Coughlin's Former Pairs Partner Alleges He Abused Her

[Perky Shae Lynn]

>>>delete<<<

not worth it

 

[UGG]

As the wife of someone who committed suicide, I agree it was a very poor choice of words stated at a very stressful time.

If you don’t create a narrative and make the post about yourself (which it is not, it has nothing to do with you or your family) it’s really not offensive

 

[overedge]

I am NOT saying Gordeeva/Grinkov shouldn't have had their happily ever after relationship. What i am saying is problematic is how coaches and judges want pairs "packaged" as a couple from the time they are paired as kids onwards. They have to have "chemistry." There has to be a "connection." For all who swooned at Tessa/Scott's Moulin Rouge -- watch their juniors programs. They were making the cute lovey dovey faces then too, and judges thought it was adorable. I am saying this relentless desire to package pairs as romantic could lead to boundaries being blurred, and for victims to stay silent as they are part of this heavily promoted "fairy tale on ice" package.

^^This. It's entirely possible for a pair and dance team to have a "connection" and "chemistry" without it being a romantic partnership.

 

[Perky Shae Lynn]

^^This. It's entirely possible for a pair and dance team to have a "connection" and "chemistry" without it being a romantic partnership.

Totally agree. I am not sure what we are arguing about? Personally, I prefer the non-romantic chemistry between partners.

 

[Perky Shae Lynn]

If you don’t create a narrative and make the post about yourself (which it is not, it has nothing to do with you or your family) it’s really not offensive

I think what @judiz was saying is that a generalization of this nature can be offensive to a lot of people. Thus the emotional reactions.

 

[PairSkater12345]

Some crazy opinions our here. You can't tell people where they can live, That they should go to real school (assume vs home school) and that they need a social life.........Mandating skaters stay off social media....yea right...lol

 

[overedge]

Some crazy opinions our here. You can't tell people where they can live, That they should go to real school (assume vs home school) and that they need a social life.........Mandating skaters stay off social media....yea right...lol

You most certainly can tell people where they can live, especially if you're paying for their training and competing. USFS (and other federations) already organizes where skaters stay when they go on trips.

 

[Barbara Manatee]

The wrong is not supporting Bridget (and other survivors) now. In your other posts, you talk a lot about the crazy people being mean to skaters who didn't do much as if that's a reason for them not to do anything now. I think they should "do the right thing" regardless of crazies on social media and that in this case the right thing is to be publicly supportive to those who are saying John abused them.

Supporting the accusers is the right thing to do. But skaters who haven't commented on social media because they believe there are other, better, or more effective ways to do so - they're not wrong.

 

[acraven]

It just made me realize that one of the most revered pairs team that married in skating history had about the same age difference and were competing together at the same age.

In addition to Gordeeva and Grinkov, we have these two examples:

Kovarikova/Novotny: He is 12 years older. They became engaged sometime during the year she turned 18 but married several years later.

Marina Klimova / Sergei Ponomarenko: He is almost six years older. They married not long after she turned 18.

On another subject: Some people seem to be blaming Dalilah Sappenfield for having ignored what was going on between Coughlin and Namiotka. So far as I know, she was never their coach. I think they trained in Delaware. This is not to say that Sappenfield's recent behavior has been appropriate; it has not.

 

[oedipamaas]

I take issue with only ONE thing she said "Nobody innocent hangs themself "

Time to grow up sweetheart, killing yourself doesn't automatically equal guilt. Sadly lots of people take their own life and generally they have done nothing wrong.

As for the rest of it, I can believe it happened and I can see it happening.

(Wasn't Tara Johnny's agent when he had that bizarre sideshow on tv? )

"Sweetheart" is so condescending here, especially directed toward someone brave enough to step forward in light of people like you. And as others have said, she misspoke out of duress. I wish I were surprised that people were latching onto this, and not onto what she is accusing him of.

 

[skatfan]

Which isn't even true, in pairs or in ice dance - Savchenko/Massot were never an item (or Savchenko/Szolkowy, AFAIK), Duhamel/Radford obviously never dated, and I don't recall Totmianina and Marinin being a couple. Davis and White were together since childhood and I'm not aware of the relationship ever being romantic, Papadakis and Cizeron are certainly not a couple, and obviously neither are the Shibutanis.

The whole Olympic podium for pairs was non-romantically involved partners, most of whom were married to other people. The French aren't, neither are Tarasova and Morosov. It really doesn't seem to be the norm for the top pairs.

