Harvey Weinstein megaproducer and executive ousted over sexual harassment

[Japanfan]

I just think it's going overboard.

Then you're trivializing sexual assault and the harm it does.

Now men will be afraid to hire women in the workplace because they might yell harassment over some tiny little thing they don't like.

There are procedures in place to challenge discrimination in the workplace.

Or men will be afraid to be alone with a female in any business situation.

Oh, poor babies.

You do realize that it's mostly the men doing the harassing? Some fear among those who do it or would do it would be a good thing.

When one boss retired, a big ol' teddy bear of a man, and I was 35 years younger, I hugged him at his retirement party with everybody around and he said something like you all saw that, she hugged me. I wouldn't want to be accused of anything. So I play-punched him on the arm. And we all laughed.

Ho ho ho. Again, you're trivializing.

It might be harder to do something about the big stuff (actual assault) if every man gets fired now for something he did once 20 years ago. And females are going to grow up being afraid that all men will assault them.

You're saying we should let sexual harassment slide, because an actual assault is worse, especially if it was 20 years ago?

If you had been victim to a theft 20 years ago, and the thief was then found, would you want the thief to be let off of the hook because so much time had past?

IMO Women should grow up being very aware of sexual assault/harassment and how common it is.

I say this as one who grew up in the 60s and 70s, when there wasn't even a word for date rape - which happened far too frequently -or a dialogue about consent. A whole lot of women were date raped but didn't have the language or permission to discuss it. And gender discrimination in the workplace was quite normal. I worked in a mine in the summer of 1979, it was one of the first summers that women were allowed to work there. The way men treated us was just awful, but at the time we just didn't talk about it and there was nothing we could do about the heckling and jeering and pin-up Playboy calendars all over the place.

 

[ballettmaus]

Jason Beghe was investiged by NBC for what is officially called "inappropriate behavior".
Bush tweeted her outrage over branding repeat sexual abusers as having "anger management issues" earlier today https://twitter.com/SophiaBush/status/938867170343309312

It's outrageous and reprehensible that TPTB at NBC protected the abuser instead of the abused. Even more outrageous is their "Bush wanted to leave" Statement. What was she supposed to do?
It's so annoying that there will be no consequences for the NBC bosses. There should be because they are enabling abuse.

 

[Susan1]

Then you're trivializing sexual assault and the harm it does.

I think (and I'm not going to attack "you" and tell "you" that you are wrong and how "you" are supposed to think) it's just the opposite. They are lumping every type of "sexual misconduct" into one basket and firing all of these men (except for the two worst). Rape should have harsher consequences than inappropriate touching 20 years ago.

There are procedures in place to challenge discrimination in the workplace.

So, this is going to be a big avalanche of "I didn't get a raise, or a part, or an opportunity, so I am going to cry discrimination". Or assault. And you have to believe ALL women now and fire all of the men.

Question (anybody) - Should Hillary be condemned for accepting Harvey Weinstein's money? It's all or nothing here. No differences in any of the cases, right?

If you had been victim to a theft 20 years ago, and the thief was then found, would you want the thief to be let off of the hook because so much time had past?

That doesn't make sense. These women knew who their abuser was 20 years ago. If you knew who the thief was and worked with them for 20 years, would you wait until someone else said they stole from them 20 years ago to say "me too"?

The way men treated us was just awful, but at the time we just didn't talk about it and there was nothing we could do about the heckling and jeering and pin-up Playboy calendars all over the place.

And I would guess things have changed since? Are you going to find them and sue them and get them fired?

 

[Scrufflet]

Then you're trivializing sexual assault and the harm it does.



There are procedures in place to challenge discrimination in the workplace.



Oh, poor babies.

You do realize that it's mostly the men doing the harassing? Some fear among those who do it or would do it would be a good thing.



Ho ho ho. Again, you're trivializing.



You're saying we should let sexual harassment slide, because an actual assault is worse, especially if it was 20 years ago?

If you had been victim to a theft 20 years ago, and the thief was then found, would you want the thief to be let off of the hook because so much time had past?

IMO Women should grow up being very aware of sexual assault/harassment and how common it is.

I say this as one who grew up in the 60s and 70s, when there wasn't even a word for date rape - which happened far too frequently -or a dialogue about consent. A whole lot of women were date raped but didn't have the language or permission to discuss it. And gender discrimination in the workplace was quite normal. I worked in a mine in the summer of 1979, it was one of the first summers that women were allowed to work there. The way men treated us was just awful, but at the time we just didn't talk about it and there was nothing we could do about the heckling and jeering and pin-up Playboy calendars all over the place.

