2020-21 Canadian Men News & Updates

[kates8]

Roman was sublime. He gave me Patrick Chan vibes with his music feel, edges and his patience with every move and the music. He’s matured so much and I’m glad he seems to have gained back confidence. Nam was also great. I no longer hold my breath with every jump, but what the heck was with him skating in track pants and gloves- give some effort and at least throw on an old costume!

 

[Marco]

Roman really has so much to prove after being left off the world team despite winning the national title. His skating is simply sublime.

That said, Nam also skated very strongly despite some silly (but costly) mistakes towards the end of his skate.

 

[Sylvia]

Bev Smith article dated Jan. 16, 2021 includes an interview with Roman Sadovsky and summarizes the Men's (and Women's) Challenge short programs: Light in a Dark Place: Seniors

Here's Beverley Smith's article recapping the Men's FS (top 5, first section): https://bevsmithwrites.com/a-challenge-to-the-finish/
Excerpt re. Stephen Gogolev:

Gogolev hasn’t competed since the 2020 world junior championships, but he’s been sprouting like a well tended bamboo shoot and has suffered injuries because of it.
...
About a year and a half ago, a sports science team in Calgary had predicted that Gogolev would have a growth cycle in the past year. And they were correct. The growth gave him problems in his back, “just the aches and pains that go with that transition,” Slipchuk said. “Nothing that is long-term but attributed to training, and the body growing. These things are going to happen in a normal cycle.”
Gogolev returned to training in December under Rafael Arutunian in California, but was not ready to provide a video.
However, the timing isn’t all bad. If Gogolev had to sit out a season, this one – pandemic and lockdowns and all – was a good one to do it in, Slipchuk said. “It’s been a bit of an up and down season [for the sport,]” Slipchuk said. He expects Gogolev to be back in the fold next season.

 

[shutterbug]

Roman watching his Challenge performances https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsMteGsnck4&t

 

[Sylvia]

Beverley Smith's article on Corey:

Circelli takes the high road - Bev Smith Writes

In the grey of winter, and the stillness of days, Corey Circelli was on watch: for his costumes. They didn’t come in time for the videotaping of his routines for the Skate Canada Challenge. They were to be the icing on the cake of all he had done during a pandemic. In fact, they […]

bevsmithwrites.com

Excerpt:

For his free, he turned to Tchaikovsky’s “The Nutcracker” ballet. Circelli loves ballet. You can see it in his classic lines when he skates. You can see it in his opening pose, before he even moves. “I am obsessed,” he said. “I think it is the hardest performance art, so fascinating and mesmerizing and I will take as many classes as possible.”
Before the lockdown he was taking drop-in classes at the National Ballet of Canada on Friday nights, and felt he needed to do this piece. He already had an idea of what the program was going to look like. David Wilson was on board. Orser and Tracy Wilson liked the idea of Circelli doing a ballet piece because it’s good to play to one’s strengths. “You have the long ballet legs,” they told him. “You may as well use them.”

Smith's article on the up-and-coming Junior Men (focus on Rio Morita, plus Matthew Newnham, Wesley Chiu, Shohei Law, Tim Pomares, Alec Guinzbourg, Brendan Wong):

Just a Fleeting Glimpse - Bev Smith Writes

Were we dreaming? Was it a mirage: the vision of young men classified as juniors sliding down the ice to impress? It all happened last weekend at the Skate Canada Challenge, an event with no venue, no spectators, no judges, no skaters, except by way of online streaming, firmly in the virtual...

bevsmithwrites.com

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

Beverley Smith's article on Corey:

Circelli takes the high road - Bev Smith Writes

In the grey of winter, and the stillness of days, Corey Circelli was on watch: for his costumes. They didn’t come in time for the videotaping of his routines for the Skate Canada Challenge. They were to be the icing on the cake of all he had done during a pandemic. In fact, they […]

bevsmithwrites.com

Excerpt:


Smith's article on the up-and-coming Junior Men (focus on Rio Morita, plus Matthew Newnham, Wesley Chiu, Shohei Law, Tim Pomares, Alec Guinzbourg, Brendan Wong):

Just a Fleeting Glimpse - Bev Smith Writes

Were we dreaming? Was it a mirage: the vision of young men classified as juniors sliding down the ice to impress? It all happened last weekend at the Skate Canada Challenge, an event with no venue, no spectators, no judges, no skaters, except by way of online streaming, firmly in the virtual...

bevsmithwrites.com

I'm really digging Corey Circelli, and the comparisons to John Curry, Toller Cranston, and Robin Cousins are valid. He oozes star potential.

