The Dance Hall 9: Bring the Bling or No Beijing 2021-2022

[angi]

Looks like the Spanish spot in Beijing will be decided by the total combined scores from Finlandia Trophy, Spanish Nationals and Euros.

Then my condolences to Smart/Diaz, they are always lowballed at Euros and I doubt this season will be different.

 

[Belsornia]

Some thoughts on the Olympic qualification with a month to go:

I would assume Kazakova/Reviya (if they are healthy) and Turkkila/Versluis are fovourite for top 2 spots.

Garabedian/Proulx-Senecal look in a fine position.

Harris/Chan and Min/Eaton are close, one way or the other. Between them it will go down to the performance (and panel of judges) of the day.
Taschler siblings, Yanovskaya/Lukacs and maybe Fioretti/Moscheni should be in this mix too.

Agree with your assessment of the contenders heading into Nebelhorn. Harris/Chan should have the AUS spot there sewn up now. Min/Eaton were pretty messy this weekend, but I'm expecting that to be better when it's not their first competition in 18 months (hopefully they'll reconsider the RD costumes too).

I've been grouping the contenders in my mind (should be safe/on the bubble/long shot/see you in 2025) and Garabedian/Proulx-Senecal are the only team who really changed my assessment. But since this is their third year skating that totally generic FD, no wonder they're looking polished.

I think pretty much all the NA-based teams who should be heading to Oberstdorf were at LPIDC. More uncertainty around the Europe-based teams, and since they'll have to wait till Lombardia not as much time for them to make changes after their first outing.

Anyone know if Ramanauskaite/Kizala of Lithuania are still competing, or if a fifth spot is likely to come available if Allison Reed doesn't get citizenship?

 

[Colonel Green]

Then my condolences to Smart/Diaz, they are always lowballed at Euros and I doubt this season will be different.

Can’t be lowballed at Euros if Euros doesn’t happen!

 

[Karen-W]

Can’t be lowballed at Euros if Euros doesn’t happen!

But however will the Spanish fed decide who goes to the Olympics then?!

The way I see it, Euros always seems to balance the Nationals overscoring (relative to what both teams seem to get internationally) that S/D always receive.

 

[Dobre]

At least the criteria is for the same events & it has been clearly announced up front. Now we see if both teams manage to make it to everything. (Wear your masks, people).

 

[Bigbird]

This all seems trite given that the one who wins is the one who has the opportunity to train or travel during a pandemic. These Olympics and world championships will never be seen as truly reflective. The champions are champions of opportunity not ability or true talent.

 

[VGThuy]

This all seems trite given that the one who wins is the one who has the opportunity to train or travel during a *********. These Olympics and world championships will never be seen as truly reflective. The champions are champions of opportunity not ability or true talent.

If you think about that’s true all of all championships. It takes more than talent to be a champion.

 

[Colonel Green]

Sort of related to my earlier joke, but since the cancellation of Cup of China has at least raised the specter of much of the international pre-Olympic season getting the kibosh for the second year running: I hadn't previously been concerned for Papadakis & Cizeron on this angle, but if the aforesaid does start rolling, then they start getting into really dodgy terrain vis a vis the World Standings. Because right now they are buried down in twelfth, about 700 points back of fifth, and would be skating before the final flood in the RD in Beijing.

I don't have any real doubts that the Olympics happen, but it has to now be at least somewhat up for grabs what else will, and whether if things do happen there will be WS points awarded for them.

 

[barbarafan]

Sort of related to my earlier joke, but since the cancellation of Cup of China has at least raised the specter of much of the international pre-Olympic season getting the kibosh for the second year running: I hadn't previously been concerned for Papadakis & Cizeron on this angle, but if the aforesaid does start rolling, then they start getting into really dodgy terrain vis a vis the World Standings. Because right now they are buried down in twelfth, about 700 points back of fifth, and would be skating before the final flood in the RD in Beijing.

