The Skating Lesson

topaz

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15,236
Dave's comments about Wakaba today had me "really". He mentioned that Wakaba Higuchi does not have any "wow" factors to her skating. I was dumbfounded by his statement. Like there is an abundance of powerful, fast skaters with very good skating skills and edges.
 

Willin

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2,606
Wakaba doesn't have any artistic "wow," but those jumps and her speed are insane! I remember the first time I saw her jump I said "wow" out loud.
 

Seerek

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Dave's comments about Wakaba today had me "really". He mentioned that Wakaba Higuchi does not have any "wow" factors to her skating. I was dumbfounded by his statement. Like there is an abundance of powerful, fast skaters with very good skating skills and edges.

He's implicitly saying "If Marin Honda doesn't get on that Olympic team, I'm going to go into seclusion..."
 

giselle23

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1,729
I turned them off today, maybe for good. Dave is a terrible commentator. Everything is just stream of consciousness. A few weeks ago he said he thought Mirai could be national champion. Now he hates her music (not mentioned before) and suggests she go "back to Frank"--as if that could happen. Is it any wonder that Jackie Wong is on Ice Network and Dave isn't? Commentary has to have some coherence and has to have some objectivity.
 

topaz

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15,236
He's implicitly saying "If Marin Honda doesn't get on that Olympic team, I'm going to go into seclusion..."

I adore Marin Honda she's a great all round skater, but she will have to earn it. Wakaba has shown she can skate well under pressure, ie. three-time Japanese senior medalists( 2 silvers and one bronze). We all Japan looks at the whole season when choosing it's team. In my opinion, Wakaba should be ranked #1 for one of the spots based on her performances for the last two years.
 

skatfan

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8,414
I couldn't listen to the whole thing. No order jumping from one random thought to another.
 

Jammers

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7,567
He was right though about Japan needing 3 spots and the US not needing them from what we've seen of the US ladies so far. Unless a complete meltdown happens at the Olympics the US will be lucky to get in the top 6 and the 3rd spot is basically wasted on a skater who will probably not finish in the top 12 while Japan has probably 4 girls who can finish in the top 8.
 

giselle23

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1,729
He was right though about Japan needing 3 spots and the US not needing them from what we've seen of the US ladies so far. Unless a complete meltdown happens at the Olympics the US will be lucky to get in the top 6 and the 3rd spot is basically wasted on a skater who will probably not finish in the top 12 while Japan has probably 4 girls who can finish in the top 8.
The comment about the US not "needing" 3 spots is exactly the kind of pointless commentary they engage in. The spots are not determined based on need; they are earned and are not going to change. If they want to critique the state of US ladies skating, fine. But it has little to do with the state of Japanese ladies skating. Yes, Japan appears stronger. But their failure to gain 3 spots actually improves the US ladies' chances.
 

GullyGirl84

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252
comment about the US not "needing" 3 spots is exactly the kind of pointless commentary they engage in. The spots are not determined based on need; they are earned and are not going to change. If they want to critique the state of US ladies skating, fine. But it has little to do with the state of Japanese ladies skating. Yes, Japan appears stronger. But their failure to gain 3 spots actually improves the US ladies' chances.

Exactly, one could also make the argument that Canada does not particularly "need" 3 ladies spots, but the thing is they earned them. It's sad that we won't be able to see the full dept of Japanese ladies and their talent at the Olympics, but they did not earn the spots. With the way their ladies so far have been throwing it down, I could see Marin not making it to these olympics, despite her talent and sparkle. I mean, Wakaba has landed on the Japanese podium for more than a few years now for a reason. And I agree that Dave will probably throw a fit if that happens, but thems the rules, and it has nothing to do with the US ladies. Everything else, yes, Dave will be completely into someone one week and them completely dump them the next week, but that's nothing new, and it is a commentary show. He was all into Karen being the #1 lady and Ashley being past her prime a few weeks ago, then the next week he was "worried" about Karen and thought Polina could make a comeback, and then he didn't think Polina could do anything and was all into Mirai, and now he is saying that Ashley will be US champion again :) Yet...that is also kind of the trajectory of people's comments here from week to week, I guess. Also, I thought that their issue with Frank was that they did not let people be themselves and that it was all cookie cutter, princess packaging?

