Two year old snatched by alligator at Disney World (FL) resort

[Skittl1321]

I agree, however, that it's not a bad idea for Disney to post that the lake has gators, for tourists who perhaps don't realize how extensive gators are in FL. I do understand why they had not, though - they hadn't had an alligator incident in something like 50 years, which is pretty much the entire history of the resort, yes?

They do remove gators pretty regularly though, so it's not like they are unheard of on the Disney property. Disney is well aware they are there and present a danger, and they do what they can to mitigate it. There seem to be a number of "close call" stories coming up though, and I've read multiple stories of guests being seen on the properties feeding them... (why the hell would anyone do that!)

It's a pretty good safety record- but it's actually only been 30 years since the last alligator attack on Disney property.

 

[madm]

This seems like a teachable moment. Disney should take the initiative to do some natural history education about alligators and crocodiles, Florida waters, and any other environmental subjects pertinent to the resort they've created. Make some educational exhibits so that tourists can learn about Florida and any dangers they should be aware of, and tell people what they should do if they see a dangerous animal like a crocodile.

 

[jeffisjeff]

What the feck is wrong with people that can't have empathy with the family and want, instead, to point fingers and berate them. They've lost their two year old son FFS. Like they aren't going to relieve the entire decision making process and regret it for the rest of their lives.

I completely agree. Some posts on this thread are really shameful.

 

[maatTheViking]

I think it requires more than 'a little bit of common sense' to realize that there is alligators in the waters at a resort. I will state again: From looking at the pictures, I would probably have let me kids splash in the water. Where I come from 'no swimming' = undercurrents. (Or maybe I wouldn't have given the algae, but some people don't mind that.)

In addition, I know that the dad tired to get the kid back from the alligator, but who says they let him splash in the water. Having a 'movie night' on the beach on vacation, I can totally see a 2-year go off to splash in the water. The parents call the kid back, the kid doesn't listen. The parents get up to get the kid, and it is too late, alligator is there.

If anything, I think it might be odd to host events on the beach at dusk.

 

[AxelAnnie]

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In addition, I know that the dad tired to get the kid back from the alligator, but who says they let him splash in the water. Having a 'movie night' on the beach on vacation, I can totally see a 2-year go off to splash in the water. The parents call the kid back, the kid doesn't listen. The parents get up to get the kid, and it is too late, alligator is there.

If anything, I think it might be odd to host events on the beach at dusk.

Holding events on a beach at dusk is glorious!

By all accounts the Parents and two kids were standing together at the waters edge in the shallow water.

One of the "Rules of Parenting" is that you NEVER let a toddler get more than arms length from you around water. Any water. You simply do not let a 2 year old wander around at all.

I don't think I would thought of alligators. And "No Swimming" is not a sufficient warning since from what I have read an alligator can propel themselves at lightening speed up out of the water and 5 feet onto land to catch something to eat.

It is a tragedy. It is horrid. That family will re-live that night forever. I keep coming back to is why does the resort have a lake that people can get near, that is full of alligators?

 

[aliceanne]

I understand there was a body of water there originally; and a swampy area. So even if they hadn't turned it into a formal lake, there would still be gators.

I admit, however, that when I went to the resort, I thought it odd that they had built actual beaches, with beach chairs and everything, along a body of water you were not allowed to swim in. To me, beach = swimming. But they use the beaches for events - still, though, I found it odd. But it is also the case that the pools are *right there*, and EXTREMELY inviting, and open either until midnight or even 24 hours, and that the lake is kind of gross and not something that you'd want to wade in, never mind at night.

With that said, there are no oceans and very few swimmable bodies of water in Nebraska, where this family is from. They wouldn't have known that you don't do things like go into bodies of water at night (lots of animals feed then.) I myself didn't know that until I moved to a beach community and the folks there told me. And yes, they made a stupid decision to ignore the signs, but we've all made stupid decisions in our lives - it's just that most of us have gotten away with them. They did not.

