Alexei Mishin's comments about Liza and judging at Skate America

[ninjapirate]

I think she has been a little underscored... but not enough to change any of her medals thus far.

 

[Tinami Amori]

Mishin-Team is on a war-path. They are going after top ladies one by one.. Now it's Medvedeva's turn. Not that they are wrong, but Mishin never was so blunt in his accusations and singling out skaters by name, calling attention to their problems (last time the administrative manipulation for WC was not fair to them, but now it's critique of actual skating and judging of "other ladies").

Tatiana Mishina: "Medvedeva did her lutz incorrectly, and keeps on doing it constantly. Yet they forgive her".

Татьяна Мишина: «Медведева как прыгала неправильно лутц, так и делает это постоянно. Он ей часто прощается»

Заслуженный тренер России Татьяна Мишина рассказала о проблемах Елизаветы Туктамышевой с исполнением флипа, из-за чего фигуристке пришлось убрать прыжок из произвольной программы.

news.sportbox.ru

Mishina: Why do you think that, just few days before Skate America, Liza substituted in her FS the 3F3T combo for the 3T3T combo? Because of that darn edge on the Flip that is so hard to fix (if problematic initially).

Medvedeva had a lutz issue, and keeps on having it, constantly. It's not because of "bad Medvedeva", it's just simply hard to fix. During the programme the judges often put an exclamation mark for that element, when the edge is in question. Once there is an exclamation mark, there can not be high GOE's or pluses.
---
Will Liza return her flip (in a combo)? Maybe. It is quite clear on the videos, if the take off from the right edge or not. For Medvedeva's lutz, they often forgive her. She always has only one lutz in her programme, because it is risky to put in two of them, and to risk that at least one will be noted.


Tuktamysheva is claiming she is now in the best/strongest shape/form of her entire career.

Елизавета Туктамышева: «Сейчас я в лучшей форме за всю карьеру»

Российская фигуристка Елизавета Туктамышева рассказала о своей форме, а также поделилась мнением о том, что нужно сделать в течение сезона, чтобы назвать его удачным.

news.sportbox.ru

this google translates well, but here are few summaries of what she said:

• she does not want try a more difficult content. She wants to come out on the ice and feel stable. 2-3 points in technical scores, she thinks are irrelevant, they don't play a role. Stability and confidence on elements that she is comfortable with in her opinion should do the trick.
• she will keep both programmes as they were at SA, not change or adjust anything, at least until Russian Nationals. But maybe Mishin will have an idea, then we'll see.
• she is asked "what will take for your to consider this season successful?", she replies: i don't know. the rules/values are constantly changing. you expect one result, and you get another, and yet you can still remain satisfied. i just want to go throw it. it's been a difficult season, last one was simpler. at the end of it, i want to know that i did my best, all i could and in my control.
• Q: it's been said that in this season you're prepared the best you've ever been. Liza: Yes, my form/shape is best ever. my 3A are more solid. i am in best form. the competition is too tough now, one has to be even better.
• She believes she is in the best ever form/shape/condition of her entire career. 100%. She came to this conclusion this july.
• her next GP is Cup of China.

 

[aftershocks]

I am surprised by Mishin’s comments. Usually he is more diplomatic than this.

I can understand Mishin being upset for his Liza, but bottom line, it's really rich of any Russian coach to ever whine about 'home-cooked' scoring.

The other part of this is as I said, Lay off complaining about U.S. ladies receiving some credit when they skate well!

Mishin's comments are not only 'not diplomatic,' they are 'disingenous, thoughtless, and uncool.' It would be like Mozer screaming bloody murder if Ash/Timothy were to ever place ahead of Z/E in a competition, which is certainly not out of the realm of possibility. Mozer surely felt happy and proud of A&T when they placed ahead of Mozer's former charges, T/M at International Classic.

So Mishin giving Bradie some technical pointers and working with her over the summer was just a p.r. ploy then? Mishin was only taking pity on the 'not strong enough' American girl who should never place ahead of any Russian ladies, especially not Liza?

