The Dance Hall 9: Bring the Bling or No Beijing 2021-2022

[Karen-W]

Anyone else think Hurtado/Khaliavin better be hoping and praying for a generous tech panel at one of their GPs like SmaDia had this week if they want to nab the Spanish Olympic spot?

 

[Bigbird]

Anyone else think Hurtado/Khaliavin better be hoping and praying for a generous tech panel at one of their GPs like SmaDia had this week if they want to nab the Spanish Olympic spot?

This panel was generous? #scratcheshead. S/D just have two great programs this year. And more importantly S/D have chemistry and swag. In H/K those qualities are much less and mostly reside in Sara for this season. For whatever reason Zhulin likes to convert his female students into something akin to Stepford wives; all gloss, frosty and very little substance. I loved her madly when she skated with Diaz at the now IAM school. They captured her essence. I still rewatch on repeat their Picasso and Paso Doble. My word their last FD is way better than anything they have this season. Pity they parted. I am not inclined to rewatch any of Zhulin's programs for them. Zhulin's students tend to resemble him and his personal tastes. JMHO. They will have their chances, however, so long as the Russian machinery is intact.

 

[firstflight]

Can we discuss the implications of the first two Grand Prix events? So many questions, and I just wanted to see you all's opinions.

1) Is the Piper/Paul bronze from last Worlds with that 130 FD score, and their continued momentum this season, coming at the cost of Canada's #2 and #3? Like is ice dance still so political that it's a tradeoff between your federation's teams; e.g. for your top team to medal at the Olympics, you'll trade placements for your lower teams...

At Skate America, F-B/S were uncomfortably close to S/D's scores, in fact falling behind them in the FD. Clearly they weren't at their best in the FD so maybe that's all there was to it.

L/L also have not been moving forward this season at all score-wise, even in the Canada events where they're not making visible errors. Position-wise, they're actually sliding backwards.

2) Christina/Anthony. What is this season? Under 100 for the FD at Skate Canada is kind of a disaster as they had the lowest base value, and their GOE didn't help them at all. Smart/Diaz on the other hand had the second lowest base value in the FD but managed to medal.

3) Where should we expect Charlene/Marco to land at the Olympics? Babs was clapping and stating "Bravo!" after their 121 came up in Skate Canada. Is that really where they'd want to be position-wise? Or was she conveying "this is the best you can get competing in Canada?"

4) Lilah/Lewis's no good Skate Canada- mistakes abounded, including the super clunky end to their free-dance. So is this really a readjustment of their position as people are suggesting, or just a particularly bad competition for them?

5) 3rd place at US Championships? That position wasn't even competitive heading into this season, but now.....

 

[aka_gerbil]

I know C/P say they’re happy in London, but I’m sort of wondering how long Mama and Papa K/P are going to let this go on before they pull the plug.

 

[Karen-W]

Can we discuss the implications of the first two Grand Prix events? So many questions, and I just wanted to see you all's opinions.

1) Is the Piper/Paul bronze from last Worlds with that 130 FD score, and their continued momentum this season, coming at the cost of Canada's #2 and #3? Like is ice dance still so political that it's a tradeoff between your federation's teams; e.g. for your top team to medal at the Olympics, you'll trade placements for your lower teams...

At Skate America, F-B/S were uncomfortably close to S/D's scores, in fact falling behind them in the FD. Clearly they weren't at their best in the FD so maybe that's all there was to it.

L/L also have not been moving forward this season at all score-wise, even in the Canada events where they're not making visible errors. Position-wise, they're actually sliding backwards.

2) Christina/Anthony. What is this season? Under 100 for the FD at Skate Canada is kind of a disaster as they had the lowest base value, and their GOE didn't help them at all. Smart/Diaz on the other hand had the second lowest base value in the FD but managed to medal.

3) Where should we expect Charlene/Marco to land at the Olympics? Babs was clapping and stating "Bravo!" after their 121 came up in Skate Canada. Is that really where they'd want to be position-wise? Or was she conveying "this is the best you can get competing in Canada?"

4) Lilah/Lewis's no good Skate Canada- mistakes abounded, including the super clunky end to their free-dance. So is this really a readjustment of their position as people are suggesting, or just a particularly bad competition for them?

5) 3rd place at US Championships? That position wasn't even competitive heading into this season, but now.....

