Who do you prefer- Savchenko & Massot or Savchenko & Szolkowy

Which pair do you prefer- Aliona & Robin, Aliona & Bruno

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savchenkoboss

savchenkoboss

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Obviously both are incredibly talented teams made up with the gem (Aliona), arguably the finest female pairs skater in history, and a very capable/ excellent male partner (Robin and Bruno), just a notch down from her excellence. Bruno & Aliona clearly have a better friendship/personal relationship, but Robin and Aliona still gelled beautifully on the ice inspite of their personal differences/conflicts. Robin & Aliona have had about 5 times longer a career (so far) than Bruno & Aliona, and for all we know Bruno & Aliona might now never be back, but even if they are their career is sure to be multiple times over shorter. Thus R&A winning far more major titles is inevitable and this they did with 5 world titles and many European titles. Bruno & Aliona though got the coveted OGM with a performance that would have very likely also won the 2010 and 2014 Olympics Aliona & Robin failed to win.

Which of these wonderfully talented pairs do you prefer. I am not asking who is greater, but which did you enjoy watching more. Me personaly it would be Aliona and Bruno. Aliona and Robin were wonderful but some of their programs were a bit gimmicky for me, and Robin wasnt the best as far as beautiful lines and positions on the ice. His basics are better than Bruno, but I prefer the more beautiful and elegant look Aliona and Bruno have together, and I love their incredible triple twist which Aliona and Robin never had. Robin simply lacks the physical strength and athleticsm to throw Aliona as high as Bruno can, especialy in the twist.
 
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Definitely Aliona and Bruno. Their programs were more lyrical, more a pair, instead of a show of Aliona's superhuman strength (which I often thought was all Aliona/Robin programs).

I also thought the chilliness between Aliona and Robin was obvious in their last years together. They just looked miserable together. Aliona with Bruno was a different woman -- smiling, happy, joyful.

The personal chemistry between Savchenko and Massot was evident in this interview and this was when they weren't even competing because of the federation issues:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9vRdcM3waQ&t=115s
 
canbelto said:
Definitely Aliona and Bruno. Their programs were more lyrical, more a pair, instead of a show of Aliona's superhuman strength (which I often thought was all Aliona/Robin programs).

I also thought the chilliness between Aliona and Robin was obvious in their last years together. They just looked miserable together. Aliona with Bruno was a different woman -- smiling, happy, joyful.

The personal chemistry between Savchenko and Massot was evident in this interview and this was when they weren't even competing because of the federation issues:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9vRdcM3waQ&t=115s
Click to expand...

ITA on all of that. I love both pairs, but those are the biggest differences for me.
 
Wow I am surprised so many agree with me. I honestly expected Robin & Aliona to be a cinch to win this poll, and was just curious how close Bruno & Aliona could make it.
 
canbelto said:
Definitely Aliona and Bruno. Their programs were more lyrical, more a pair, instead of a show of Aliona's superhuman strength (which I often thought was all Aliona/Robin programs).

I also thought the chilliness between Aliona and Robin was obvious in their last years together. They just looked miserable together. Aliona with Bruno was a different woman -- smiling, happy, joyful.

The personal chemistry between Savchenko and Massot was evident in this interview and this was when they weren't even competing because of the federation issues:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9vRdcM3waQ&t=115s
Click to expand...
Thank you so much for the video.....wonderful
 
:lol: I'm not falling for this one. Each of these partnerships is divine in its own right. Different reasons for different seasons. There's no need to compare, unless fruitless convo is needed for the off-season, which apparently it is. :p

Apples to oranges folks. Robin was overall a more skilled pairs partner. Bruno laid his heart on the ice to help win Aliona and himself Olympic gold. But without Robin and Ingo, Aliona would not have been in quite that position with Bruno. Nor would she have been in that position without the support of fans. She knows it, and that's why she thanked everyone. It took her own guts and amazing drive and self-belief, but she didn't do it with Bruno solely on the steam of her own sturdy will and deep desire.

