Papadakis/Cizeron: Latin dances always look "cheap and cliche"

[Dobre]

I'm presuming no strappy neon dress or tiger outfit for Gabby?

I was just watching Lorraine in her glittery leopard-print Samba earlier this evening. Complete with big-cat roars in the soundtrack. One must not take oneself seriously all the time, IMO.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfDgyptxEXM

 

[VGThuy]

I was just watching Lorraine in her glittery leopard-print Samba earlier this evening. Complete with big-cat roars in the soundtrack. One must not take oneself seriously all the time, IMO.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSpab95C8Qg

Are you saying you want Gabrielle and Guillaume to stop thinking and to just move their bodies, shake their bodies, hot?

 

[starrynight]

I was just watching Lorraine in her glittery leopard-print Samba earlier this evening. Complete with big-cat roars in the soundtrack. One must not take oneself seriously all the time, IMO.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSpab95C8Qg

Ha ha Love it! What fun. I also was a big fan of Kaitlyn Weaver's tiger dress in 2011-2012. Andrew said it was his favourite costume of hers because it made him smile everytime he saw it. Sometimes it's just good to let your inhibitions go and have some fun.

Pechalat/Bourzat had great slightly less out there costumes that season. But very fun and effective though.

 

[Karpenko]

So they made a comment that they don't like Latin dances.

Suddenly, that means their Latin program is going to suck, they'll never become a versatile team, and they'll only ever have their FD niche (only that one thing that works for them)...because they made a comment to the press saying they don't necessarily care for Latin dances on the ice.

You're all waiting with baited breath and need to go hibernate a few months, the season isn't even starting for another 3-4 months. We haven't even heard the music choices yet, let alone seen the damn programs. I effing hate the Olympic season.

Maybe best save all of the energy to shame your fav team's competition/other posters for the Olympic season, and take up a hobby this summer in the meantime.

 

[escaflowne9282]

Their career started in 1998 not 2005-2007.

And your fridge break had a great reptetoire and coaching the students you are godsmacked over.

lmfao. The irony of this is hilarious.

I know their career started in 1998, and I know their repertoire was longer than the programs I mentioned, but I just never found their programs to be that convincing, particularly in their later seasons.

When did I say I was godsmacked over anyone?
I like the present top 2 in the world , and I give Marie-France and Patrice all the accolades for their coaching and technical prowess. They come across as genuinely nice people. I just found them very vanilla when they skated.

I just have yet to see a Latin dance by anyone that I really cared for. Not even A&P's OD from 2000. Even with the most talented ice dancers the movements always look off to me because I just don't find it to be a ballroom style that translates particularly well to the ice.

 

[chapis]

Thank you for posting that. It's how I feel, and far more eloquent. I am. I am not a dancer, but I am Latin, and ballroom Latin is nothing like the Latin dancing I grew up with. It feels completely inauthentic to me.

(I think ice dance could be a big hit in the Latino demographic in the US, but obviously, it's very expensive and not something most Latinos really know anything about)

I don´t follow too much ballroom dance, but when I watch it, there are many russian dancers, I guess they dominate or dominated this style . Russia is really far from Latinoamerica, I guess they adapted the style.

Add. No one has said that P/C SD is going to suck.

 

[Twilight1]

Latin music is some of the funnest music to listen to. It has incredible beat, can be seductive and sensual or fun and fast paced.

To say it is all the same IS lazy and to say they are ALL cheap and cliche is pretty ballsy considering Torvill & Dean did one of the best rhumba's ever.

Not to mention that the sport was around at the Olympics since 1976 and some ICONIC OSP, OD's and SD's dances came about because of ballroom dance.

Sorry but it boggles my mind that they want to compete in a sport involving ice dance but only want to one style.

Maybe grow as a skater people. Maybe expand the horizons, see that your narrow view is actually crazy biased and really ridiculous.

 

[princeton123]

I sort of agree with P/C. So much of Latin dance is based off the movement of your foot on the floor, at all angles, which then comes up through the hip. You can't replicate that movement dynamic when you're on blades and can only move at right angles. You can make it look like you are by moving your core and upper body to give the impression of Latin, but the true movement isn't there. So why choose rhythms that fight the ice surface? Why not choose rhythms that take advantage of the ice? P/C aren't complaining about the various waltz rhythms for example, as far as I can tell.

I mean, if you're Tessa Virtue you can. I don't want to be snarky and just tell everyone else to try harder but..................try harder. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

[VGThuy]

I thought the point of some people's posts were that some people thought that not even Tessa was good at translating it to the ice in the past. She might be one of the best out of the rest but they thought the "best" wasn't really that good.

 

[Twilight1]

Dubreuil & Lauzon skated to an arabian like dance in 1999. Life is Beautiful in 2000, Victorius Titus in 2001, Madame Butterfly in 2002, A specially composed piece in 2003, a Tango in 2004, and Winter Vision in 2005.

