U.S. Men 2024-25 news & updates

I predict a world team of Ilia, Jason and Lucas with Jacob on the bubble
I'd be really surprised if Jacob makes the Worlds team or is 1st Alternate. I don't think we have any confirmation of whether he's even skating senior domestically this year. The turnaround between Jr Worlds and Worlds is about 3.5-4 weeks, so it's doable, but my expectation is that if he DOES compete seniors at Nats the only way he winds up on the team or 1st Alternate is if he scores significantly higher than the next two men behind him. If the next few guys behind him are close, score-wise, then he'll drop down to 2nd or 3rd Alternate.
 
We always seem to obsess about keeping three spots, but what is the value of the third spot if the first two spots are always used by the same two people?

The argument seems to be "we need Jason to keep three spots," which is the same as saying, "if we don't send Jason we'll only earn two spots." But if Jason is skating he's using one of those spots, and with one spot almost certainly going to Ilia, there's only one extra spot. If Jason isn't skating and one spot is almost certainly going to Ilia, there's only one extra spot. So either way, don't we end up with the same outcome in terms of development opportunities?
 
We always seem to obsess about keeping three spots, but what is the value of the third spot if the first two spots are always used by the same two people?

The argument seems to be "we need Jason to keep three spots," which is the same as saying, "if we don't send Jason we'll only earn two spots." But if Jason is skating he's using one of those spots, and with one spot almost certainly going to Ilia, there's only one extra spot. If Jason isn't skating and one spot is almost certainly going to Ilia, there's only one extra spot. So either way, don't we end up with the same outcome in terms of development opportunities?
Yes, but say Jason had not returned in 2023 or fully stepped away and not returned in 2024 - there would have been an earned 3rd spot that he wasn't filling the following season. So, that would have meant 2 spots for our guys who had, prior to 2023, relatively little senior ISU Championship experience.

2020 4CCs - Tomoki & Camden
2022 4CCs - Tomoki, Jimmy & Camden
2022 Worlds - Camden
2023 4CCs - Jimmy, Max & Liam
2023 Worlds - Andrew
2024 4CCs - Andrew, Tomoki & Max
2024 Worlds - Camden

Tomoki - 4
Camden - 4
Jimmy - 2
Andrew - 2
Max - 2
Liam - 1
Grand Total - 15

By contrast, this is Jason's senior ISU Championships/Olympics experience
Olympics - 2014 & 2022
Worlds - 2015, 2017, 2019, 2021, 2022 & 2023
4CCs - 2015, 2017, 2018, 2019 & 2020
Grand Prix Final - 2018 (2021 qualified, event cancelled)
Grand Total - 14

Sure, it's easy to point out that Jason earned those assignments and demonstrated over the course of his career far more consistency than the other 6 guys listed above. I'd like to see these guys put in the actual hot seat of needing to produce results when spots are on the line and see what they manage to accomplish.

If the rumors (coming from a couple of very different sources, both of whom I see no reason to distrust on this topic) about the USFS paying Jason to continue competing are accurate then I question the use of those funds in that way. I'm sure there are a lot of parents & skaters doing GoFundMe campaigns to pay for some Int'l B competitions this season who might be inclined to agree that perhaps that money paid to support Jason could be funneled toward skater development - especially if the US winds up losing the 3rd spot next year.
 
Just a thought about Jacob Sanchez and Nationals. I think Jacob wants that Junior men's title. I hope he will get it and it's important that he does.

Here's why. The Junior men's title means something historically. Ladies/Women's doesn't (in fact winning Jr. Ladies has been something of a jinx) but men's does. In looking at the list of Senior Men's champions, I didn't find any skaters (going back to Scott Hamilton) who didn't win either Jr. Nationals or Jr. Worlds. Almost all of the men won Jr. Nationals. One prominent exception is Johnny Weir, who won Jr. Worlds - and he was second at Jr. Nationals. The other noticeable exception is Rudy Galindo who won both bronze and gold at Jr. Worlds. If only as a tradition, if a men's skater wants to win Senior Nationals, he better start by going after the Junior title.
 
