Royalty Thread #9. Welcome Archie, the red headed heir, don’t care!

[once_upon]

Huh, I didn't get the racism comment with the back of the bus statement
Guess I'm pretty naive or dense or both

 

[AxelAnnie]

Wow.

Sad but true. It is the British Monarchy and there is an order to it all. Not judging, just saying.


IB Times

Meghan Markle, the new Duchess of Sussex, has to curtsy to Catherine, Duchess of Cambridge, as well as other senior royals. Prince Harry’s new wife may be getting on well with Kate Middleton, but that doesn’t mean they are equals.

Although both are duchesses and each is married to a born prince, Kate, as Prince William’s wife and as a future Queen consort, outranks Meghan. British royalty takes the Order of Precedence very seriously, and therefore everyone, including the newly joined member Meghan, must abide by the rules of the royal family.

Hello Magazine

All eyes were on the Royal Family as they took their spots on the Buckingham Palace balcony for Trooping the Colour over the weekend. While the Cambridge kids certainly stole the show (it was Prince Louis's balcony debut!), eagle eyed royal watchers noticed how far Prince Harry and Meghan were standing from Prince William and Kate – and there’s a reason.

Cheat sheet

Since Kate Middleton married Prince William, and he is higher up on the line of succession, the two always walk and stand ahead of Meghan Markle and Prince Harry. That’s why you often see Meghan Markle slightly behind the Duchess of Cambridge during those iconic balcony shots.

Although people are fascinated with and want to see Meghan.............the rules are the rules. And the Queen is VERY clear.

 

[Japanfan]

Really - you bring race to the discussion. Moron! You are what is wrong with so much of the world.

The poster was clear that she was being sarcastic.

And the poster to whom that poster was responding explained what she meant - her comment was in reference to protocol.

Although both are duchesses and each is married to a born prince, Kate, as Prince William’s wife and as a future Queen consort, outranks Meghan. British royalty takes the Order of Precedence very seriously, and therefore everyone, including the newly joined member Meghan, must abide by the rules of the royal family.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Send her to the back of the bus! (and yes that is sarcasm)

You just might want to look at the definition of sarcasm

 

[AxelAnnie]

Huh, I didn't get the racism comment with the back of the bus statement
Guess I'm pretty naive or dense or both

Maybe young.

 

[ballettmaus]

I'm not entirely sure what the royal hierarchy has to do with the split of the foundation. The article that was linked didn't mention anything about any differences between the four or that Meghan was having difficulties adjusting. It seems to be pure speculation and therefore, the comment in question seemed quite condescending.

 

[taf2002]

I think Meghan (and the rest of the world) knew about the

hierarchy before she even met Prince Harry. It was not a new concept that William is older than Harry & thus the heir to the throne. She couldn't have been confused about the fact that W&K plus their kids had precedence over Harry & now her. To accuse her of petulance or jealousy now is ridiculous. If it had mattered so much she wouldn't have married him.

​

 

[ballettmaus]

I like to believe she married him out of love and not his proximity (or not) to the throne.

 

[PDilemma]

I think Meghan (and the rest of the world) knew about the
hierarchy before she even met Prince Harry. It was not a new concept that William is older than Harry & thus the heir to the throne. She couldn't have been confused about the fact that W&K plus their kids had precedence over Harry & now her. To accuse her of petulance or jealousy now is ridiculous. If it had mattered so much she wouldn't have married him.

But she knew nothing about him or the royal family, remember? She just wanted to know if he was "kind".

 

[canbelto]

Am I the only one who finds the idea of royal foundations in general to be odd? I guess I don't really know what any of them actually do. And I'm not sure what the day to day management of these foundations is like. I understand why they set up a foundation but I'm just never sure what the point of these foundations are.

 

[PDilemma]

I believe that it is basically to financially support their charitable endeavors.

The stuff about how this split was necessary before William becomes Prince of Wales because of their very different future roles, etc...is nonsense. Guess who has a much larger charitable foundation? The current Prince of Wales. And it has been determined by those who care to analyze such things that there is no conflict of interest if Charles's foundation continues to operate just as it is when he becomes king. It is expected that he will continue to operate it as he does now. If their different future roles meant that Harry and William could not work together on charitable endeavors for the long term, the foundation would not have been set up as it was in the first place. Their grandmother was 83 the year they founded it. Everyone knew, just as well then as they do now, that it is sooner rather than later that William's role in the monarchy will change.

