UPDATED: Jason Brown to Brian Orser (official)

[mag]

Well I'd just like to say that I think it's terribly sad (and wrong) that young ebullient joyful Jason Brown is skating to a slow tune about old men

I don’t. I am neither here nor there about Jason, but what I can really appreciate is that he is stepping out of his comfort zone, has moved to a new country, is trying a completely different coaching set up and style, and has committed to a different style of program for this season.

That all should be celebrated. Who cares about the results this season? This is about setting himself up for the next quad. This is go big or go home. This is what “we” fans seem to want, until someone like Jason or Med does it, then we $hit all over them for it. Skaters, or people in general, can’t continue to do things the same way if they want different results.

 

[Lizziebeth]

Jason seems to be doing OK, he won a medal in Russia.

While it was not my favorite long program for Jason, I have to say I love his short. If he skates both of them clean, he will score very well and win some more medals. I hope he gets two programs that suit him next year.

People complain if a skater or team keeps the same style of program every year and then complain if they branch out. Make up your mind people!

Personally, if someone skates a perfect program - and does all their jumps and gets positive GOE and shows good skating skills - what's not to love??? Even if the program or music is not my favorite.

I bet Jason is really encouraged about this result and will go home and work harder than ever.

 

[mag]

I hope he gets two programs that suit him next year.

I hope that the changes Jason has made this season expand his range of styles and that next season he builds on that. What has suited him in the past may no longer be what is best for him. Hopefully he is growing both technically and artistically. My hope is that he continues his growth next season and sets himself up to be a better version of him self for the 2020/2021 season and the best he can be in 2021/2022.

 

[Alilou]

I don’t. I am neither here nor there about Jason, but what I can really appreciate is that he is stepping out of his comfort zone, has moved to a new country, is trying a completely different coaching set up and style, and has committed to a different style of program for this season.

That all should be celebrated. Who cares about the results this season? This is about setting himself up for the next quad. This is go big or go home. This is what “we” fans seem to want, until someone like Jason or Med does it, then we $hit all over them for it. Skaters, or people in general, can’t continue to do things the same way if they want different results.

Um I don't think I shat all over Jason. I said nothing about Jason. I merely commented on his team's choice of music. IMO if this is stepping out of his comfort zone IMO he (his coaches who gave it to him) stepped in the wrong direction. It's a dreary song. He could skate to slow/lyrical music as a change of pace it didn't have to be a song about old men while wearing a bowling shirt. IMO!

I celebrate change. I don't celebrate bad choices.

 

[Tavi]

Well can I just say that after Jason’s devastating season last year and the rough start to this one, I am absolutely thrilled that he placed first in the SP at Int. de France and took silver overall. I honestly don’t think Brian Orser was 100% convinced about taking him on, so it was really great to see how proud and happy he was for him in the knc.

I also think his beautiful SP, which resulted in a record breaking score for quadless programs, not only shows the progress he’s made at TCC but demonstrates exactly what the new scoring system is all about. His FS isn’t at the same level yet, but with the changes they’ve made and his increased commitment, I’m liking it more and more, and look forward to seeing a brilliant performance complete with 4S by the end of the season.

 

[barbarafan]

I don’t. I am neither here nor there about Jason, but what I can really appreciate is that he is stepping out of his comfort zone, has moved to a new country, is trying a completely different coaching set up and style, and has committed to a different style of program for this season.

That all should be celebrated. Who cares about the results this season? This is about setting himself up for the next quad. This is go big or go home. This is what “we” fans seem to want, until someone like Jason or Med does it, then we $hit all over them for it. Skaters, or people in general, can’t continue to do things the same way if they want different results.

It is entirely possible that slower music is in part to help absorb the changes in his skating.He cannot rely on muscle memory at all as his technique for jumping is completely changed. It is now based on quick rotations to get them all in. His other moves have been revamped as well to up his GOE's to get every point out there. The program will build and build as his repititions grow and he feels more natural.

 

[misskarne]

Eh, every skater has a dud program occasionally. The FS isn't the first Jason program I've wrinkled my nose at, and I'm sure it won't be the last. At least he's not doing sprinklers in over-bedazzled suspenders.