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I had posted the link to this article in Jason's fan thread before Skate Canada Int'l but did not post it here: https://www.usfigureskating.org/news/article/fired-jason-brown-returns-grand-prix-series
Relevant excerpt:
“If I was not able to help out the U.S. team, or if I was not keeping up at all, or at least not keeping up with my standards, I would not compete,” he said. “Ilia is making an unbelievable mark with what he's doing, and I'm just in awe of his ability and the way he's handling it all. But I want that next generation to know there are so many different ways you can push the sport and make an impact.”
“You want to be relevant,” Tracy Wilson, Brown’s primary coach in Toronto, said. “You want to go out there knowing you’re raising your game, and you’re raising everybody else’s game. That’s the beauty of it. We can be inspired by others and some of the things they have, and they can be inspired by some of the things that we have.”
Wilson, who supported her skater’s decision to balance shows with competition the last few seasons, is delighted Brown has re-dedicated himself to training.
“There comes a point where you have to be in the practice rink, you have to give yourself time, you have to give your body a rest,” she said. “You can’t just be on this frantic pace and just hope that everything is going to go well. So I think this is how he raises his game. If he is looking ahead to competing at Worlds in Boston this season, we’re counting on the fact that this work now will help him to that end.”
 

Andrew with “coach” Brandon Frazier in the mixed zone afterwards: https://x.com/goldenskate/status/1852747445945446445
Andrew Torgashev 🇺🇸 152.10 / 233.64
“I feel very good about today. The whole day was of course a bit nerve-wracking but when I finished the skate I thought: yes, I did it!”
I asked Brandon to accompany me as he is a great friend of mine, works in the same rink as me, he is an Olympic champion and a great moral and mental support. The best advise he probably gave me was to concentrate on what I feel and think myself. I am very pleased with my skate today. It’s a bit tough to miss out by 0.2 on a better placement but I concentrate on my own inner feeling. I think I can built on this competition to do even better in the future.”
4th in both SP & FS with 2 new ISU personal bests (FS & Total) in Angers! :)
 
Camden’s post just now:

What he said in the mixed zone after his FS: https://x.com/goldenskate/status/1852732865219289137
Camden Pulkinen 🇺🇸 129.23 / 193.60 rushed right away to congratulate Amber Glenn after her winning performance.
“Things didn’t go my way, there are a few reasons behind it but I will work hard to do better in Finland. I am so proud of my teammates, Amber and Sarah. Amber and I are friends for a long time, I am so proud of her, she’s the hardest worker I know.”
On his FS music: “I wanted to skate to this music forever, I think it’s a great vehicle. I wanted to give more on the performance but things unfortunately didn’t went my way this event.”
 
