Mental Health in Ladies' Skating

[hoptoad]

I believe there are some who are, and who are licensed to treat mental conditions and illnesses, but the field was initially developed by physical education specialists rather than as a branch of clinical psychology, and as a result its focus is on how psychological factors affect performance, rather than on diagnosing and treating mental illnesses in athletes or anyone else. It tends to focus on developing psychological skills that support performance improvement, the mental aspects of injury management and career management, team building etc. If you like, it's more a kind of applied psychology discipline than a clinical one.

You're right. I'm surprised the label "psychologist" isn't more heavily regulated in the US.

 

[Vagabond]

Are there "sports psychologists" who aren't licensed?

Google is your friend: https://www.apa.org/ed/graduate/specialize/sports.aspx

 

[el henry]

In order to call yourself a "psychologist', whether sports, clinical or whatever, in almost every state in the US of A, you must be licensed:

http://www.siop.org/Licensure/sectionIIlicenseneed.aspx

Most states, in order to be licensed (I sure as heck don't know every state), require a graduate psychology degree.

If someone is out there calling themselves a "sports psychologist" without a license, they may be violating state law. And should be reported.

 

[Tinami Amori]

I don't want such critiques and comments to be censored just because a skater might read them. This board is a discussion board, not a fan forum.

It's not even "fan forum" vs. "open discussion board". Skaters/athletes/public figures/etc. most of them post fotos and events on their social media, and their followers make comments to them directly, including very negative ones. If a skater uses social media, he/she will get comments directly, without "forums or chats".

 

[carriecmu0503]

In order to call yourself a "psychologist', whether sports, clinical or whatever, in almost every state in the US of A, you must be licensed:

http://www.siop.org/Licensure/sectionIIlicenseneed.aspx

Most states, in order to be licensed (I sure as heck don't know every state), require a graduate psychology degree.

If someone is out there calling themselves a "sports psychologist" without a license, they may be violating state law. And should be reported.

This person is a well known sports psychologist. Her doctorate is in sports psychology. She is not, nor is she qualified to be based on degree, licensed as a psychologist.

https://www.drsilby.com/

 

[cholla]

Sports psychologists are NOT licensed psychologists and are not qualified to diagnose or treat mental/emotional disorders.

I am a sport psychologist and I am licensed. I was first a clinical psychologist then I specialized in sport psychology. It's not a rare occurence, I've met a lot of sport psychologists who are actually licensed. As such we are qualified to diagnose and treat mental disorders. Nonetheless it's usually better to refer people with severe disorders to psychiatrists and/or someone specialized in the relevant type of disorder. Eating disorders for instance are treated by therapists and/or psychologists who are specialized in this particular field.

You're right. I'm surprised the label "psychologist" isn't more heavily regulated in the US.

It's far worse in France where I live now. You don't even need a degree or to be a member of a registered order. Anyone can be a self-proclaimed "psychologist". Fortunately, most part of time, potential patients are careful enough to check your background. But still, this absence of regulation does not make look the profession good. And it allows a whole wave of "life coaches" and "mental coaches" to make practice of something they are not professionally trained for. Most of them know as much about psychology as I know about breeding llamas...

 

[carriecmu0503]

I am a sport psychologist and I am licensed. I was first a clinical psychologist then I specialized in sport psychology. It's not a rare occurence, I've met a lot of sport psychologists who are actually licensed. As such we are qualified to diagnose and treat mental disorders. Nonetheless it's usually better to refer people with severe disorders to psychiatrists and/or someone specialized in the relevant type of disorder. Eating disorders for instance are treated by therapists and/or psychologists who are specialized in this particular field.

Exactly. Your degree is in clinical psychology. That is why you are licensed. People who get their degree in sports psychology are not eligible to be licensed as psychologists or to diagnose/ treat mental and emotional disorders. It is very confusing to the public, and they should not be allowed to call themselves psychologists.

 

[screech]

I said no one should be cruel I think there is a big difference between criticizing someone’s body and a performance.

And a difference between criticizing someone's performance and saying that they are talentless, horrible, and shouldn't be competing.

Saying that someone is too fat, with the implication that it's affecting their performance or how their performance is perceived, is indeed criticizing their performance.

Saying someone is fat is not criticizing their performance, no matter how it is explained. It is criticizing someone's body.

As for sports psychology, depending on the school and program, it could just refer to someone who studied psychology, applied with a phys-ed degree, and is combining the two to work with athletes to work on applying psychological concepts to their performance. I know of some people who graduated with a sports psychology degree, but it was basically a mix of phys ed/human kinetics and psychology (with a few psych classes tailored towards athletics).