I don't have any real doubts that the Olympics happen, but it has to now be at least somewhat up for grabs what else will, and whether if things do happen there will be WS points awarded for them.

Do you have any info on Cdn Ice dancers going to challenger events? I of course am waiting to hear of news of this nature re: my favourite ice dancers Alicia Fabbri/Paul Ayer.

 

[Colonel Green]

Do you have any info on Cdn Ice dancers going to challenger events? I of course am waiting to hear of news of this nature re: my favourite ice dancers Alicia Fabbri/Paul Ayer.

No, there haven't been any reports about those assignments.

 

[Dobre]

I hadn't previously been concerned for Papadakis & Cizeron on this angle, but if the aforesaid does start rolling, then they start getting into really dodgy terrain vis a vis the World Standings.

Why is it particularly significant where they finish in the World Standings? They've never seemed particularly worried about them themselves.

 

[barbarafan]

No, there haven't been any reports about those assignments.

ok..thanks

 

[Colonel Green]

Why is it particularly significant where they finish in the World Standings? They've never seemed particularly worried about them themselves.

It governs start orders at events, which is important in ice dance more than any other discipline. And I wouldn't say any dance teams are unconcerned about starting positions; P/C, in this case, have just ended up in a potentially bad spot due to completely unforeseeable circumstances.

 

[Karen-W]

It governs start orders at events, which is important in ice dance more than any other discipline. And I wouldn't say any dance teams are unconcerned about starting positions; P/C, in this case, have just ended up in a potentially bad spot due to completely unforeseeable circumstances.

Well, not completely unforeseeable. They made a conscious choice to skip Worlds this year. That, they knew, was going to drop them in the World standings. Other factors might contribute to keeping them where they are but they did have control over their current ranking as much as any other team who did choose to compete at Worlds instead.

 

[Colonel Green]

Well, not completely unforeseeable. They made a conscious choice to skip Worlds this year. That, they knew, was going to drop them in the World standings. Other factors might contribute to keeping them where they are but they did have control over their current ranking as much as any other team who did choose to compete at Worlds instead.

Of course, but that choice was also substantially because of the effects of YKW.

 

[Dobre]

I still don't think P&C have demonstrated that they care much about start order.


Also--though I don't know if it's relevant regarding P&C--its unlikely that the North American teams will have points from 4CCs if anyone has points from 4CCs. I take it 4CCs is the Olympic Test event as it's scheduled in China. How likely do we think it is that the IOC will hold China's feet to the fire on holding international test events?

 

[Bigbird]

If you think about that’s true all of all championships. It takes more than talent to be a champion.

If all it took was talent P/C would never be champions, they and many others have worked very, very hard. We cannot equate XYZ to the normal struggles and strains of a typical season. It has completely skewed the playing field, but beyond that their body of work will speak for itself in decades to come.

 

[Colonel Green]

Also--though I don't know if it's relevant regarding P&C--its unlikely that the North American teams will have points from 4CCs if anyone has points from 4CCs. I take it 4CCs is the Olympic Test event as it's scheduled in China. How likely do we think it is that the IOC will hold China's feet to the fire on holding international test events?

The Asian Open is the Olympic test event. 4CC is being held in Tianjin, not Beijing.

 

[Karen-W]

I still don't think P&C have demonstrated that they care much about start order.


Also--though I don't know if it's relevant regarding P&C--its unlikely that the North American teams will have points from 4CCs if anyone has points from 4CCs. I take it 4CCs is the Olympic Test event as it's scheduled in China. How likely do we think it is that the IOC will hold China's feet to the fire on holding international test events?

No, Asian Trophy in October is the test event. 4CCs isn't in Beijing so it wouldn't be the test event, assuming the IOC holds China's feet to the fire regarding those.

 

[VGThuy]

If all it took was talent P/C would never be champions, they and many others have worked very, very hard. We cannot equate XYZ to the normal struggles and strains of a typical season. It has completely skewed the playing field, but beyond that their body of work will speak for itself in decades to come.

