U.S. Men 2018-19 season (cont.) - news & updates

[aftershocks]

I for one wish we were still allowed to listen in to entire press teleconferences with U.S. athletes prior to major events. The notes and articles afterward are welcome, of course. But write-ups and notes can't take the place of first-hand listening. Most likely though, USFS nixed contnuing to make the teleconferences available to the wider public because of endless speculation and over-analysis by fans that often ensued.

IceTalk recently played a small portion of the recent teleconference with Ashley Cain & Timothy LeDuc, which was a wonderful morsel to hear up-close and personal. Sigh.

Meanwhile, that was a nice write-up on Nathan by NYT journalist, Karen Crouse. The article has it's own thread in GSD, and it's also being discussed in Nathan's fan thread. For those concerned about 'equal time,' I recall that lovely and lengthy NYT feature last year post-U.S. Nationals about Jason Brown's rare artistry.

Just reading the Nathan feature, which is truthfully about more than Nathan, should actually cause us to pause and to examine our own lives (or the lives of our children/ younger generation), re the nature of goal-setting, and melding professional and/or athletic pursuits with our personal lives. What is the value and meaning of our own journeys? Good luck to Nathan and to all TeamUSA athletes at Worlds!

 

[aftershocks]

I was recently re-watching these gems and getting stoked:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvswULFC2Bw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4q9GFtiSrYc Ah, look at some of the comments...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jziRzx_rejw This was an interesting online NYT feature before the 2018 Olympics that I must have seen, but had forgotten about

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TX19SEKD49o Nathan's Olympic fp (At the time, I thought 17th place in the sp was warranted, if somewhat harsh; since then I've wondered about that placement, in light of how generally lenient and accommodating the judges were on Patrick, and have been on Yuzu and Shoma when they've faltered; granted that Nathan's faltering was huge in a big moment. Eh, in any case, coming back from so far with nothing to lose may have been what Nathan needed in that moment)

 

[Carolla5501]

Well, thank you for that stellar contribution to the conversation.

Your welcome.

(After all your attempt to whine about tweets was also a stellar contribution LOL)

 

[Dobre]

ETA- I do think the one major issue Nathan had in the past that led to the occasional screw up was his toying with jumping passes involving various quads. It seems that by setting his jump layouts in stone he might show us something special like he did at Nationals

Nathan hasn't done the same jump layout in two free programs all season. Per Jackie's tweet from practices yesterday, Jackie thinks Nathan is now aiming for 4Lz 4F 4S 3A 4T3T 4T3T 3F1Eu3S. (Jackie is not always correct when he interprets Nathan's practices. It's a hypothesis). Nathan said during the press conference at Nationals that they decided pretty late, while he was at Nationals, not to go for the sal there so I do think it has been part of the plan longterm. (Really, Nathan does not tell people his jump format in pre-competition interviews. He tells you some of the story some of the time). Anyway, I think he has had a longterm plan all season. But I wouldn't use the term "set in stone." I would say rather that his LP format has "evolved" along a generally planned trajectory. Though he also makes decisions based on what is working during the practices.

 

[el henry]

Your welcome.

(After all your attempt to whine about tweets was also a stellar contribution LOL)

LOL I think not.

@Tavi didn't whine about Jackson B. Squat. She pointed out that the Twitter coverage was heavily concentrated to Nathan and and that the one quote from Jason we've heard a million gazillion times before.

True statements both.

Whining? I don't think so, Tim. LOL.

 

[BittyBug]

Are we back in grade school?

 

[olympic]

Nathan hasn't done the same jump layout in two free programs all season. Per Jackie's tweet from practices yesterday, Jackie thinks Nathan is now aiming for 4Lz 4F 4S 3A 4T3T 4T3T 3F1Eu3S. (Jackie is not always correct when he interprets Nathan's practices. It's a hypothesis). Nathan said during the press conference at Nationals that they decided pretty late, while he was at Nationals, not to go for the sal there so I do think it has been part of the plan longterm. (Really, Nathan does not tell people his jump format in pre-competition interviews. He tells you some of the story some of the time). Anyway, I think he has had a longterm plan all season. But I wouldn't use the term "set in stone." I would say rather that his LP format has "evolved" along a generally planned trajectory. Though he also makes decisions based on what is working during the practices.

It was reported on the TSL preview that he was going to keep the same jump layout(s) from Nationals. That is what I was referring to.

 

[barbarafan]

This is a newer interview with Jason
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgoO7SnXmY4&feature=youtu.be

 

[Dobre]

It was reported on the TSL preview that he was going to keep the same jump layout(s) from Nationals. That is what I was referring to.