 

[Lorac]

William, Kate, Harry, and Meghan to split charity foundation. It will now be the Royal Foundation of the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge. The Sussexes are expected to form their own by the end of the year.

Harry and Meghan split from William and Kate joint charity

The Duke and Duchess of Sussex are leaving the Royal Foundation set up by Harry and William in 2009.

www.bbc.com

I always wondered why the added Meghan to this foundation. The time to split would have been when Harry got married. It would have seemed natural then and certainly makes sense given that Harry and Meghan may want to focus on different things. Now it fuels the feud rumours.

I totally agree the more logical point to split would have been just after the wedding but maybe they really thought it would work out. However - and I know some will not agree - I don't think Meghan is a team player per say and has found to difficult to work within the structure of the foundation which requires the principles to work together. I get the impression that she moves forwards very quickly with her ideas and passions and that probably is where issues have arisen as I suspect William and Kate like to be more sure before making decisions. She clearly has her passions and wants to work with them and stepping out of the current royal charitable foundation will make that easier for her as well as Harry.

It will be interesting to see what aspects of the current foundation William and Kate move forwards with - conservation and early childhood development are 2 things mentioned in the press. I believe Mind and mental health issues will still be issues both couples will address - again it will be interesting to see how that splits!!!

It is sad that this split has just fuelled the feud rumours and the rather formal birthday wish from Harry and Meghan to Wills yesterday didn't really help that either. Hopefully this separation of foundations allows both couple to be exactly who they are as they move forwards on their respective paths.

 

[canbelto]

A lot of the royal writing about W&K's future in the royal family is really out of touch. For instance they act as if William and Kate will be all about doing the royal wave on balconies and attending state banquets. Some are fretting that Kate hasn't been gifted enough jewelry from the royal vault, like Kate is just going to need a diamond-encrusted tiara every day. And of course, their foundation has to change into soft-focus topics.

In truth that hasn't been what the monarchs do for a long time. Queen Elizabeth does do her ceremonial and diplomatic duties but she also has many day-to-day engagements that are not super duper glamorous at all. Charles has even less patience for pomp and circumstance, and I don't see William gravitating towards that sort of thing either.

 

[Lorac]

A lot of the royal writing about W&K's future in the royal family is really out of touch. For instance they act as if William and Kate will be all about doing the royal wave on balconies and attending state banquets. Some are fretting that Kate hasn't been gifted enough jewelry from the royal vault, like Kate is just going to need a diamond-encrusted tiara every day. And of course, their foundation has to change into soft-focus topics.

In truth that hasn't been what the monarchs do for a long time. Queen Elizabeth does do her ceremonial and diplomatic duties but she also has many day-to-day engagements that are not super duper glamorous at all. Charles has even less patience for pomp and circumstance, and I don't see William gravitating towards that sort of thing either.

What royal writing are you talking about - I haven't read anything like that in regards to Kate and Wills going all soft focus - whatever the heck that means. Most royal engagements are not pomp and circumstance and haven't been for a long time and I don't see anyone reporting that Kate and Wills will change that or their approach. In fact I suspect Harry and Meghan who will change their approach and I have a horrid feeling they will go more Hollywood on us - which would be awful!!

 

[canbelto]

Most every article has talked about how William and Kate's charities have to be more "restrictive" once they become King and Queen. Which ... why?

Meghan and Harry split from joint charity with William and Kate | CNN

Meghan and Harry are formally splitting from the Royal Foundation, the body that co-ordinates their charitable work with William and Kate, the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge, it was announced Thursday.

www.cnn.com

 

[Lorac]

^Well that's the first time I've seen someone say Kate and Will need to be more restrictive - most articles I've seen just say the couple are going in differing directions. I don't see Kate and Wills dropping anything they currently do and no-one said they were restrictive then and they are looking to develop more initiatives that address environmental issues - an important and somewhat divisive issue for some.