 

[Sylvia]

2021 Worlds selection criteria: https://skatecanada.ca/high-performance/resources/international-selection-criteria/

The decision as to the athletes [1 man] to be named must meet the following eligibility requirements:

ISU Minimum Technical Score (Appendix i).
Age requirements as per ISU Rule 108.
Citizenship requirement as per ISU Rule 109.
And will then take into account, in no specific order, the following criteria:

Placement at the 2019 ISU World Championships:
15. Keegan MESSING CAN 237.64 14 (82.38) 15 (155.26)
16. Nam NGUYEN CAN 237.27 13 (82.51) 16 (154.76)

Placement and scores at the 2020 Canadian Championships:
1 Roman Sadovsky 85.02 (SP) 175.55 (FS) 260.57
2 Nam Nguyen 88.04 (SP) 155.47 (FS) 243.51
3 Keegan Messing 92.61 (SP) 149.18 (FS) 241.79

Placement and scores at the 2020 ISU Four Continents Championships:
6 Nam NGUYEN CAN 251.60 9 (85.24) 6 (166.36)
8 Keegan MESSING CAN 243.93 4 (94.03) 10 (149.90)
16 Roman SADOVSKY CAN 200.50 17 (65.87) 15 (134.63)

Season best international score from the 2019-2020, ISU Grand Prix Series, Senior International events and / or ISU Grand Prix Final:
10 Nam NGUYEN CAN ISU GP Skate Canada International 2019 26/10/2019 262.77 (84.08 SP 3rd, 178.69 2nd - silver)
11 Keegan MESSING CAN ISU CS Autumn Classic International 2019 14/09/2019 256.02 (89.57 SP 3rd, 166.45 FS 3rd - bronze)
19 Roman SADOVSKY CAN ISU GP NHK Trophy 2019 23/11/2019 247.50 (78.51 SP 4th, 168.99 FS 2nd - bronze)

Season best score from the 2020/21 ISU Grand Prix Series and 2020/2021 Skate Canada Challenge:
2020 Skate America Bronze - Keegan MESSING, CAN 266.42 3 3 (92.40 SP, 174.02 FS)
2021 Virtual Skate Canada Challenge:
1 Roman Sadovsky 94.43 (SP 1) 167.58 (FS 1) 262.01
2 Nam Nguyen 89.34 (SP 2) 167.09 (FS 2) 256.43

Demonstration of short and free skate international scores for a potential world placement in the top three flights at the 2021 ISU World Championships

 

[Karen-W]

So, here's an idea... Take the average of each man's scores over the qualifying events and see who has the highest mark. Each of them has a similar high score, whereas Roman has one really bad score that drops him several points behind Nam and Keegan. Nam has slightly better scores than Keegan, so I'd probably give him the nod and name Keegan as 1st alternate.

Nam 250.32
Keegan 249.16
Roman 242.65

 

[mackiecat]

I’d go Roman. He was far and away the best at Challenge.

 

[Colonel Green]

I would send Keegan. Last season he was fairly reliable in the short program, but (for well-known reasons) the free skate just never worked after Autumn Classic. We sadly don't have a huge amount of information to make a decision on any of these skaters due to how limited the season has been, but based on SkAm he appears to have been able to move on more; that was his best free since 2019 4CC. He got the highest score of any of the guys this season, from a non-Canadian panel, and (by luck) he's the only one of them who was able to participate in an actual in-person competition.

I'd be fine with sending Nam. Roman, I wouldn't send, he has too long a track record of messing up in the short program and (unfortunately) this season hasn't given him enough opportunities to show he's gotten past that.

 

[tony]

I’d go Roman. He was far and away the best at Challenge.

But Keegan wasn't there and Keegan has the higher score from an all-USA judging panel (as @Colonel Green also said above). So I'm not sure Challenge means much of anything.

I wouldn't mind some kind of monitoring skate-off when the pressure is on, because I doubt Nguyen and Sadovsky were really feeling pressure for a virtual Challenge in which they were already qualified to Nats.

 

[skategal]

I feel like Roman has the highest scoring potential but he's also the biggest risk.

Keegan scores well and is the most consistent.

I would send Keegan over Nam.

Nam has had other chances and doesn't usually deliver on them.

I'd probably go with Keegan.

 

[dramagrrl]

I would send either Keegan or Nam over Roman.

 

[sk8girl]

I love Roman, but with Olympic spots on the line and only one Worlds spot available, I agree that It should be either Nam or Keegan, since they're more consistent under pressure. Tough choice for Skate Canada between those two.

 

[screech]

I think they'll end up sending Nam.

Nam is usually more consistent than Keegan and Roman, which could be a big draw in sending him. Not as high scoring potential (due to his comparatively mediocre general skating), but more dependable than Keegan and Roman. If both Nam and Keegan were to skate decently in a field where everyone skates well (however unlikely), I could see Keegan in the top 8, and Nam somewhere between 10th and 15th.
As much as I like Roman and want him to have the opportunity that his national skates have earned in the last 2 years, I agree he's a bit too much of a wild card. I hope he kicks ass at Canadians next year and gets to go to the Olympics, though.

