War in Israel

starrynight

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,234
Does the IDF have sufficient resources? I just ask this because I follow the actor Tomer Capone on Instagram (he’s in The Boys) and I can see from his stories that he’s coordinating a fundraiser to purchase tents for medics.

Is there not enough available? Is this just people wanting to help where they can?
 

TAHbKA

Cats and garlic lover
Messages
20,961
Does the IDF have sufficient resources? I just ask this because I follow the actor Tomer Capone on Instagram (he’s in The Boys) and I can see from his stories that he’s coordinating a fundraiser to purchase tents for medics.

Is there not enough available? Is this just people wanting to help where they can?
Yes and no.
Yes, people want to help where they can, think it's the most human response.
Yes, the army lacks resources, but it's not because they don't have the funding, but because they misused them. @Andrey aka Pushkin can tell what mr. Andrey lacks on his base, but generally there were fundrasers for helmets, socks, boots, flashlights, food and what not. Either the army is totally not prepared (would not be surprised) or they drafted more people than they have resources to equip (would not be surprised) or they have all the things needed and the government is arguing who is in charge and is not giving the keys (would not be surprised). At the end of the day there are solders who were drafted and have not received the equipment, so at this point am not asking too many questions when donating the money (I am asking who the organization am donating to is, and choosing the one I trust).
 

Allskate

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12,920
American war ships are in the region and the U.S. hasn't publicly asked Israel to cease fire. Statements coming from American officials have avoided that terminology. Several world leaders have visited the region. So far, it feels different, but everyday seems to bring a new wrench in the wheel.
Biden repeatedly has called for Israeli restraint and trying to limit civilian deaths. He also condemned the recent attacks by settlers against Palestinians in the West Bank. But, I don't think the U.S. is going to call for a ceasefire right now. What the U.S. is doing is urging restraint and encouraging the Israelis to think carefully about their plans before they launch a ground attack and hopefully get hostages out first. I do think the U.S.. has convinced the Israelis to at least delay the ground offensive.

Biden again said this war needs to end with a two-state solution and told Netanyahu that it is important to focus on a pathway to permanent peace between Israelis and Palestinians after this crisis. I don't hold out much hope for this, but I'm glad Biden wants to at least try.

 

Andrey aka Pushkin

Playing ping pong with balls of chocolate jam
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22,704
I don't think this was mentioned, somehow.
There's a lot of talk in Israel, Qatar mediates between Israel and Hammas, and "there are several breakthroughs". No one knows what it means, the current assumption is that Hammas will release some of the hostages in exchange for gasoline. Apparently the lack of it crucial and doesn't allow them to operate. To the question of "hospitals that don't have oil for the generators"....
 

PRlady

Cowardly admin
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46,626
Biden repeatedly has called for Israeli restraint and trying to limit civilian deaths. He also condemned the recent attacks by settlers against Palestinians in the West Bank. But, I don't think the U.S. is going to call for a ceasefire right now. What the U.S. is doing is urging restraint and encouraging the Israelis to think carefully about their plans before they launch a ground attack and hopefully get hostages out first. I do think the U.S.. has convinced the Israelis to at least delay the ground offensive.

Biden again said this war needs to end with a two-state solution and told Netanyahu that it is important to focus on a pathway to permanent peace between Israelis and Palestinians after this crisis. I don't hold out much hope for this, but I'm glad Biden wants to at least try.

Biden now has the credibility with Israelis so they pay attention. People who think he’s too easy on Israel should understand that bear hugs work here. Without Israelis feeling caring and connection they won’t listen to even the best ideas for their own good.
 
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Allskate

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12,920
There's a lot of talk in Israel, Qatar mediates between Israel and Hammas, and "there are several breakthroughs". No one knows what it means, the current assumption is that Hammas will release some of the hostages in exchange for gasoline. Apparently the lack of it crucial and doesn't allow them to operate. To the question of "hospitals that don't have oil for the generators"....
The conditions in the hospitals are horrible. They need not only gasoline to operate but medicine and other supplies. The IDF claims that Hamas is hoarding fuel. And the UNRWA had tweeted at one point that Hamas had stolen fuel and medicine from them, though for some reason they later took down those tweets despite U.N. officials confirming the claim to a reporter. It's a mess. I totally understand that Israel is desperate to get the hostages back ASAP and that it is Hamas's fault for abducting them. I also realize that there is a significant risk that the gasoline and medication might end up going to Hamas. But, IMO there have to be attempts to get it to the hospitals.
Biden now has the credibility with Israelis so they pay attention. People who think he’s too easy on Israel should understand that bear hugs work here. Without Israelis feeling caring and connection they won’t listen to even the best ideals fir their own good.
I don't think we can really know how hard he is being on Israel because we don't know everything that is going on behind the scenes and I'll bet there is a lot going on. IMO, Biden knew that some people would be unhappy about him hugging Bibi and that it wasn't the best thing for him politically in the U.S., but he did it anyway because he thought he would be more successful influencing the Israelis. Most Americans don't like him more because of the hug and there are some who are very unhappy with him for that and for being "too soft" on Israel as you put it. But, some of them are on the right and would be unhappy with him no matter what since he wants to give aid to Israel. Some are on the other end of the spectrum and would be unhappy with him for the same reason and because he believes that Israel should exist and be safe as part of a two state solution.