 

[aftershocks]

... Tuktamysheva is claiming she is now in the best/strongest shape/form of her entire career.

Good for Tuk. Now, she should keep her head down and continue aceing her 3-axels. Also, stay healthy and work on tweaking her speed, spins and ice coverage, eh! If she can't manage a quad at this stage, have coach Mishin work on Rusfed politicking, instead of cluelessly bashing American ladies.

 

[bardtoob]

Legitimate, but it is not something Mishin said

that's not a quote from Mishin. It's the article writer's (who is not even named there) point of view. Don't put words in
Mishin's mouth.

and that, ladies and gentlemen, is the only quote from Mishin in that 29384298349km long post....

Just a small example of how news are made....

This is what I suspected from the context.

This is really to smear Mishin and smells of something that would have been kept in Russia in the past.

While I think the Russian ladies are the best in the world right now, I think their national politics is bleeding into international skating, and the Russian Federation should be embarrassed.

This is very trashy.

 

[aftershocks]

... Stability and confidence on elements that she is comfortable with in her opinion should do the trick.

It might do the trick for her confidence and consistency, which doesn't mean it will do the trick as far as the judges are concerned, eh.

Maybe Liza should incorporate a K-Sako 'blade shade' move at the judges' panel next time out.

 

[Bigbird]

The man is desperate, who does he have after Liza? He needs time to deal. Give Grandpa a little space and don't pay him so much attention, he'll get over it one way or another, which might involve some vodka.

 

[Tinami Amori]

This is really to smear Mishin and smells of something that would have been kept in Russia in the past.

If that was the case...

.... then RT, the spokes-channel of Russia, would not have posted this in English.

‘Difficult to beat US skaters in North America’: Renowned Russian coach blasts ‘home soil’ judging at Skate America

Prominent Russian figure skating specialist Alexei Mishin, who currently coaches Elizaveta Tuktamysheva, suggested that US athletes received “extra help” from the judges at the season-opening Skate America event in Las Vegas.

www.rt.com

Further more, Mishin and his wife would not be talking, talking, talking, and talking more... They don't think that spreading this info is a smear, they want to be heard, by "international judges"...

 

[bardtoob]

If that was the case, then RT, the spokes-channel of Russia, would not have posted this in English.

‘Difficult to beat US skaters in North America’: Renowned Russian coach blasts ‘home soil’ judging at Skate America

Prominent Russian figure skating specialist Alexei Mishin, who currently coaches Elizaveta Tuktamysheva, suggested that US athletes received “extra help” from the judges at the season-opening Skate America event in Las Vegas.

www.rt.com

RT would have been kept in Russia in the past . . . Listening to RT about Mishin now is like listening to Radio Free Europe about Frank Carroll in 1980

 

[Amantide]

Kostornaya and 3A in the last few of his comments came up, but can be understood only by those who read few of his other and previous comments, and who know "the whole story" prior to that. That would require several links and explanations, not related to Skate America.

As Mishin said, "he does not want to start trouble", so he does not say many things "directly", while "saying it"..

And as you understood it, what's his complain about Kostornaya's 3A?

 

[aftershocks]

liza was the only lady in the comp who never in either program made it all the way down to my seat, she only ever passed in front of me in warm ups. my seat was roughly at 3 o o'clock for reference.

Maybe she didn't like you, or she was uncomfortable with that side of the rink. Just kidding.

I have to laugh because your comment reminds me of 2016 SA when Shoma Uno did not cover the full rink in one of his programs. He otherwise skated his usual sublime with a mistake or two, and was awarded with gold over out-of-this-world performances with great ice coverage, by Jason Brown and Adam Rippon who weaved gorgeous stories on the ice at that event!

That was also the event where Jason actually landed a very good quad without any visible UR. But the judges apparently couldn't believe their eyes because Jason is not known for landing quads and they refused to give him the benefit of the doubt on a very cleanly landed jump that was simply too close to call a UR. That could have been the breakthrough for Jason in mastering quads, but it broke his confidence and setback his quad progress. Later sob-story, go-to judges' excuses blamed 'lack of good camera angles.'