 

[Finsta]

I think forums are visited. American skater Hughes coach would post on this board in past and many skaters also. But they choice to check the skating forums. Good bad or not. It is fans that post and love sport and posts opinions

 

[Orm Irian]

Google is your friend: https://www.apa.org/ed/graduate/specialize/sports.aspx

Thanks, that's good info to have for the USA at least (not being American, the APA isn't the first place I tend to look to for specifics!).

 

[Japanfan]

It's far worse in France where I live now. You don't even need a degree or to be a member of a registered order. Anyone can be a self-proclaimed "psychologist". Fortunately, most part of time, potential patients are careful enough to check your background. But still, this absence of regulation does not make look the profession good. And it allows a whole wave of "life coaches" and "mental coaches" to make practice of something they are not professionally trained for. Most of them know as much about psychology as I know about breeding llamas...

I belief you need a Phd in psychology to be a psychologist here.

But Counselor is different. SFAIK you can be a counselor with a MA in psychology and there is actually a three month course that qualifies people for the designation. So it's pretty easy to become a counselor - and buyer beware.

 

[AJ Skatefan]

If someone is out there calling themselves a "sports psychologist" without a license, they may be violating state law. And should be reported.

When I was coming back from US Nationals last year I met a guy on the plane who claimed to be Mirai Nagasu's sports psychologist. He had a name tag of some kind and I looked him up on twitter and he's just some dude who is a figure skating fan. I rolled my eyes.

 

[carriecmu0503]

I belief you need a Phd in psychology to be a psychologist here.

But Counselor is different. SFAIK you can be a counselor with a MA in psychology and there is actually a three month course that qualifies people for the designation. So it's pretty easy to become a counselor - and buyer beware.

Um, no. At least, not in the US. To become licensed as a counselor, one must complete a masters degree that is a minimum of 48 credit hours, though most states require 60 credits. There is no quick easy path to becoming a licensed counselor in the US. Clinical mental health counseling is a 60 credit program that requires a year of clinical experience. One must also pass a state licensure exam. Clinical mental health counselors diagnose and treat mental and emotional disorders.

 

[Japanfan]

Um, no. At least, not in the US. To become licensed as a counselor, one must complete a masters degree that is a minimum of 48 credit hours, though most states require 60 credits. There is no quick easy path to becoming a licensed counselor in the US.

I'm in Canada. And I know a person who went through the three month program to become a counselor - which is not the same thing as a counseling psychologist.

In addition, requirements for 'counselor' may differ by province.

 

[carriecmu0503]

I'm in Canada. And I know a person who went through the three month program to become a counselor - which is not the same thing as a counseling psychologist.

In addition, requirements for 'counselor' may differ by province.

In the US, counselors are not the same as a counseling psychologist. Counseling is a distinct prifession, and there is zero way to get licensed as a professional counselor in three months. I seriously doubt anybody can become licensed to be a counselor and diagnose/ treat mental and emotional disorders in three months in Canada or anywhere else in the world.

And here you have it. Canada requires a masters degree for counselors. https://www.ccpa-accp.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/CertificationGuide_EN_2017.pdf

 

[Japanfan]

In the US, counselors are not the same as a counseling psychologist. Counseling is a distinct prifession, and there is zero way to get licensed as a professional counselor in three months. I seriously doubt anybody can become licensed to be a counselor and diagnose/ treat mental and emotional disorders in three months in Canada or anywhere else in the world.

And here you have it. Canada requires a masters degree for counselors. https://www.ccpa-accp.ca/wp-content/uploads/2018/05/CertificationGuide_EN_2017.pdf

The program did exist, Mr. Japanfan remembers it as well - he was studying psychology at the time hoping to do his Masters in Counseling psychology (American spelling for Counseling). He rejected the idea of doing the three month program, thinking it rather useless.

That was over ten years ago, however, and the program is not around anymore SFAIK (not surprisingly).

And yes, you can claim to be a counselor in my province without the certification you mention - as I said, I don't know that the same is true elsewhere in Canada.

This is because there is no college/regulatory body for counselors.

https://www.alongsideyou.ca/difficulties-choosing-counsellor-british-columbia/

Here is the major problem with the counselling profession in British Columbia: because there is no College, you could literally drop out of high school, put up a sign, and call yourself a counsellor. There is absolutely nothing illegal about this, and quite frankly, variations of this are going on far too often. This is why it is very important to know what to look for, and also, why degrees and credentials are important when looking for a counsellor.

 

[cholla]

I belief you need a Phd in psychology to be a psychologist here.

In the US, yes you do.

 

[becca]

And a difference between criticizing someone's performance and saying that they are talentless, horrible, and shouldn't be competing.