You said,

These Olympics and world championships will never be seen as truly reflective. The champions are champions of opportunity not ability or true talent.

And that's kind of true pandemic or no pandemic. Some people had nicer upbringings to afford to take skating lessons, some people have parents who are coaches and thus introduced their children to skating earlier than other children, some always had more opportunity than other competitors...so on and so forth...so if you think about it, your statement that the champions are champions of opportunity and "not ability or true talent" would be true then as it is now even if a pandemic is affecting one's current faves when they seemed unaffected before. Every champion is one based on some combination of talent, skill, discipline, hard work, opportunity, timing, and a bit of luck.

 

[Dobre]

Thank you. So how likely do we think it is that China is going to hold 4CCs with it not even being a test event?

 

[Colonel Green]

Thank you. So how likely do we think it is that China is going to hold 4CCs with it not even being a test event?

It's going to be held pretty adjacent to the Olympics, temporally, so it's possible it's being folded into those plans (and maybe as a warmup for China's own skaters). A championship event is I think automatically a bigger deal than a Grand Prix. But it could very well be cancelled as well.

 

[Bigbird]

You said,


And that's kind of true ********* or no *********. Some people had nicer upbringings to afford to take skating lessons, some people have parents who are coaches and thus introduced their children to skating earlier than other children, some always had more opportunity than other competitors...so on and so forth...so if you think about it, your statement that the champions are champions of opportunity and "not ability or true talent" would be true then as it is now even if a ********* is affecting one's current faves when they seemed unaffected before. Every champion is one based on some combination of talent, skill, discipline, hard work, opportunity, timing, and a bit of luck.

Will have to agree to disagree with you on this one. I cannot objectively compare apples with oranges.

 

[Dobre]

I would like to see Sui & Han get the opportunity to gear up for the Olympics at 4CC.

Are Wang & Liu back to training in Canada at this point?

 

[Colonel Green]

Are Wang & Liu back to training in Canada at this point?

No, not that we've seen. I'm not sure if China even wants its skaters training abroad at the moment.

Incidentally, I still have never seen any explanation for how IAM was able to get Saulius Ambrulevicius into Canada when that has continued to be impossible for other non-American foreign skaters.

 

[barbarafan]

No, not that we've seen. I'm not sure if China even wants its skaters training abroad at the moment.

Incidentally, I still have never seen any explanation for how IAM was able to get Saulius Ambrulevicius into Canada when that has continued to be impossible for other non-American foreign skaters.

The Austrailians have been back for a few months

 

[Andrea82]

Anyone know if Ramanauskaite/Kizala of Lithuania are still competing, or if a fifth spot is likely to come available if Allison Reed doesn't get citizenship?

They are entered at Lombardia Trophy

Lombardia Dance entry list is here: https://results.isu.org/events/csita2021_IceDance.htm

 

[Belsornia]

Thanks. Regardless of what happens with the Olympic spot, I'm glad Lithuania have got a second dance team.

Lombardia looks like a good field: lots euro Nebelhorn-hopefuls warming up for the big event, some top ten teams kicking off their seasons, and some new OES couples!

 

[Colonel Green]

The Austrailians have been back for a few months

Yes, but they were already in Canada (and evidently Holly Harris was more eager to nail down her visa status pre-YKW than Gabriella Papadakis or Evgenia Medvedeva, for whatever reason).

Whereas Ambrulevicius had no pre-YKW connection to IAM or Canada, but was able to get to Montreal for a while while skaters in similar situations like Rika Kihira could not.

 

[marbri]

Yes, but they were already in Canada (and evidently Holly Harris was more eager to nail down her visa status pre-YKW than Gabriella Papadakis or Evgenia Medvedeva, for whatever reason).

Whereas Ambrulevicius had no pre-YKW connection to IAM or Canada, but was able to get to Montreal for a while while skaters in similar situations like Rika Kihira could not.

Are they in Montreal now training? I got the impression from some instagram posts they were in Europe but he could just be sharing old photos/memories.