 

[Tinami Amori]

And as you understood it, what's his complain about Kostornaya's 3A?

He did not "complain about her 3A", he was unhappy that it was unexpected, and used another "conflict-issue" to drag her into it in a negative way, and! intentionally twisted facts in the original "conflict-issue" to link it to Kostornaya. He wanted to "negative-hit" her a bit, and that was the only way.

(do you want me to send you a PM?)... because i am not sure i want to drag the details into this topic, which is about Mishin complaining about judging and acting out and if his complaints are fair. Kostornaia is on his "hit shit-list", but he has not yet complained about scoring at Finlandia (Tuk did instead, quite vividly... )

 

[TAHbKA]

This is what I suspected from the context.

This is really to smear Mishin and smells of something that would have been kept in Russia in the past.

While I think the Russian ladies are the best in the world right now, I think their national politics is bleeding into international skating, and the Russian Federation should be embarrassed.

This is very trashy.

That's not Russia or Mishin, that's the idiot poster who invents some shit and posts it as a 'translation'. Am pointing that it's not what the article says, but what she decided to write here.

 

[Tinami Amori]

That's not Russia or Mishin, that's the idiot poster who invents some shit and posts it as a 'translation'. Am pointing that it's not what the article says, but what she decided to write here.

The only idiot here, now and in the past, is you, who in your translations intentionally uses the wrong words attributed to the interviewee, to make a person that you don't like sound worst off, and then you proudly brag about it, stating 'yeah, i did. i just don't like him" (Trankova for example).

There are links posted above. they have info, same as in the original post. Stop B.S-ing.

 

[aftershocks]

‘Difficult to beat US skaters in North America’: Renowned Russian coach blasts ‘home soil’ judging at Skate America

Prominent Russian figure skating specialist Alexei Mishin, who currently coaches Elizaveta Tuktamysheva, suggested that US athletes received “extra help” from the judges at the season-opening Skate America event in Las Vegas.

www.rt.com

That should go down as one of the more ridiculous figure skating headlines, right next to "American beats Kwan," mis-aptly blared with full-on bias showing by a U.S. newspaper, post the 2002 Olympic ladies' results.

 

[TAHbKA]

It's tough when someone points on your bullshiting, isn't it?
You either deliberately or out of stupidity wrote as a quote something that is not, you start a subject where you put your personal point of view as a quote and then what? Accuse me of not liking Trankov? If there is someone who never needed my help to sound bad or someone who deserves his medals whether I like him or not it's Trankov.
What's next, you'll keep insisting your first 'Mishin:' is a quote or accuse me of being a Mishin fan???

 

[aftershocks]

Further more, Mishin and his wife would not be talking, talking, talking, and talking more... They don't think that spreading this info is a smear, they want to be heard, by "international judges"...

Exactly, and unfortunately. And it's the wrong tactic, and the wrong way to tackle what Tuk is up against for real. Bradie Tennell and the American ladies will be the least of Tuk's problems going forward. And Tuk ain't going forward very far if she can't get out of Russian Nationals.

 

[Tinami Amori]

It's tough when someone points on your bullshiting, isn't it?

Sounds like it is tough for you, when someone finally calls you on your BS...

You either deliberately or out of stupidity wrote as a quote something that is not, you start a subject where you put your personal point of view as a quote and then what?

You can't read, can you?

My comments are: The first paragraph, before the heading of the article and its text and quotes (which include some summaries by the original author of the article). If anyone needs a clarification that it is me speaking, then god help that person...

Next one is, after the last paragraph of the first article's translation, the paragraph that starts with My comments. Which i now put in bold, so "a certain stupid person" can understand better..