I do not think Robin and Aliona had conflicts and personal differences until very late in their partnership when it was more about Robin feeling the need to retire from eligible competition due to age and injury. Aliona clearly still desired to compete. Robin did come back for four more years after 2010, but it was extremely difficult for them to overcome the favoritism toward Tat/Max, especially with the 2014 Olympics being held in Sochi. Still, Aliona & Robin managed to win 2013-14 GPF, and they also won 2014 Worlds in their swan song (for a 5th World championship). A&R also faced problems no team should have to deal with due to the cruel opposition against their coach, Ingo Steuer. The fact Ingo was ostracized by the German fed made it difficult for all three in their creative, productive partnership. Plus the volatile on-again, off-again romance between Aliona & Ingo also caused tensions. If anything, Robin was the quiet, steady, long-suffering member of the threesome.

Bruno made a lot of fine-tuning improvements in his skating with Aliona, which is to her and to his credit. While Robin lacks Bruno's height and maybe his brute strength, in no way did Robin ever lack sufficient physical strength and the athleticism required to be a pairs partner. :drama: Bruno is taller and he has a bigger body build than Robin, so of course Bruno is able to throw Aliona higher in the air.
 
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To me, the only Aliona and Robin program i liked was their Torino short program. This pair had a lot of messy performances and concepts that left a lot to be desired. Pina was a good concept.

Aliona and Bruno blew me away time after time. I understand that Aliona is who we will remember and she is top 4 pairs girls of all time behind Ekaterina, Natalia, Elena B. Bruno however set a new standard for strength and ability to THROW and lift. Aliona talked right away about that. I truly love them. Their programs, especially the free was from another world
 
Im gonna go with Bruno for these reasons...

1. I MUCH prefer ALL the music selections she has done with Bruno (not Robin's fault tho Im sure) I despise Pink Panther and their version of Send in the dang clowns.

2. Bruno seems more muscular... way more height in the twist, more powerful throws, etc....
 
What do people think is the likelihood Aliona and Robin return to competition? I hope they come back, I feel they still have so much more to do.
 
arakwafan2006 said:
To me, the only Aliona and Robin program i liked was their Torino short program. This pair had a lot of messy performances and concepts that left a lot to be desired. Pina was a good concept.

Aliona and Bruno blew me away time after time. I understand that Aliona is who we will remember and she is top 4 pairs girls of all time behind Ekaterina, Natalia, Elena B. Bruno however set a new standard for strength and ability to THROW and lift. Aliona talked right away about that. I truly love them. Their programs, especially the free was from another world
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You speak for me. I just could not get into Ingo's work with Aliona and Robin.
 
Meoima said:
Robin had better skating skills but Bruno caught up with Alyona very well. Also, his relationship with Alyona was more joyful and mutual.
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They had different relationships. Jeez! Aliona would not have been with Robin that long nor accomplished as much as she did with him, if they did not have mutual goals, moments of levity, and deep understanding, as well as having shared joy in their triumphs. The Robin and Aliona relationship was complicated by Aliona's romantic relationship with Ingo, and by the fact that Ingo was ostracized by people who were jealous of him. The story of Ingo having been compromised by the Stasi as a 21-year-old athlete did not surface until Ingo gained success with Aliona & Robin. People were jealous of his success and thus attempted to stab him in the back and to break up the team. I admire the way that all three stood steadfast together like The Three Musketeers and in the process they changed pairs skating with their creativity, athleticism and innovative moves, which are now part of the canon of pairs figure skating.

The real story of The Three Musketeers is as complicated as the dynamic among Savchenko/Szolkowy/Steuer. Aliona seemed to regret not leaving sooner for her own ambitions, but honestly the reason she stayed is because she achieved success with Ingo and Robin. There was something alchemically magical about what all three wrought together on the ice. People can continue to bellyache and complain about not liking Aliona with Robin, but at the end of the day they are just haters. Aliona with Robin and Ingo got her to the pinnacle of success in the sport and it didn't happen by accident, nor by only the sweat of Aliona's brow and she knows it. The problem for Aliona/Robin/Ingo largely was the jealous haters, and the fact that the actions against Ingo by the German fed made it extremely difficult for them all financially. And still they remained loyal to each other and they achieved greatness in the face of opposition and huge obstacles.