He took a big risk going to Israel. It's a shame he couldn't meet with the other leaders. Publicly, he's walking a really fine line between trying to convince Israel to do what is in Israel's best interest (and the best interest of so many others) while presenting a united front to those who might wish to broaden and intensify the war. I'm really glad he has condemned the attacks in the West Bank and has consistently lobbied for humanitarian aid.

@PRlady, have a safe trip back to the U.S..
 
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TAHbKA

Cats and garlic lover
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20,961
The conditions in the hospitals are horrible. They need not only gasoline to operate but medicine and other supplies. The IDF claims that Hamas is hoarding fuel. And the UNRWA had tweeted at one point that Hamas had stolen fuel and medicine from them, though for some reason they later took down those tweets despite U.N. officials confirming the claim to a reporter. It's a mess. I totally understand that Israel is desperate to get the hostages back ASAP and that it is Hamas's fault for abducting them. I also realize that there is a significant risk that the gasoline and medication might end up going to Hamas. But, IMO there have to be attempts to get it to the hospitals.
So the best of luck to all the inernational ogranizations who are there controlling what goes where. Or is Israel supposed to take care of that as well?
I don't think we can really know how hard he is being on Israel because we don't know everything that is going on behind the scenes and I'll bet there is a lot going on.
This is one of the examples of what is going on. That's Netaniyahu on the way to greet Biden. The dude he is pushing back is the president. Of Israel. You know, the dude who is supposed to greet the president of the foreign country first when he lands.
Netaniyahu is busy saving his ass and so far he is doing not a bad job. Biden came because there is no one who would take charge, and, I assume, for some reason the US cares more about Israel than the prime minister of Israel.
 

TAHbKA

Cats and garlic lover
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22:00 - bombs on Tel Aviv. Duuuh.
Well, that explains why my boss is online and working.
 

Allskate

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12,920
So the best of luck to all the inernational ogranizations who are there controlling what goes where. Or is Israel supposed to take care of that as well?
I would like there to be some sort of independent effort to try to control the aid. I am not naive. I know that's not easy. But, I think there needs to be an attempt. I think it needs to be done for the benefit of the Palestinian civilians. I also think that it needs to be done for the benefit of the Israelis. The reports and images from Gaza hospitals are being used as propaganda in the Mideast and that is bad for Israelis (and others). The hospital situation also is being covered extensively here (or was before the shooter in Maine, who is still on the loose, started being the main focus.) I saw the same "report" here several times over a couple of says. In a dramatic voice, the "reporter" starts by saying, "Hospital walls can't talk, but if they could" and goes on to explain horrible conditions in the hospitals. This is not good for shoring up support for Israel, regardless of Hamas's role in this. The reporting doesn't lay the blame on Hamas.

It is possible that there are exaggerations about hospital conditions and some of the reports may be deliberately or recklessly inflammatory, but the reality almost certainly is that hospitals and doctors in Gaza desperately need medical supplies and energy. I realize that Hamas brought this on, but I still believe that attempts must be made to get necessary supplies to the hospitals.
This is one of the examples of what is going on. That's Netaniyahu on the way to greet Biden. The dude he is pushing back is the president. Of Israel. You know, the dude who is supposed to greet the president of the foreign country first when he lands.
Netaniyahu is busy saving his ass and so far he is doing not a bad job. Biden came because there is no one who would take charge, and, I assume, for some reason the US cares more about Israel than the prime minister of Israel.
As an American, I know what it is like to have a political leader who is narcissistic (as well as corrupt and authoritarian) and who does not act in the best interests of his citizens. It's scary and infuriating. I think the Biden administration knows what/who it is dealing with and is doing the best they can in accordance with that knowledge. I really hope that Bibi does not successfully rehabilitate his image and that he and others who failed to protect the Israelis on October 7 are driven out of power. For now, though, Biden has to deal with what he's got. And that means hugging Bibi and much more.
 

Sylvia

TBD
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81,173
If any of you are looking for a factual account of all that’s happened with what I think is a midpoint view, this is good to share and not paywalled:
I could only read the first part - "Or register for a free account to read just this article."