1) Ehhhhh... Not really. Keep in mind that the consensus is, at least for the RD, the tech panel at SCI was more generous than the one at SkAm. Also, SmaDia's FD (and their RD) is a crowd-pleasing number. F-B/S, by most reports of those at the Orleans, was rather lukewarm by comparison. As far as L/L go, position-wise, it's hard to say whether they're sliding backwards or stagnating. One thing to keep in mind is that there is a bit of uncertainty in both the Russian and US dance fields right now, especially Russia with huge question marks about the health of their top 3 teams, same goes for Hawayek/Baker and the #3 US spot. Both of those countries are looking to position their teams for the next quad, so right now, maybe L/L look to be regressing but they're really just holding their own with the teams they can expect to be competing against for the next 4-8 years.

2) CarPon are definitely struggling - they also didn't help themselves at SCI with misses on their twizzles in both the RD and FD plus two programs that don't seem to fit them quite right. We'll see if they can re-establish themselves next season with better material.

3) 6th at best, assuming that SinKats and StepBuk make it to Beijing, 5th if neither team is there. They're fighting to make the final group of the FD at this point and it might very well be a lost cause already.

4) Really bad competition. They earned the bronze at Finlandia and were well-positioned to earn the bronze at SCI. Maybe nerves got to them, going in knowing they could earn a GP medal. British fed has good politicking power so I don't think this is really so much a readjustment of their position as some people think.

5) It's still Hawayek/Baker's to lose. Green/Parsons really have hit it out of the park with their exquisite contemporary dance FD - like @taz'smum said - THAT is how you do contemporary, modern dance in ice dancing, not the lyrical snot, derivative crap we see from most teams trying to emulate what works so well for PapCiz but not so well for pretty much anyone else. But, GrePar still haven't scored equal to Worlds 2021 Top 10 even once and we have yet to see how Hawayek/Baker look (can NHK come yet, please?!).

 

[PRlady]

Since we haven’t seen H/B yet, it’s premature to question if they will be dumped. I love Green/Parsons FD this year but H/B has done some interesting stuff the last two years.

 

[VGThuy]

I’m kind of shocked that Green/Parsons are already hitting close to the top ten though for a new partnership and their SCI FD score puts them in good stead to be taken seriously internationally. Their base values were high for the FD too. Had they received Smart/Diaz GOEs and PCS, they’d score around 117-18 for their FD.

 

[Karen-W]

I’m kind of shocked that Green/Parsons are already hitting close to the top ten though for a new partnership and their SCI FD score puts them in good stead to be taken seriously internationally. Their base values were high for the FD too. Had they received Smart/Diaz GOEs and PCS, they’d score around 117-18 for their FD.

This is their 3rd season together so they aren't THAT new, lol. But, yes, I'm with you in being very surprised at how close they are to hitting top ten given how young they are and that they've only been together just over 2 years. Like I said in the US Olympic selection thread, if StepBuk don't show up at Italy next week, I won't be at all surprised to see GrePar win a surprise bronze. I only hope they can sustain the momentum they're building. CarPon and McNamara/Carpenter both came up fresh out of juniors a few years ago and won some surprise GP bronzes and we know where both of those teams are right now - struggling and kaput.

 

[VGThuy]

This is their 3rd season together so they aren't THAT new, lol. But, yes, I'm with you in being very surprised at how close they are to hitting top ten given how young they are and that they've only been together just over 2 years. Like I said in the US Olympic selection thread, if StepBuk don't show up at Italy next week, I won't be at all surprised to see GrePar win a surprise bronze. I only hope they can sustain the momentum they're building. CarPon and McNamara/Carpenter both came up fresh out of juniors a few years ago and won some surprise GP bronzes and we know where both of those teams are right now - struggling and kaput.

For ice dance three years together is not a lot. Look at how long teams in the top ten at worlds have been together. And unlike other teams, they haven’t had the opportunity to enjoy a full international season during the second year of their partnership due to you know what.

 

[Colonel Green]

Can we discuss the implications of the first two Grand Prix events? So many questions, and I just wanted to see you all's opinions.

1) Is the Piper/Paul bronze from last Worlds with that 130 FD score, and their continued momentum this season, coming at the cost of Canada's #2 and #3? Like is ice dance still so political that it's a tradeoff between your federation's teams; e.g. for your top team to medal at the Olympics, you'll trade placements for your lower teams...

At Skate America, F-B/S were uncomfortably close to S/D's scores, in fact falling behind them in the FD. Clearly they weren't at their best in the FD so maybe that's all there was to it.

