Paul Wylie, former figure skating medalist, on why the Olympics still matter

[jenniferlyon]

http://www.heraldsun.com/sports/olympics/article197200504.html

“I think it is thrilling to have that moment every four years, when it becomes watercooler conversation,” says Wylie, 53, who took to the ice at age 3 and began figure skating before he reached teenhood. “There are things which are very different from other sports. That’s how I think about our sport – it’s almost like a unicorn. It’s very unique in the sporting world, to have the music and the emotion but the sheer athleticism and technique that goes into it. So I love figure skating, how about that?”

 

[MacMadame]

I am not sure he makes a compelling argument for why the Olympics still matter. They are more than figure skating after all.

 

[overedge]

Not to be too picky, but AFAIK still has his Olympic medal, so he's not a former medalist

 

[jenniferlyon]

Not to be too picky, but AFAIK still has his Olympic medal, so he's not a former medalist

Those were the words used in the article's headline, not mine. Just sayin'.

 

[Bellanca]

Paul Wylie is a very good example of an athlete living in the moment and achieving the dream. Paul went into the Olympics without a bunch of fanfare, but left with plenty. He gave every sleeper and underdog out there hope and inspiration that they too were capable of reaching their full potential on the biggest stage. Paul successfully captured and experienced that highly sought-after Olympic moment. For any Olympic eligible athlete, it doesn't get any better than that.

 

[overedge]

I assumed it was, because I know you wouldn't have worded it like that

Those were the words used in the article's headline, not mine. Just sayin'.

 

[aftershocks]

Paul Wylie is a very good example of an athlete living in the moment and achieving the dream. Paul went into the Olympics without a bunch of fanfare, but left with plenty. He gave every sleeper and underdog out there hope and inspiration that they too were capable of reaching their full potential on the biggest stage. Paul successfully captured and experienced that highly sought-after Olympic moment. For any Olympic eligible athlete, it doesn't get any better than that.

I agree, but with BOW and 'favored athlete status' becoming the norm, underdogs will have little chance to make the Olympics these days and going forward unless they are able to turn things around well in advance of the Olympics season. Therefore no more Paul Wylie scenarios. It's been so many years ago already, back when Paul actually had the opportunity to not only experience an unexpected medal-winning Olympics triumph, but also to later carve out a cool pro career with so many memorable moments!

 

[berthesghost]

I’m confused. BOW was pretty much why Paul went to Albertville instead of Mark so if anything, Paul’s silver is a reason why BOW is good, not the other way around.

 

[StasiyaGalustyanLove]

I just clicked on the link to read the article, and there is a really great picture of Paul with Nancy Kerrigan at the top of the web page! I see it is an exhibitionist skating program, but dressed in those elegant white costumes they look like a married couple going on a honeymoon in an exotic country of the north like Finland or the Neverlands.

This was my favorite saying in the article: "he glided and twirled, dressed in black, his thick, dark hair rippling in a breeze raised by his own constant, graceful movement."

My wife didn't like the article. She said it was confusing.

 

[bardtoob]

The fact that he had to say it causes me to question it.

Also, I have gotten a lot of satisfaction out of watching Max and Ross skate well at non-Olympic competitions, so maybe it is just that I got to see them skate well. Maybe the venue does not matter? Maybe the Olympics is just something popular kids get to do. I'm mean US Nationals does not count for anything anymore. At least Skate America is international and you can accumulate points towards qualifying to the GPF.

... Yeah, SA is now the most prestigious competition held in the US. Even the USFSA thinks higher of SA than US Nationals.

We can now compare any event performance to another now with Youtube, right.

There used to be a "do it when it counts" aspect to competition, but American skaters are not required to do that anymore.

Yeah, maybe Americans will start thinking they can watch Olympic figure skating on a second hand recording months after the event, commercial free. I will probably do that with US Nationals, and just cherry pick the performances worth seeing. Its not like that competition is of any consequence.