Since I've shared the USFS' ISU Championships Selection Pool table as scores currently stand halfway through the GP season and with 3 Challengers left for the other disciplines, I thought I'd share the Men's table here. X = assigned Int'l; this table is only for the senior age-eligible men presumed to be competing seniors domestically (we still don't know what Sanchez's intentions are, but I'm including him here since he's being sent to Tallinn Trophy to get his senior CTES mins); if you want the junior age-eligible men's table for Jr Worlds discussion, let me know!
SkaterLevelAge EligibleISU Min Score2024 U.S. NatsGPFGP/ JGP 1GP/ JGP 2GP/ JPG HighestGP/ JGP AvgCS/ Sr B/ Jr Int 1CS/ Sr B/ Jr Int 2CS/ Sr B/ Jr Int HighestCS/ Sr B/ Jr Int AvgSect Final (Top 2 in each Section JR/SR)NQS Score (Top 2 in each Section JR/SR)Non-USFS Funded EventPrev Yr Final NumberTotal
Annis, WilliamSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
185.65​
0
92.83​
Broussard, LucasS/JYY/Y
206.57​
206.57​
103.29​
246.48​
X
246.48​
123.24​
233.19​
0
784.53​
Brown, JasonSYY
218.75​
X
218.75​
109.38​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
242.79​
7
636.55​
Endo, GokuSYY
0.00​
0.00​
203.03​
203.03​
101.52​
0
279.17​
Hiwatashi, TomokiSYYX
0.00​
0.00​
190.56​
190.56​
95.28​
0
262.02​
Kapeikis, LiamSYY
0.00​
0.00​
196.64​
208.93​
208.93​
202.79​
0
361.02​
Kim, JoonsooSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Klein, JosephSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
210.79​
210.79​
105.40​
0
289.84​
Kovar, KaiS/JY4CCs/Y
0.00​
0.00​
179.12167.61179.12173.37176.870
397.58​
Ma, JimmySYY
0.00​
0.00​
236.77229.41236.77233.090
411.59​
Malinin, IliaSYY
290.12​
301.82​
301.82​
295.97​
312.55​
312.55​
312.55​
0.00​
16
1534.20​
Martynov, DanielS/JY4CCs/Y
0.00​
0.00​
207.01​
170.27
X
207.01​
188.64​
183.70​
0
440.34​
Mindra, SamuelSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Monaco, AntonioSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Murzin, DaniilSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Naumov, MaximSYY
216.38​
216.38​
108.19​
199.30​
X
199.30​
99.65​
0.00​
0
679.75​
Paniot, YaroslavSYY
0.00​
0.00​
206.59​
206.59​
103.30​
230.54​
144.07​
0
413.73​
Pulkinen, CamdenSYY
193.60​
X
193.60​
96.80​
226.97​
226.97​
113.49​
0.00​
2
705.08​
Sanchez, JacobS/JYPEND/Y
220.25​
229.46​
229.46​
224.86​
218.21​
X
218.21​
109.11​
0
867.93​
Savary, EmmanuelSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
201.10​
0
50.28​
Shinohara, TairaS/JYN/Y
197.53​
0.00​
197.53​
197.53​
182.99​
182.99​
91.50​
215.13​
0
799.22​
Strommer, BeckSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
213.51​
0
53.38​
Torgashev, AndrewSYY
233.64​
233.64​
116.82​
224.94​
207.65​
224.94​
216.30​
0.00​
0
825.24​
Xie, MichaelSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
198.73​
198.73​
99.37​
0
273.25​
Zharkov, MaximSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
 
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Per some notes from @ice coverage in the US Ice Dance thread, I've gone back through the table and made some updates for both sr & jr.

Senior -
SkaterLevelAge EligibleISU Min Score2024 U.S. NatsGPFGP/ JGP 1GP/ JGP 2GP/ JPG HighestGP/ JGP AvgCS/ Sr B/ Jr Int 1CS/ Sr B/ Jr Int 2CS/ Sr B/ Jr Int HighestCS/ Sr B/ Jr Int AvgSect Final (Top 2 in each Section JR/SR)NQS Score (Top 2 in each Section JR/SR)Non-USFS Funded EventPrev Yr Final NumberTotal
Annis, WilliamSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
185.65​
0
92.83​
Broussard, LucasS/JYY/N
0.00​
206.57​
165.26​
206.57​
185.91​
246.48​
184.86​
246.48​
215.67​
233.19​
0.00​
0
957.13​
Brown, JasonSYY
0.00​
218.75​
175.00​
218.75​
196.88​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
242.79​
7
745.93​
Endo, GokuSYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
203.03​
152.27​
203.03​
177.65​
0.00​
0.00​
0
336.27​
Hiwatashi, TomokiSYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
190.56​
142.92​
190.56​
166.74​
0.00​
0.00​
0
315.62​
Kapeikis, LiamSYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
196.64​
208.93​
208.93​
202.79​
0.00​
0.00​
0
361.02​
Kim, JoonsooSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Klein, JosephSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
210.79​
158.09​
210.79​
184.44​
0.00​
0.00​
0
349.12​
Kovar, KaiS/JY4CCs/Y
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
179.12​
167.61​
179.12​
173.37​
0.00​
176.87​
0
397.58​
Ma, JimmySYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
236.77​
229.41​
236.77​
233.09​
0.00​
0.00​
0
411.59​
Malinin, IliaSYY
0.00​
290.12​
301.82​
301.82​
295.97​
312.55​
234.41​
312.55​
546.96​
0.00​
0.00​
16
1710.01​
Martynov, DanielS/JYPEND/4CCs/Y
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
207.01​
170.27​
207.01​
188.64​
0.00​
183.70​
0
440.34​
Mindra, SamuelSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Monaco, AntonioSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Murzin, DaniilSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​
Naumov, MaximSYY
0.00​
216.38​
173.10​
216.38​
194.74​
199.30​
149.48​
199.30​
174.39​
0.00​
0.00​
0
843.99​
Paniot, YaroslavSYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
206.59​
154.94​
206.59​
180.77​
230.54​
144.07​
0
471.83​
Pulkinen, CamdenSYY
0.00​
193.60​
154.88​
193.60​
174.24​
226.97​
170.23​
226.97​
198.60​
0.00​
0.00​
2
865.72​
Sanchez, JacobSYPEND/Y
0.00​
220.25​
229.46​
229.46​
224.86​
218.21​
163.66​
218.21​
190.93​
0.00​
0.00​
0
929.30​
Savary, EmmanuelSYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
201.10​
0.00​
0
50.28​
Shinohara, TairaS/JYN/Y
0.00​
197.53​
158.02​
197.53​
177.78​
182.99​
137.24​
182.99​
160.12​
215.13​
0.00​
0
825.99​
Strommer, BeckS/JYN/Y
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
213.51​
0.00​
0
53.38​
Torgashev, AndrewSYY
0.00​
233.64​
186.91​
233.64​
210.28​
224.94​
207.65​
224.94​
216.30​
0.00​
0.00​
0
942.06​
Xie, MichaelSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
198.73​
149.05​
198.73​
173.89​
0.00​
0.00​
0
329.15​
Zharkov, MaximSY4CCs
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
0.00​