 

[overedge]

The whole Olympic podium for pairs was non-romantically involved partners, most of whom were married to other people. The French aren't, neither are Tarasova and Morosov. It really doesn't seem to be the norm for the top pairs.

Which makes it even more absurd that commentators emphasize "they're a couple off the ice" so strongly for the pairs that *are* couples.

 

[her grace]

The whole Olympic podium for pairs was non-romantically involved partners, most of whom were married to other people. The French aren't, neither are Tarasova and Morosov. It really doesn't seem to be the norm for the top pairs.

The romantic requirement may well be a relic of the past. Soviet pairs often married because that raised their odds of getting an apartment from the government. Since the Soviets were so successful, they set the norms. But since there isn’t that economic incentive to marry anymore, actual romance is no longer required. Portraying romance in programs is still common, but a lot of other styles of programs are acceptable, too.

 

[gkelly]

You most certainly can tell people where they can live, especially if you're paying for their training and competing.

USFS does not pay significant amounts, if anything, for skaters' training at junior and novice levels when this kind of abusive relationship between partners might be more likely to occur. The minuscule amounts the more successful teams at those levels might earn in envelope funding would be a drop in the bucket compared to the expenses that parents rack up to be able to compete nationally in hopes of international assignments.

Portraying romance in programs is still common, but a lot of other styles of programs are acceptable, too.

The required pattern dances/some of the required rhythms in Rhythm Dances more or less require partners to act out a romantic relationship to portray those dances authentically. For pair skating, and for free dances, there is no need go that route at all.

 

[Rob]

I don't think Bridget meant that all people who commit suicide are guilty of something. I read her comment to mean that she thinks that no-one who has been falsely accused of abuse or illegal activity commits suicide. I don't agree with her on this point (someone who is falsely accused might also be subject to extreme depression), but that doesn't mean that she was not abused. It is impossible for parents to see all of it especially if the guy is likable so that side of him is not apparent. Heck, the parents of many victims of Larry Nassar were IN THE ROOM AT THE TIME!

Regarding romance between partners, I recall one of the commentators complimenting the Kerrs for coming up with unique programs because they were "limited" in subject matter because they were brother and sister.

 

[attyfan]

"Sweetheart" is so condescending here, especially directed toward someone brave enough to step forward in light of people like you. And as others have said, she misspoke out of duress. I wish I were surprised that people were latching onto this, and not onto what she is accusing him of.

Why is it OK for the victim to speak carelessly because she is emotionally upset, but not OK for people who have lost loved ones to suicide to do the same?

 

[ballettmaus]

In addition to everything you've said, I think the USFS, other federations, the PSA, and coaches need to take a much stronger stance on:
-- absolute ban on pairs and dance partners living under the same roof while one is a minor (unless family)
-- real schooling
-- social life / activities outside of skating

I don't think forcing children/teenager to take up activities they may have no desire to take up is the answer. There is no guarantee that they will even make friends in school or at whatever activity it is they have to take up and there is a good chance that they wouldn't have time and/or the (mental) energy for any other activity especially if they attend regular school.

I think it is more important to create an environment at the rink that gives children/teenagers confidence, raises awareness, is supportive of the skater's needs and makes them feel comfortable to say no and/or report any behavior they are not comfortable with.

 

[Lara111]

Is there information somewhere about how exactly he abused her? May be I just missed that. Can someone point me in a right direction?

 

[tony]

Is there information somewhere about how exactly he abused her? May be I just missed that. Can someone point me in a right direction?

The first anyone knew of her being one of the complainants was when she went to Facebook and posted about it the other night. I'm sure, at this point, only her attorney knows the full details.

 

[meggonzo]

Is there information somewhere about how exactly he abused her? May be I just missed that. Can someone point me in a right direction?

Why would we need to know that?

 

[Sparks]

Is there information somewhere about how exactly he abused her? May be I just missed that. Can someone point me in a right direction?

It is grotesque to want to know the details.

 

[overedge]

The required pattern dances/some of the required rhythms in Rhythm Dances more or less require partners to act out a romantic relationship to portray those dances authentically. For pair skating, and for free dances, there is no need go that route at all.

I agree that there is no need, but IMO there is implicit pressure to follow that norm. Otherwise we would be seeing a lot more non-romantic-couple programs. The Shibs and Duhamel/Radford programs stand out for exactly that reason.

