Russian Ladies news & discussion

[_Lola_]

FWIW, in the U.S., the rules of the Professional Skaters Association (PSA), which govern coaches, require that the prior coach of a skater be fully paid up before a new coach can take that skater on as a student. I'm not sure that Rudkovskaya's request is much different than this rule.

This has been discussed for some time - there is no contact system, similar to American, in Russia. Not in figure skating, at least. The discussion about necessity of contracts was fueled by Alyona's and Sasha's exit from Khrustal'ny. I'm sure the Alyona's case will create a precedent and things will change. I feel sorry for her right now. I'm sure Yana will find a way to make them pay - through court or in some other way. It's mesmerizing how them both, she and Plushy, say that that they parted ways with Alyona on good terms. And then - here we go, her mother has contractual obligations and a debt. They are not wrong - they are a commercial club that provided services to Alyona. I wonder if results is a factor in the contract. Probably not. Otherwise, Yana and Plushy would need to pay to Alyona and her mother.

 

[Frau Muller]

This has been discussed for some time - there is no contact system, similar to American, in Russia. Not in figure skating, at least. The discussion about necessity of contracts was fueled by Alyona's and Sasha's exit from Khrustal'ny. I'm sure the Alyona's case will create a precedent and things will change. I feel sorry for her right now. I'm sure Yana will find a way to make them pay - through court or in some other way. It's mesmerizing how them both, she and Plushy, say that that they parted ways with Alyona on good terms. And then - here we go, her mother has contractual obligations and a debt. They are not wrong - they are a commercial club that provided services to Alyona. I wonder if results is a factor in the contract. Probably not. Otherwise, Yana and Plushy would need to pay to Alyona and her mother.

That’s what I said above - sounds like a countersuit situation.

 

[BittyBug]

This has been discussed for some time - there is no contact system, similar to American, in Russia. Not in figure skating, at least.

The PSA rules apply to any coach / student relationship - there does not need to be a contract involved. The rules are to ensure that a skater does not leave behind debts.

 

[Skibean]

I guess I don’t see how Plushenko is being painted as the bad evil villain here. It sounds as if her mother signed a contract with Plushenko. Did the mother not read the terms of this contract before signing?

 

[Stephanie]

Aren't a lot of these financial issues due to the fact that Alyona changed clubs outside of the normal Russian transfer window (May)? Therefore she still represented Sambo and the money due to her as a national team member was sent to Sambo? Plushenko spoke of having to use/arrange sponsors to pay for her training costs and/or programs.

 

[love_skate2011]

I guess I don’t see how Plushenko is being painted as the bad evil villain here. It sounds as if her mother signed a contract with Plushenko. Did the mother not read the terms of this contract before signing?

the mothers fault, not Plushenko. There is nothing free, they signed a contract. Not a Charity.

 

[Cherub721]

I hope i am answering what you're asking: Aleona is under-aged, and the contract (per Rudkovskaya) was signed by Aleona's mother, an adult.

What I meant was why is Yana saying the club that takes her must pay? I would think that she, or her mom, would be responsible for fulfilling that contract and could be sued personally. Why should the club pay? For example if one federation has to release a skater to compete internationally, the other federation often ends up paying because the skater can't afford it, and the release is required by the ISU in order for them to skate. So does AoP somehow have to release her from the contract before another club can take her? Or can she go skate for another club and settle her debts on her own?

 

[_Lola_]

Yana knows this stuff, she works in the PR Department and is a millionaire, indeed Aliona made a big mistake making a deal of the devil. its like a rug newbie taking on Miranda Priesley.

She is a showbiz shark - producer and director. She and Plushy are major figures who are transforming figure skating from sports to business.

 

[hanca]

I noticed that Plushy never takes responsibility. Neither he wants to take it for what is happening in his club. Anyway, he paid for 4 out of 6 programs. I guess, by doing so he was a part of this decision anyway.