I like the rhythm of Hazy Shade of Winter and I do think it should start earlier and the program spends too long in the dreary slow section. The program also seems to be getting a little more together and full and less Wilson-y, thank goodness.

Frankly, it's like Tristan all over again. The costume is blinding. Remember how so many people hated Tristan right up until he got the black pants and they changed the faux-leather on the costume to a dark brown/black? And then suddenly people loved it. The horrible mustard pants were blinding people to the program's true potential. The same thing is probably happening here with that terrible bowling shirt that hides Jason's upper body lines. (No, seriously. Look at his pretty pretty lines and then tell me, Wilson/Orser/whoever was responsible for that, why would you swathe them in the world's ugliest baggy bowling shirt?!)

 

[Carolla5501]

Um I don't think I shat all over Jason. I said nothing about Jason. I merely commented on his team's choice of music. IMO if this is stepping out of his comfort zone IMO he (his coaches who gave it to him) stepped in the wrong direction. It's a dreary song. He could skate to slow/lyrical music as a change of pace it didn't have to be a song about old men while wearing a bowling shirt. IMO!

I celebrate change. I don't celebrate bad choices.

But the real question is why is your opinion the one that is so important. Obviously the judges liked the program. Maybe the truth is his coaches know more than you do?

The fact that you celebrate only changes you like pretty much you have appointed yourself judge of all you survey . I don’t think you’re that important LOL


I’m going to assume that he’s smarter than we are and he is not reading this thread and making his career decisions based on the uninformed fans. You apparently think that the shirt is the most important part of skating. ( Unbelievably bizarre.)

 

[VGThuy]

alilou's opinion is obviously important to alilou. All alilou has done is express their personal opinion about the choices Jason's team made regarding his music and costume.

 

[el henry]

80 year olds? I'm shaking the old lady cane at that one

Obviously we can all have our opinions about Jason's LP, and I for one do not like the looooooong slow section before Hazy Shade of Winter. But S&G are not 80, and neither is their audience. *I* remember S&G, and I'm far from 80, even if I'm old enough to have an old lady cane.

At least the S&G tune is an original. I hate with the passion of a thousand burning suns that Disturbed cover of Sound of Silence.

And if your gramps all wore bowling shirts, that has nothing to do with age The spousal unit has never ever ever worn anything that looked like that, and he is old enough to be gramps. It's just an ugly shirt.


Anyway, Jason is punching the LP up and it's looking better. Onward and upward

 

[DreamSkates]

Well I'd just like to say that I think it's terribly sad (and wrong) that young ebullient joyful Jason Brown is skating to a slow tune about old men

I just read the lyrics. I do like Hazy Shade of Winter (music and lyrics). That's 1/3 I'd give a plus! I'll just ignore the other lyrics when he's skating.

 

[mag]

Um I don't think I shat all over Jason. I said nothing about Jason. I merely commented on his team's choice of music. IMO if this is stepping out of his comfort zone IMO he (his coaches who gave it to him) stepped in the wrong direction. It's a dreary song. He could skate to slow/lyrical music as a change of pace it didn't have to be a song about old men while wearing a bowling shirt. IMO!

I celebrate change. I don't celebrate bad choices.

Sorry, I wasn’t specifically saying you $hit all over the changes. It was a general comment based on how quickly people, again in general, get worked up with something appears not to be working right away. Another example would be Bradie and the lutz loop in the short. The first time she missed it people, again in general, wanted her to go back to the lutz toe. Now I don’t know whether she should or shouldn’t, but I do know you don’t get anywhere giving up the first or even the second time something doesn’t work.

Brian and Tracy have a plan. Jason obviously agrees with the plan. I am not going to get worked up after only a few months. They all need time to work the plan and, if needed, revise the plan.

 

[Alilou]

Sorry, I wasn’t specifically saying you $hit all over the changes. It was a general comment based on how quickly people, again in general, get worked up with something appears not to be working right away. Another example would be Bradie and the lutz loop in the short. The first time she missed it people, again in general, wanted her to go back to the lutz toe. Now I don’t know whether she should or shouldn’t, but I do know you don’t get anywhere giving up the first or even the second time something doesn’t work.