You are dead-on with your analysis! I'm the same vintage as you and experienced similar things although I never had the courage to work in a mine! I applaud what is going on. And I will never be "bored" with it. I want a massive change in our culture and if that means daily accusations, so be it.

 

[gk_891]

Out of curiosity, does racial harassment will get the same spotlight as sexual harassment in the U.S? I'm not from the U.S so I honestly couldn't say. I think it's an issue here in Canada but it seems to be almost a no-no to even mention it as for some people, such a thing couldn't possibly exist. It's only a relic from the past.

The story below is a recent one.

https://nextshark.com/eugene-gu-doctor-put-on-probation-workplace-bullying/

ETA - Sorry if I got off topic here!

 

[overedge]

Out of curiosity, does racial harassment will get the same spotlight as sexual harassment in the U.S? I'm not from the U.S so I honestly couldn't say. I think it's an issue here in Canada but it seems to be almost a no-no to even mention it as for some people, such a thing couldn't possibly exist. It's only a relic from the past.

I think racial harassment of First Nations people is getting more attention in Canada, partially as a result of the reconciliation movement and the missing & murdered women inquiry. And just in the past week there was the story about the woman in a hijab being harassed on the Skytrain in Vancouver. I wouldn't agree that it's not usually mentioned.

 

[gk_891]

I think racial harassment of First Nations people is getting more attention in Canada, partially as a result of the reconciliation movement and the missing & murdered women inquiry. And just in the past week there was the story about the woman in a hijab being harassed on the Skytrain in Vancouver. I wouldn't agree that it's not usually mentioned.

It's nice to see that stuff like this is getting more attention. My impression of Canada is that for some people (emphasis on some of course), racism doesn't exist here and that it only exists elsewhere. Maybe it's just the people that I'm around. Because for many Canadians who are from minority backgrounds that I am friends with, the consensus seems to be that most white Canadians are a little deluded about racism in our society and they have an overly rosy image of themselves.

 

[made_in_canada]

most white Canadians are a little deluded about racism in our society and they have an overly rosy image of themselves.

I think this is true. But I also grew up in a school and neighbourhood that didn't really have any visible minorities, which I don't think is that unique in many rural areas in Canada. It's pretty easy to say you don't have a racism problem when you don't have to deal with people that look differently than you. But I can remember a few comments from friends' parents and even teachers that exposed their racial biases particularly towards First Nations. I do think the reconciliation process has been good to expose some of the racism towards First Nations people that exists in Canada.

 

[gk_891]

I think this is true. But I also grew up in a school and neighbourhood that didn't really have any visible minorities, which I don't think is that unique in many rural areas in Canada. It's pretty easy to say you don't have a racism problem when you don't have to deal with people that look differently than you. But I can remember a few comments from friends' parents and even teachers that exposed their racial biases particularly towards First Nations. I do think the reconciliation process has been good to expose some of the racism towards First Nations people that exists in Canada.

I also think it's easy for some people to say that something doesn't exist if it doesn't effect themselves personally in a negative way.

It kind of reminds me of some international students I had met back when I was a student. A few of them were from the Netherlands but their families were originally from countries like Suriname, Indonesia, Turkey, etc. And they mentioned how racism and discrimination was a major issue in Dutch society but it was something that many Dutch people were in denial about. IMO, a lot of Canadians are often the same way.

 

[overedge]

I agree that diversity is certainly not evenly distributed across Canada, and that acknowledging racism may be difficult for someone whose context is a community or area where there isn't a lot of diversity.

I lived in Alberta just after the Jim Keegstra case - the mayor of Eckville (rural Alberta town) who was also a high school teacher, who was discovered to be teaching in his classes that the Holocaust was a fraud and that Jews were conspiring to take over the world. I believe that at some point someone actually asked Keegstra why, if Jews were taking over the world, there weren't any Jews in Eckville, and he really didn't have a good answer....

 

[Japanfan]

I think this is true. But I also grew up in a school and neighbourhood that didn't really have any visible minorities, which I don't think is that unique in many rural areas in Canada. It's pretty easy to say you don't have a racism problem when you don't have to deal with people that look differently than you. But I can remember a few comments from friends' parents and even teachers that exposed their racial biases particularly towards First Nations. I do think the reconciliation process has been good to expose some of the racism towards First Nations people that exists in Canada.