Not one was the same...or vanilla. Please explain how those various programs were.

Especially Victorius Titus, the Tango and Winter Vision...

 

[princeton123]

I thought the point of some people's posts were that some people thought that not even Tessa was good at translating it to the ice in the past. She might be one of the best out of the rest but they thought the "best" wasn't really that good.

I mean if people don't think Tessa was a revelation in their 2011 FD (2012 SD I can understand people not liking) and especially in the opening 30 seconds or so, we probably dissent on a very basic level and should just agree to disagree.

 

[Dobre]

Are you saying you want Gabrielle and Guillaume to stop thinking and to just move their bodies, shake their bodies, hot?

Couldn't hurt. But, nope, I was saying that I enjoy a Junior World silver medal performance in a glittery leopard-print samba dress with big-cat roars in the soundtrack very much. I think fun can be greatly underrated in figure skating. Latin SDs are one time when the ability to project and sell, sell, sell a program is genuinely appreciated.

 

[maya1985]

So, they can not have an opinion, they still have the right to have preferences! I do not understand the problem unless it's just to hurt them and say there's much better than them.
Long live hypocrisy, a dancer must be silent, not having an opinion

(This interview (in full) is very interesting, full of maturity and freshness)

 

[aftershocks]

Well, I think that Gaby and Guillaume make some interesting points. I don't completely disagree with them about the difficulty of making some latin dances work well on the ice without looking cheesy or cheap. Not that latin dances can't or haven't been translated beautifully. The difficulty is not the same, but it is somewhat similar to the difficulty of making hip hop work for the ice. And yet even with the difficulties involved, both hip hop and latin (especially latin) have been shown to be possible to translate. I don't agree that all latin dances and beats are the same either.

In any case, it's not as if P/C never performed latin dance on the ice, or can't perform it on the ice. It's just not their style or what they enjoy dancing to.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCE9h3fuWvo JGP Baltic Cup SD 2011
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUpJV1bkTO8 JWC FD 2011

 

[chapis]

So, they can not have an opinion, they still have the right to have preferences! I do not understand the problem unless it's just to hurt them and say there's much better than them.
Long live hypocrisy, a dancer must be silent, not having an opinion

(This interview (in full) is very interesting, full of maturity and freshness)

They can have an opinion, and we can have an opinion about their opinion

 

[Dolore]

If Scott Moir had made the same comments he would be ripped to shreds and years later people would still complain about it but with P/C it's obviously just a preference/opinion

I find it interesting that Gui doesn't like Latin music because it all sounds the same ( it doesn't, no idea what kind of Latin music he's listening to ) when they have been using the same style of music for 3 years in a row. And he clearly stated it doesn't matter to him that they keep recycling the same style, but it's a problem when it is a style that he can't dance to ?

 

[chapis]

If Scott Moir had made the same comments he would be ripped to shreds and years later people would still complain about it but with P/C it's obviously just a preference/opinion

I find it interesting that Gui doesn't like Latin music because it all sounds the same ( it doesn't, no idea what kind of Latin music he's listening to ) when they have been using the same style of music for 3 years in a row. And he clearly stated it doesn't matter to him that they keep recycling the same style, but it's a problem when it is a style that he can't dance to ?

It was Gabriella who made that comment. But the rest of your comment is the same that I thought.

 

[Dolore]

It was Gabriella who made that comment

Same goes for her then because she obviously agrees with Guillaume in their choices of FD music.

 

[escaflowne9282]

I mean if people don't think Tessa was a revelation in their 2011 FD (2012 SD I can understand people not liking) and especially in the opening 30 seconds or so, we probably dissent on a very basic level and should just agree to disagree.

For me Tessa was a revelation in Umbrellas of Cherbourg which is when I first really saw her and Scott. She had beautiful upper body movement wonderful port de bras, I particularly loved the softness of her movements and was impressed that she was able to maintain such fluidity.
Their Latin FD did nothing for me, I thought the middle section dragged and found the ending unconvincing. Although they do have a nice snap to their movements at the beginning.
Give me their SD from that season or their Carmen FD any day.

 

[princeton123]

So, they can not have an opinion, they still have the right to have preferences! I do not understand the problem unless it's just to hurt them and say there's much better than them.
Long live hypocrisy, a dancer must be silent, not having an opinion

(This interview (in full) is very interesting, full of maturity and freshness)

They're allowed to have their preferences. They don't have to piss on everyone else's past programs by saying they all look 'cheap and cliche' though.

 

[maya1985]

They don't have to piss on everyone else's past programs by saying they all look 'cheap and cliche' though.

Sorry but It is you who makes a shortcut there

 

[snoopy]

So would they advocate cutting out all Latin dance requirements? That would be a cop out as this has been a part of ice dance for a long time. The best ice dancers make it work.

And if they do one more smooshy smooshy FD, let's talk about cliche.

