Unexpected Entries to Jumps

[On My Own]

Also, her jump technique is a joy to watch, including a 3Lz from steps with a solid outside edge that I would presume was going to actually be a 2A from steps until she does one additional step.

Women's singles short program - Figure Skating | Sochi 2014 Replays

ð² Subscribe to @olympics: http://oly.ch/Subscribe Can't wait? Watch it now: https://oly.ch/WSinglesShortProgramFigureSkatingSochi14Relive the full Women's ...

youtu.be

What are some other unexpected entries to jumps over the years?

 

[bardtoob]

Midori Ito's entrance into her 2A during her 1987-88 SP.

Midori Ito ä¼è¤ ã¿ã©ã (JPN) - 1988 Calgary, Figure Skating, Ladies' Short Program (US ABC)

Calgary, Alberta, CANADA - 1988 Winter Games, Ladies' Short Program - Midori Ito of Japan placed 4th in the Short Program to move up from 10th to 8th Place o...

youtu.be

 

[On My Own]

Midori Ito's entrance into her 2A during her 1987-88 SP.

Midori Ito ä¼è¤ ã¿ã©ã (JPN) - 1988 Calgary, Figure Skating, Ladies' Short Program (US ABC)

Calgary, Alberta, CANADA - 1988 Winter Games, Ladies' Short Program - Midori Ito of Japan placed 4th in the Short Program to move up from 10th to 8th Place o...

youtu.be

Yes, it was actually pointed out in the commentary, as you linked. There have been a few 3As out of the same step since then...


Would you say this is? Goes more sideways than I expect from a lutz set up, and the preceding transition (layback ina bauer) totally makes me think it's going to be an edge jump.

Yuzuru Hanyu Hope and Legacy WC 2017 B.ESP

take this isu

youtu.be

 

[screech]

I want to say Patrick Chan, and I want to say it was in a FP, but I remember someone actually entering a double axel from forwards (no back edge before stepping into the entry), but I can't seem to remember, and I can't seem to find it.

Not really unexpected, since he's on a long back outside edge, but Viktor Petrenko's entry into his solo 3A in his 1990 SP has a spiral-esque stretch on the back edge that you didn't really see 30+ years ago. (Also, the two triple axels he did in that program are probably the most gorgeous triple axels I've ever seen).

Though it became very connected to him, You've also got to think the gorgeous spread eagle Brian Boitano would do into his lutz would count.

This entry into a triple salchow/triple loop done by Jeff Langdon makes it seem like he's going into a flip jump instead.

 

[On My Own]

Salchow did remind me, this could technically qualify:

Here's a triple salchow from a back inside-to-outside edge change.

Jason Brown did something similar in his Nessun Dorma program.

2011 US Nationals Jason Brown FS

No commentary.

youtu.be

 

[tony]

This has to be one of my all-time favorites, and I've cited it here so many times by this point but it always comes to mind.

ISU ZAGREB 2013 -18/31- MEN SP - Viktor PFEIFER - 24.01.2013

Segment score: 67.34TUTTO in sezione SKATING de La Riserva forum http://lariserva.forumcommunity.net

www.youtube.com

Ingrida Snieskiene of Lithuania had a completely forward entry into her 2A:

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This entry was ambitious as hell, and something that wasn't in the program earlier in the season IIRC, and we see the result:

Krisztina Czakó 1997 Worlds FS "The Addams Family"

Krisztina Czakó / ÐÑиÑÑина Цако / ã¯ãªã¹ãã£ã¼ãã»ãã£ã³1997 World Figure Skating Championships Ladies Free SkatingÐ§ÐµÐ¼Ð¿Ð¸Ð¾Ð½Ð°Ñ Ð¼Ð¸Ñа по ÑигÑÑÐ½Ð¾Ð¼Ñ ÐºÐ°ÑÐ°Ð½Ð¸Ñ 19971997å¹´ä¸çãã£ã®ã¥ã¢ã¹...

www.youtube.com

The spiral directly into a 3-turn looks simple but it's not. This program as a whole is also absolutely glorious

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It's been done by several skaters, but here's a LBO spiral before stepping into her 2A:

Maria Butyrskaya RUS - 1994 European Championships SP

QA : 3rd, SP : 6th, LP : 4th, 4th placeJan. 17th-23rd, Copenhagen, DEN

www.youtube.com

 

[gkelly]

I want to say Patrick Chan, and I want to say it was in a FP, but I remember someone actually entering a double axel from forwards (no back edge before stepping into the entry), but I can't seem to remember, and I can't seem to find it.