How do you know Pluschenko paid for the last two programs? Her family could have funded it, or even she could have funded it herself, if she saved some of the price money she won last year. She won quite a lot competitions, so I wouldn’t be surprised if she could afford to pay a choreographer for a new program (if her parents were not willing to pay). Saying that, I heard that her family is quite well off, so even the family could have paid it.

 

[hanca]

This may be a countersuit. AK’s parents may have demanded certain conditions & results from Plush/AoP in exchange for moving their talented child to AoP. This is a lawyer’s paradise, when big business is involved.

This is Russia, not USA.

 

[love_skate2011]

She is a showbiz shark - producer and director. She and Plushy are major figures who are transforming figure skating from sports to business.

they cant, Not unless there will be no more Eteri. This will send very bad message to new skaters they want to poach or recruit, parents will think twice now of going to Plushenkos rookie academy.

 

[hanca]

This entire thing is becoming so disgusting.

I knew that it won’t be friendly divorce. And it will get even worse when they follow it (both of them -Aliona and Pluschenko ) with an interview of their own experience of hell...

 

[_Lola_]

How do you know Pluschenko paid for the last two programs? Her family could have funded it, or even she could have funded it herself, if she saved some of the price money she won last year. She won quite a lot competitions, so I wouldn’t be surprised if she could afford to pay a choreographer for a new program (if her parents were not willing to pay). Saying that, I heard that her family is quite well off, so even the family could have paid it.

Plushy told himself that he paid in one of his last interviews. He also said that Alyona can keep the programs for herself: "Программы, которые были поставлены Ше-Линн Бурн, остаются Алёне. Я действительно потратил большие суммы. Ну ничего, бывает, всё нормально" (Programs choreographed by SLB are left with Alyona. I indeed spent large sum of money. Well, this happens, it's ok): https://www.sport.ru/figurnoe_katan...ornaya-svobodna-vse-programmy-/article474452/

 

[hanca]

Plushy told himself that he paid in one of his last interviews. He also said that Alyona can keep the programs for herself: "Программы, которые были поставлены Ше-Линн Бурн, остаются Алёне. Я действительно потратил большие суммы. Ну ничего, бывает, всё нормально" (Programs choreographed by SLB are left with Alyona. I indeed spent large sum of money. Well, this happens, it's ok): https://www.sport.ru/figurnoe_katan...ornaya-svobodna-vse-programmy-/article474452/

He said he paid for programs, but did he say he paid for the last two? He definitely has paid for the ones she got when she came to his school.

 

[_Lola_]

He said he paid for programs, but did he say he paid for the last two? He definitely has paid for the ones she got when she came to his school.

Could be both ways, right? What are you trying to say, by the way? Are you trying to say that Alyona herself had control over her training process and she herself decided to get two new programs in the middle of the season, in addition to other 4? I wouldn't be surprised if this is the case. Exactly this I find problematic. It is sad if her coaches didn't have authority and a say in her decisions. I also think it's Plushy's position of choice - not to take any responsibilities. They provide services - skaters bare responsibility. This probably sounds normal to an American or a Western European? But it's not how it normally works in the country where government pays for sports.

 

[hanca]

Could be both ways, right? What are you trying to say, by the way? Are you trying to say that Alyona herself had control over her training process and she herself decided to get two new programs in the middle of the season, in addition to other 4? I wouldn't be surprised if this is the case. Exactly this I find problematic. It is sad if her coaches didn't have authority and a say in her decisions. I also think it's Plushy's position of choice - not to take any responsibilities. They provide services - skaters bare responsibility. This probably sounds normal to an American or a Western European? But it's not how it normally works in the country where government pays for sports.

Yes, that’s exactly what I am saying. That’s what happens when you let young, inexperienced coach like Sergei Rozanov in charge of a skater with a strong personality. I can quite easily imagine that it could be what had happened. Why would Pluschenko pay from his own money yet another programs if he didn’t agree with her changing them? He did say he paid from his own money for programs, but he didn’t say which programs. He could have paid for program number 3 and 4, and her number 5 and 6 could easily be her own arrangement with choreographers.