I've observed a lot of racism towards First Nations in Canada. It manifests primarily as 'they should pull themselves up by the bootstraps and get with the program'. I'd like to think this is changing as the result of reconciliation efforts and the inquiry into the missing women, but sadly, I don't think it is. This is in part because First Nations remain largely marginalized.

I wonder if schools now include First Nations history and culture in their curricula?

And they mentioned how racism and discrimination was a major issue in Dutch society but it was something that many Dutch people were in denial about. IMO, a lot of Canadians are often the same way.

It's hard to get a racist to admit to being one, and to having privilege or entitlement.

 

[Japanfan]

They are lumping every type of "sexual misconduct" into one basket and firing all of these men (except for the two worst). Rape should have harsher consequences than inappropriate touching 20 years ago.

Rape does have harsher consequences.

And I would guess things have changed since? Are you going to find them and sue them and get them fired?

I'm not a lawyer, but it would probably be too long ago.

But it should not have been allowed at the time, and is an example of why discrimination and sexual harassment should not be allowed in the workplace.

We women workers in the mines were demeaned, denigrated, ridiculed, and confronted by Playboy calendars all over the place.

There was one class action suit for discrimination put forward successfully by female mine workers in the 70s. This was the subject of the movie "North County" with Charlize Theron, which is an excellent film. I was so pleased to see that movie and see that a film-maker had given voice to all the women workers who were mistreated and discriminated against in mines at the time. It really had all the makings of an Oscar winner, but interestingly, was completely overlooked on the award circuit. Which in itself points to discrimination against women in Hollywood - movies about gay men like "Milk" and "Brokeback Mountain" get way more attention than movies about women. There was a "The Color Purple', but that was about black women, and Hollywood loves to show how progressive it is with films about blacks and the Holocaust.

 

[Jay42]

It's nice to see that stuff like this is getting more attention. My impression of Canada is that for some people (emphasis on some of course), racism doesn't exist here and that it only exists elsewhere. Maybe it's just the people that I'm around. Because for many Canadians who are from minority backgrounds that I am friends with, the consensus seems to be that most white Canadians are a little deluded about racism in our society and they have an overly rosy image of themselves.

My dad and his step-sister are very much like this. I made a comment to my dad once about the amount of First Nations communities who don't have access to clean water and he started talking about how they had to earn the right to it. He wouldn't listen to me at all so I finally changed the subject. My aunt has posted several things on Facebook about how racism really isn't that bad.

My mom on the other hand grew up with a tremendously racist father and my grandma always taught my mom that my grandpa's behaviour was wrong so my mom taught us not to behave like that either. I think she's still a little head in the sand about how bad racism actually is here, but she's not as bad as my dad is.

 

[VGThuy]

Thank you for your post. I suspect most of us did not earn our right to easy access to clean water. We were lucky to be born having it.

 

[Jay42]

Thank you for your post. I suspect most of us did not earn our right to easy access to clean water. We were lucky to be born having it.

We definitely were. And for my dad to talk like First Nations people on the Reservations needed to change their behaviour in order to have the right to clean water is so infuriating to me but trying to explain to him that human beings should have access to drinkable water was like slamming my head against brick. I've done that (accidentally), it's not fun and it really hurts. So I moved on. My mom listened to me, maybe she can get it through his head.

 

[MsZem]

Another high-profile case: Alex Kozinski from the 9th circuit.

Should all this still be under the original Weinstein thread? I feel like it should maybe be retitled "Harvey Weinstein and other sexually predatory creeps".

 

[PeterG]

We definitely were. And for my dad to talk like First Nations people on the Reservations needed to change their behaviour in order to have the right to clean water is so infuriating to me but trying to explain to him that human beings should have access to drinkable water was like slamming my head against brick. I've done that (accidentally), it's not fun and it really hurts. So I moved on. My mom listened to me, maybe she can get it through his head.

"Dad, what have you done to earn the right to clean drinking water?" (Do I want to know his response??)

 

[PeterG]

A Fourth Woman Has Accused Dustin Hoffman of Sexual Harassment

 

[skatesindreams]

There also appears to be a photo of a female groping Hoffman.

 

[falling_dance]

There also appears to be a photo of a female groping Hoffman.

If you're referring to the photo that was published in Playboy in 1985, Rossetter says that it was a retaliatory gesture after innumerable instances in which Hoffman groped her.

As Dustin was leaving, a photographer stopped him and asked for a picture with me and another actress from the film. He stood between us and put his arms around our rib cages. On cue, he grabbed our breasts. Without thinking, a knee-jerk response built up over two years, I grabbed his crotch. How would he like some of his own medicine? In that moment I understood how women abused for many years by husbands or boyfriends will pick up a gun or a knife and suddenly attack back. I also knew I had snapped and what I had done was awful. I was terrified and humiliated. My pathetic attempt at fighting back could have horrible repercussions. After all, I was not a jokester, or famous or powerful. I went home and cried for hours.