 

[bardtoob]

I just remembered that Paul was a splatfest medalist that did not skate exceptionally. His performance is not worth rewatching.

 

[Wyliefan]

You're cheery tonight.

 

[aftershocks]

I’m confused. BOW was pretty much why Paul went to Albertville instead of Mark so if anything, Paul’s silver is a reason why BOW is good, not the other way around.

It had to do with the medical bye given to Todd Eldredge who was injured and did not compete. Christopher Bowman won gold at Nationals, Paul won silver and Mark won bronze. If BOW had anything to do with the selection machinations, it's definitely not the same BOW scenario that we have today. Even the international competition rules were quite different, and skaters did not compete as often throughout the season as they obviously do today. Also US fed did not put out a notice about which events would be considered for BOW assessment to make the Olympic team, AFAIK. It was still generally considered that who medaled would make the team, aside from medical byes and special circumstances.

If there was any strict BOW measurement applied to the Paul vs Mark, I'd love to see their stats to that point. Many decisions in figure skating are obviously based not only on performance results but also quite a bit on the politics of who is popular and more high profile, etc. Basically Paul was older and more established than Mark, but not necessarily more talented and accomplished.

Checking Wiki career stats for both, the BOW issue is actually a toss-up IMO. Wylie had a bit more experience and opportunities, but he didn't have a great record at Worlds. Mark had not received a Worlds assignment until 1992, but again through no fault of his own. They both had medaled a decent amount at the few international events that were around in those days, again keeping in mind that Paul being older had more experience and opportunities. If you examine closely, Paul had only a slight edge in having received more silver medals than Mark (along with gold and bronze internationally). But Mark wasn't exactly a slouch, having won bronze and gold medals internationally as well as two bronze and one pewter at Nationals from 1990 - 1992. And with his two opportunities to go to Worlds overall (1992 forward), Mark has a better placement record than does Paul in his three times attending Worlds. Paul is a former World junior champion (1981), and he'd won three silver and two bronze medals at senior Nationals from 1988 - 1992. While Mark does not have a junior Worlds medal, he won the junior event at Nationals in 1986 (something that is not listed among Paul's accomplishments).

ETA:
Anyway, speaking of confusion, the Olympic selection in 1992 was ultimately between Mark Mitchell and Todd Eldredge who was injured and did not compete at Nationals that season. Todd was sent to the Olympics instead of Mark, which in hindsight was the wrong choice. Even Todd regrets being sent over Mark. Todd placed 10th at the 1992 Olympics and did not perform well. On his first trip to Worlds in 1992, Mark placed 5th with a lovely performance. The following season, Mark placed 4th at Worlds.

Christopher Bowman had a better record than anyone, but he was also troubled and unpredictable. Bowman placed 4th at the 1992 Olympics. Todd Eldredge's results up to 1992 were perhaps slightly better than Mark's and Paul's, but more-so Todd was seen as the up-and-comer to invest in (similar to Vincent today). Mark is about 3 years older than Todd, and Paul is around 9 years older than Mark. IMHO, the fact that Todd was recovering from an injury should have given Mark the edge. I remember feeling that way at the time too. The decision was made to send Mark to Worlds over Paul -- US fed seemingly wished to reward Mark with something after favoring Todd for the Olympics. And it was known to be Paul's final season. In that respect, it is Paul who serves as the 'Ross Miner' figure in this scenario. As we know, Paul went to the Olympics and brought the house down, nearly copping the gold medal.

The huge difference that does not allow such an amazing 'Paul Wylie' moment at the Olympics today is of course, mighty quad. There are only a specific handful of skaters with quads who are most likely to medal.

 

[berthesghost]

Paul very nearly took bronze at the olys because many of the judges were impressed by Petre's quad.