Nathan might. Jackie has updated his hypothesis with that format today. We'll see what happens.

 

[CassAgain]

Great SP showing from US men!

I am intrigued by the Jason Brown/Brian Orser dynamic. Brian has an air of ambivalent incredulity every time Jason’s scores come up, like I would have that five points lower, but hey, we’ll take it.

Tracy, though, seems to have found her person.

 

[barbarafan]

Great SP showing from US men!

I am intrigued by the Jason Brown/Brian Orser dynamic. Brian has an air of ambivalent incredulity every time Jason’s scores come up, like I would have that five points lower, but hey, we’ll take it.

Tracy, though, seems to have found her person.

I think he is finding it almost unbelievable that the judges are actually rewarding Jason for what he is putting out there instead of skipping him as he does not have a quad. That being said there were 3 judges giving him PCS in the 8's but the others were all in the 9's. Lots of 5's in the GOEs.

 

[CassAgain]

That's an odd stance from the guy's own coach, though, right?

 

[caseyedwards]

I think he is finding it almost unbelievable that the judges are actually rewarding Jason for what he is putting out there instead of skipping him as he does not have a quad. That being said there were 3 judges giving him PCS in the 8's but the others were all in the 9's. Lots of 5's in the GOEs.

Why would this be so? Americans don’t need to have quads. Chen is the first american to ever win a world title with a quad. Now Brown will win a title without one. Like lysacek did.

 

[greenapple]

Brian Orser is not Jason Brown's coach. All credit goes to Tracy Wilson. Winning or placing simply by landing quads is so retro last season. Hanyu had no quad in the short but his PCS was in the high 9s. The difference between him and Brown was what in the SP?

Both have outstanding skating skills, musicality and interpretation and both were rewarded for that.

 

[nimi]

Hanyu hd no quad in the short but his PCS was in the high 9s. The difference between him and Brown was what in the SP?

Huh? Hanyu popped the sal but he did land a 4T3T in his short. You can always argue about the GOEs, but claiming that he had no quad in his short is a pretty wild claim to make.

But this is U.S. men's thread so congrats to Jason and Nathan for their fabulous SPs! I loved both!

BTW, Nathan had this to say about the FS skating order and having to deal with the onslaught of Poohs:

Chen: It's not my first time skating after Hanyu. The raining of the Pooh bears is an incredible sight to see. It's amazing thing - it's great to see the fans do this and try to make us feel happy. I have to focus on being mentally prepped.

https://twitter.com/rockerskating/status/1108711645486956544

 

[Max Enchilada]

Why would this be so? Americans don’t need to have quads. Chen is the first american to ever win a world title with a quad. Now Brown will win a title without one. Like lysacek did.

This makes me so outraged!! I feel like Max Aaron needs to be retroactively rewarded with a world title! Ross Miner too!!

 

[Max Enchilada]

Your welcome.

(After all your attempt to whine about tweets was also a stellar contribution LOL)

Even I know the correct spelling is you're welcome!

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Are you telling me that the US men almost swept the SP podium???

Ive stayed out of this thread all day so i could watch the telecast first...

Wow.... just Wow.....

OMG... reminds me of the days of 91 in ladies. lol

So excited for the free.

 

[AxelAnnie]

I think he is finding it almost unbelievable that the judges are actually rewarding Jason for what he is putting out there instead of skipping him as he does not have a quad. That being said there were 3 judges giving him PCS in the 8's but the others were all in the 9's. Lots of 5's in the GOEs.

I think Jason's skating and presentation has improved greatly, and that is what is showing up with the scores. And Jason's jump placements for max scoring has also helped.

 

[DreamSkates]

That's an odd stance from the guy's own coach, though, right?

Orser's reaction strikes me as pleasantly surprised (because skaters with quads normally get the higher goe's).

 

[Carolla5501]

That's an odd stance from the guy's own coach, though, right?

Actually what I always find odd is that we have such expert mind readers on here

 

[misskarne]

Orser's reaction strikes me as pleasantly surprised (because skaters with quads normally get the higher goe's).

I think Orser is just surprised that the judges go so high on PCS for Jason because of how much PCS has been tied to TES in recent years. Even if Jason's PCS relative to Hanyu/Chen was too low on this occasion.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ I think Orser was mostly very surprised to see Jason topping Hanyu in the sp.