L/L also have not been moving forward this season at all score-wise, even in the Canada events where they're not making visible errors. Position-wise, they're actually sliding backwards.

F-B/S mainly just had level issues, I don't think that reflects anything else (though I think it's undeniable that the free dance isn't an audience favourite like S/D's is, also).

In L/L's case, they're definitely not moving up, but I don't know that they're really losing ground (they ended up with the same ordinal at SCI they had last time). But for them, I don't think pushing them is really a priority for either the fed or their coaches right now (in the latter case, that's the downside to sharing the same coaching staff as like half the field). At both ACI and SCI, I.A.M.'s job #1 was pretty clearly trying to generate momentum for S/D to help them snag the Olympic dance spot (which right now is the biggest proxy battle in the larger conflict between I.A.M. and Zhulin over Olympic gold).

4) Lilah/Lewis's no good Skate Canada- mistakes abounded, including the super clunky end to their free-dance. So is this really a readjustment of their position as people are suggesting, or just a particularly bad competition for them?

The judges were totally ready to give them the bronze here. They're just starting the season rather roughly.

Which could turn into a momentum reverse if they don't firm things up, mind you, but I don't think that's at hand just yet.

 

[GoneWithTheWind]

3) Where should we expect Charlene/Marco to land at the Olympics? Babs was clapping and stating "Bravo!" after their 121 came up in Skate Canada. Is that really where they'd want to be position-wise? Or was she conveying "this is the best you can get competing in Canada?"

I think Barbara was going with the "this is the best you can get in Canada, so let's be happy you skated clean and got over 200". However, I felt they were lowballed in the scores across both programs (especially in the SS mark and in the GOE on some elements - how did their spin only get +1.88?), and their tech marks were surprising low (they seemed surprised too, judging by the comments in the press conference). I imagine Barbara will be drilling them hard on the tech before their next event. Overall, they were probably always going to get silver here, so the placement ended correctly but I don't think they should've been as far as 10 points behind 1st.

Realistically, they'd have to be at their very, very best (probably coupled with small mistakes from others) to crack the top 5 at the Olympics, if all the top teams are there and are, sadly, much more likely to be 6th or 7th. Aside from any other factors, they just don't have the politics behind them to climb much higher than that. I really hope they might manage a medal at post-Olympic worlds though.

4) Lilah/Lewis's no good Skate Canada- mistakes abounded, including the super clunky end to their free-dance. So is this really a readjustment of their position as people are suggesting, or just a particularly bad competition for them?

I think this was a particularly bad competition but, while the twizzle error was the main issue, it also proved they can't afford mistakes on their choreo elements as it's the massive GOE from them that partially props up their ranking. I also think that, because this free dance isn't as flashy and fun as the last couple, it's making it more difficult to cover up their lower level skating skills/tech because there isn't the exciting, in-your-face choreo.

It will be interesting to see where they end up in the fight for bronze at NHK Trophy; they'll be up against Hawayek/Baker and Hurtado/Khaliavin there.

 

[Bigbird]

I think Barbara was going with the "this is the best you can get in Canada, so let's be happy you skated clean and got over 200". However, I felt they were lowballed in the scores across both programs (especially in the SS mark and in the GOE on some elements - how did their spin only get +1.88?), and their tech marks were surprising low (they seemed surprised too, judging by the comments in the press conference). I imagine Barbara will be drilling them hard on the tech before their next event. Overall, they were probably always going to get silver here, so the placement ended correctly but I don't think they should've been as far as 10 points behind 1st.

Realistically, they'd have to be at their very, very best (probably coupled with small mistakes from others) to crack the top 5 at the Olympics, if all the top teams are there and are, sadly, much more likely to be 6th or 7th. Aside from any other factors, they just don't have the politics behind them to climb much higher than that. I really hope they might manage a medal at post-Olympic worlds though.

I think this was a particularly bad competition but, while the twizzle error was the main issue, it also proved they can't afford mistakes on their choreo elements as it's the massive GOE from them that partially props up their ranking. I also think that, because this free dance isn't as flashy and fun as the last couple, it's making it more difficult to cover up their lower level skating skills/tech because there isn't the exciting, in-your-face choreo.

It will be interesting to see where they end up in the fight for bronze at NHK Trophy; they'll be up against Hawayek/Baker and Hurtado/Khaliavin there.

This year, IMHO, S/D are just better than H/K.

 

[Gris]

I also think that, because this free dance isn't as flashy and fun as the last couple, it's making it more difficult to cover up their lower level skating skills/tech because there isn't the exciting, in-your-face choreo.