I agree, however, that it's not a bad idea for Disney to post that the lake has gators, for tourists who perhaps don't realize how extensive gators are in FL. I do understand why they had not, though - they hadn't had an alligator incident in something like 50 years, which is pretty much the entire history of the resort, yes?

I would be more afraid of flesh eating bacteria, standing water in the Deep South has gotten a lot of publicity for that. Kids get a lot of cuts and open wounds especially in murky water. As FGRSK8 said, brain eating amoeba too.

I know from watching Honey Boo Boo that a lot of people ignore those warnings too. That's why I am surprised that Disney would even have a beach there.

 

[catatonic]

When our daughter was young we stayed at the Wilderness Lodge in Disney World. We thought about staying at the Grand Floridian but decided against it because of its size. We thought it might have been too large and therefore too crowded.

At the Wilderness Lodge, we could take the curtesy bus or boat rides. Not once did we feel we were in danger of gator attacks. I'd worry about my daughter being snatched by a sexual predator than a gator, if anything.

If my daughter wanted to wade in that murky lake, I would probably object because of the quality of the water. But if she had insisted and my husband was willing to take her, then they would be wading in the water. One just doesn't equate gator attacks with Disney World.

It sounds like a Stephen King novel, grand beautiful scenery, happy party atmosphere, BUT! In the lake something sinister and dangerous lurks, ready to pounce on the innocent victims!

I don't know how any family can survive this tragedy.

 

[IceAlisa]

The parents made the decision to ignore multiple "No Swimming" signs and allowed their toddler child to splash in the water. This was absolutely preventable with the application of a little bit of common sense.

Does "No swimming" mean "no splashing at the water's edge" in Australia?

Yes, it would have been preventable with a "Danger: alligators in the water" sign.

I am a total exception who researches every new place I visit, including the incidence of gator attacks in Florida and how to avoid them, venomous snakes, etc. But that's not the norm.

 

[StitchMonkey]

Maybe it's a cultural thing but if I see a sign that says "no swimming", I'm not going anywhere near that water, no way, no how. Because if it says no swimming, there must be a reason, and a very good one.

And given that Disney World is a place that attracts people of many different cultures, speaking different languages go to, they may have wanted to keep it simple.

"No Swimming" could be clear to a much greater number of people than a long winded sign explaining things that half the people reading it can't understand.

There can be advantages in keeping it simple and clear and to the point - you don't want to give more information and confuse people.

 

[gkelly]

Maybe "Stay Out of Water" or "Keep Away from Water" would have been more effective.

But it only takes one person misunderstanding or defying the signs, or a young child who can't understand, for tragedy to happen

 

[Cachoo]

Had I been there before this gators would not have occurred to me. I would have waded into the water without a second thought. The signs need to be more explicit for folks like me who have never seen a gator (except on tv.) It just would not have been on my radar.

 

[Karina1974]

Why? No swimming means no swimming only. Is there any hidden meaning I am missing? Just curious, what do you think "No diving" means?

You do realize that most people who go to pools are not actually "swimming," yes? Playing, horsing around, doing handstands and flips, wading in the shallow end or sitting on the edge, but I see very few people actually doing laps and practicing strokes.

 

[Kruss]

Excellent viewpoint in this article. "Parents, stop blaming and shaming."

 

[Karina1974]

They may have taught him to swim when he was just a baby. I know some parents teach their 6-9 months old babies to swim. If that was the case, I can see that they felt comfortable with him in that shallow water.

Yeah, and those parents are why pools get closed down when human shit is found in the water. That's happened several times at the pool where I go to swim. They shut it down for the rest of the day when that happens, even if it's 2:00 and the pool closes at 7:00. You can't even get a full refund when that happens, because the pool is inside Saratoga Spa State Park, so you have to pay once to get into the park, and then again to get into the pool.

Children shouldn't be allowed in pools until they are completely potty-trained.