ETA: and the Kerrs, as mentioned by @Rob above.

 

[Coco]

I think the poster wants to make her own decision as to whether or not it really constitutes abuse.

That's my charitable take on that comment.

The world is full of high functioning survivors of abusive and/or less that optimal sexual relationships. Some of these people refuse to see relationships that did not involve force/duress but were age inappropriate or involved a power/authority imbalance as abuse.

 

[VGThuy]

Why would we need to know that?

Exactly. It's not like we need to know all of that to stop us from casting doubt about her experiences of being abused. She's already hired an attorney to represent her so I think it's enough to trust that the possible litigation will uncover it to the parties involved.

I mean not knowing the details didn't stop some people from already making all sorts of defenses and turning this thread into something about minors dating those who are close in age, which is not really the issue. I think people think John Coughlin just entered into a healthy relationship like a normal teenaged boy with a teenaged girl. From what Bridget said about her relationship with him causing her trauma, how he did the same with ten other girls, and the fact he was being investigated by SafeSport by at least three different women, we know that is not the case from their end.

The problem is not skaters dating really because let's be real, this is going to happen. These skaters live their social life in the rink and it's sort of like high school, even for older skaters because we know their development is sort of arrested compared to most other people their age who socialize differently (though it still happens outside of figure skating obviously with the way so many in this country and outside have so many issues with ideas of consent...and boy is that another loaded topic). What people are talking about is ensuring that possible romantic entanglements aren't sullied by power imbalances and making the younger party (mostly female so far) feel trapped for a multitude of reasons beyond her control like with financial obligations, obligation to stay in a partnership for skating success, fear of ruining dreams of parents putting so much time, effort, and resources into your career, etc. Let's also talk about feelings of confusion and unsafeness that occurs when you're put in a situation you yourself can't figure out while someone is directing you to be in a relationship. What people want is to make sure young skaters are not put in that situation.

 

[once_upon]

Is there information somewhere about how exactly he abused her? May be I just missed that. Can someone point me in a right direction?

Why do you need to know? She has a lawyer, I presume she was who first talked to Safe Sport. They have enough to say she is credible.

Trying to get statements or links to what she said happened is like wanting to see a train wreck. Somehow people get thrills from that.

 

[Polaris]

I think the poster wants to make her own decision as to whether or not it really constitutes abuse.

That's my charitable take on that comment.

The world is full of high functioning survivors of abusive and/or less that optimal sexual relationships. Some of these people refuse to see relationships that did not involve force/duress but were age inappropriate or involved a power/authority imbalance as abuse.

You're being very charitable. Per previous posts (see below), the poster just wants to dig into the details and look for more ways to discredit the victim (and perhaps the victim's parents as well).

What is not clear to me is why she waited for so long and why she did not leave the abusive partner. I also did not get what exactly he did to abuse her. From my experience, some girls with the help of their mothers are extremely unreasonable and blame the partner for mere fact he exists.

I also need to hear specifics before I am on one or the other side. If he lived with her family how would not family know anything about the abuse that was going on for years? Just does not make sense. Figure skating parents are very involved in their kids lives most of the time.

 

[coppertop1]

Is there information somewhere about how exactly he abused her? May be I just missed that. Can someone point me in a right direction?

Why do you want to know that?That's disgusting Ever wonder why victims don't come forward? Look no further

 

[FSfan107]

I have to say, I am incredibly leery of the line of thinking that teenage guys don't know any better and on the other side that girls mature faster than guys. I was sexually abused at 11 by a 16-year-old who absolutely knew what he was doing. I had no idea what was going on. I was incredibly naive, sheltered, and shy as a teenager, and I wasn't even a skater then. There are plenty of older guys and men who look for younger women to manipulate. I'm not saying that is what happened here.

As others have said, the problem was not just age but the enormous power differential between them. John being the male partner, older, stronger, likely more experienced, etc.

 

[Lara111]

Why would we need to know that?

Why do you want to know that?That's disgusting Ever wonder why victims don't come forward? Look no further

i actually feel bullied for no good reason. Get a life. I asked very legitimate questions. I do need to know what has happened to make my conclusion.

 

[Sparks]

i actually feel bullied for no good reason. Get a life. I asked very legitimate questions. I do need to know what has happened to make my conclusion.

YOUR conclusion doesn't matter. My conclusion doesn't matter.