Ashley Wagner reveals she was assaulted by John Coughlin

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tony

Throwing the (rule)book at them
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17,677
So..Ashley gets it off her chest when John cannot refute her story. I do not call that brave. By not reporting it....she left John free to go do it to someone else. I find that cowardly and self serving.. Kind of like the big named stars who leftvWeinstein free to prey on others.

You sure have a lot of awful opinions.

One day, people (hopefully you) are going to realize that not everyone is the same and not everyone can deal with things in the same manner.
 

insideedgeua

Well-Known Member
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It’s great Ashley had courage to talk about the issue. However, it makes me sad her experiences were needed in order people to take the abuse seriously. If only people would have been as supportive to Namiotka.


You are wrong about this.

I’m not able to give details but the jealous commentator wasn’t Ashley.

The original accuser also wasn’t Ashley.


I believe that Ashley is telling the truth.

But you don’t have the details correct and I can’t share them. It’s unfortunate that the full explanation of this can’t be given but it would put the original accuser (who isn’t a commentator either) in the spotlight. Sorry if that’s confusing but unless the original accuser decides to speak openly, then this part will remain confusing for many. That said, if she wants to maintain her anonymity then that’s her right.
 

UGG

Well-Known Member
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2,437
So..Ashley gets it off her chest when John cannot refute her story. I do not call that brave. By not reporting it....she left John free to go do it to someone else. I find that cowardly and self serving.. Kind of like the big named stars who leftvWeinstein free to prey on others.

It’s not Ashley’s fault he killed himself...maybe he shouldn’t have done that and he could defend himself.
 

insideedgeua

Well-Known Member
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Ashley's point about someone being a good person or you think they are is really an excellent one.

And USFSA ignoring the conditions that makes things like this possible--the parties (where were the adults?! the coaches, the minders, the people supposed to look out for these kids?!), the age gaps, where imo the older skaters are not mature or responsible like actual adults and therefore create situations like this, then USFSA ignoring it...is infuriating. I hope Ashley's recommendations to USFSA are looked into. We have a lot of young people in this sport who are not protected, both girls and boys, from this sort of thing happening because the federation doesn't give a fcuk. They only care about results. As I assume most sports organizations do, sadly.

I'm glad she spoke up.

Well said!
 

Badams

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5,855
So..Ashley gets it off her chest when John cannot refute her story. I do not call that brave. By not reporting it....she left John free to go do it to someone else. I find that cowardly and self serving.. Kind of like the big named stars who leftvWeinstein free to prey on others.
Stop it. Stop putting it on other people when someone is a serial rapist. Not reporting it does NOT make someone guilty of another's actions. This line of thought is disgusting. Stop it.
 

insideedgeua

Well-Known Member
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Drunk teenagers at a house party. That is the problem right there. USFS needs to discourage the party environment at camps and competitions and do way more to educate all of its skaters on what acceptable behavior is. A formidable challenge with groups of young people who want to let loose after intensely stressful situations. There's a reason that the Olympics provides free condoms.

I believe that it happened. I also think it could have been misinterpreted signals.

Greater supervision is required at all levels.

Skaters go away, attend competitions, ‘do their job’ and are then largely unsupervised. Coaches and officials are out socialising, skaters with a wide range of ages, in hotels, after events, party atmosphere and no supervision. It’s bound to lead to some situations that can be avoided.
 

Enchanted

Well-Known Member
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You are wrong about this.

I’m not able to give details but the jealous commentator wasn’t Ashley.

The original accuser also wasn’t Ashley.


I believe that Ashley is telling the truth.

But you don’t have the details correct and I can’t share them. It’s unfortunate that the full explanation of this can’t be given but it would put the original accuser (who isn’t a commentator either) in the spotlight. Sorry if that’s confusing but unless the original accuser decides to speak openly, then this part will remain confusing for many. That said, if she wants to maintain her anonymity then that’s her right.

It was said at the article that Ashley was not one of the original accusers. I was only talking about the public response to Ashley’s interview vs. the hateful response Namiotka got.
 

allezfred

In A Fake Snowball Fight
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65,405
So..Ashley gets it off her chest when John cannot refute her story. I do not call that brave. By not reporting it....she left John free to go do it to someone else. I find that cowardly and self serving.. Kind of like the big named stars who leftvWeinstein free to prey on others.

You are a truly awful human being if that was your first thought when you heard this news.
 

Bigbird

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Greater supervision is required at all levels.

Skaters go away, attend competitions, ‘do their job’ and are then largely unsupervised. Coaches and officials are out socialising, skaters with a wide range of ages, in hotels, after events, party atmosphere and no supervision. It’s bound to lead to some situations that can be avoided.

I want to thank Ashley for coming forward, may others not be overwhelmed by fear and do the same truthfully. #Believewomen.
 