 

[canbelto]

It's in many articles. Here's another one which mentions how in the future William and Kate have to be more "restrictive":

Meghan Markle and Prince Harry 'Have More Flexibility' in Their Charitable Work Than William and Kate

Meghan Markle and Prince Harry split from Prince William and Kate Middleton in Royal Foundation work

people.com

 

[AxelAnnie]

I think Meghan (and the rest of the world) knew about the
hierarchy before she even met Prince Harry. It was not a new concept that William is older than Harry & thus the heir to the throne. She couldn't have been confused about the fact that W&K plus their kids had precedence over Harry & now her. To accuse her of petulance or jealousy now is ridiculous. If it had mattered so much she wouldn't have married him.

Of course she knew who was older. What she may not have know is how that distinction played out. Meghan made a huge splash and is/was quite popular. No matter that, her status in the family is behind Kate. Quite literally. I am now sure she knew that she and Kate would not be equal. Things like standing behind Kate, not having the same access to the Royal Jewels, would/could be quite galling.

Being American, and an actress, with all the red carpets, autographs, and Hollywood fame would not prepare someone who is brought up in Britian and is not only familiar with but a part of the British heirarchy.

 

[mag]

I suspect most of what has been written about the split is simply stuff made up to fill column inches. As mentioned above, there really is no reason for split unless the principals are not getting along/can’t agree on the direction they should go or how decisions should be made.

It would also not surprise me one bit if Meghan was finding it all quite restricting. Royal calendars are usually worked out a year in advance to give time for proper security planning, coordination among family members, and research and preparation. I imagine that long view could be difficult for someone used to a shorter decision cycle. It will be interesting to see how it works out. Harry and Meghan will have a little more flexibility especially as William and Kate’s kids grow up, but not nearly as much as I suspect, at least Meghan, will want. While I am sure there are some things that could be changed for the better, when dealing with a large organization like the BRF which relies heavily on the loyalty of long time staff, stability, and traditions, Meghan is going to have to learn the rules and then be very selective about the ones she tries to change.

 

[Lorac]

It's in many articles. Here's another one which mentions how in the future William and Kate have to be more "restrictive":

Meghan Markle and Prince Harry 'Have More Flexibility' in Their Charitable Work Than William and Kate

Meghan Markle and Prince Harry split from Prince William and Kate Middleton in Royal Foundation work

people.com

Well this article from the Telegraph doesn't use the word 'restrictive' which is in quotes in both articles you quote.

Royal Foundation Split

The decision was confirmed in a trustee meeting on Wednesday, attended by Prince William and Prince Harry. Sources pointed towards the "divergent paths" of the two brothers, with one destined to become Prince of Wales and then King, while the other has more freedom to forge his own working life.

So clearly people are taking what a source says and putting their own slant on it - as here it implies one has more freedom so therefore some have decided that the other must be 'restrictive'.

I don't see William and Kate restricting themselves - they will continue on as they have been which is a credit to themselves and the monarchy.

 

[aftershocks]

I don't think Meghan is a team player per say and has found to difficult to work within the structure of the foundation which requires the principles to work together. I get the impression that she moves forwards very quickly with her ideas and passions and that probably is where issues have arisen as I suspect William and Kate like to be more sure before making decisions.

Film at 11 on Lorac planet.

I don't think Meghan is a team player per say and has found to difficult to work within the structure of the foundation...

Right, this is surely why Meghan was successful working as part of the very talented and cooperative cast of Suits for seven seasons. And it has to be why Queen Elizabeth passed on two of her major patronages to the Duchess of Sussex earlier this year, along with naming the Duchess of Sussex as Vice-President of the Queen's Commonwealth Trust.

Woozy woo wah Aunt Mamie Sue hah at some of the comments on here. Some of you actually rival the British tabloid media.

 

[aftershocks]

I suspect William and Kate like to be more sure before making decisions.

Hmmm, ya don't say. Well whaddya know. I've heard it straight from Robert Jobson in the Daily Mail or Daily Fail, as you please, that King, ahem Prince William The Duke of Cambridge likes to be surrounded by 'yes' sycophants and that he refuses to listen to any advice from Prince Charles or Queen Elizabeth II, much less does he honor his brother and spare Harry, The Duke of Sussex's two cents. William does tend to listen to his Middleton parents-in-law however, while taking wife Kate for granted, along with his king-in-waiting heir-apparent stature, naturally.