Saying someone is fat is not criticizing their performance, no matter how it is explained. It is criticizing someone's body.

As for sports psychology, depending on the school and program, it could just refer to someone who studied psychology, applied with a phys-ed degree, and is combining the two to work with athletes to work on applying psychological concepts to their performance. I know of some people who graduated with a sports psychology degree, but it was basically a mix of phys ed/human kinetics and psychology (with a few psych classes tailored towards athletics).

Exactly. There is a difference between criticizing a performance and the person. And the camera also can tell some lies to I have heard many say that many girls who look bigger on the camera are tiny in real life. I would rather not comment on the skaters bodies since in most cases they all look great and better than most of us anyways. And then you have folks delaying too what is natural the body changes that happen when one becomes a woman.

I imagine though there's what looks great in real life and then there is the shape that is perhaps needed to compete and be an athlete. However considering eating disorders the rest, I would rather have that be conversations between coaches and experts. Seems to me in the case of the skaters words like "competition shape" would be far better than the words "fat."

 

[puglover]

It makes sense that as the technical difficulty increases, the body type needed to be competitive becomes more and more selective. In fact, we now see quads being performed, by girls really, scoring enormous points. I feel for the coaches who walk a very fine line. How do they tell a young woman if she wants to stop coming 10th she needs to be trimmer and sleeker to rotate her jumps without causing an eating disorder? I believe most coaches really care about their skaters and do not want to do them harm. There need to be more conversations but I think they need to start much younger. Nutritional counseling needs to be a necessity like off-ice or choreography. It is too easy to go from eating chicken fingers and fries during the zamboni break - to eating nothing. We need more Meghan Duhamels - not that I think you need to be vegan - but if your body is your instrument it needs the best of care. Not sure how we change things.

 

[AxelAnnie]

It makes sense that as the technical difficulty increases, the body type needed to be competitive becomes more and more selective. In fact, we now see quads being performed, by girls really, scoring enormous points. I feel for the coaches who walk a very fine line. How do they tell a young woman if she wants to stop coming 10th she needs to be trimmer and sleeker to rotate her jumps without causing an eating disorder? I believe most coaches really care about their skaters and do not want to do them harm. There need to be more conversations but I think they need to start much younger. Nutritional counseling needs to be a necessity like off-ice or choreography. It is too easy to go from eating chicken fingers and fries during the zamboni break - to eating nothing. We need more Meghan Duhamels - not that I think you need to be vegan - but if your body is your instrument it needs the best of care. Not sure how we change things.

You tell young people the truth. If the truth is to place higher they need to be more trim....then that is the truth. Telling a young lady that they need to be trimmer does NOT cause an eating disorder. It can contribute to it, but it is not the cause.

I would like to think that a coach or someone in that young ladies life would notice signs. Mental and emotional health go hand in hand.

 

[overedge]

You tell young people the truth. If the truth is to place higher they need to be more trim....then that is the truth. Telling a young lady that they need to be trimmer does NOT cause an eating disorder. It can contribute to it, but it is not the cause.

Yes, it can. It was a gymnastic judge telling Christy Heinrich that she "needed" to lose "a few pounds" that started her on the disordered eating that eventually killed her.

And to all the posters claiming that telling skaters to lose weight is OK if it won't affect their performance - if the skater's weight doesn't have anything to do with their performance or how it's evaluated, then why comment on their weight at all?

 

[screech]

How do they tell a young woman if she wants to stop coming 10th she needs to be trimmer and sleeker to rotate her jumps without causing an eating disorder?

I quit skating when I was 18, weighed just over 90 lbs, and was 5'4. I was the same height and weight and age as another girl at my club, though we had different main coaches. Her coach put her on a strict diet. Mine flat out told me that I could actually do with gaining a bit of weight.

It's amazing how two different professionals can see the same thing and respond to it so differently.

 

[AxelAnnie]

I quit skating when I was 18, weighed just over 90 lbs, and was 5'4. I was the same height and weight and age as another girl at my club, though we had different main coaches. Her coach put her on a strict diet. Mine flat out told me that I could actually do with gaining a bit of weight.

It's amazing how two different professionals can see the same thing and respond to it so differently.

Body type gets thrown into the equation as well. To people of the same height and weight could wear different sizes. Boy - I don't think I ever weighed 90 lbs. And I hope the girl on the strict diet kept healthy.

 

[puglover]

Well, maybe most coaches don't have the training or expertise to deal with these mental health issues. Seemingly innocent and helpful statements from a respected coach can start issues in some people, especially if they are already struggling in some way. I am not saying the coach's comments are the cause - just that they can have an affect on an already sensitive person.