Junior -
SkaterLevelAge EligibleISU Min Score2024 U.S. NatsGPFGP/ JGP 1GP/ JGP 2GP/ JPG HighestGP/ JGP AvgCS/ Sr B/ Jr Int 1CS/ Sr B/ Jr Int 2CS/ Sr B/ Jr Int HighestCS/ Sr B/ Jr Int AvgSect Final (Top 2 in each Section JR/SR)NQS Score (Top 2 in each Section JR/SR)Non-USFS Funded EventPrev Yr Final NumberTotal
Blackwell, PatrickJYY
0.00​
221.56​
196.47​
221.56​
209.02​
175.24​
131.43​
175.24​
153.34​
0.00​
0.00​
0
828.46​
Brooks, NicholasJYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
186.47​
139.85​
186.47​
163.16​
193.92​
179.16​
0
446.90​
Broussard, LucasS/JYY/N
0.00​
206.57​
165.26​
206.57​
185.91​
246.48​
184.86​
246.48​
215.67​
233.19​
0.00​
0
957.13​
Elano, LorenzoJYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
173.06​
129.80​
173.06​
151.43​
185.79​
186.64​
0
426.40​
Farrington, CalebJYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
161.58​
0
80.79​
Fegan, AleksandrJYY
0.00​
190.07​
0.00​
190.07​
95.04​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0
356.38​
Haugeto, KirkJYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
174.39​
130.79​
174.39​
152.59​
187.91​
168.61​
0
420.12​
Kazanecki, LuciusS (J)YY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
168.98​
126.74​
168.98​
147.86​
200.26​
0.00​
0
329.94​
Kovar, KaiS/JY4CCs/Y
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
179.12​
167.61​
179.12​
173.37​
0.00​
176.87​
0
397.58​
LoPinto, ZacharyJYY
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
186.44​
0.00​
0
46.61​
Martynov, DanielS/JYPEND/4CCs/Y
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
207.01​
170.27​
207.01​
188.64​
0.00​
183.70​
0
440.34​
Sanchez, JacobS/JYPEND/Y
0.00​
220.25​
229.46​
229.46​
224.86​
218.21​
163.66​
218.21​
190.93​
0.00​
0.00​
0
929.30​
Shinohara, TairaS/JYN/Y
0.00​
197.53​
158.02​
197.53​
177.78​
182.99​
137.24​
182.99​
160.12​
215.13​
0.00​
0
825.99​
Strommer, BeckS/JYN/Y
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
213.51​
0.00​
0
53.38​
Vasquez, VaclavJYN
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
0.00​
182.10​
172.65​
0
131.85​
 
AnythingGOEs just tweeted that Lucas Broussard has withdrawn from Warsaw Cup per the USFS international assignments page. If it's due to injury (and not a GP spot opening up at CoC), doesn't this mean he would be out of nationals (unless he's somehow able to compete at sectionals the week before, which wouldn't seem likely)?
 
