Alysa Liu Switches to Colorado Coaching Team

overedge

Mayor of Carrot City
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Unless some type of abuse I think the parent and skater get to decide what they think is best. Coaches are not exactly neutral and it is a business relationship. I have total respect for coaches but having spent many years professionally working with both coaches and parents the decision making should remain with the parents/skater.

Then - again speaking generally - what do you think federations should do with parents who are convinced that medals are the only indicator of success or accomplishment, and will make decisions based on what they think are most likely to make their children into medalists? Not on the basis of what the athlete/child enjoys or wants to do, or what is best for the athlete/child as a person.
 

clairecloutier

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What makes me uncomfortable is statements from like 5 or 6 different men about what a teenage girl will do and why without even mild lip service being paid to pretending to express what she wants.


Good point here. Alysa has often talked directly with the press. So why are we now getting quotes from Alysa’s dad and coaches but nothing from her?? 🤔
 

4rkidz

plotting, planning and travelling
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Then - again speaking generally - what do you think federations should do with parents who are convinced that medals are the only indicator of success or accomplishment, and will make decisions based on what they think are most likely to make their children into medalists? Not on the basis of what the athlete/child enjoys or wants to do, or what is best for the athlete/child as a person.
you don't think federations measure success by medals? Observe the criteria for team selections, its not based on what is in the best interest of the child? One would hope however the only one guarding what is in the best interest of the child is the parent. from all accounts Alysa is a wonderful young woman? Coaches and associations didn't raise Alysa, so if they think this move is the best move, that is their choice as the parent and the athlete.
 

Marco

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I feel the decision-maker (whether it was Arthur Liu or USFS) probably felt she had sufficient buffer at Nationals so the focus is not that she has 2 months til Nationals, but more like she has 3 months til the Olympics.

Nope. Ask Vincent and Karen in 2018 or even Mirai at 2010.... The judges made their results happen, not the callers.

These skaters weren't the default contenders that needed help so they didn't get the help. Think Flatt and Wagner in 2010, Wagner in 2018 etc. In Wagner's cases, the caller could only help so much.

Now also think Tennell 2020-1. She was hit with <s all season leading to Nationals and suddenly got clean calls all over, only to get <s again at Worlds. I expect the same for Liu this Nationals.
 
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skateboy

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you don't think federations measure success by medals? Observe the criteria for team selections, its not based on what is in the best interest of the child? One would hope however the only one guarding what is in the best interest of the child is the parent. from all accounts Alysa is a wonderful young woman? Coaches and associations didn't raise Alysa, so if they think this move is the best move, that is their choice as the parent and the athlete.
Congratulations on your 13,000th post!
 

mtnskater

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First of all I can see why Alysa has made it clear she has not moved to Colorado Springs. Her family is in Oakland and they are very close. No way at 16 would I want her to permanently move away from them. That is her home.

Before this change I was beginning to wonder if she had the right coaching team. It was kind of a default team due to *********. Massimo did work wonders with her skating skills and I really like the programs he gave her. He is not a jump coach. Jeremy, though a beautiful skater with pretty good jump technique, is unproven as a coach. We do know he was a headcase as a competitor. Though I really loved his overall skating he was so inconsistent. He surely has helped Alysa gain her triples back but she still needs technique work and training to get better GOE and get them fully around. I was never quite sure Jeremy was the one to do that given his lack of elite coaching experience. I also wasn’t too thrilled to have Grassl’s coach work with her in Italy because his jumps are crazy wild technique.

Maybe the new team will help her make strides on that front, but I don’t see how that will happen in six weeks. Arthur admits it is a risk. I don’t think she is at risk of not making the Olympic team though. I’ll keep my fingers crossed for some jump improvements 🤞 Arthur Liu has done a lot of things right with Alysa. She’s a great kid with a great head on her shoulders. She’s joyful and seems to enjoy it all and doesn’t appear to be sweating bullets like so many ladies when she competes. Who knows if ********* hadn’t hit where she would be right now (maybe with Lee and Lori in Canada?) but it changed a lot of plans for her. I just love her, medal or no medal, and find her joyful demeanor such a breath of fresh air in the angsty skating world.
 

topaz

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I really do not understand this decision from Alysa's father. Unfortunately, I don't see this improving her UR issues. More training will lead to more stress on that hip, which will lead to downtime and possibly career ending. She can get a medal from the Team event. She'd be lucky to finish in the top 10 at the Olympics.
 

overedge

Mayor of Carrot City
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you don't think federations measure success by medals? Observe the criteria for team selections, its not based on what is in the best interest of the child? One would hope however the only one guarding what is in the best interest of the child is the parent. from all accounts Alysa is a wonderful young woman? Coaches and associations didn't raise Alysa, so if they think this move is the best move, that is their choice as the parent and the athlete.

The team selection is based on results. Those results may not have been achieved from situations that are in the best interest of the child.