Brian and Tracy have a plan. Jason obviously agrees with the plan. I am not going to get worked up after only a few months. They all need time to work the plan and, if needed, revise the plan.

Okay, yes I do agree with this. And I'm patiently giving them time, and to Med too. I can't wait to seem them next season, and the one after!

(but nothing will convince me that was the right choice of music for Jason )

 

[Alilou]

But the real question is why is your opinion the one that is so important. Obviously the judges liked the program. Maybe the truth is his coaches know more than you do?

The fact that you celebrate only changes you like pretty much you have appointed yourself judge of all you survey . I don’t think you’re that important LOL


I’m going to assume that he’s smarter than we are and he is not reading this thread and making his career decisions based on the uninformed fans. You apparently think that the shirt is the most important part of skating. ( Unbelievably bizarre.)

Lol my opinion is important to me I don't like the music. And I don't think it's a good choice for Jason. And I think the shirt is ugly. So sue me

 

[Alilou]

alilou's opinion is obviously important to alilou. All alilou has done is express their personal opinion about the choices Jason's team made regarding his music and costume.

Thank you

 

[MAXSwagg]

So where is the quad salchow? It’s not even in the free skate! The issue is Ade couldn’t get brown to world medals quadless but orser will!

Jason is not getting a consistent quad. Ever.

 

[misskarne]

Jason is not getting a consistent quad. Ever.

Oh, piss off and let us enjoy this you jerk.

Didn't you say this about his triple Axel too?

 

[dinakt]

While I did not like Jason's LP the first time I saw it, I think it is improving and will continue to do so. For the record, I love S&G, and that includes "Old Friends"- the problem is not the songs. S&G are hard to skate to because they are so starkly direct and unadorned and introvert, while Jason likes to instantly connect with the audience... I still think Jason and "Old Friends" might find each other, and even if not completely, they'll serve a purpose to him as a performer.
He did so well in France, major kudos to him.
And I agree with @mag, changes are very hard... we need to allow people some breathing space.
(but I hope the shirt goes away by Nationals...)

 

[caseyedwards]

Oh, piss off and let us enjoy this you jerk.

Didn't you say this about his triple Axel too?

This is not the Jason brown fan thread! Don’t go nuts!!!

Brown always underrotates at least one triple axel!! It’s still poor!!

Jason is not getting a consistent quad. Ever.

Totally! Too much time being totally quadless and believing he will be lysacek buttle

 

[misskarne]

This is not the Jason brown fan thread! Don’t go nuts!!!

Brown always underrotates at least one triple axel!! It’s still poor!!

For you, I save my fcuk off.

 

[MAXSwagg]

Oh, piss off and let us enjoy this you jerk.

Didn't you say this about his triple Axel too?

No, I didn’t. And like you, sir, I will be a jerk whenever I want.

 

[misskarne]

No, I didn’t. And like you, sir, I will be a jerk whenever I want.

Yeah, you're real good at it. Flare up like someone dumped petrol on a bushfire when it's Hanyu, but it's open season on everyone else, right?

Or are you just salty as fcuk that Jason managed to lay down the fourth-highest SP score under the new GOE? Without a quad? Because his skating quality is unrivalled?

 

[GreatLakesGal]

Max is likely correct that Jason will never attain a CONSISTENT quad and my guess is that Brian Orser would (privately) agree with that assessment. Jumps are just not his strength; he did not even do a 3-3 in his FS this weekend although he did pull that off in his SP. And even if Jason were to get a quad that is consistent, he would also need to incorporate it into his program without it affecting the quality of the program as a whole. That's something the men at the very top struggle with all the time.

So I think the question for Jason and his team may end up being: Are quads worth the risk? Risk in terms of injury and risk in terms of making a mess of his programs that so many of us enjoy so much? As Patrick Chan repeatedly told us, quads consume a great deal of a skater's energy and there is always a tradeoff for doing them. And he said that before the men's FS was shortened by 30 seconds--which makes including quads even more difficult.

