U.S. Men 2025-26 Discussion - Quad God and the Mere Mortals

[PRlady]

Honestly, if I were Torgashev & Naumov, I'd probably hang up my skates and call it good after making it to the Olympics. There's a bunch of hungry young guys coming up the ranks for the US men who I think will overtake them by 2028 - Sanchez, Kazanecki, Farrington, Blackwell and Martynov. They're still learning how to put it all together in competition, but there is some good talent from those guys who are 17-19 years old right now and once they put it together... Look out.

I seem to remember, although I could be wrong, there was a time we had such great young men! Camden, Tomoki, Kras, Andrew, Maxim…and all while Ilia wasn’t yet on the scene.

Obviously the Great Winnowing Out that happens to every generation winnowed out almost everyone in terms of any real impact internationally. So forgive me for not getting excited, yet, about the new crop.

 

[Karen-W]

I seem to remember, although I could be wrong, there was a time we had such great young men! Camden, Tomoki, Kras, Andrew, Maxim…and all while Ilia wasn’t yet on the scene.

Obviously the Great Winnowing Out that happens to every generation winnowed out almost everyone in terms of any real impact internationally. So forgive me for not getting excited, yet, about the new crop.

Well, they were all up-and-coming in 2018 and, for whateve reasons (pandemic included) never quite asserted themselves on the senior level. I don't know if it was because we had Nathan & Vincent already achieving great success at the senior level or what, but by 2022, I wasn't confident that any of them would have a lot of senior international success.

But your point is well taken and, like I said, this next crop of young men still have plenty to learn before they're successful at the senior international level.

 

[haribobo]

I think part of the issue could be that there may not be that many US coaches capable of teaching and consistently training really solid jump technique and especially quad jumps. Certainly not Tammy, Kori, or Tom/Becky which some of those skaters stayed with for a while. I may be forgetting someone, but are Ryan Bradley, Max Aaron, and Jeremy Abbott the most successful US men's skaters to come from the Broadmoor area in the last 25 years? We almost had Josh Farris also...

Like it is starting to seem that Malinina/Skorniakov (Ilia, Lucius), and Selezneva/Makarov (Jacob, Caleb) are the only US coaches with truly stable men's jump technique. There is also Patrick Blackwell (Ganicheva/Letov) who is pretty good depending on the day...I guess you could include Raf in this list although after Nathan he has sort of petered out with top contendors. I think it is saying something that Tomoki Hiwatashi had to move to Japan to get his very wayward trajectory back on track. Like we may need to stop fooling ourselves that anyone is going to develop steady jumps with Derrick/Ivan or Viktor Pfeifer or Tammy G. at the helm, lovely as they may be...

Basically what I am saying is that Colorado and California coaching needs to figure this mess out and there's been a lot of fools' gold over the last few years in that area, but very little in the way of truly competitive skaters. Although I do understand jumping is not everything.

 

[Sylvia]

Re-posting here from the 2026 4CC Men's FS PBP thread in case anyone is interested in discussing this topic further :

Americans: SOS on quads. [...] USFS may want to consider how they can incentivize quads more in young skaters' development.

Hopefully, USFS is also considering how to encourage quad development because otherwise, the team’s scoring ceiling is lower. And adding quads “late” often turns into not adding a quad at all.

 

[Debbie S]

I assume Patrick will stay Junior internationally next season, even if he moves up to Senior domestically. Has he said otherwise?

 

[kwanfan1818]

I thought USFS gives bonus points for US lower-level competitions to perform more difficult jumps, like Russia did.

Maybe they need to up the ante.

 

[SidelineSkater]

Broadmoor was producing men with quads back in the early quad-craze era. Max had the most consistent of the bunch. But Bradley, Abbott and Mroz were all in the bunch. I think each had their own other deficiencies or lack of reliable quad. Vincent and Camden were also in the Tom-Tammy group for awhile too. Raf certainly helped Nathan.