 

[IceAlisa]

You do realize that most people who go to pools are not actually "swimming," yes? Playing, horsing around, doing handstands and flips, wading in the shallow end or sitting on the edge, but I see very few people actually doing laps and practicing strokes.

No, actually I do not. I must have been hallucinating all these times by the pool. But if that were the case, a different sign would be more appropriate, since no one is swimming anyway, to follow your own logic?

 

[Karina1974]

Maybe it's a cultural thing but if I see a sign that says "no swimming", I'm not going anywhere near that water, no way, no how. Because if it says no swimming, there must be a reason, and a very good one.

Same here. But then again, I grew up swimming at a pool that had set rules, management was to be obeyed (and they did kick a few kids out who refused to listen), and when we were told to get out of the pool, we didn't question why, we just did it. I only remember evacuations being done for thunder storms, though; bringing diaper-wearing infants into the big pool wasn't in fashion yet. I don't think this pool allowed that, to be honest.

 

[IceAlisa]

And given that Disney World is a place that attracts people of many different cultures, speaking different languages go to, they may have wanted to keep it simple.

"No Swimming" could be clear to a much greater number of people than a long winded sign explaining things that half the people reading it can't understand.

There can be advantages in keeping it simple and clear and to the point - you don't want to give more information and confuse people.

How about a sign with an alligator on it? Simple enough?

 

[Tinami Amori]

Disney management could possibly put up these signs V V ..... but i imagine that such would certainly alarm people and drive customers away... ... not something anyone visually expects in the "disney wonderland".

http://www.firstsign.com/Shared/images/Product/no-swimming-no-wading-firstsign.jpg

http://images.mysafetysign.com/img/lg/K/alligators-no-swimming-sign-k-0003.png

http://www.davidwallphoto.com/gallery/Australia/Northern_Territory_Top_End/ANTr219.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/d9/1e/7f/d91e7f59facc3770cbf1fbb2ee76d7d2.jpg

http://images.viralnova.com/000/046/686/warning-signs26.jpg

 

[attyfan]

Given that alligators can get out of the water ... and fast ... a "no swimming" sign isn't enough, IMO. Some other method has to be found .. fencing, or, "don't go near" with Ice Alisa's suggestion of an alligator on it until the fencing can be built. This is especially true at Disney World where there are likely to be more small children than there might be at other, more adult-focused resorts.

 

[Karina1974]

The point is, not everyone does extensive research of the location they are about to visit.

And that is to their detriment. We here in the foothills of the Adirondacks are privy to the stories of city-idiots who come up here trying to hike up Mount Marcy and the other High Peaks mountains wearing sneakers instead of hiking boots, camping without using proper gear or storing their food in such a way that they don't attract bears and using GPS to guide them instead of using orienteering skills.

 

[StitchMonkey]

How about a sign with an alligator on it? Simple enough?

ummmm meaning what?

It's Disney... a pic of an animal is likely to make people think it is an attraction. I would not think a pic of an Alligator meant a warning of Alligators... id likely think it was a "look for the sign with an alligator on it" type thing like they do in parking lots. Id just assume there was a monkey zone and a tiger zone elsewhere and this was arbitrarily named alligator. A pic with no context does not really help.

Regardless of alligators the message is don't get in the bloody water. "No Swimming" is pretty much the shortest, simplest, easiest for many to understand way to put it. If you want to split hairs and say "wading is not swimming" well that is your choice to take a risk, but don't blame Disney for your hair splitting.

 

[Karina1974]

It is a tragedy. It is horrid. That family will re-live that night forever. I keep coming back to is why does the resort have a lake that people can get near, that is full of alligators?

Same reason that NY State doesn't eradicate all of our wild animal population from the Adirondack Park so people can camp and fish, canoe and hike in the mountains without worrying about coming across moose or bear, bobcats and coyotes, etc.

Because it is part of their natural habitat. That lake used to be swampland, which is, again, alligator natural habitat. Alligators are a keystone species, which means their existence is a benefit to other native species, plus they help control the population of species.