Well, it was cool to see three U.S. men in the top four at Worlds (in the sp). And kudos for how well Vincent Zhou skated in both programs. Winning bronze is such a great bonus for Vincent's struggles this season! Jason was great in the sp, which is just a great program for him. I really hope Jason gets two good programs next season. He should not settle for less, like he did this season with this problematic fp.

Skating last at Worlds in all disciplines for this season, I totally wish Jason had just decided to go clean and not feel like he had to protect his position or something by going for a quad. He goes for it, ends up falling and then messes up other jumps and the program falls flat, because it's a problematic program to begin with. Oh well, good job overall for these guys. But sad to see Jason fall so low in the standings (it was just low in the fp, since overall he's in 9th). If he had just concentrated on skating clean, he would have dropped not quite as far, with good GOE.

Nathan was amazing skating right after Winnie the Pooh's favorite Little Prince. That was a great battle by Hanyu to try and pull up. The judges sure give Hanyu huge GOE on his best jumps. Overall, it was fairly decent scoring in the men's event. Way to go Nathan!!! And kudos to Michal Brezina too! And also a good job by Kevin Aymoz, although not exactly his best in the fp. I was glad to see Kolyada redeem himself in the fp. It's looking like Russia will only have two men at Worlds next season though. And unfortunately for Canada, only one men's spot and one two ladies spots. Too bad that France will have just missed out on sending two men to Worlds, as I believe Aymoz would have had to finish in the top ten and he landed in 11th.

ISU prez is just a huge fan at heart, wanting to get photo-ops separately with Nathan and Hanyu.

 

[Jammers]

Nathan has truly revolutionized US men's from a group of skaters know for great programs and skating but no quads to a powerhouse. Vincent is the result of Nathan's pushing the younger US men and it's now paid off with another US man on the podium who's even younger then him.

 

[aftershocks]

... Vincent is the result of Nathan's pushing the younger US men

I was thinking the same thing while watching Vincent and Nathan skate in the fp. It's not just younger U.S. men either, it's U.S. men in general, because veterans like AdaRipp have also been inspired by Nathan. And I'm sure Jason has been as well.

It will be interesting to see if Nathan goes for the same school and training schedule next season. He'll probably take summer courses so that perhaps he can wind down a bit next season, and then be in a position for the 2020-2021 season to take some time off from school. It certainly worked well for Nathan this season with the scheduling since Yale and US Fed helped him to be able to work it all out in a way he could manage. Hearing crickets from all the Nathan naysayers.

Correction re Canadian ladies: Okay, someone explained the math to me. Canada gets two ladies spots, and France still has only one men's spot, unfortunately.

 

[dawnie]

Congrats to Nathan and Vincent! Sad for Jason but without a quad I'm afraid he might be surpassed by other U.S. men like Tomoki if they improve drastically in the coming years.

 

[Dobre]

Wow! Congratulations to Nathan & Vincent for two terrific performances for each at Worlds! So impressed with how each rose to the challenge on that huge stage. Kudos.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

I just finished watching.. I was wondering/hoping if Vincent and Nathan would both end up on podium... Wow.... SO amazing!!!!

2 American men... I havent checked protocols yet... just one UR for Vincent??

Him and Bradie stepped it up as far as that.

Sad that Jason's program just kind of fell apart....

Looking forward to next season because his free music was my least favorite piece of music (maybe of all time. And my as* has been around.)

I even thought to myself when he was last to take the ice.... what a bummer that after Yuzuru and Nathan's great music we have to close out the show and listen to this sad sad downer.

Congrats USA men, 2 on podium, 3 in top 10!!

 

[Jammers]

Congrats to Nathan and Vincent! Sad for Jason but without a quad I'm afraid he might be surpassed by other U.S. men like Tomoki if they improve drastically in the coming years.

Jason is a solid 3rd man right now in the US and unless the younger guys like Camden, Alexei or Andrew improve dramatically he should be able to hold them off for another couple of seasons at the least. I do agree that Tomoki is a threat to him soon if he keeps improving. Also one other thing i've noticed is that Vincent is a late season skater who seems to start off slow but ends up peaking later in the season. Has a decent JGP season but then wns the silver at Nats in 2017 then wins Junior Worlds later that season then after a mediocre year on the GP he makes the podium at Nats last year and makes the Olympic team and finishes top 6. And now this season after another average GP season he wins silver at Nats bronze at 4CC and bronze at Worlds. His only real bad skate in a late season competition in the last 3 seasons was in the LP at Worlds last year but i think he was injured but still impressive what he does when it counts.

 

[livetoskate]

Vincent's new exhibition skate:

https://youtu.be/Jwx6euqsJXQ