Not sure about the example you're thinking of, but here are a couple:

Just holding a looong FO edge before jumping:

Gary Beacom, Canada - 1984 Worlds. Free skating.

www.youtube.com

BI to FO spiral, FO change of foot:

[HD] Irina Slutskaya - 1998 Nagano Olympics - FS ã¤ãªã¼ãã»ã¹ã«ãã«ã¤ ÐÑина СлÑÑкаÑ

Irina Slutskaya / Ирина Слуцкая / イリーナ・スルツカヤ1998 Nagano Olympics / 1998 олимпиада в нагано / 1998 長野五輪Ladies FS Playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?li...

www.youtube.com

And speaking of double axels,

Ilia Kulik (RUS) - 1997 World Figure Skating Championships, Men's Short Program

Lausanne, SWITZERLAND - 1997 World Figure Skating Championships, Men's Short Program - Ilia Kulik of Russia placed 3rd after this skate.

www.youtube.com

 

[On My Own]

Pfeifer's was fantastic, in similar vein as Weinzierl's.

 

[morqet]

Aliev's knee slide into 3F

Dmitri Aliev FP World Junior Championship 2017

youtu.be

 

[gkelly]

Back shoot-the-duck to 3S

Eric Millot (FRA) - 1995/1996 Gran Prix Finals, Figure Skating, Men's Long Program

Paris, FRANCE - 1995/1996 Gran Prix Finals, Figure Skating, Men's Long Program - Eric Millot of France

www.youtube.com

Hydroblade followed by 3A

Matthew SAVOIE 2006 Olympics LP

www.youtube.com

 

[Rukia]

Matt Savoie's transitions into, well, everything are what some super fans think their fave did


do not call interpol on me I just really love Matt Savoie ok

 

[On My Own]

Hydroblade followed by 3A

Matthew SAVOIE 2006 Olympics LP

www.youtube.com

I think his hydroblade into 3Lz is the more unexpected one, because I again expect him to just do a long curve with it and go into an edge jump, but instead he uses it to enter super short setup into a 3Lz. https://youtu.be/-w872zjNfzY?t=253

 

[vu2019]

Ilia Klimkin (camel in both directions to immediate 3S)

[HD] Ilia Klimkin - 2000/2001 GPF - Final Round Free Skating

Ilia Klimkin / Илья Климкин / イリヤ・クリムキン2000/2001 ISU Grand Prix Final, Tokyo, Japan, Feb.15-18 20012000-2001 フィギュアスケート グランプリ ファイナル 代々木体育館 (東京) 2001年2月15日-18日...

youtu.be

 

[screech]

I found the Patrick Chan double axel I'd been thinking of. It wasn't quite as 'forward entry' as I was remembering, but it's still an unexpected entry for an axel.

 

[bardtoob]

For it's time, I think it was really surprising to see a woman integrate a 2A within field moves the way Peggy Fleming did, although it now probably seems like a natural set-up that is directly and specifically rewarded by the IJS as a difficult entry.

She started doing it in the 1965-66 season.

Peggy Fleming - 1966 World Championships FS

A compilation of footage to (just about) complete Peggy's first world victory in Davos, 1966 in glorious winter sunshine.

youtu.be

Here is a similar program from the 1964-65 season without it.

Peggy Fleming - 1965 World Championships - Free Skate

Peggy Fleming's Free Skate from the 1965 World Championships

youtu.be

 

[bardtoob]

I think Tenley Albright's 2F from steps was somewhat unexpected for it's time. I would have expected a Walley jump from the step immediately prior.

It is important to note that this would have fulfilled a requirement in the SP up to 1992.