Sources for this gossipy truth-telling or yarn-weaving will never reveal themselves. And the British royal family's p.r. image machine has been working over time in recent months to clean up the waft of William misbehavin' rumors that have been making the rounds on Twitter and other media outlets. Meghan being made fair game in the media for months while she was pregnant had a boomerang effect. Mud-throwing never serves anyone well.

ETA:
As far as the Royal Foundation split The brothers formed it in 2009, two years before Wiliam and Catherine's marriage. With Harry's creation of Sentebale in 2006, combined with other charitable endeavors both brothers were interested in sponsoring and funding, the formation of their foundation was necessary. And the Royal Foundation served its purpose until both of their lives, focuses and interests began to diverge.

The brothers have always been teasing rivals who have supported each other in good times and bad. But they've always had a sibling rivalry with Harry going along (not always happily) with being the fall guy for their mutual adolescent antics. Harry was also cool with being the third wheel behind William and Kate for a time. After Harry meeting his soul mate, coming into his own more fully and wishing to carve out new directions in his life, it's only natural that the Royal Foundation as an umbrella for the charitable interests of both brothers is no longer viable. This is especially true in light of William preparing to one day become Prince of Wales.

This heedless blaming of Meghan for existing needs to stop.

 

[mag]

Right, this is surely why Meghan was successful working as part of the very talented and cooperative cast of Suits for seven seasons. And it has to be why Queen Elizabeth passed on two of her major patronages to the Duchess of Sussex earlier this year, along with naming the Duchess of Sussex as Vice-President of the Queen's Commonwealth Trust.

I have no idea if Meghan is a “team player” or not, but none of the examples you have cited prove anything one way or the other. I think @Lorac has a point about Meghan being accustomed to moving more quickly and making decisions on the fly. That is not a criticism. It is simply a different way of operating which may be at odds with the traditions of the BRF. If that is the case (and it certainly seems likely given that not much in this world moves slower than the BFR) it will cause some friction and misunderstandings. Again, nothing wrong with friction and misunderstandings as long as they are dealt with appropriately. Only time will tell if the parties involved have the required skills. Neither Charles nor Diana have ever demonstrated those skills, so William and Harry will not have learned them at home. There is a good chance Kate has them; given her upbringing and the success she has had over the last 18 years. Meghan, well, the jury is still out. Hopefully she can deal with the friction and misunderstandings and help Harry develop those skills. If she doesn’t or can’t it is going to be a bumpy ride!

 

[aftershocks]

...but none of the examples you have cited prove anything one way or the other...

I cited concrete facts that don't need to prove anything.

I think @Lorac has a point about Meghan being accustomed to moving more quickly and making decisions on the fly. That is not a criticism. It is simply a different way of operating which may be at odds with the traditions of the BRF.

Uh huh. Enjoy staying on Lorac's planet then. I'm going to sit back and be entertained by all of the scenarios and commentaries about Meghan you guys come up with in this thread. The fact you seem to think Harry plays little part in the Sussex family decisionmaking is a laugh-a-minute hi-larious.

Only time will tell if the parties involved have the required skills. Neither Charles nor Diana have ever demonstrated those skills, so William and Harry will not have learned them at home. There is a good chance Kate has them; given her upbringing and the success she has had over the last 18 years. Meghan, well, the jury is still out.

Since you and Lorac are so knowledgeable and understand what it takes, maybe William and Harry should hire you and Lorac to straighten everything out and get those loafers up to speed already. Except of course for willowy and wonderfully successful Kate, who needs no help being the classy, well-bred, ever enduring English rose.

 

[aftershocks]

If she doesn’t or can’t it is going to be a bumpy ride!

Luxuriously magical and bumpy, and amazing. From what I've witnessed in Meghan's interviews and speeches, and read in her own words, she's always been very grateful for her many blessings. Let's face it, both Kate and Meghan are some tough ladies who have styles of their own and are nobodies fools. They both walked into their marriages and into the British royal family with their eyes open! It's not for nothing that Meghan has been called 'Tungsten' by her father-in-law.