A lot of people still wish to give Aliona all the credit and to downplay Robin's talents, and to complain about Ingo having a difficult personality. Well, Aliona's romantic relationship with Ingo was mutual. If she was so unhappy, she should have quit the relationship and broken up the partnership with Robin early on, but then she would not have achieved as much success in her career. Who Aliona was when she first partnered with Bruno, is as a result of what she went through in those years with Robin and Ingo, the ups, the downs, the victories, the defeats, the tough times and the good times, both on and off the ice. Aliona really should be honest with herself about that reality. I'm glad she's happier now, but no one should piss on their past, no matter how bittersweet and painful.

The reason Mozer wanted Robin to work with her teams is not out of pity or benevolence. It's out of the knowledge of Robin's own extraordinary talents. Give Aliona and Bruno respect, but please stop dissing Robin, and stop dismissing Ingo completely.
 
aftershocks said:
They had different relationships. Jeez! Aliona would not have been with Robin that long nor accomplished as much as she did with him, if they did not have mutual goals, moments of levity, and deep understanding, as well as having shared joy in their triumphs. The Robin and Aliona relationship was complicated by Aliona's romantic relationship with Ingo, and by the fact that Ingo was ostracized by people who were jealous of him. The story of Ingo having been compromised by the Stasi as a 21-year-old athlete did not surface until Ingo gained success with Aliona & Robin. People were jealous of his success and thus attempted to stab him in the back and to break up the team. I admire the way that all three stood steadfast together like The Three Musketeers and in the process they changed pairs skating with their creativity, athleticism and innovative moves, which are now part of the canon of pairs figure skating.

The real story of The Three Musketeers is as complicated as the dynamic among Savchenko/Szolkowy/Steuer. Aliona seemed to regret not leaving sooner for her own ambitions, but honestly the reason she stayed is because she achieved success with Ingo and Robin. There was something alchemically magical about what all three wrought together on the ice. People can continue to bellyache and complain about not liking Aliona with Robin, but at the end of the day they are just haters. Aliona with Robin and Ingo got her to the pinnacle of success in the sport and it didn't happen by accident, nor by only the sweat of Aliona's brow and she knows it. The problem for Aliona/Robin/Ingo largely was the jealous haters, and the fact that the actions against Ingo by the German fed made it extremely difficult for them all financially. And still they remained loyal to each other and they achieved greatness in the face of opposition and huge obstacles.

A lot of people still wish to give Aliona all the credit and to downplay Robin's talents, and to complain about Ingo having a difficult personality. Well, Aliona's romantic relationship with Ingo was mutual. If she was so unhappy, she should have quit the relationship and broken up the partnership with Robin early on, but then she would not have achieved as much success in her career. Who Aliona was when she first partnered with Bruno, is as a result of what she went through in those years with Robin and Ingo, the ups, the downs, the victories, the defeats, the tough times and the good times, both on and off the ice. Aliona really should be honest with herself about that reality. I'm glad she's happier now, but no one should piss on their past, no matter how bittersweet and painful.

The reason Mozer wanted Robin to work with her teams is not out of pity or benevolence. It's out of the knowledge of Robin's own extraordinary talents. Give Aliona and Bruno respect, but please stop dissing Robin, and stop dismissing Ingo completely.
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Didn’t I say generally the same thing? Robin was the better skater and of course he was talented but his relationship with Alyona was more or less rocky. Maybe Alyona and Bruno worked out well because Alyona had experience with Robin. But in general watching Alyona and Bruno giving less tension.
 
Meoima said:
Didn’t I say generally the same thing? Robin was the better skater and of course he was talented but his relationship with Alyona was more or less rocky. Maybe Alyona and Bruno worked out well because Alyona had experience with Robin. But in general watching Alyona and Bruno giving less tension.
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No you didn't say what I said. You surely can see it exactly as you are able. I make no judgements on you for what you are able to see or to not see.