Anderson Cooper's "Hostage to Terror" premiered tonight on CNN about "the families of those kidnapped from Nir Oz in Southern Israel" (VERY tough to watch :() - press release: https://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/...ror-for-the-whole-story-with-anderson-cooper/
The hour-long report ends with what was described in this Oct. 23-24 article:
CNN anchor Anderson Cooper on Monday spoke with the parents of an American hostage who was seen in a never-before-released video being abducted in Israel by Hamas.
Cooper explained that in a prior interview with Rachel Goldberg and Jonathan Polin about their 23-year-old son, Hersh Goldberg-Polin, he realized that he had a video of him on his phone.
“It had been shown to me by a soldier at the music festival. We recorded it off his phone. We had permission to do so,” Cooper said. After showing the minute-long video to Goldberg-Polin’s parents after that interview, he said, the couple decided they wanted it to be shared with the world.
“They want you to know what has happened to their child, and they want the world to know that there are seriously wounded people who were taken by Hamas,” Cooper said, before narrating the scene in which gunmen load an injured Goldberg-Polin and several others in the back of a pickup truck.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
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I could only read the first part - "Or register for a free account to read just this article."

Anderson Cooper's "Hostage to Terror" premiered tonight on CNN about "the families of those kidnapped from Nir Oz in Southern Israel" (VERY tough to watch :() - press release: https://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/...ror-for-the-whole-story-with-anderson-cooper/
The hour-long report ends with what was described in this Oct. 23-24 article:

Watched it. Good job by Anderson.
 

Lynn226

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,814
I could only read the first part - "Or register for a free account to read just this article."

Anderson Cooper's "Hostage to Terror" premiered tonight on CNN about "the families of those kidnapped from Nir Oz in Southern Israel" (VERY tough to watch :() - press release: https://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/...ror-for-the-whole-story-with-anderson-cooper/
The hour-long report ends with what was described in this Oct. 23-24 article:

For those without access to CNN, this is an Haaretz Weekly podcast interview with Rachel Goldberg about her son.

 

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
Messages
65,810
From a friend;

Today is the “world opera day” in which every opera house is sending a piece which represents it to the world. This is what the Israeli opera house chose to record and submit

Thank you.

You need to warn people to have tissues handy.
 

Allskate

Well-Known Member
Messages
12,920
Some American citizens and other citizens, along with some wounded Palestinian civilians, are being allowed to leave Gaza into Egypt. The amount of time and effort it took to get this done is sad. I can't imagine how they are going to be able to negotiate even bigger issues. And if Hamas is controlling the Gaza side of the gate, I don't know how we can ensure that hospitals and civilians get the food and medicine that is being trucked in.

 

MsZem

I see the sea
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18,544
Something I just read in the Hebrew-language media: the Israel Nature and Parks Authority assisted with the recovery of bodies by sharing information regarding the movements of birds of prey in relevant areas.

I don't even know what to say.
 

MsZem

I see the sea
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18,544
And on a related note... in some places the remains of the dead were so badly burned that archeologists were called in to find bone fragments in the rubble. This article is in Hebrew, but a machine translation should get most of it across:
 

Judy

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Messages
5,646
I cannot imagine what that family is going through. He previously gave an interview where he said death was a blessing for Emily.

Happy early birthday, Emily 🎉 🎂
I had seen his original interview. All I could think was if that was if that my family member, child etc. It has to be agonizing for the families of the hostages and not knowing … 😔😔😔😔😔😢😢😢😢

He broke my heart listening to him.
 

reut

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,137
Emily is back home. Although she wasn't just "lost and then found".

Some touching moments of her reuniting with her dad:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXvscyZ7H2s

A bit more of background story about Emily:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/famil...-hand-believed-held-hostage-by-hamas-in-gaza/

When Emily was two and a half, her mother, Liat Korenberg, died of breast cancer. Korenberg and Hand had never married and were living apart, she in Haifa and he at Be’eri. Before Liat succumbed, she and Emily moved in with Hand at Be’eri so Emily’s transition would be easier. Liat suffered for just over two years. Emily’s life included her father’s now ex-wife, Narkis Hand, and two older children from his marriage that ended more than 20 years ago. She was very close with her half-sister, Natalie.
“Emily loved cooking so Emily and Natalie would cook together,” said Hand. “Narkis really became Emily’s second mother. Even Narkis’ mother, she became a second grandmother.”
Narkis Hand was brutally murdered on October 7th.

There was also a long interview with Nathalie (Hebrew):
https://www.ynet.co.il/laisha/article/hyzxxilna
Where she told that she was in Australia on vacation on September 7th and she was in touch with Emily till the very last minutes, trying to calm her down and promising they will see each other soon.
The quote in the title says: "I don't know how to tell her that she lost her second mother, too"...
 
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PRlady

Cowardly admin
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The Taoiseach and those of us in Ireland are fully aware of that. Rather than concentrating on that phrase it might be worthwhile reading the Taoiseach's entire statement on the release of Emily who thankfully is now safe back home with her family after surviving an ordeal no child should have to go through.
As usual I sat through the Israeli news in Hebrew (their evening) since DH puts it on. You’ll be happy to know that a Foreign Ministry guy said what you just wrote and also pontificated on Christian theology! Hopefully most Israelis will read the full text of the speech.
 

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