But keep those patronizing characterizations and condescending scenarios coming. I'm literally

 

[mag]

I cited concrete facts that don't need to prove anything.

You made your comments in response to something @Lorac had written. It certainly appeared like you were trying to make a point. Yes, you stated some facts, but you also stated an opinion about the the Suits cast.

The fact you seem to think Harry plays little part in the Sussex family decisionmaking is a laugh-a-minute hi-larious.

Would you please show me where I said that Harry “plays little part in the Sussex family decisionmaking (sic)?”

But keep those patronizing characterizations and condescending scenarios coming.

Again, if you would please show me where I was “condescending?” I said absolutely nothing negative about Meghan. In fact, I was very specifically not condescending or negative about Meghan. It seems quite reasonable that she would be accustomed to a different sort of decision making and that there would be some growing pains and she and Harry work to find their place as a couple and now a family within the broader BRF. The division of the charitable foundation only a year after Meghan was added certainly indicates that there are some growing pains and resulting changes. Again, not necessarily a negative and in fact could be quite positive. Time will tell. My only negative observation was about Charles and Diana not demonstrating any skill in dealing with friction or misunderstandings. Surely that observation is not a shock to anyone who has even a passing interest in the BRF?

 

[taf2002]

@aftershocks, why is it ok for you to make assumptions based on everything you've heard & read but no one else in this thread is allowed to have an opinion? You don't just disagree, you try to put down the poster as though they are stupid to have their opinions. Talk about patronizing & condescending!

 

[canbelto]

@aftershocks, your devotion to Harry and Meghan is rivaling this instagrammer "elleroseking" who is convinced that she and Harry are secretly married and "they've" taken Harry away and their baby "Jane" away and evil Meghan wants him to become a "leftist" then take him to the United States to become president.

Login • Instagram

Welcome back to Instagram. Sign in to check out what your friends, family & interests have been capturing & sharing around the world.

www.instagram.com

Seriously. You're coming across as a stan.

 

[AxelAnnie]

@aftershocks, why is it ok for you to make assumptions based on everything you've heard & read but no one else in this thread is allowed to have an opinion? You don't just disagree, you try to put down the poster as though they are stupid to have their opinions. Talk about patronizing & condescending!

This the ignore button!

 

[aftershocks]

@aftershocks, your devotion to Harry and Meghan is rivaling this instagrammer "elleroseking" who is convinced that she and Harry are secretly married and "they've" taken Harry away and their baby "Jane" away and evil Meghan wants him to become a "leftist" then take him to the United States to become president.

Login • Instagram

Welcome back to Instagram. Sign in to check out what your friends, family & interests have been capturing & sharing around the world.

www.instagram.com

Seriously. You're coming across as a stan.

Hmmm, you should probably focus more on what you are coming across as...

@aftershocks, why is it ok for you to make assumptions based on everything you've heard & read but no one else in this thread is allowed to have an opinion? You don't just disagree, you try to put down the poster as though they are stupid to have their opinions. Talk about patronizing & condescending!

Right back at you. And ask yourself why you get so hot and bothered by my opinions. I will continue pointing out how I feel and what I disagree with. That my posts make you think no one else is allowed to think differently simply adds to the OTT off-base commentaries in this thread.

Yep Meghan is who she is, and it's so fascinating watching the clusterf*ck going on in this thread, in other royalty related forums, on Twitter, Facebook, tumblr, Youtube, and in the media -- both tabloid and mainstream -- simply because of who Meghan is, where she came from and who she married. There are strange commentaries on all sides that really make me take some serious pause. There's a whole group of people who think they own Meghan, Harry and Archie, juxtaposed by all the OTT haters, and contrasted by a number of folk similar to some of the people in this thread who continuously get all bent out of shape for reasons they will apparently never ever come to grips with.

But yeah, either go back to your lighthearted, fun and worshipful other European royalty-gazing, or get used to the fact that the Duchess of Sussex is a respected member of the British royal family regardless of what detractors, ubers, naysayers, admirers, and haters of all stripes think or say about her. Duchess Meghan is an itch you just can't get away from scratching, but never to yo' full satisfaction.

Meanwhile, carry on with your endless exaggerations and outraged diatribes about my posts too. Par for the course.

Good afternoon royalty aficionados.