The only real issue I took with their Mirai comments was Dave saying that her wearing Edea boots meant she was not "going for gold". They're not the prettiest, but I don't think Mirai would have switched brands mid season last year if she didn't have to, which she got into in her nationals post-SP conference last year. I am fine with her wearing Edeas if they do not literally split in half like her other boots did at Nationals and at Worlds, and she also needs something sturdier for the triple axel. Meagan Duhamel also commented on their Facebook page that switching to Edea made some of her foot injury issues go away. It's comments of TSL's like that that make me go :wall:
 

barbarafan

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5,306
Exactly, one could also make the argument that Canada does not particularly "need" 3 ladies spots, but the thing is they earned them. It's sad that we won't be able to see the full dept of Japanese ladies and their talent at the Olympics, but they did not earn the spots. With the way their ladies so far have been throwing it down, I could see Marin not making it to these olympics, despite her talent and sparkle. I mean, Wakaba has landed on the Japanese podium for more than a few years now for a reason. And I agree that Dave will probably throw a fit if that happens, but thems the rules, and it has nothing to do with the US ladies. Everything else, yes, Dave will be completely into someone one week and them completely dump them the next week, but that's nothing new, and it is a commentary show. He was all into Karen being the #1 lady and Ashley being past her prime a few weeks ago, then the next week he was "worried" about Karen and thought Polina could make a comeback, and then he didn't think Polina could do anything and was all into Mirai, and now he is saying that Ashley will be US champion again :) Yet...that is also kind of the trajectory of people's comments here from week to week, I guess. Also, I thought that their issue with Frank was that they did not let people be themselves and that it was all cookie cutter, princess packaging?

The only real issue I took with their Mirai comments was Dave saying that her wearing Edea boots meant she was not "going for gold". They're not the prettiest, but I don't think Mirai would have switched brands mid season last year if she didn't have to, which she got into in her nationals post-SP conference last year. I am fine with her wearing Edeas if they do not literally split in half like her other boots did at Nationals and at Worlds, and she also needs something sturdier for the triple axel. Meagan Duhamel also commented on their Facebook page that switching to Edea made some of her foot injury issues go away. It's comments of TSL's like that that make me go :wall:

Sorry...but doesn't Med wear Edeas? I would think they would be pretty strong with her million hours of jumping training.
 

Rukia

A Southern, hot-blooded temperamental individual
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Sorry...but doesn't Med wear Edeas? I would think they would be pretty strong with her million hours of jumping training.
She does. I know some of the guys doing quads wear them too. I think Edeas look fugly, but they clearly work for a lot of skaters.
 

GullyGirl84

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252
Sorry...but doesn't Med wear Edeas? I would think they would be pretty strong with her million hours of jumping training.

Yes, pretty sure (and think they even reference it in the recap?). Dave goes off on the Edea skates a lot in other recaps and how they "cut off the line", but (again) while not the prettiest, it's not even something that I particularly latch onto when watching these skaters. But we all have our thing.
 

oleada

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43,434
Yeah, I can't bring myself to care about that. Whatever skaters find comfortable and works for them. I, rarely, if ever, notice. Better ugly boots than foot injuries.

On a similar note, I know many hate gloves, but blades are sharp and ice rinks are cold, so again, I can't blame skaters for wearing them.
 

kittysk8ts

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1,820
David Lease isn't a skater and doesn't have a clue what they need.
So true.

I used to watch/listen semi-regularly when Jenny was on board, but the quality has nosedived since that point and I see I’m not missing much.

You can seriously get much better and coherent analysis by reading FSU posts out loud.

And Jonathon is a singer. They never talk about the actual SKATING. LOL. And now they are suggesting Ashley change her free to "Smash". Very helpful. Three and half months before the Games. My God, just leave her alone.
 

shine

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4,889
I feel Dave has a very limited range of appreciation for different styles of skating. If the skater doesn't fit his very particular stylistic preference he's very dismissive of their artistry. He's still stuck thinking Michelle Kwan is the end all and be all of all artistry. Meh.
 

Cleo1782

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1,347
I understand why people hate it but, I take their "knowledge" for what it's worth. TSL's this and that recaps are supposed to be taken as opinion pieces I think. They recap the skating, but it's their opinions. Some I agree with some I don't. I enjoy the fact that they generally put up consistent content and I find some of their snark funny sometimes. It's not everyone's cup of tea, but I am the kind of person if I don't like it I won't bother watching it.