I agree. For me the novelty of their programs has worn off which makes it harder to ignore their technical issues. I also think they themselves don't seem to be that much into this FD compared to the previous two.

As for Guignard / Fabbri, I'm not a fan of either program this season (the RD is pretty bad honestly), but them being constantly lowballing is really a shame.

 

[angi]

2) Christina/Anthony. What is this season? Under 100 for the FD at Skate Canada is kind of a disaster as they had the lowest base value, and their GOE didn't help them at all. Smart/Diaz on the other hand had the second lowest base value in the FD but managed to medal.

Adjusting to a new technique is hard, especially for a team that doesn't have a lot of experience (relatively speaking). They first need to solve the levels issues, it cost them 3.5 points in the FD where they missed levels on twizzles, lifts, and spin. They are also trying to go for harder lifts which they are struggling with.
Perhaps they were trying to go too big this season by trying new styles while learning new techniques and upgrading their lifts all at the same time, but I do think that since this is the season where they have nothing really to lose it was the right time to move. I think they just need more time and a lot of work, the question is if they won't freak out about the perceived drop (which mainly happened in PCS since the beginning of the season).

 

[litenkyckling]

Have we all forgotten that Michael Parsons is a junior world champion? Gr/P have always been technically sound, this is just the first time they've had good material. Plus, they've trained with the same coaches forever so there wasn't the same kind of adjustment period in that sense. Like, I just don't find them doing well a surprise?

 

[litenkyckling]

Adjusting to a new technique is hard, especially for a team that doesn't have a lot of experience (relatively speaking). They first need to solve the levels issues, it cost them 3.5 points in the FD where they missed levels on twizzles, lifts, and spin. They are also trying to go for harder lifts which they are struggling with.
Perhaps they were trying to go too big this season by trying new styles while learning new techniques and upgrading their lifts all at the same time, but I do think that since this is the season where they have nothing really to lose it was the right time to move. I think they just need more time and a lot of work, the question is if they won't freak out about the perceived drop (which mainly happened in PCS since the beginning of the season).

I agree with this - and I actually think that there are some visible improvements with them. Saturday just wasn't their day.

I think the FD score is a cause for concern BUT given that their tech score was lower than usual and L/L were kind of lowballed here, it's not as concerning? I think this move was nescessary for their future and their health, and this uncomfortable season will be too. They've not had a flop season yet as seniors so I guess this is it for them. I can't help but think that them missing US Nats did a bit of damage too. Hopefully next season, with more time under new coaches under their belt, they'll come back strong and with more personalised programmes.

 

[PRlady]

Honestly I also think that CarPon don’t have any USFS politics behind them. First because they save their lobbying for the top 2 who are medal threats (without a clear hierarchy between them) and second because no one knows if Christina will get citizenship before ‘26. If Nguyen/Kolesek hadn’t split I think they’d be the next team in line for a big push but as it is, Gre/Parsons have a lot going for them. Caroline is amazingly mature in her performance ability and just like Maddy Hubble a decade ago, the sky’s the limit now that she and Michael aren’t limited to choreo appropriate for siblings.

 

[angi]

I agree with this - and I actually think that there are some visible improvements with them. Saturday just wasn't their day.

I think the FD score is a cause for concern BUT given that their tech score was lower than usual and L/L were kind of lowballed here, it's not as concerning? I think this move was nescessary for their future and their health, and this uncomfortable season will be too. They've not had a flop season yet as seniors so I guess this is it for them. I can't help but think that them missing US Nats did a bit of damage too. Hopefully next season, with more time under new coaches under their belt, they'll come back strong and with more personalised programmes.

I agree with pretty much everything you wrote, and overall the judging at this event felt very uneven to me, it was really apparent in the choreographic elements and lifts. Lajoie/Lagha had a beautiful curve lift that should pretty much check most of the boxes - difficult entrance, an amazing position from both, innovative, good speed, but they still only got +2/+3 for it, same for Fear/Gibson's curve lift and combination lift (that was one of the most difficult at the event).
The choreographic elements are a real issue for me, the GOE for them seem mostly related to how the judges perceive the ranking of the team and it translates to a gap of 1.5-2 points for each element, and when you have three of them it's 4-6 points difference for different FDs with the same BV. So a team like Lajoie/Lagha or Carreira/Ponomarenko will always get +2/+3 at best for them no matter how good they are performed.