 

[Karen-W]

I think part of the issue could be that there may not be that many US coaches capable of teaching and consistently training really solid jump technique and especially quad jumps. Certainly not Tammy, Kori, or Tom/Becky which some of those skaters stayed with for a while. I may be forgetting someone, but are Ryan Bradley, Max Aaron, and Jeremy Abbott the most successful US men's skaters to come from the Broadmoor area in the last 25 years? We almost had Josh Farris also...

Like it is starting to seem that Malinina/Skorniakov (Ilia, Lucius), and Selezneva/Makarov (Jacob, Caleb) are the only US coaches with truly stable men's jump technique. There is also Patrick Blackwell (Ganicheva/Letov) who is pretty good depending on the day...I guess you could include Raf in this list although after Nathan he has sort of petered out with top contendors. I think it is saying something that Tomoki Hiwatashi had to move to Japan to get his very wayward trajectory back on track. Like we may need to stop fooling ourselves that anyone is going to develop steady jumps with Derrick/Ivan or Viktor Pfeifer or Tammy G. at the helm, lovely as they may be...

Basically what I am saying is that Colorado and California coaching needs to figure this mess out and there's been a lot of fools' gold over the last few years in that area, but very little in the way of truly competitive skaters. Although I do understand jumping is not everything.

Raf may not be traveling much himself anymore - seems to have left that to Brezina & Frazier - but he's still working with skaters and we just saw one of his - Reshtenko - win bronze at Euros.

I do agree, though, I wouldn't be relying on Colorado or California coaching for reliable quads. I also wonder about SCoB - Blackwell is inconsistent whereas Malinina/Skorniakov (who have learned from Raf) and Selezneva/Makarov seem to be producing men with sound jumping technique.

 

[Allskate]

I don't think you can just blame the coaching for the lack of reliable quads, though good coaching certainly helps. (Realistically, though, it's not that easy or necessarily the best decision to uproot your family to try a new coach for your child.) It's not like all these men would be jumping like Ilia if they had the same coaching. Talent and body type can enter into it. Even most of the senior men who do quads internationally aren't that consistent with them and/or are ignoring other things in their skating. I really don't want a bunch of Grassls in the American ranks. Or Timothy Goebels.

 

[Capt. DeSoto]

I thought USFS gives bonus points for US lower-level competitions to perform more difficult jumps, like Russia did.

Maybe they need to up the ante.

There’s a b1 for each quad in the FS domestically, but still disallowed in the SP. there isn’t enough close competition in junior ranks to really push the need. It’s really on the skaters to realize how necessary they are for longevity on the senior international stage.

 

[Jonas]

From Jackie's Xweet on Men's FS for Four Continents:

https://x.com/rockerskating/status/2015326475717910683

Explains why Mie Hamada was so emotional in the Kiss & Cry. Not surprised, but I was secretly hoping he'd stick it out for another season.

Your thoughts...

 

[Jonas]

I assume Patrick will stay Junior internationally next season, even if he moves up to Senior domestically. Has he said otherwise?

Patrick is age eligible next season and with Tomoki already announcing his retirement and others possibly following suit, Patrick should be groomed (along w/Jacob Sanchez and Lucius Kazanecki among others) for 2030. This is kinda why I was hoping that he get the opportunity to compete at Jr. Worlds: get that ISU Championship experience. I would've liked to see him get the chance to nail a clean, 3-quad FS, which I think could challenge for the podium. With at junior world medal, I'd hope he opt to compete senior internationally.

Your thoughts...

 

[Karen-W]

Patrick, like Lucius, is already senior age-eligible this season. Both of them chose to remain exclusively at the junior level instead, but I'd be surprised if they don't both make the move to seniors next season.

 

[Theatregirl1122]

Like we may need to stop fooling ourselves that anyone is going to develop steady jumps with Derrick/Ivan or Viktor Pfeifer or Tammy G. at the helm, lovely as they may be...

I really don't think anyone but the skaters and USFSA are fooling themselves that anyone is going to develop steady jumps with Tammy Gambil at the helm. Certainly no one on FSU that I've seen.