Tenley Albright 1953 US Nationals filmed by Howard Craker

youtu.be

 

[Allskate]

Jason Brown hasn't actually done this in a competitive program, but it's a fun entry - and certainly would qualify as an "unexpected entry" -- into a triple loop:

Jason Brown on Instagram: "“In the mood”… for another week of shows!! 次のショーの週です! 🎶😉 #moncton 🔜 #toronto 🔜 #hamilton 🔜 #kitchner #show #tour #iceshow #figureskating #canada #soi2023 #starsonice @starsonice #avenircentre 🎥: @pchan31"

132K likes, 1,064 comments - Jason Brown (@jasonbskates) on Instagram: "“In the mood”… for another week of shows!! 次のショーの週です! 🎶😉 #moncton ..."

www.instagram.com

 

[On My Own]

For it's time, I think it was really surprising to see a woman integrate a 2A within field moves the way Peggy Fleming did,

Was it less surprising for men?

It is important to note that this would have fulfilled a requirement in the SP up to 1992.

Would it really have despite being so disconnected? I agree it's great for its time, I'm just curious about this one part of your post.

 

[bardtoob]

Would it really have despite being so disconnected? I agree it's great for its time, I'm just curious about this one part of your post.

It flows well enough to not incur a deduction.

Was it less surprising for men?

I don't know that any men were doing anything like that back then.

 

[On My Own]

It flows well enough to not incur a deduction.

Hmmm. Did this rule apply the same way in IJS, in your opinion?

 

[bardtoob]

Hmmm. Did this rule apply the same way in IJS, in your opinion?

Per ISU Communication No. 2176

Rule 611 paragraph 2 and 3
The Junior and Senior Short Program Ladies and Men
b) The Solo jump no longer has the requirement of connecting steps and/or other comparable movements preceding this jump.

https://www.isu.org/inside-isu/rules-regulations/isu-congresses/17400-isu-communication-2176/file

 

[On My Own]

Per ISU Communication No. 2176

I meant when the rule existed, pre 2018-19. I was usually confused as to why a SP solo jump lacking in steps got high GOE. So I wondered if it was a case of "It flows well enough to not incur a deduction" in the minds of some judges, stuck in 6.0 mentality.

I don't know that any men were doing anything like that back then.

Thanks for the answer.

 

[bardtoob]

I meant when the rule existed, pre 2018-19. I was usually confused as to why a SP solo jump lacking in steps got high GOE. So I wondered if it was a case of "It flows well enough to not incur a deduction" in the minds of some judges, stuck in 6.0 mentality.

Short Program of the season 2017 – 2018 must include 2 solo jumps:
− double or triple Axel for Senior & Junior Men and for Senior Ladies, double Axel for Junior Ladies;
− a jump immediately preceded by connecting steps and/or other comparable Free Skating movements:
...
A single spread eagle, spiral/Free Skating movement cannot be considered as meeting the requirements of connecting steps and/or other comparable Free Skating movements the lack of which must be considered by the Judges in the GOE.

https://www.isu.org/docman-document...2017-18-singles-tp-handbook-updatedaug15/file

So that quotes the rule book. Why it wasn't enforced consistently is all political.

 

[SkateGuard]

Not a jump per se, but this has got to be one of my favourite entrances to a flying spin:

Shaun McGill - Unknown Christmas Show EX

youtu.be

 

[DORISPULASKI]

Not legal, of course, but Surya Bonaly showed her command of landing a back flip on one foot by tacking on a triple Salchow after it.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://m.facebook.com/TheSkatingLesson/videos/surya-bonalys-incredible-back-fliptriple-salchow-combination/1116868745591754/&ved=2ahUKEwjtutrF15-AAxWBD1kFHVQMBF8QwqsBegQIFBAE&usg=AOvVaw2HtmfhDsqRT-76pOIR_v1L

 

[bardtoob]

Not legal, of course, but Surya Bonaly showed her command of landing a back flip on one foot by tacking on a triple Salchow after it.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://m.facebook.com/TheSkatingLesson/videos/surya-bonalys-incredible-back-fliptriple-salchow-combination/1116868745591754/&ved=2ahUKEwjtutrF15-AAxWBD1kFHVQMBF8QwqsBegQIFBAE&usg=AOvVaw2HtmfhDsqRT-76pOIR_v1L

I think that counts as a jump combination, split flip - 3 Sal, by the standards back then

 

[Marco]

Klimkin used to do a camel spin combination right into a 3sal.

Buttle used to do an entire field moves sequence right into a 3sal, in his 2002-3 program - it was a beautiful program, alas the program was entirely too complicated for it to be skated remotely cleanly.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Shoot the duck!

Nancy did them