 

[sap5]

Perhaps they were trying to go too big this season by trying new styles while learning new techniques and upgrading their lifts all at the same time, but I do think that since this is the season where they have nothing really to lose it was the right time to move. I think they just need more time and a lot of work, the question is if they won't freak out about the perceived drop (which mainly happened in PCS since the beginning of the season).

I would think the beauty of the IAM system where everything is broken into 15 min blocks each day, every week, is that skaters, parents, etc can really see the plan for improvement, and make adjustments.

 

[VGThuy]

Have we all forgotten that Michael Parsons is a junior world champion? Gr/P have always been technically sound, this is just the first time they've had good material. Plus, they've trained with the same coaches forever so there wasn't the same kind of adjustment period in that sense. Like, I just don't find them doing well a surprise?

As a fan of the Parsons, I didn't forget that he was a Junior World champion. I just didn't expect the three-year-old team that both got out of long-term partnerships with their siblings to gel as fast as they did (same coaches or no) and to be scoring this close to Hawayek/Baker's Worlds 2021 scores, a team that's been competing in the senior level forever. Usually, by the Olympic season, the hierarchy in U.S. ice dance is pretty much set, especially when it's been the same three teams going to Worlds for the past four seasons (well three out of the past four seasons since there was no Worlds in 2020 thanks to you-know-what).

 

[sap5]

As a fan of the Parsons, I didn't forget that he was a Junior World champion. I just didn't expect the three-year-old team that both got out of long-term partnerships with their siblings to gel as fast as they did (same coaches or no) and to be scoring this close to Hawayek/Baker's Worlds 2021 scores, a team that's been competing in the senior level forever. Usually, by the Olympic season, the hierarchy in U.S. ice dance is pretty much set, especially when it's been the same three teams going to Worlds for the past four seasons (well three out of the past four seasons since there was no Worlds in 2020 thanks to you-know-what).

We haven't see H/B at all this season. I wonder if they will score higher than G/P, or if they will be at the same level.

 

[chantilly]

Much preferred Gr/Par’s performance at Skate Canada.

It’s is a well choreographed program. Very unique and fresh

Reminds me of the feeling I had seeing the Georgian team a couple of seasons ago.

They clearly need more speed, power, ice coverage, and confidence.

But it’s nice to see something modern in ice dance that is not lyrical.

I think Piper and Paul are much stronger skaters now in the last two seasons. They definitely have more confidence and perform better as well.

They improved last year but I was kind of blown away with their RD at Skate Canada.

I think they have a real shot at the podium.

I think it’s a bronze medal depending on H/D and S/K. But I think they are better skaters now than C/B, S/B and have better material.

We will see.

I’ve always liked Piper and Paul, but I’ve grown to love them in the last two seasons.

 

[Brenda_Bottems]

I suspect the British team will tumble down the standings this season,as they no longer can rely on their patented vulgar brand of flimsy disco trifles to seduce the judges.

-BB

I hate to say it,but I told you so...

-BB

 

[Peepsquick]

Much preferred Gr/Par’s performance at Skate Canada.

I had the opposite reaction ... I loved their FD the first time I saw it because it was inventive and different. This time around, it struck me as "heavy" (for lack of a better word) and slow. I must say that Caroline's outfit was also distracting (in a bad way ...)I think they are heading in the right direction but they need to change a few things.

I think Piper and Paul are much stronger skaters now in the last two seasons. They definitely have more confidence and perform better as well.

They improved last year but I was kind of blown away with their RD at Skate Canada.

I think they have a real shot at the podium.

I do think that Piper and Paul have improved their skating skills but I miss their "old" style. I have a few favorites: their Tango FD (sorry, I don't remember the season) and their 2016 FD: it was really innovative and mesmerizing! The past few seasons, I caught myself loving their RDs over their FDs (unpopular opinion:sorry, not a fan at all ... ). I hope they have a fabulous season though.

I think it’s a bronze medal depending on H/D and S/K. But I think they are better skaters now than C/B, S/B and have better material.

We will see.

I’ve always liked Piper and Paul, but I’ve grown to love them in the last two seasons.

I do not understand L/L's scoring ...

 

[PRlady]

I don't see Gil/Poi as having better skating skills than Chock/Bates at all. Madison is a better skater than Piper and Evan has a slight edge (pardon the pun) over Paul. But chacun a son gout.

 

[aka_gerbil]

I would think the beauty of the IAM system where everything is broken into 15 min blocks each day, every week, is that skaters, parents, etc can really see the plan for improvement, and make adjustments.