We all know what happened at 92 nats (Todd sent because of his 91 world bronze - very BOW like decision) but the negative press focused on Paul who they felt was held up to silver and hence the team because he was more experienced than Mark ( also BOW like in spirit) as the complainers didn't feel paul skated terribly well at nats Iirc.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

As someone who saw '92 US Nationals in person, Mark should have won both the short and the free.

Wylie had excellent skating skills, but his jumps were really off for the entire competition.

He was very lucky to even be fourth after the short program, and should probably have been fourth overall behind Mitchell, Bowman, and Scott Davis.

With Eldredge unable to skate his best and bombing in Albertville, it's painful even now to think about the decision to keep Mark off the Olympic team.

 

[berthesghost]

^exactly. Paul was the Adam of ‘92 not the Ross.

 

[skateboy]

I dislike headlines like this one. Who has been saying the Olympics don't matter, other than a very small percentage of people (which always has and always will exist)?

Of course the Olympics matter, they always have. It's the largest gathering of athletes in the world.

 

[Inessence]

I think the Olympics matter in depicting sports that get very little fanfare otherwise. I mean, how much football, baseball, and basketball can people really watch?

 

[jenniferlyon]

I think the Olympics matter in depicting sports that get very little fanfare otherwise. I mean, how much football, baseball, and basketball can people really watch?

Yeah, I always enjoy watching the luge, the bobsledding, and the ski jumpers in particular.

 

[bardtoob]

Paul very nearly took bronze at the olys because many of the judges were impressed by Petre's quad.

We all know what happened at 92 nats (Todd sent because of his 91 world bronze - very BOW like decision) but the negative press focused on Paul who they felt was held up to silver and hence the team because he was more experienced than Mark ( also BOW like in spirit) as the complainers didn't feel paul skated terribly well at nats Iirc.

The more things change the more they stay the same.

But Boston coaches did have more clout back then.

 

[falling_dance]

I just remembered that Paul was a splatfest medalist that did not skate exceptionally. His performance is not worth rewatching.

I can't lend my unqualified endorsement to the choreography, but this wasn't a bad, splatfesty Olympic performance at all.

 

[bardtoob]

I can't lend my unqualified endorsement to the choreography, but this wasn't a bad, splatfesty Olympic performance at all.

It would have been okay if the announcer had not mentioned Mark. It is really tasteless to try to tell somebody how to feel when you have a voice across national television and they have no chance to reply.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

It would have been okay if the announcer had not mentioned Mark. It is really tasteless to try to tell somebody how to feel when you have a voice across national television and they have no chance to reply.

Mark Mitchell, who was the third place finisher, is sitting home wishing Paul Wylie well?

Wow. Just wow.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

For an unheralded skater like Wylie, the stars were really in alignment for Paul in Albertville.

Browning and Eldredge were injured.
Bowman seemed underprepared and was having tremendous problems with the triple axel.
New kids on the block Urmanov, Stojko, and Zagarodnyuk made small errors here and there.
Barna let it slip through his fingers in the free skate.

Petrenko was well, Petrenko.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ Exactly @essence_of_soy. I was going to point out that no matter how much the judges were intrigued and admiring of Petr Barna's quad, he had a letdown/ mistake in his performance which scotched his chances for the silver medal. In a similar vein, had Paul gone completely clean in the fp as he had in the sp, he arguably should have won gold. It would have been even more controversial had Paul not been rewarded with gold if he'd skated clean in the fp, with the fact that Petrenko made even more visibly sloppy eras in fp that he was forgiven because of his more lofty reputation.

^exactly. Paul was the Adam of ‘92 not the Ross.

Eh not in some respects. A parallel can clearly be made for Paul being the Ross more-so than the Adam because Paul had a poor record at Worlds in his three appearances. In recent years Adam has been performing to great results on the GP and holding his own at Worlds among quadsters (quads are the sticky wicket that did not exist in Paul's era). Similar to Paul, Adam and Ross were both the veteran skaters still trying to nab an Olympic berth, but only Adam has had much more notable success and popularity internationally than both Paul and Ross in the lead-up to an Olympic season.