 

[thvu]

This thread has turned into a bad Facebook comment thread - so many irrational attacks, so much unaware posturing, so many illogical extrapolations masquerading as logical arguments.

 

[MsZem]

I find it interesting that Gui doesn't like Latin music because it all sounds the same ( it doesn't, no idea what kind of Latin music he's listening to ) when they have been using the same style of music for 3 years in a row. And he clearly stated it doesn't matter to him that they keep recycling the same style, but it's a problem when it is a style that he can't dance to ?

Claiming that Mozart, their 2016 FD music, and the experimental piano piece are all alike makes no more sense than the argument there is no variety in Latin music. I've always found it odd that some V/M fans are so quick to argue that C/Z are one-note skaters, given that V/M were the targets of similarly unfair criticism ("young couple in love" programs in their case) for many years.

I haven't seen any recent Latin ice dance that's wowed me - and that includes V/M's efforts - but maybe someone will come up with something original.

p.s. It was Papadakis who said that Latin music sounds alike to her and that being original is difficult. And Cizeron's name is Guillaume, not Gui. You can copy-paste from my post if typing it is too difficult.

 

[Dolore]

Claiming that Mozart, their 2016 FD music, and the experimental piano piece are all alike makes no more sense than the argument there is no variety in Latin music. I've always found it odd that some V/M fans are so quick to argue that C/Z are one-note skaters, given that V/M were the targets of similarly unfair criticism ("young couple in love" programs in their case) for many years.

I haven't seen any recent Latin ice dance that's wowed me - and that includes V/M's efforts - but maybe someone will come up with something original.

p.s. It was Papadakis who said that Latin music sounds alike to her and that being original is difficult. And Cizeron's name is Guillaume, not Gui. You can copy-paste from my post if typing it is too difficult.

Wow, you are a sunshine, aren't you? Thank you for playing defender of Guillaume's name but almost everybody seems to call him Gui on message boards so until I hear him say that he doesn't want to be called that I'll just keep going and you mind your own business. Do you also get upset when people write Yuzu and Javi or is this specific to Guillaume ?

Not sure what this has to do with VM fans because it's not only them that call PC's programs one note. Various commentators and former ice dancers have also pointed it out. But why bother with what they have to say when you can get a dig at VM fans, right? Believe it or not but some people's opinions aren't clouded by which team's style they prefer.

Too bad for Gabriella that she struggles with the basic requirements of ice dancing but that doesn't mean she has to call other team's programs cheap and cliche.

 

[levineismine]

I actually thought they raised some good points. I don't agree that all Latin music sounds the same, but it's true that some rhythms (hip hop, latin) are more difficult than others (e.g. waltz) to translate on the ice just for the nature of their movements.
I wasn't a big fan of the latin OD a few years ago as it often looked like a 'caricature' (maybe that's what they mean as 'cheap'), just like some of the hip hop did this year.
That being said, I appreciate that there's a diversity of rhythms otherwise it would be waltz and foxtrot year after year. But maybe once again it's time to look at the system and see what can be improved.
I hope P/C come up with a creative SD fitting the requirements while being interesting!

edit to add: I also appreciate when skaters have their own opinions and are not afraid to share them - I don't think they were disrespectful to any of their competitors in doing that.

 

[princeton123]

I don't really understand this logic of "it's really hard and lots of skaters do it badly so we shouldn't have it". Why don't we just eliminate quads and triple axels while we're at it because sometimes skaters fall?

 

[MsZem]

That being said, I appreciate that there's a diversity of rhythms otherwise it would be waltz and foxtrot year after year. But maybe once again it's time to look at the system and see what can be improved.

Bring back CDs, that's what could be improved

 

[Karpenko]

Sorry but it boggles my mind that they want to compete in a sport involving ice dance but only want to one style.

Maybe grow as a skater people. Maybe expand the horizons, see that your narrow view is actually crazy biased and really ridiculous.

Maybe you'll come to terms with your extreme black and white thinking one day, but the reality here is they said they don't necessarily prefer one certain style of dance on the ice.

For whatever reason, you've taken that comment soooo far out of context (they only want to do one style? ) and have become sooo by it that you've decided that they only want to do one style of dance, and competing anything other than their "one style" FD isn't what they want to do in their career, AND you're projecting your own biased view of their style onto them based on one comment about Latin dances on the ice?

Just because they don't care for it doesn't mean they can't end up with one of the best SD's next year does it? Or do you already know their music? Some of you can't wait to pounce on the material we haven't even seen yet, and you're using these comments in this interview as the bait.

Care to come up for air and see the reality of the situation here? You might realize you went a bit overboard with the generalizations, while you're trying to put other people in check. The irony there is hilarious.

Good lord This season we are going to need an exorcist.

*chants to self* Love them both, love them both, love them both... no daggers need to be thrown at V/M, ever, even if their fans drive you crazy, love them both, love them both... (and I'm relaxed again)

 

[teacakes]

Lol I thought this was one of those spoof threads.