 

[Karen-W]

I think they'll end up sending Nam.

Nam is usually more consistent than Keegan and Roman, which could be a big draw in sending him. Not as high scoring potential (due to his comparatively mediocre general skating), but more dependable than Keegan and Roman. If both Nam and Keegan were to skate decently in a field where everyone skates well (however unlikely), I could see Keegan in the top 8, and Nam somewhere between 10th and 15th.
As much as I like Roman and want him to have the opportunity that his national skates have earned in the last 2 years, I agree he's a bit too much of a wild card. I hope he kicks ass at Canadians next year and gets to go to the Olympics, though.

It's such a toss up, to me, between Nam and Keegan. I agree that Keegan has a slightly higher ceiling than Nam, all things being equal and every skater skating up to their full potential, but I think that Nam has a slightly more consistent, albeit lower ceiling, than Keegan. Six of one, half dozen of another, IMO.

 

[skatingguy]

Nam's only finished in the top 10 at Worlds once in five competitions, so I'm not sure he's a sure bet either. Keegan is probably the safest choice & Roman the highest scoring potential. I don't think Nam is a factor in the decision.

 

[dramagrrl]

I don't think Nam is a factor in the decision.

If you look at Skate Canada's selection criteria, along with the fact that he was supposed to be our one entry to Worlds last year and the fact that he was not that far behind Roman at Challenge, I think he is very much a factor in the decision.

 

[sk8girl]

If you look at Skate Canada's selection criteria, along with the fact that he was supposed to be our one entry to Worlds last year and the fact that he was not that far behind Roman at Challenge, I think he is very much a factor in the decision.

Exactly. While Roman was great at Canadians last year, he was not good at 4CCs, and we know how Skate Canada weighed that - they chose Nam instead for the Montreal spot. I don't see the Challenge results being enough to change their mind on that. The question mark is how they assess Keegan vs. Nam, given Keegan's good Skate America showing.

 

[Marco]

This is such a difficult question. Nam is consistent but not as high scoring in comparison, Keegan has the highest potential but is more likely to bomb, and Roman skated so well at Nationals 2020 and the recent Challenge.

They have to choose 1 from 3 and there isn't a recent head to head competition to make a fair, direct comparison. 2020 4CCs was a year ago. And worse yet, whether the Olympic / world spot stays at 1 or moves to 2 after 2021 Worlds, it will still be very difficult to choose for next year.

 

[puglover]

I think I would side again with current monitoring. Roman is more the new guy in the picture and if he skated well he could make quite an impact with his ability to touch hearts. He seems so much more secure on the axel and quad. I think Keegan could fare better than Nam or Roman with a miss in the short.

 

[shutterbug]

I feel like Roman has the highest scoring potential but he's also the biggest risk.

This. If he'd had the opportunity to compete internationally even once this season and shown reasonable consistency I'd say roll the dice, especially given that the combination of Nam and Keegan is the reason we're down to one men's spot.

But, based on what little we've seen, I'd go with Keegan. He's the only one who's actually gotten on a plane and travelled to a competition this year, and wouldn't be terribly bothered by the lack of fans in the stands. Nam needs an audience to be at his best.

The other thing that might possibly factor into Skate Canada's decision is that this is the last Worlds before the 2022 Olympics. Nam and Keegan have both been to Worlds, Roman hasn't. If he proves himself to be a legitimate front runner for the (very likely) lone men's Olympic entry, this lack of experience at the highest level would definitely NOT be optimal. Or, they may have written off 2022 and are looking ahead to 2026, in which case don't give a rat's a$$ about preparedness.

 

[Colonel Green]

Nam's only finished in the top 10 at Worlds once in five competitions, so I'm not sure he's a sure bet either. Keegan is probably the safest choice & Roman the highest scoring potential. I don't think Nam is a factor in the decision.

While obviously Nam has had some rough experiences at Worlds in recent seasons, 2019-20 was the best season of his career in terms of consistency and results leading up to Worlds.

 

[haribobo]

Just send Roman, he is a gift and he won 20 Nats and 21 Challenge. People really overcomplicate things. And even if he were to bomb, we would get a full detailed youtube video explaining why, which I think FSU would find satisfying.

 

[screech]

No matter who they choose, isn't it fantastic to see that we have 3 amazing skaters who are each deserving of a spot, and who have each legitimately earned it based on criteria? While it's a hard decision to make, at least we have 3 wonderful options to choose fom.

 

[shutterbug]

People really overcomplicate things.

This is FSU. It's what we do.