If I was a current high level skater I wouldn't watch it, but I wouldn't read this board either. It's not healthy.

I don't feel like it's trying to be the journalistic venture it once was. Both of them work regular jobs, so it's not a big money maker. It seems like they truly follow the sport in their spare time. I think people should just take it at face value. Two guys' opinions on skating.

And yeah, I don't care about what boots skaters are wearing either.....
 

supergirl573

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477
I don't think that he means artistry, but Michelle was pretty much perfect at expression. Especially in comparison to someone like Mirai Nagasu, who often looks like she is being forced to skate against her will.
 

Cleo1782

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1,347
I don't think that he means artistry, but Michelle was pretty much perfect at expression. Especially in comparison to someone like Mirai Nagasu, who often looks like she is being forced to skate against her will.

I also think to your point that Michelle was someone (especially later in her career) who could make you think she was doing a ton of transitions and choreo when she wasn't because of the expression. If Mirai brought some of that into her skating it would make a world of difference.
It's a shame. Mirai practices so hard and well. You know she wants this, but her skating in competition doesn't reflect it. It's almost like she wants it too much and everything gets so tight.
 

wouldacoulda

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305
David Lease isn't a skater and doesn't have a clue what they need.
Technically speaking, Dave is a skater, much the way I am a skater. Started as an adult, has done some testing and competing, but will never know what it feels like to do triples and quads, fast spins with impossible position changes, or intricate footwork with speed, all in front of huge audiences and harsh judges, with the added pressure of the federation and sponsors. The difference, I believe, is that I appreciate what each competitor does, and when I nit-pick about artistry, costuming or music, it's not out there for the general public (usually done with one or two friends over dinner). When a skater falls on a jump on TV, I get mad FOR them, not AT them.
 

MAXSwagg

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1,859
To be honest, most of the actual commentators have biases and commentate half the time based on what they like, even to the point of blatantly (deliberately?) ignoring severe technical flaws of the skaters they prefer. There are only a few regular commentators who say objective, rational, and factual things:

*Kurt Browning
*Johnny Weir more often than not
*Tarasova more often than not
*Robin Cousins
*Tracy Wilson
*Max Ambesi (who is not even a skater but gives more accurate commentary even at the technical level that commentators who were actually skaters)
*Monfort and Candeloro

B.ESP are great, but they many times gloss over technical flaws, and Mark Hanretty has said some very, very odd and downright incorrect things.

Julia also gave fantastic commentary during Rostelecom.

OF COURSE TSL's comments are their opinions and they're just as valid as anyone else's. I certainly don't find them anymore objective than many official commentators...
 

Anyasnake

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1,100
*Kurt Browning
*Johnny Weir more often than not
*Tarasova more often than not
They don't even hide it that's true. On the other hand, when Browning is swept away by the performance he acknowleges it. But he can be very Canadian when he wants. But that is nothing compared to Tarasova when commentating on Russian skaters though. She does have her favourite. I HATED when she spoke out loud about the skaters' weight on live TV, that is crossing a big line. I strongly disliked Weir's and Lipinski commentary... especially about ice dance, they just know when it's time not to talk... and they do (can we have Tanith and Charlie please ? Charlie isn't shy about pointing technical flaws at all).
TSL is more of a talk show though.
The "issue" with TSL is the "brutal" commentary, borderline offensive, and unbearable for the fans of course. If I were a Wagner fan I would have stopped listening to it a while ago.
 

Dobre

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17,118
can we have Tanith and Charlie please ? Charlie isn't shy about pointing technical flaws at all).

Tanith & Ben are the best. Charlie doesn't say much about the technical stuff. He's nice--tries extremely hard to be nice about everyone, I think--but Ben is better. He's had tech specialist training, and he has enough backbone to not let Tracy drag him into No Man's Land.
 

sap5

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10,548
Tanith & Ben are the best. Charlie doesn't say much about the technical stuff. He's nice--tries extremely hard to be nice about everyone, I think--but Ben is better. He's had tech specialist training, and he has enough backbone to not let Tracy drag him into No Man's Land.

I do like the combo of Tanith and Ben the best. There's something about Ben that feels so genuine. I never feel that he's trying to push some agenda or bias, probably because he can actually talk about the technical elements, and what it takes for the skaters to achieve them. Plus he and Tanith work so well together, it's like hearing two old friends who really love the sport sharing their thoughts.
 
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