I would be careful if I was you to describe Aliona's relationship with Robin as 'rocky.' In fact, it was her volatile romance with Ingo that was rocky, and that dynamic affected her partnership with Robin, because they all worked together on the ice. And Aliona and Ingo had an on-again, off-again relationship off the ice. If anything, it was Robin's calm and steadiness which kept the partnership on solid footing all those years. It was the break-up of the partnership after the 2014 Olympics, and how it went down that lead some people to believe Aliona and Robin didn't get along. I don't think that's true at all.
 
aftershocks said:
No you didn't say what I said. You surely can see it exactly as you are able. I make no judgements on you for what you are able to see or to not see.

I would be careful if I was you to describe Aliona's relationship with Robin as 'rocky.' In fact, it was her volatile romance with Ingo that was rocky, and that dynamic affected her partnership with Robin, because they all worked together on the ice. And Aliona and Ingo had an on-again, off-again relationship off the ice. If anything, it was Robin's calm and steadiness which kept the partnership on solid footing all those years. It was the break-up of the partnership after the 2014 Olympics, and how it went down that lead some people to believe Aliona and Robin didn't get along. I don't think that's true at all.
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I remember that at some farewell party, Robin was not happy and acted cold. Aliona was the only one who said thank you though.
 
I remember the first time I saw Robin and Aliona for the first time up close.

It certainly put pay to the illusion that all pair men were giants. He was the same height as me (5"7'). It was Aliona who was absolutely tiny at around 4"10'.

I like both combinations. They brought something different to each union.
 
Meoima said:
I remember that at some farewell party, Robin was not happy and acted cold. Aliona was the only one who said thank you though.
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Well, that's your perception. What do you mean by a 'farewell party' anyway? Robin apparently is not an effusive person AFAIK. And you shouldn't judge people by their behavior at a party. I thought Paul Wylie was distant and stuck-up at a gathering after a pro competition. But he was simply tired and not in a mood to speak with overly fawning fans he didn't know. On other occasions, I heard Paul was very open and kind to fans. Skaters are human beings too.
 
I dont think anyone was ever discrediting Robin. It is Bruno who has often been discredited, with people saying he was an average skater who was just lucky to be picked by the legendary Aliona, as if he was carried entirely by her and had to do with her success. I dont think she would have reached the top again with say John Couglin or Dylan Moscovitch as her partner. It is nice to see in this poll and thread him getting some of his proper recognition finally.
 
What's funny is both Bruno and Robin have been discredited and dissed as partners, just at different times. :lol: When Aliona first started with Bruno, a lot of people were saying that she was nuts, that Bruno was not good enough for her, that he didn't have good enough extension or line, that he would never be as worthy of a partner as Robin. Now that Aliona has climbed the pinnacle with Bruno and become Olympic & World champion, there is revisionist thinking about Robin and how he wasn't that good after all, didn't make Aliona happy, didn't allow her to flourish, they had weird programs, etc.

The reality is that both guys had a great deal to offer as partners. Or Aliona would never have achieved the great level of success she had with both of them. Remember, she and Robin were 5-time World champions together.
 
I think the people that preferred Bruno and Aliona were always there from the beginning but afraid to share that opinion on FSU because Robin and Aliona were so revered here.

The minute I saw the first practice video of Bruno and Aliona I was on board in a way I never was for Robin and Aliona (even though I think they were an excellent pair.)
 
I absolutely loved Robin and Aliona right from the get-go. They just had 'it'.

I didn't love Bruno and Aliona from the start. As others have said, he wasn't up to her level, and it was very noticeable at the start. But from the get-go, I loved their programs more than Aliona's with Robin's. And Bruno made such huge strides so quickly, and there was a kind of ease that wasn't there with Robin.

So my reply is that my first impression of S/S as newbies was stronger than my first impression of S/M as newbies, but once both teams hit their strides, I enjoyed S/M more than S/S.

I also like that she didn't fake tan as much with Bruno as she did in her early years with Robin.
 
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