Accuse me of not liking Trankov? If there is someone who never needed my help to sound bad or someone who deserves his medals whether I like him or not it's Trankov.
What's next, you'll keep insisting your first 'Mishin:' is a quote or accuse me of being a Mishin fan???

Accused you of intentionally taking one of Transkov's comments you translated and making it much worst in English that what he said in Russian. and then you laughed about it, that yeah, it's because i don't like him.

Why don't you do all a favor and translate that Tatiana Mishina's interview, that i gave you? that would be very useful..

 

[Bigbird]

There's so much shite flying all over the place soon we'll have to do some deep cleaning. Kazaamm!!

EDIT: Oh girls you need to stop this now. Skate Canada with it's set of conspiracy theories hasn't begun yet

 

[Prancer]

Why don't you do all a favor and translate that Tatiana Mishina's interview, that i gave you? that would be very useful..

Why don't both of you do the entire forum a favor and take this scintillating conversation to PM?

 

[Aerobicidal]

I am too busy to read this thread. May be tomorrow, after I try to find a pair of boots to wear to the arena in Kelowna, I will read it.

I believe that it is Mishin impossible for Tuktamysheva to get higher scores unless she changes what she is doing with her hands and arms.

 

[bardtoob]

I am too busy to read this thread. May be tomorrow, after I try to find a pair of boots to wear to the arena in Kelowna, I will read it.

I believe that it is Mishin impossible for Tuktamysheva to get higher scores unless she changes what she is doing with her hands and arms.

The content is comparable to your best satirical fan fiction

 

[nlloyd]

Mishin: If a skater makes a mistake in her programme, like it Liza did in her short programme, then it is clear to the skater, what’s wrong (what caused low marks). And then some mistakes can be explained by the coach. It is clearly the skater’s fault. But when the performance is good (worked out), and yet the judges hold back the marks (underscore), and to artificially put ahead another skater, that’s when even the coaches start asking questions.

You don't need to educate the readers about the obvious. They are smart enough to tell apart, what is "my words", the author of the article "words" and quotes by Mishin clearly marked as quotes "Mishin:"

The first paragraph in the article is not Mishin speaking; it is the journalist. It was an error on your part to preface those words with "Mishin:" When you do that, the subsequent words read as indirect speech i.e. Mishin said that if a skater makes . . .

 

[nlloyd]

I am too busy to read this thread. May be tomorrow, after I try to find a pair of boots to wear to the arena in Kelowna, I will read it.

This is bullying. Please desist.

 

[Aerobicidal]

This is bullying. Please desist.

BLOCKED!

 

[TAHbKA]

The first paragraph in the article is not Mishin speaking; it is the journalist. It was an error on your part to preface those words with "Mishin:" When you do that, the subsequent words read as indirect speech i.e. Mishin said that if a skater makes . . .

Thank you. This is exactly the point I failed to make.

 

[Amantide]

(do you want me to send you a PM?)... because i am not sure i want to drag the details into this topic, which is about Mishin complaining about judging and acting out and if his complaints are fair.

Sorry, just read this. Yes, please. Thanks.

 

[Tinami Amori]

Sorry, just read this. Yes, please. Thanks.

We have power outages, for the last 2.5 days, in our area. PGE gave us power for few hours, warning that very soon the power will go off again, maybe until friday. I am just playing a bit of catch-up, and will send you a PM, and check on the "wrong quote" by Mishin issue when power is back on.

 

[Vash01]

We have power outages, for the last 2.5 days, in our area. PGE gave us power for few hours, warning that very soon the power will go off again, maybe until friday. I am just playing a bit of catch-up, and will send you a PM, and check on the "wrong quote" by Mishin issue when power is back on.

Are you in California? I heard on TV that PG&E is cutting power due to the fires there (I just started a thread about it).

 

[Amantide]

We have power outages, for the last 2.5 days, in our area. PGE gave us power for few hours, warning that very soon the power will go off again, maybe until friday. I am just playing a bit of catch-up, and will send you a PM, and check on the "wrong quote" by Mishin issue when power is back on.

No problem.