I’m confused. BOW was pretty much why Paul went to Albertville instead of Mark so if anything, Paul’s silver is a reason why BOW is good, not the other way around.

We all know what happened at 92 nats (Todd sent because of his 91 world bronze - very BOW like decision) but the negative press focused on Paul who they felt was held up to silver and hence the team because he was more experienced than Mark ( also BOW like in spirit) as the complainers didn't feel paul skated terribly well at nats Iirc.

So you're confused, and then you're not. Everyone has their memory and recall of what happened. And then refreshing our memories with facts and visual evidence can be helpful. You seem to want to keep pressing the BOW way of looking at things. As I pointed out in my earlier post, BOW was not a strict policy or criteria used back then. It was a different era, and the skaters did not compete at as many events as they do now in the lead-up to Nationals. Of course there are similarities we can cite, as well as many differences. Things do tend to stay the same in figure skating traditionally, but that's not specifically related to a BOW argument IMO, because there are many differences, starting with the difference in number of competitive events and the completely different era generally and specifically.

Obviously, results were important and political popularity was always a factor as well. Paul had more politically connected and popular coaching in his background than Mark. Paul was also a former junior World champion. However, Paul's international results, as well as some of his results at Nationals were hampered by his competition nerves which thwarted his ability to demonstrate his high level of talent consistently. Again, I think my earlier post spells out all of the complicated factors involved in the 1992 Olympic team selection. Clearly it was not strictly nor policy-wise a BOW judgment. It was first a medical bye decision of Todd over Mark since Mark was the bronze medalist. The argument of Paul vs Mark was based on the fact that Mark had skated better than Paul, thus many felt Mark should have won silver over Paul based on the actual skating at Nationals. Again, Paul winning silver rather than bronze shows he was well-liked poltically and his coaches had more connections perhaps than Mark's coach had.

Plus let's not lose sight of the fact that everyone knew Paul had amazing talent at his best, and that his main problem was having to struggle with his nerves to be able to perform the way he could. In the end, the Olympic selection came down to many factors, among them being the fact that it was Paul's final year, he was older, and it was probably assumed that Mark would have more opportunities. The cruel reality is that Mark had already been previously rejected for an opportunity to attend Worlds in favor of injured Christopher Bowman. So Mark was bitten by the medical bye exception twice, as well as by political factors. Mark was obviously talented and he had good results at the few fall international events that were on the season schedule back then (which again proves that BOW was not a front and center concern, and definitely not a stated policy). It was more a matter of there being increasing depth of talent among U.S. men, and also Mark being caught betwixt and between politically with not having a coach who held much clout and being the odd guy out in terms of the timing of when he came up to seniors with a number of other talented top guys already there on the scene (as well as there existing a younger highly regarded up-and-coming talented jumper in Todd Eldredge).

 

[MacMadame]

For an unheralded skater like Wylie,

Wylie was a popular skater frequently shown on tv and sent to many international competitions. He wasn't remotely "unheralded".

 

[Simone411]

http://www.heraldsun.com/sports/olympics/article197200504.html

Wow! I'll just say that I was thinking about Paul Wylie earlier this week. I just saw this thread, and earlier during the week, I added some video captures I made a long time ago of Paul and Nancy during their Exhibition program together on my ice gallery page.

Paul had amazing technical and artistic abilities. I always loved his skating and was really proud of him when he won that silver medal.

 

[Coco]

OMG...that spiral into 3f!

 

[Cleo1782]

I’m confused. BOW was pretty much why Paul went to Albertville instead of Mark so if anything, Paul’s silver is a reason why BOW is good, not the other way around.

Mark was bumped for Todd not Paul

 

[Coco]

Mark was bumped for Todd not Paul

That's one way to look at it, but basically, Todd was going before Nationals even started.

There was no true BOW consideration back then, so the judges saw to it that Paul edged out Mark due to his BOW. That's my guess, anyway.