Except coaching is not a one-size fits all situation. Some skaters struggle in a system others thrive under.

 

[sap5]

Except coaching is not a one-size fits all situation. Some skaters struggle in a system others thrive under.

True. I just don't think C/P are struggling. To me, it looks like they are re-working the way they skate, which will take time.

 

[Sonata]

I'm curious as to whether the long-term plan for C/P is to stay in London? What happens after this Olympic cycle when other teams (including possibly Gr/P) express interest in I.AM in Montreal? Do C/P get first dibs, especially considering that she grew up in Montreal?

Also D/S above L/L? I did not see that coming. I also wonder why an ice dance team would choose Moulin Rouge as their FD music for this cycle as it begs comparison with V/M's 2018 Olympic FD. Is it some weird cosmic coincidence that Igor Shpilband, who used to coach V/M, gave D/S the Moulin Rouge music, and that D/S skated to this right before Scott Moir's team skated? And then G/F - Barbara, did you still the Moulin Rouge FD lift?? The one that is the climax to V/M's program? With Moir sitting in the arena?? Otherwise I quite liked G/F. All I needed was Annabelle Morozov to show up with her Moulin Rouge costume rip-off and the trifecta of flattering imitation would have been complete.

I found the music to Gilles/Poirier's free strangely irritating. Maybe it's the added dance beats (or what I assumed were added dance beats). I found the colour choice in the SD courageous, but it also brought attention to their lack of unison.

 

[marbri]

I'm curious as to whether the long-term plan for C/P is to stay in London? What happens after this Olympic cycle when other teams (including possibly Gr/P) express interest in I.AM in Montreal? Do C/P get first dibs, especially considering that she grew up in Montreal?

Also D/S above L/L? I did not see that coming. I also wonder why an ice dance team would choose Moulin Rouge as their FD music for this cycle as it begs comparison with V/M's 2018 Olympic FD. Is it some weird cosmic coincidence that Igor Shpilband, who used to coach V/M, gave D/S the Moulin Rouge music, and that D/S skated to this right before Scott Moir's team skated? And then G/F - Barbara, did you still the Moulin Rouge FD lift?? The one that is the climax to V/M's program? With Moir sitting in the arena?? Otherwise I quite liked G/F. All I needed was Annabelle Morozov to show up with her Moulin Rouge costume rip-off and the trifecta of flattering imitation would have been complete.

I found the music to Gilles/Poirier's free strangely irritating. Maybe it's the added dance beats (or what I assumed were added dance beats). I found the colour choice in the SD courageous, but it also brought attention to their lack of unison.

I will say I think it's a curious choice indeed that Igor gave Davis/Smolkin that MR FD (with some bold similarities in music and moves) the same year Scott starts coaching Carr/Pom after they leave Igor. Reminded me a bit of the year Igor and Marina split up, V/M chose to stay with Marina, Cappellini/Lanotte start training with Igor and he gives them a Carmen FD to compete against V/M's Carmen FD (which he knew about before working with C/L).

I have never had any bad feelings about Igor, ever, but once is a coincidence, twice? Makes me wonder if he has a vengeful or bitter side to him ? Did anything similar happen when Chock/Bates left him?

 

[litenkyckling]

I will say I think it's a curious choice indeed that Igor gave Davis/Smolkin that MR FD (with some bold similarities in music and moves) the same year Scott starts coaching Carr/Pom after they leave Igor. Reminded me a bit of the year Igor and Marina split up, V/M chose to stay with Marina, Cappellini/Lanotte start training with Igor and he gives them a Carmen FD to compete against V/M's Carmen FD (which he knew about before working with C/L).

I have never had any bad feelings about Igor, ever, but once is a coincidence, twice? Makes me wonder if he has a vengeful or bitter side to him ? Did anything similar happen when Chock/Bates left him?

To be fair, D/S had this copycat FD last year as juniors too. But as we all know, Igor doesn't have a single bone of originality in his body. I was quite amused when during the commentary for C/P's RD Kaitlyn Weaver mentioned how they're used to skating to music everyone already knows, and Ted Barton said it was a great change that they aren't this year. Made me chuckle. Igor's poor choices is a huge part of why his teams just stagnate.

Interestingly though, C/P did get given a Dr Zhivago when C/B had already done one with Igor and they were also given a flameno which echoed V/M's 2010 OD. I think that they're not used to having a voice when it comes to programmes, so this move will be a good way for them to finally find their voice.