 

[_Lola_]

Yes, that’s exactly what I am saying. That’s what happens when you let young, inexperienced coach like Sergei Rozanov in charge of a skater with a strong personality. I can quite easily imagine that it could be what had happened. Why would Pluschenko pay from his own money yet another programs if he didn’t agree with her changing them? He did say he paid from his own money for programs, but he didn’t say which programs. He could have paid for program number 3 and 4, and her number 5 and 6 could easily be her own arrangement with choreographers.

If this is true, it only proves that Plushy outsources responsibility.

 

[Tinami Amori]

How do you know Pluschenko paid for the last two programs? Her family could have funded it, or even she could have funded it herself, if she saved some of the price money she won last year. She won quite a lot competitions, so I wouldn’t be surprised if she could afford to pay a choreographer for a new program (if her parents were not willing to pay). Saying that, I heard that her family is quite well off, so even the family could have paid it.

Because Pluschenko said (in one of the earlier interviews i posted) that he paid a lot of money for her programmes and mentioned SLB.

What I meant was why is Yana saying the club that takes her must pay? I would think that she, or her mom, would be responsible for fulfilling that contract and could be sued personally. Why should the club pay? For example if one federation has to release a skater to compete internationally, the other federation often ends up paying because the skater can't afford it, and the release is required by the ISU in order for them to skate. So does AoP somehow have to release her from the contract before another club can take her? Or can she go skate for another club and settle her debts on her own?

She said that which ever club takes her must pay them back, and later she added or somebody (private sponsor), that they are a commercial entitity.

At the same time, Pluschenko (earlier) said that Aleona has no contract, even if they spent lots of money on her, she can keep the programmes. Then Yana corrected, no contract with Aleona, but an agreement signed by her mother. And Yana does want money back. At the same time she said "when talking to Aleona and Mother, we're all friendly, we're all smiling"...

 

[hanca]

Because Pluschenko said (in one of the earlier interviews i posted) that he paid a lot of money for her programmes and mentioned SLB.

But that could have been her FS from when she came there, done by SLB. The one Wayward sister/Dance for me Wallis/The cheek of nigh/Abdication.

 

[Tinami Amori]

But that could have been her FS from when she came there, done by SLB. The one Wayward sister/Dance for me Wallis/The cheek of nigh/Abdication.

That's is 1 SLB's programme, and then there is new one (for the Rus. Cup. Finals), so at least 2 x $10,000 = $ 20,000. I don't know what's true what's not in that camp, only quoting what Pluschenko says to the press.

 

[hanca]

If this is true, it only proves that Plushy outsources responsibility.

How come? If you are the head coach and you learn that some student in your school wants new program (even though you paid already for two programs from your own pocket AND you don’t believe it is a good strategy for her to have new programs), would you pay for them? I wouldn’t, and I wouldn’t blame him for refusing to pay for new programs in these circumstances!

 

[Tinami Amori]

The situation is now a meme....

"Here is a great talent. When Tutberidze turns away, grab her and ran".

imgur.com

Discover the magic of the internet at Imgur, a community powered entertainment destination. Lift your spirits with funny jokes, trending memes, entertaining gifs, inspiring stories, viral videos, and so much more from users.

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"Money and Promisses"

imgur.com

Discover the magic of the internet at Imgur, a community powered entertainment destination. Lift your spirits with funny jokes, trending memes, entertaining gifs, inspiring stories, viral videos, and so much more from users.

imgur.com

"Here is MY list of demands"

imgur.com

Discover the magic of the internet at Imgur, a community powered entertainment destination. Lift your spirits with funny jokes, trending memes, entertaining gifs, inspiring stories, viral videos, and so much more from users.

imgur.com

 

[_Lola_]

How come? If you are the head coach and you learn that some student in your school wants new program (even though you paid already for two programs from your own pocket AND you don’t believe it is a good strategy for her to have new programs), would you paid for them? I wouldn’t, and I wouldn’t blame him for refusing to pay for new programs in these circumstances!