We just don't have any control over what skaters do.

 

[Jammers]

Patrick, like Lucius, is already senior age-eligible this season. Both of them chose to remain exclusively at the junior level instead, but I'd be surprised if they don't both make the move to seniors next season.

They really should move up to Senior internationally next season with all of the retirements. Tomoki is now done and has Camden said anything about continuing to compete? Also how long are Torgy and Max going to continue?

 

[Capt. DeSoto]

[H]as Camden said anything about continuing to compete? Also [how] long are Torgy and Max going to continue?

I thought for sure Camden would be done, but he hinted recently on social media that he wasn’t. As for Andrew and Max, they could really go either way in my opinion. I can see them either retiring after the Olympics, or continuing on for a year or two before making the decision whether to push on to 2030.

 

[BittyBug]

I would not be surprised if Naumov retired from competitive skating. He appears to have been fueled this season by a drive to fulfill his parents’ (and his) dream of going to the Olympics, for himself, but also for their memory, and with that accomplished, I could see him moving on from competitive skating. He has his parents’ skating school, and I would not be surprised if he is sought out for speaking engagements and other opportunities, so I would expect he will not want for other things to do if he so desires.

 

[Aceon6]

He has his parents’ skating school

The kids love him. I don’t see him moving from SCoB until the youngest of the group is junior eligible and moves on to the Letovs or decides to go elsewhere. Whether he feels that the work is done then is anyone’s guess.

 

[Sylvia]

This is kinda why I was hoping that he [Blackwell] get the opportunity to compete at Jr. Worlds: get that ISU Championship experience.

Patrick debuted at Junior Worlds last year and placed 13th, pulling up after a rough SP:

4 Jacob SANCHEZ USA 230.41 3 5 (10th in his debut in 2024; clean SP and landed both 3A in his FS but his 1Lz+2A in the 2nd half - the only element with negative GOE in his protocol - cost him the bronze that Hagara won)

13 Patrick BLACKWELL USA 200.06 21 12 (landed a +3A but had errors on his 3Lz combo & 3F in SP; landed opening 4T, 3A+2A, 3A & 3Lo in his FS but had small errors in the 2nd half)

 

[Sylvia]

Patrick Blackwell won the Junior national title by 25 points this year despite errors on his 3Lz+3Tb1 in SP and 3Ab1+3Aqb1 (16.00 base value -1.60 GOE + 2.00 bonus = 16.40 points) and 2T+1Eu+3S in the 2nd half. His opening 4T & 4S (first in competition) were impressive and he kept up his energy level until the end (ETA that it was exciting to be part of the audience cheering for him that night!).
Results/protocols: https://ijs.usfigureskating.org/leaderboard/results/2026/36273/CAT006SEG013.html

It's unfortunate for Patrick that there are only 2 men's spots for Junior Worlds this year, but hopefully Jacob & Lucius will be successful in gaining the 3rd spot back and one of them will be among the top 3 countries for the 14 JGP spots next season.

Dec. 17, 2025 in this thread:

Clip of Junior Patrick Blackwell's new 4S+3A in practice: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DSX-Huwkdpg/
...
He and his (German) mother/coach recently spent some time in Germany (after Tallinn Trophy) where he worked on his quads, including Axel, on the pole harness: https://www.instagram.com/reel/DSIq5qwDGEE/

 

[miffy]

I’m so sad Tomoki is retiring it doesn’t seem that long ago that he finally won Junior Worlds.

 

[clairecloutier]

I’m so sad Tomoki is retiring it doesn’t seem that long ago that he finally won Junior Worlds.

It's a bit sad, but I'm really glad Tomoki is ending on a good note. He truly sounds content with where he's at and what he accomplished this year. He upped his performance level and made a legitimate run at the Olympic team. In the end it didn't quite happen, but all you can do is try your best, and he did that. I'll miss him, but it's good to know when to step away, and to be okay with that.