AnythingGOEs just tweeted that Lucas Broussard has withdrawn from Warsaw Cup per the USFS international assignments page. If it's due to injury (and not a GP spot opening up at CoC), doesn't this mean he would be out of nationals (unless he's somehow able to compete at sectionals the week before, which wouldn't seem likely)?

He needs to stop doing Rippon quad toe loops.
 
Amennnn

Skaters can be obsessed with that when their success rate is less than 50% yet they keep doing them all throughout the programs. I wish they would just stop even if they learned that way which I don’t know if I believe.

Example on the women's side: Hanna Harrell.

Even Adam Rippon stopped doing them after he dislocated his shoulder a couple of times. I know I've been admonished for second guessing skaters' coaches, but if you're doing something that is taking you outside of the axis of rotation, wouldn't a prudent coach pick that up?
 
I know I've been admonished for second guessing skaters' coaches, but if you're doing something that is taking you outside of the axis of rotation, wouldn't a prudent coach pick that up?
Broussard spent part of his summer at the Cricket club in Toronto and presumably all of the coaches involved with his training were consulting with each other.
If it's due to injury (and not a GP spot opening up at CoC), doesn't this mean he would be out of nationals (unless he's somehow able to compete at sectionals the week before, which wouldn't seem likely)?
I'm still hoping for the best.
 
Will Jason compete for the Golden Spin (Dec. 4-7/2024)?


ETA: fixed a typo.
 
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I expect he will, he's shown clear progression between Skate Canada and here so I imagine the next comp will be another stepping stone for him.
 
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Thank you @marshallpond :) - would you like to post the info in the U.S. Women's news thread as well?

We now have official confirmation that Jacob will make his senior national debut in Wichita and I'm very glad to see Lucas got a bye through Pacific Coast Sectionals.
Also of note - Tomoki Hiwatashi does NOT have a bye to Nationals which means he will have to qualify through Midwesterns - not the easiest of fields - Shinohara, Klein & Strommer are all in that section and have NQS scores of 210+.
 
Also of note - Tomoki Hiwatashi does NOT have a bye to Nationals which means he will have to qualify through Midwesterns - not the easiest of fields - Shinohara, Klein & Strommer are all in that section and have NQS scores of 210+.
Right. Deepest section is still Pacific Coast - NQS scores of 190+ (* = in ISP; last year's Nationals placement included where applicable):

PACIFIC COAST (Sectional is Nov. 13-16):
2 *Yaroslav Paniot S7 230.54 [1 CS, 1 Sr B]
3 *Goku Endo S10 230.26 [1 CS]
4 *Michael Xie S14 227.42 [1 CS]
5 *Daniil Murzin 218.34
6 *Joonsoo Kim 217.62 [WD from his 1 Sr B]
10 *Liam Kapeikis S13 205.65 [2 CS]
11 *Kai Kovar S11 203.58 [1 Jr B, 1 CS]
15 Samuel Mindra S15 197.56
17 Anthony Mugg 191.78

MIDWESTERN (Sectional is Nov. 20-23):
*Tomoki Hiwatashi S8 [1 CS, NHK Trophy is Nov. 8-10 & Mids Sr. Men compete Nov. 22-23]
7 *Taira Shinohara J2 215.13 [1 Jr B, 1 JGP]
8 *Beck Strommer J4 213.51
9 *Joseph Klein S17 212.02 [1 CS]

EASTERN (Sectional is Nov. 14-17):
12 Emmanuel Savary 201.10
13 *Lucius Kazanecki J1 200.26 [1 Jr B]
14 Daniel Samohin S12 197.75
16 *Will Annis S16 193.86 [1 Sr B]

ETA: 9 Senior men's spots are available this year via Sectionals (top 2 in each Sectional plus next 3 highest total scores).
 
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An interesting article that tells us what Camden is up to:


Now instead of studies he juggles skating with a full-time job in the corporate strategy department of Capital One bank in New York City.
(emphasis is on the original article)

I thought it is Capital One that he is working when I saw his Insta posts.

As much as he enjoys switching between his figure skating and banking personalities, Pulkinen said he might become a full-time athlete in 2025 as he tries to qualify for the next Olympic Games.

What will he do about his job?

Anyhow, good luck, Camden!
 
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