 

[Debrah]

Nam earned it at 4CC over both Roman and Keegan last season, plus the Silver blinder he skated at SC thus he was the pick for Mtl Worlds and is my pick for 2021. Nam was well on his way to peaking for 2020 Worlds and seems he has actually improved his overall skating since last season from what I saw of his Challenge vids, however, since he only needed to qualify, not even bothering with costumes, his full technical arsenal, etc., seems he wasn't putting out his best effort, likely expecting to peak for national's or even later in the season if indeed the season during the pandemic was actually still going to happen. Nam is a former world Jr Champion, he has finished the highest at worlds of the 3 so far, as well as bested them at 4CC and he also has the best record domestically, thus while it's true he has had a bumpy ride as a SR, at least till he took full charge of his own skating career, he is now fully back on track to become his very best self. IMO Nam IS the best competitor of the 3 and along with Roman is also on an ever-improving upward trajectory. Nam has loads of personality, many fans, he has learned to compete well, seems to enjoys skating for an audience, or for himself, or to help secure spots for friends esp., when he is really motivated and being properly supported by SC.

Roman is arguably the best overall skater of the 3 with most future international potential having organic natural artistry, a commanding presence, and an IT factor to die for, plus he has my fav SP of the season, (Kolyada has my 2nd fav sp) but IMO Roman is still learning how to put 2 strong programs together in the same event. He needs some more time to become fully baked as an international top gun competitor. He is definitely on the right track and with increasing self-belief and all this new fan support now to help motivate him if he had had more opportunities this season to compete internationally and won them over the other 2 strong contenders we are discussing, I might have a very different opinion about sending him to worlds 2021 because I really do love his skating and am keeping my fingers crossed he will be at the next Olympics whenever they are.

Keegan was the favored skater during most of this past cycle mainly due to being the fastest skater, dynamic jumper, but very unrefined, but he had a huge bonus quad lutz to keep him in the top gun game range, but overall his record has been extremely hit and miss, mostly miss and he tends to be his best self, by being the friendly, supportive and fan-fav, 2nd banana guy.

If I had a vote, I would still send Nam if Worlds 2021 is a go. But I don't get to vote so it's all moot, LOL!

 

[Marco]

Has Keegan ever landed the 4lutz?

 

[Sedge]

Has Keegan ever landed the 4lutz?

He put a hand down on a fully rotated 4 Lutz at GPF 2018 in the FP

 

[4rkidz]

Nam earned it at 4CC over both Roman and Keegan last season, plus the Silver blinder he skated at SC thus he was the pick for Mtl Worlds and is my pick for 2021. Nam was well on his way to peaking for 2020 Worlds and seems he has actually improved his overall skating since last season from what I saw of his Challenge vids, however, since he only needed to qualify, not even bothering with costumes, his full technical arsenal, etc., seems he wasn't putting out his best effort, likely expecting to peak for national's or even later in the season if indeed the season during the ********* was actually still going to happen. Nam is a former world Jr Champion, he has finished the highest at worlds of the 3 so far, as well as bested them at 4CC and he also has the best record domestically, thus while it's true he has had a bumpy ride as a SR, at least till he took full charge of his own skating career, he is now fully back on track to become his very best self. IMO Nam IS the best competitor of the 3 and along with Roman is also on an ever-improving upward trajectory. Nam has loads of personality, many fans, he has learned to compete well, seems to enjoys skating for an audience, or for himself, or to help secure spots for friends esp., when he is really motivated and being properly supported by SC.

Roman is arguably the best overall skater of the 3 with most future international potential having organic natural artistry, a commanding presence, and an IT factor to die for, plus he has my fav SP of the season, (Kolyada has my 2nd fav sp) but IMO Roman is still learning how to put 2 strong programs together in the same event. He needs some more time to become fully baked as an international top gun competitor. He is definitely on the right track and with increasing self-belief and all this new fan support now to help motivate him if he had had more opportunities this season to compete internationally and won them over the other 2 strong contenders we are discussing, I might have a very different opinion about sending him to worlds 2021 because I really do love his skating and am keeping my fingers crossed he will be at the next Olympics whenever they are.

Keegan was the favored skater during most of this past cycle mainly due to being the fastest skater, dynamic jumper, but very unrefined, but he had a huge bonus quad lutz to keep him in the top gun game range, but overall his record has been extremely hit and miss, mostly miss and he tends to be his best self, by being the friendly, supportive and fan-fav, 2nd banana guy.

If I had a vote, I would still send Nam if Worlds 2021 is a go. But I don't get to vote so it's all moot, LOL!

such a tough decision for Skate Canada, I would not want to be in their shoes. My favourite skate this year is from Roman and also has most scoring potential BUT your explanation is good as to why Nam could be chosen and of course would always love Keegan to go as well. I think I would have to put their three names in a hat and pick one LOL