Colonel Green

Well-Known Member
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13,930
People are ripping Kaitlyn Weaver on Ashley's Instagram post. Sigh.
Not that piling on doesn't often go way over the top, but skaters who eulogized Coughlin publicly even though the allegations had by then been reported have to expect some backlash if they aren't going to acknowledge that. I was one of the people interviewing Weaver and Poje after the free dance at Canadian nationals when they made that dedication, and it was awkward.

The parade of red hats at the last US Nationals looked bad at the time, but it looks worse and worse as time goes by.

Though I'm much less concerned about skaters than about people like Dalilah Sappenfield, whose vitriol was truly alarming for someone who is a mandatory reporter and responsible for protecting minors under her charge.
 

Lanie

the uberdom chooses YOU
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7,138
@vesperholly has a point, though. These kids, that's what they are, kids, are largely unsupervised and that does create the atmosphere where things like this can happen so easily because the perpetrator knows nobody is around to stop them. Then add in underage drinking and that kind of thing... It is a very bad environment and USFSA needs to step up and be more responsible--these kids are in their care, aren't they?!
 

insideedgeua

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Not that piling on doesn't often go way over the top, but skaters who eulogized Coughlin publicly even though the allegations had by then been reported have to expect some backlash if they aren't going to acknowledge that. I was one of the people interviewing Weaver and Poje after the free dance at Canadian nationals when they made that dedication, and it was awkward.

The parade of red hats at the last US Nationals looked bad at the time, but it looks worse and worse as time goes by.

I think we also need to take great care in not ‘bashing’ these skaters.

At the time they were mourning someone that they knew as a friend. They clearly didn’t see the same side of John that some women saw.

This must be an awful thing for them too. Many of them are quite young. Many of them would have little experience of losing a friend to suicide. To now see more and more evidence that they didn’t know John as well as they thought must also be confronting and very confusing to them.

There are no winners in this. There are women that were clearly hurt by John. There were young people mourning the death of their friend. At the time these extra facts and stories weren’t available to them. We need to take care now that these skaters aren’t bullied for their initial very emotional reactions.
 

rfisher

Let the skating begin
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Not that piling on doesn't often go way over the top, but skaters who eulogized Coughlin publicly even though the allegations had by then been reported have to expect some backlash if they aren't going to acknowledge that. I was one of the people interviewing Weaver and Poje after the free dance at Canadian nationals when they made that dedication, and it was awkward.

The parade of red hats at the last US Nationals looked bad at the time, but it looks worse and worse as time goes by.

Though I'm much less concerned about skaters than about people like Dalilah Sappenfield, whose vitriol was truly alarming for someone who is a mandatory reporter and responsible for protecting minors under her charge.
I thought it at the time and I still think Sappenfield knew very well what happened in the past and was way more afraid she was going to be caught up in a lawsuit. She was trying to set up a defensive parameter.
 

Habs

A bitch from Canada
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6,236
I think we also need to take great care in not ‘bashing’ these skaters.

At the time they were mourning someone that they knew as a friend. They clearly didn’t see the same side of John that some women saw.

This must be an awful thing for them too. Many of them are quite young. Many of them would have little experience of losing a friend to suicide. To now see more and more evidence that they didn’t know John as well as they thought must also be confronting and very confusing to them.

There are no winners in this. There are women that were clearly hurt by John. There were young people mourning the death of their friend. At the time these extra facts and stories weren’t available to them. We need to take care now that these skaters aren’t bullied for their initial very emotional reactions.

This speaks for me.

rfisher said:
I thought it at the time and I still think Sappenfield knew very well what happened in the past and was way more afraid she was going to be caught up in a lawsuit. She was trying to set up a defensive parameter.

Her words and actions were appalling.
 

MsZem

I see the sea
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18,458
People are ripping Kaitlyn Weaver on Ashley's Instagram post. Sigh.
I understand why people are upset, but Ashley needs support, not internet policing of other skaters.

What signals do you think someone gives that says come and find me in the middle of the night when i'm asleep and take advantage of me?
I'm going to make a very limited defense of vesperholly's comment about misinterpreted signals: it's possible to read it as Coughlin mistaking normal teenage partying for something sexually suggestive. It still leaves him as the person to blame, but it's perhaps more palatable than the alternative.

The alternative is that John Coughlin was a sexual predator who abused multiple girls. And I think it's very clear which alternative the evidence supports.

We now have two women who have come forward, publicly and bravely- Bridget and Ashley. Both are believable. There is zero chance of mistaken identity; both knew him well. Both were teenagers, and of a similar age at the time of the sexual abuse/assault. Bridget says there were multiple other victims, and I suspect she knows what she's talking about. This points to a perpetrator who felt entitled to take what he wants, and was opportunistic in doing so. If anyone chooses to believe otherwise, it is not for lack of compelling testimony.