This discussion goes nowhere. Let's agree to disagree.

 

[yeslek]

I guess I don’t see how Plushenko is being painted as the bad evil villain here. It sounds as if her mother signed a contract with Plushenko. Did the mother not read the terms of this contract before signing?

Right. I guess I’m confused why people think plushenko shouldn’t get paid for his work?

 

[Frau Muller]

This is Russia, not USA.

True...but this sort of thing is prominent among the New Russian class.

 

[Ananas Astra]

Right. I guess I’m confused why people think plushenko shouldn’t get paid for his work?

The federation usually pays the coaches IIRC. Since Alena switched to him in July only, when the time-frame for switching coaches was wayyyy over, her funding went to Sambo-70, but her training had to be paid for as well. So I imagine, Plushenko paid for it and all those programs and costumes and who knows what else.
Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[hanca]

This discussion goes nowhere. Let's agree to disagree.

This discussion goes nowhere only because you are determined to find at least some fault on Pluschenko, and you are getting desperate. If you inject at least tiny bit of objectivity into it, suddenly you may realise that even though he might be a jerk (I am not going to argue about that), that doesn’t mean that he is to blame on the situation with Kostornaya. She was training at his rink for the whole season, even though technically she belongs still to Tutberidze’s school so he got no funding for her at all. He financed her definitely two programs (and possibly 4, according to you, even though I doubt that he would be silly enough to pay for the last two if he didn’t agree with her having them!) So what exactly are you finding wrong on him this time? (Besides him being a jerk?)

 

[giselle23]

In order to medal, she'll need the two axels 3A-3T , 3A and a quad.

more like since Kotornaia isnt an adult, the mistake is from her mother signing it but not reading the contract properly.

 

[Scott512]

Kostornaia just had one of those worst case scenarios, but its not the first one, look at Tuks struggles and she endured it for many years, Tuktamysheva battled weight gain from 2013 to 2018 !!

She needs to make a goal at least to make the 2022 Olympics, make it or break it if she can hold into that goal.
Kostornaia cant get lower than this season: massive weight gain, growth spurt, injury, changing coaches, new programs, covi.

It's an unbelievable amount of changes and difficulty to overcome.

 

[ChiquitaBanana]

I do agree with you partially, but one must be careful not to make allowances to the extreme. Children are taught from young age what is right and what is wrong. Intelligent person (which Kostornaya seems to be) should be able to distinguish right from wrong. Kostornaya is 17, it is not as if she was a 5 year old kid. If she is selfish or arrogant at 17, she will not miraculously stop being selfish or arrogant as soon as she turns 18, just because she legally became adult. So making too much allowances for a 17 year old can lead to having a world full of selfish people, who were never taught the proper values because everyone was making allowance (because they were ‘only’ children...until suddenly they were not children any more). While I understand that she is still a teenager and teenagers make mistakes, at the same time people learn by consequences and her behaviour was such that she deserves whatever comes to her way. She must have known at her age that talking badly about her past coaching situation would come back to her and bite her. We are not talking about just not bringing flowers, we are talking about publicly criticising someone and publicly talking about someone in a negative way -that’s not just a mistake. This is being nasty and do it publicly. It is unreasonable to expect that it will just go away because she was a teenager. She is old enough to go to war, old enough to be criminally responsible, old enough to get married with parental consent, so she should be old enough to know when to shut up (or to be more diplomatic) or she will have to experience the consequences. And hopefully she will learn, or not learn and experience the consequences again...and again. Until she learns.

We totally agree here. My point was that life or other people around her will take care of her. Not skating fans who don’t know her and the full story.

One may say she seems to have a bad temper or that she is hard to coach and maybe that explains her present path. Then, to write 22 posts about how brat she is when she didn’t do anything to you... Move on!