The dust settled and I did another show with wonderful actors who were healthy and professional. Three months after the party I was in a restaurant with fellow actors when another friend came racing in with a Playboy magazine. There in the back was a picture of me and Dustin and the other actress and I am apparently, gleefully grabbing his genitals. Yes, the millisecond had caught the act. But it hadn’t captured the story. The caption was to indicate how fun-loving we serious theater people are. And it read, “Reviving a dead Salesman." All my friends could say was, "Oh my God, your career is over." How ironic. Abused women who fight back usually go to jail.

 

[skatesindreams]

It indicates that she engaged in similar behaviour; for whatever reason.
I doubt that it strengthens her credibility,

 

[overedge]

@Japanfan the new K-12 curriculum in BC schools has a large First Nations component - history and culture both. Universities and colleges are also being encouraged to indigenize their current courses and programs and to incorporate indigenous elements in new programming. I think the same is also happening, to different degrees, in other Canadian provinces.

 

[Peaches LaTour]

Personally, as one whose had alot of interaction with my Canadian neighbors, (both at home & in Canada) I've always felt that they've had a VERY overly- rosy viewpoint of themselves on all levels. A viewpoint they never hesitate to share with anybody who is willing to listen.

 

[gk_891]

Personally, as one whose had alot of interaction with my Canadian neighbors, (both at home & in Canada) I've always felt that they've had a VERY overly- rosy viewpoint of themselves on all levels. A viewpoint they never hesitate to share with anybody who is willing to listen.

Yup, that's my experience too as a Canadian myself. Some white Canadians seem to believe that they are automatically good people just by virtue of their nationality.

I remember our PM Justin Trudeau announced a while back that Canada was the world's first post-national state. I think he said that there is no mainstream in Canada but rather shared values like openness, respect, compassion, etc. Friends of mine from countries like Trinidad, Jamaica, Brazil, Peru, etc found that highly amusing. While their countries are by no means free of racial problems, I remember they mentioned how their societies were very rich melting pots and that a high degree interracial mixing had been going on for centuries (unlike Canada where that type of overlapping between communities is more of a recent phenomenon). I don't believe Canada ever enforced anti-miscegenation laws like the U.S did but it was still strictly kept to a minimum relative to countries throughout most of Latin America and the Caribbean.

 

[skatesindreams]

I'm afraid that these allegations will become "commonplace" among media personalities:
http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/11/media/mario-batali-sexual-misconduct-allegations/index.html

 

[MsZem]

I'm afraid that these allegations will become "commonplace" among media personalities:
http://money.cnn.com/2017/12/11/media/mario-batali-sexual-misconduct-allegations/index.html

So that's the famous chef who was about the get accused! I saw speculation about it on Twitter earlier (Yashar Ali is really well-sourced).

Honestly, at this point there are very few accusations that could surprise me. But I will be very disappointed if it turns out that someone like Obama or Tom Hanks harassed someone. Hopefully not.

 

[Japanfan]

I remember our PM Justin Trudeau announced a while back that Canada was the world's first post-national state. I think he said that there is no mainstream in Canada but rather shared values like openness, respect, compassion, etc. Friends of mine from countries like Trinidad, Jamaica, Brazil, Peru, etc found that highly amusing. While their countries are by no means free of racial problems, I remember they mentioned how their societies were very rich melting pots and that a high degree interracial mixing had been going on for centuries (unlike Canada where that type of overlapping between communities is more of a recent phenomenon).

I grew up with the understanding that Canada prided itself on being a 'cultural mosaic' versus a 'melting pot', which was more characteristic of the U.S. Though I'm sure there is variance in Canadians' perspective on how true that claim is.

 

[Japanfan]

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...fter-sex-harassment-accusations-idUSKBN1E52CV

And now celebrity chef Mario Batali. These guys are just crawling out of the woodwork it seems.

 

[skatingguy]

New Yorker fires reporter Ryan Lizza over alleged sexual misconduct
http://www.cbc.ca/news/world/ryan-lizza-fired-new-yorker-1.4443922

 

[MacMadame]

Apparently John Oliver used his position as host of a panel to grill Dustin Hoffman about the allegations against him:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...term=.4221b6e6fae3&wpisrc=nl_headlines&wpmm=1