 

[Carolla5501]

Oh, piss off and let us enjoy this you jerk.

Didn't you say this about his triple Axel too?

For you, I save my fcuk off.

Such an adult response. The best part is since I was smart enough to put the jerks on ignore what I see is just your 12 year old responses LOL!

If you want people to like your skater resorting to 12 year old name calling retorts rarely works. Didn't your fan girl act with Max teach you that?

So just put the posters on ignore and do that. Responding like this only makes you look bad. Time to act like a grown up!

 

[MAXSwagg]

Yeah, you're real good at it. Flare up like someone dumped petrol on a bushfire when it's Hanyu, but it's open season on everyone else, right?

Or are you just salty as fcuk that Jason managed to lay down the fourth-highest SP score under the new GOE? Without a quad? Because his skating quality is unrivalled?

I thought you would be salty, considering Jason’s quadless program scored higher than anything Max Aaron ever did...

 

[Tavi]

None of us know whether or not Jason will get a quad, including you, MaxSwagg. And you should know @misskarne loves Jason just about as much as she loves Max Aaron.

Regarding quads, it’s clearly been a struggle for him to get one, more than for most guys. But I don’t see the point of making a prouncement that he’ll never get one 6 months into his time at TCC. And I especially don’t see the point right now, after this competition.

On the one hand, he just demonstrated in the SP that he can skate like pretty much no one else can - by that I mean what he offers is really unique - and under the new system he’s highly rewarded for it. On the other hand, he also just demonstrated that he can’t yet sustain that level in the FS, and that with lapses in concentration he’s still prone to dumb errors like popping.

All I wanted to see here was progress from Skate Canada, and he showed that. Well, maybe a new FS costume too.

I hope he’ll show more progress at Golden Spin and US Nationals, but we’ll see.

Time will tell about the quad. But you know if he doesn’t get it, it doesn’t make him a failure, a poor athlete, or any of the rest of it.

 

[leigh466]

Such an adult response. The best part is since I was smart enough to put the jerks on ignore what I see is just your 12 year old responses LOL!

If you want people to like your skater resorting to 12 year old name calling retorts rarely works. Didn't your fan girl act with Max teach you that?

So just put the posters on ignore and do that. Responding like this only makes you look bad. Time to act like a grown up!

So, clearly I already had all the a$$holes on ignore since I see none of them, only the responses. However, I disagree heartily with this assessment. I find that with a$$holes, there is no rational discussion to be had, therefore, the only rational response is to tell them they are a$$holes that need to fcku off! LOL!

P.S. In MHO, Bookends is one of the most beautiful, emotional, heartfelt songs ever written, and a WONDERFUL choice for an artist of Jason's caliber.

 

[Theoreticalgirl]

re: Jason's music - I think the selections are perfectly fine. That said, there's 3 full minutes of "Old Friends/Bookends" (almost the whole thing) and only one minute of "Hazy Shade of Winter," and to me it feels really lopsided. I'm sure David Wilson could have balanced the two much better to serve his overall creative vision.

As for his outfit, I don't love it, but *I think* it's trying to reference The Graduate? The film makes heavy use of striped ties throughout.

 

[VGThuy]

I think Jason is still growing into it. It'd be smart of me to wait till Worlds to make a final assessment of the program, as some times it does take a whole season for a program to finally gel. This seems like a program Patrick Chan could have done really well with whereas it's not as natural for Jason's performing style. He can do beautiful, introspective, musical work as evidenced by his "Piano" LP and that one also took awhile for him as well.

 

[Impromptu]

I like the music as music, and in fact had been hoping that at some point someone would use "Hazy Shade of Winter." I'm not so certain that I like these three pieces together as they have been edited. However, I'm willing to give Orser/Wilson/Wilson the benefit of the doubt that this choice, this year, serves some particular long goal. And that as Jason gets more comfortable with everything, that the program will work better.

On the other hand, I hate the costume. I don't need to see sparkles,or mesh... but something about the way it fits on Jason make him look bulky and breaks him at the waist.