They have more of a right to be there than humans have.

 

[IceAlisa]

I will ask the same question: what does a sign that says no diving mean?

No diving? No swimming? No wading? Caution, piranhas?

How hard to understand or unclear is this: http://thumbs3.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mwWJydXyD5dgBkxZABpwR2g.jpg

 

[TheGirlCanSkate]

Not only did it house at least 4 alligators, but they enticed families to the edge of the the habitat by putting in a fun man made beach, pools and poolside service. If there had been a 4ft retaining wall between the sand and water, this would not have happened. The fact the child was in the water within arms reach of a parent doesn't matter. He could have been on the edge where water meets sand and still be pulled in a killed.

This is a manmade lake that knowingly housed alligators in an area where families play on the beach, the hotel has chairs set up on the beach for guests and hosts events on that beach. They serve food and drinks on the beach and there is also a children's playground.

When I think of Florida and alligators, I think of the everglades. Those boats that run with that big fan and people sitting above looking for them. I don't think of a manmade lake with a playground. I think swamp.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Same reason that NY State doesn't eradicate all of our wild animal population from the Adirondack Park so people can camp and fish, canoe and hike in the mountains without worrying about coming across moose or bear, bobcats and coyotes, etc.

Because it is part of their natural habitat. That lake used to be swampland, which is, again, alligator natural habitat. Alligators are a keystone species, which means their existence is a benefit to other native species, plus they help control the population of species.

They have more of a right to be there than humans have.

I would argue that the alligators have absolutely no rights to that particular piece of real estate. I can't imagine that that little 17 acre lake will make a difference in the overall health and well being of the species.

If Disney is going to have a lake with predators in it (and they certainly can) they ought to make sure to protect the humans from the people eating animals....at least in my opinion.

 

[Karina1974]

I will ask the same question: what does a sign that says no diving mean?

No diving? No swimming? No wading? Caution, piranhas?

How hard to understand or unclear is this: http://thumbs3.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/mwWJydXyD5dgBkxZABpwR2g.jpg

I already said to you, you see very few people actually SWIMMING in a swimming pool. i would say the majority of people these days at any given pool or beach can't even demonstrate proper strokes on command. And every time I have seen a pool or beach water evacuated by management, they have never made exceptions for those people who wish to wade in the shallows or sit with their feet in the water. "No swimming" means "no water activity at all in this body of water."

 

[Skittl1321]

When I think of Florida and alligators, I think of the everglades. Those boats that run with that big fan and people sitting above looking for them. I don't think of a manmade lake with a playground. I think swamp.

Disney was built over a swamp. It's why they got the land so cheap. They can't keep the alligators out, they can only remove them when they find them.

Even if you are swimming in your own backyard pool in Florida, it's a wise idea to check for alligators first.

"No swimming" means "no water activity at all in this body of water."

I've been to places that didn't allow swimming but allowed standing ankle deep in the water. Seems like a "do not enter water" sign would have been better.
Of course, a hungry alligator can EASILY leave the water (and extremely quickly!) if this child was playing even remotely near it.


Edit: Here's an example (a place we've been): Rule 12: No swimming allowed, wading beach only.
http://virginiakeybeachpark.net/parkinfo/

 

[Kecasyl]

Yes they still run. But there was a time when the lake would be filled with small motorboats and sailboats from the resorts which buzzed across the lakes during the days.

I'm aware of this. There are still fishing excursions and SeaRaycers that run on the lake and lagoon that people can rent.

 

[IceAlisa]

"No swimming" means "no water activity at all in this body of water."

You have a very strange understanding of the English language.

 

[Kecasyl]

I for one, am from nowhere near Florida, yet since I was very young associate it with gators and venomous snakes.
There actually are signs on Walt Disney World property that have photos of snakes and gators on them and warns of the wildlife in lakes and also on golf courses where it is not odd to see Alligators sunning themselves.
https://i.ytimg.com/vi/DTGlE56v6hE/maxresdefault.jpg