Obviously we're not going to agree on this. But I'll just say, speaking generally again, that what some parents think is in the best interests of their child/young athlete is not what's most constructive for the child/athlete, in the long run or as a well-rounded emotionally and physically healthy person.
 
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VGThuy

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I’m glad I’m not a parent with a child with a public persona. Of course, I also wouldn’t publicly say what Arthur Liu did about intensity of training because that just raises all kinds of yikes, especially for those fishing for that type of thing. That’s all I’m going to say.
 

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico, via Russia - to the World!
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Camp Liu may be more concerned about Isabeau Levito winning Sr Nationals than anything else at this point. The worst p.r. in weeks leading up to an Olympics would be for the top US senior lady to lose to someone who’s too young to go to the Olympics. Hmmm…. I don’t think that it’s a huge possibility but a possibility nonetheless. (Alysa knows better than anyone, as she won her Sr Natl titles when she was too young to go to Worlds.)
 

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico, via Russia - to the World!
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As if we didn’t have enough “takes” on this situation…voila! - TSL’s David Lease-Spletnikov chimes in (As the Blade Turns)! This one is truly entertaining.

 

Brenda_Bottems

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Perhaps Alysa and her father know what's best for her? I mean, given that they've taken her to multiple US championships and a world Junior medal? I don't know, just one possible theory.
The membership of this forum (myself included) literally have hundreds of years of experience and knowledge in figure skating. Our experience,opinions and recommendations shall not be dismissed or erased.

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maatTheViking

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The membership of this forum (myself included) literally have hundreds of years of experience and knowledge in figure skating. Our experience,opinions and recommendations shall not be dismissed or erased.

-BB

I think this is the answer. Before considering any coaching change, partner change, program layout, choreographer, music, costume, or hairstyle, skaters MUST create an FSU poll and adhere by it.
 

Willin

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Expecting Alysa's jumps to noticeably improve in the next 6 weeks is like expecting the USA as a country to immediately improve when a new President is elected.
I'm not sure. I don't think a quad is possible in that timeframe, but clean triples is reasonable. Her triples even as recently as Nebelhorn looked very much around (minus the 3A and the back half of some combos). At the GP she looked slower, tighter, and more nervous that before - which can lead to more URs. If they can get her to build confidence for big international stages I think we could see her UR count drop.
 

Mayra

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I'm not sure. I don't think a quad is possible in that timeframe, but clean triples is reasonable. Her triples even as recently as Nebelhorn looked very much around (minus the 3A and the back half of some combos). At the GP she looked slower, tighter, and more nervous that before - which can lead to more URs. If they can get her to build confidence for big international stages I think we could see her UR count drop.
Then again at Nebhelhorn, it was essentially a hey look at me I'm back type of performance. In the GP, the expectations increased and it now sounds like there was pressure behind the scenes from Papa Liu to perform to a certain level. A level that was not reached.
 

layman

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I'm not sure. I don't think a quad is possible in that timeframe, but clean triples is reasonable. Her triples even as recently as Nebelhorn looked very much around (minus the 3A and the back half of some combos). At the GP she looked slower, tighter, and more nervous that before - which can lead to more URs. If they can get her to build confidence for big international stages I think we could see her UR count drop.
NHK was like her sixth or seventh competition this season. Plus, Alysa has been globe hopping for these competitions...California, Italy, Germany, Italy, Canada, Japan... Maybe she was tired.

She looked a bit slower and she was not going into the jumps with the same kind of speed (at NHK) that she had at the beginning of the season when she was fresh and raring to go. Honestly, I think the loss of speed and the tightness could have been "cured" just with a little rest (and a little time spent at home recharging).
 

Willin

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@layman ITA that she looked exhausted - but she herself say nerves played a role in her problems. But either way I don't think it will be as hard as some posters are saying for her to cure her "UR problem."
 

layman

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@layman ITA that she looked exhausted - but she herself say nerves played a role in her problems. But either way I don't think it will be as hard as some posters are saying for her to cure her "UR problem."
I am sure it will be "cured" at Nationals (by judges looking the other way) but I don't think ISU judges will be as kind.
 

VGThuy

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I mean it's a competition. Medaling is always going to be a crapshoot for most competitors but many medalists were able to medal by NOT listening to what "experts" and arm chair quarterbacks have told them what their limits were and what they were capable of achieving. A lot of times fans know better and are right, but those that actually get up every day and train and compete are the ones who are supposed to fight against the naysayers and prove the rest of us wrong. They do that by thinking bigger than most fans think for them.
 
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4rkidz

plotting, planning and travelling
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The team selection is based on results. Those results may not have been achieved from situations that are in the best interest of the child.

Obviously we're not going to agree on this. But I'll just say, speaking generally again, that what some parents think is in the best interests of their child/young athlete is not what's most constructive for the child/athlete, in the long run or as a well-rounded emotionally and physically healthy person.
Actually I don’t disagree at all. In fact many decisions made in figure skating is likely not in the best interest of the child. Those decisions made by all involved
 

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