmeen]

I find this to be exceptionally harsh. As a patient, I place my trust in my physician. When my doc says she is giving me a flu shot, I trust her that it is in fact a flu shot and accept the injection. I do not ask to see the vial, inspect the label and research to confirm that it appears legitimate.

We are talking about Ekaterina Bobrova, the young lady who took the Mercedes she received as a reward for her performance in Sochi, sold it and donated the money to charity. Of course anyone could theoretically succumb to the pressure to cheat, but Bobrova strikes me as someone of character, and it is completely believable to me that she could have been duped, or doped as it were.

It's also entirely possible that the substance may have been given to her by mistake. Let's say for example that the team had supplements prepared prior to the ban that included this newly banned drug. It's possible that the formula was updated to remove this drug and that a vial of the old mixture was inadvertently used. Mistakes like this - wrong meds - happen ALL THE TIME, even with the best doctors in places with the highest medical standards.

Of course it's also entirely possible that it was used intentionally by her physician. But mistakes do happen, and in this case I will give the benefit of the doubt to Bobrova, someone who has always demonstrated only the most gracious sportsmanship during her career.

I am glad you are so trusting, but we're not talking about a flu shot here. And it doesn't matter how nice she is or how much she donated, etc, it doesn't change what happened. And your conspiracy theories about the wrong meds or an old vial while not impossible, are highly unlikely. Whether she took it deliberately or it was given to her by mistake, it's still on her to ask about ANYTHING that is being administered to her (especially considering her defense that she always checks, which obviously is not true). It's a banned substance, she and her team had plenty of notification about it, she tested positive, so she has to pay the price. And perhaps I'd be willing to give her the benefit of the doubt more if she hadn't admitted to using this performance enhancing substance for no apparent medical reason previously and voluntarily.

 

[Katha]

What really annoys me with doping - and with not-doping (the use of non-banned performance enhancing substances) is that it enlarges the discrepancies between large and small federations, large and small countries, rich and poor countries. Not only does US and Russia have a larger talent pool to begin with, they have a much better chance of having the knowledge and money to help atheletes with drugs (either finding loopholes, masking or bribing). And I don't think Russia is worse than many other countries in this respect.

What strikes me here: She admits to taking that drug before it was banned. IMO it seemed highly questionable even beforehand, she doesn't have any of the illnesses it's supposed to treat. So she was using it to heal quicker/get stronger? And likely jeopardizing her long-term health for it? I know that the problem is likely systemic and not only in Russia. But geez. What are these athletes doing to their bodies?

 

[MsZem]

What really annoys me with doping - and with not-doping (the use of non-banned performance enhancing substances) is that it enlarges the discrepancies between large and small federations, large and small countries, rich and poor countries. Not only does US and Russia have a larger talent pool to begin with, they have a much better chance of having the knowledge and money to help atheletes with drugs (either finding loopholes, masking or bribing). And I don't think Russia is worse than many other countries in this respect.

Yes, athletes from bigger and richer countries will typically have better training opportunities, better facilities, more advanced medical care, access to superior coaching and other relevant expertise, better gear, and probably (if they want to go that way) a more cutting edge doping regimen. But the latter is only one factor contributing to a lack of an even playing field.

I'd love to see even a fraction of the money spent on anti-doping being directed to promote opportunities for athletes from developing countries.

 

[Vash01]

I find this very scary. She admits to using this heart medication in the past even though she has no heart condition? What a sad commentary that an athlete wants to win so badly that they are willing to use medication to give them an edge (and with the blessing of coaches and doctors). What about possible side effects down the road? She could be risking her long-term health for short-term gain. I feel bad for them but yet also hope that this serves as a wake up call to other athletes. Such a sad end to their career if the 4 year ban is imposed.

There can be any reasons for using a heart medication; it's not necessary to have a heart condition for it. Some doctors prescribe low dose aspirin to people that have no heart condition whatsoever. I am not a doctor but I have heard of medicines for one part of the body being used for another. We don't know why she was taking this medicine. Unless you have expertise in the field, all this speculation is pointless.

 

[Yazmeen]

Why is this substance even illegal? It sounds like it's some sort of treatment for the respiratory system?

Also, are there ever exceptions to these banned substances? Like if someone has bad asthma, it's common to take an inhaled cortico steroid to control the symptoms. Or if you have ADHD, the most commonly prescribed medications are stimulants, so if an athlete was in school and took medication for class/homework/studying or even driving, it would be in their systems even if they didn't take it before training.

Are people with medical conditions simply forced to find alternative substances for treatment? I didn't realize how many items were on that list...

Once again, it is indicated for heart disease - chest pain and heart attack. Otherwise, it's a performance enhancing substance (see my original post earlier). And there is no evidence that has been presented that Bobrova had this prescribed for a heart condition. She did not appear to have any medical reason to take this; therefore, her use of it (recall that she admitted to using it last fall) was likely for performance enhancement.

As for other conditions like asthma, there are many drugs available for treatment (and methods of administration) that don't violate these rules. And I don't get the impression that this drugs was used by athletes for medical indications considering someone who has a heart attack or angina is highly unlikely to be a Olympic athlete.

 

[morqet]

Sharapova has just announced that she failed a test at the Australian Open for the same thing. She says she was originally prescribed it for heart issues 10 years ago.

 

[IceIceBaby]

Zhulin's quote.

"It's the worst possible time to test positive for a banned drug," the R-Sport agency quoted Zhulin as saying.

"The doping scandal in the country's athletics is in its full swing. RUSADA is out of business. This is absolutely the wrong time," he said.

Very strange quotes. It sounds like he's only sorry that it happened now?