I hope the US Figure Skating listened to Ashley and is implementing her suggestions, as well as those of experts in preventing a culture of sexual grooming and abuse.
 

Lanie

the uberdom chooses YOU
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7,138
It's outrage culture. The internet brings out the worst in people because they can hide behind a screen and a keyboard and do what they're doing to Kaitlyn or other skaters right now, or whoever they feel should be "canceled". (I hate social media.)
 

Rukia

A Southern, hot-blooded temperamental individual
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21,724
"Mixed signals" and "drunk teens" were at the top of my excuse list. Sad.

I don't care if she took her top off and gave him a lap dance during the party, she was asleep upstairs. She even pretended to be asleep even after realizing what was happening hoping he would stop. THIS IS ASSAULT.

That's it. The end. Full stop. Nothing else matters. And it's clear there was a pattern of behavior there.
 

MsZem

I see the sea
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18,458
This was Ashley's response to Kaitlyn Weaver:
Everybody has their own personal experience with everyone else individually. You can’t point a finger at someone’s response that hasn’t experience what I have. I only want positivity here to everyone else, no one needs to be attacked. Kaitlyn you are truly incredible. I love you too, you are an amazing person and someone I am so lucky to have as my friend ❤️
That's a truly kind and generous statement.
 

Wyliefan

Ubering juniors against my will
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43,977
And now Ashley is coming to Kaitlyn's defense, which is kind of her but the last thing she should have to be doing right now. People really need to get themselves under control and just focus on supporting the person who needs support.
 

Barbara Manatee

Well-Known Member
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2,474
I greatly admire Ashley's courage and I hope she will have all the strength and support she needs in the days ahead.

I'm so angry to see that now she's being attacked on her instagram post for defending Kaitlyn. Who are these self-righteous members of the abuse police that will not allow even the survivors to express an ounce of compassion and understanding? I wonder if they realize they are probably making it less likely that other victims will come forward.
 

puglover

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2,728
One would hope that the take-away from this and other accusations would be that people not rush to judgement. I realize with the death of John, skaters who merely expressed condolences were attacked and that is wrong. There were a few voices, Mervin Tran's comes to mind, that were thoughtful and measured. A non-biased organization such as SafeSport is vital to examine complaints and hopefully they will be given the necessary resources to do their job well.
 

Lanie

the uberdom chooses YOU
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7,138
Yeah. People are already telling Ashley she has no right in telling them how to respond and/or explaining why Ashley is wrong. I get where they’re coming from but I don’t appreciate their tone and need to pontificate to her.

Disgusting, but not surprising. I bet they're all fairly young and spend their time on social media attacking others thinking they are so self-righteous.
 

wickedwitch

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15,993
So I didn't get to write this before the thread on Bridget was closed, but she too was incredibly sweet to me and I'm devastated this happened to her, Ashley, and the other victims.

Regarding the Kaitlyn Weaver thing, skaters who were close to John were put in an incredibly difficult situation. And while many did not handle this situation in the ideal manner, it doesn't make them a horrible person. Max Settlage wrote this in May: https://twitter.com/Max_Settlage/status/1130678381215985666

There are a few people -- like Sappenfield -- I would like to see a public apology from, but that should have already happened.
 

mollymgr

Well-Known Member
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4,052
When there are more than one accusers, it points to a problem. Sometimes, a very big problem. I still can’t believe that the USFS has wanted this to go away. I’m glad Ashley spoke up. I’m also glad that Bridget came forward. And now you know why people are scared to come forward. It is bad enough having to endure the abuse, but having to relive the nightmare of that and defend the backlash from those who doubt them is the most difficult thing to overcome.
 

Meoima

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This is so hard to read. I think Ashley is extremely brave, I hope she will get all the support she deserves. At the same time, it’s so difficult to see people speaking against her like “Why keeping it for so long?”
I have this story. My family had a neighbor who was threw in jail several years ago. For the most part, we never thought too much of him. He was kinda old, he seemed nice and not many people paid attention to him. Later on we saw his name all over the media. Apparently the guy was a pedophile and some of his victims spoke up after 10-15 years so they opened an investigation and the guy was found guilty. He was a big name in the law enforcement and complaints from victims were hidden away. They only came to light eventually when the guy retired. It’s such a disgusting situation. But the guy was throw in jail eventually. Life is complicated, and it’s much more dangerous for sexual assaulted victims. For the most part, if they speak out, they not only place themselves or their careers in danger but also their families.
I am just so sick of the line “why wait for so long?”
I mean? How long is too long? Victims put themselves in danger more when they speak up. Respect them and support them is what we should do, not criticize them for their silence.
 
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