Coughlin's Safe Sport Status Changed to Interim Suspension

[Deleted member 221]

This is a horrible, tragic situation, all-around. Coughlin's family deserves our sympathy, no matter what.

What did Brennan or Lease do beyond report what SafeSport published on their web site and what the USFS publicly stated? They stated that sources had told them there were multiple accusations, which may well be true. Remember that truth is an absolute defense, and any investigation of Brennan or Lease will have to involve an investigation of Coughlin to determine whether their statements were factual.

I am in no way wanting to speak ill of the dead, but the fact that Coughlin has made the sad decision to take his own life does not mean that the accusations against him were baseless. Yes, he is presumed innocent, but he had serious allegations levied against him, and he chose to end his life before the due process of investigating those allegations was complete.

This is a horrible, sad, tragic outcome regardless of guilt or innocence. Even if he had done whatever he was accused of doing, redemption was always possible. One or two or even 100 bad acts does not make a person irredeemable, and does not negate the good they've done. There is nothing wrong with the ISU, the USFS, or anyone else mourning the tragic loss. I join them in grieving him.

 

[Icetigger]

TSL reported that John was under investigation by Safe Sport for sexual misconduct. Which he was. That is a fact. They did not imply he was guilty of these charges. They were very deliberately measured about what they said.

Where is the error?

I've said all I am going to say. I don't think calling for an inquiry in to everything Dave Lease posted regarded this matter and allowed to be posted on his page and left unchallenged, or what Christine Brennan posted on twitter (though I have less of a problem with that) is at all an outrageous assertion; and I'm going to stand by it. You are welcome to provide your own intelligent review of what was posted. If someone with a sport dies in this sad and tragic manner it is only proper that everything be reviewed, including the way in which this particular case was reported and commented upon, and how any individuals conducted themselves with regard to this matter.

 

[princeton123]

I've said all I am going to say. I don't think calling for an inquiry in to everything Dave Lease posted regarded this matter and allowed to be posted on his page and left unchallenged is at all an outrageous assertion; and I'm going to stand by it. You are welcome to provide your own intelligent review of what was posted.

Dave has said nothing about this matter that USFSA and Safe Sport haven't confirmed. Dave isn't a villain here and he didn't kill anyone just because he vaguely criticized your favorite skaters once.

 

[Icetigger]

Dave has said nothing about this matter that USFSA and Safe Sport haven't confirmed.

Not true......

 

[DimaToe]

This is just going to be such a messy situation going forward. I hope that as a skating fan community we can provide support when and where needed, step back and “stick together” and remember that this is just ice skating at the end of the day and not make assumptions based on our own views or experiences of things. My eternal optimist is really coming out now

 

[GullyGirl84]

Very sad. John's death is sad. The possible abuse is very sad.

Not a Dave fan, but, to be fair, he only reported the investigation and Safesports actions. Parents have a right to know of these actions to protect their kids.

Christine mentioned possible additional complaints against him.

Abuse is a terrible thing. But remember, if the abuse stories are true, John is not the victim here.

The ISU should not be holding him up as a model for others. If he damaged lives as an abuser, he should be mourned by his family and loved ones.

As fans, we mourn what we thought he was before all this came out.

Abusers are among us.

This is how I feel. I’m not the biggest fan of TSL, but I watch from time to time, and there is no doubt in my mind that they do traffic in inuendo and rumors in some very personal and destructive ways. I do think that they seem thirsty and eager for publicity, and almost get off more on the suggestion of these types of things than actual reporting (they said that there is “stuff” about Vincent Restencourt that they “know” from their friends in France, which is why he can’t coach in France), and I disagree with him trying to drag Jackie Wong and Phil Hersh into this when they should just stick by their own reporting. But it seems that they were simply reporting what was on the SafeSport website that no one was talking about. John Coughlin was so active in the figure skating community, he’d been teaching seminars up until very recently with Gracie, and if I were a parent of a skater I would want to know that there was at least an investigation going on.

Just feel so awful for everyone involved, a lot of people are in pain right now, I hope that the investigation will continue. He seems like the very type of person who you could not imagine doing *this (editing because we don't know what *this was...which was part of the problem...but I'm not sure if there was a better way), but this is the exact thing that people say about abusers all of the time. There was an investigation going on, but he also had a figure skating community who would likely have stuck by him and had been willing to hear the investigation out before jumping to conclusions, I don't think others can be blamed for him choosing to end his own life though. I do think that his friends and family might feel that way in the immediate aftermath unfortunately, so this conversation will probably continue.

 

[mollymgr]

USFS just tweeted this.
https://twitter.com/USFigureSkating/status/1086606368885346305
We are stunned at the news of the death of two-time U.S. pairs champion John Coughlin. Our heartfelt and deepest sympathies are with his father Mike, sister Angela and the rest of his family. Out of respect to the family, we will have no further comment until a later time.

 

[LarrySK8]

What can these events shed light on? Firstly, it can raise awareness regarding suicide. Secondly, it can raise awareness on how public reporting of actions can impact someone's life. Thirdly, it can shed light on the vast differences between what is known about any allegations, and what is reported to and by the media in public. Lastly, it can shed light on the needs of the accused. While no one denies the need for help for the accusers, it seems that the accused also have needs to be addressed, and they need support and help also.

 

[Frau Muller]

TSL reported that John was under investigation by Safe Sport for sexual misconduct. Which he was. That is a fact. They did not imply he was guilty of these charges. They were very deliberately measured about what they said.

Where is the error?

Exactly. Brennan and TSL did not put Coughlin’s name on the SafeSport database.

 

[dancefan17]

I have known John for many years. I do not know if the allegations are true, but agree that this situation is tragic for everyone. One wonders if USFS had pressure to take action given the state of U.S. gymnastics, #metoo, and ever-growing media tendencies to report sensational news. When I recently heard the accusations and media reports, my first thought was this will be hard, maybe impossible for both the victim and John to recover from. Social media reaction to reports sometimes take away due process and influence decisions. Did that happen in this case? I don’t know. It is simply a tragic outcome all around.

Edited this to clarify my comments - did not intend to say anything negative or minimize the me too movement. Apologies if it sounded that way.

 

[Icetigger]

What can these events shed light on? Firstly, it can raise awareness regarding suicide. Secondly, it can raise awareness on how public reporting of actions can impact someone's life. Thirdly, it can shed light on the vast differences between what is known about any allegations, and what is reported to and by the media in public. Lastly, it can shed light on the needs of the accused. While no one denies the need for help for the accusers, it seems that the accused also have needs to be addressed, and they need support and help also.

Thank you for your post.

 

[Icetigger]

I have known John for many years. I do not know if the allegations are true, but agree that this situation is tragic for everyone. One wonders if USFS had pressure to take action given the state of U.S. gymnastics, #metoo, and ever-growing media tendencies to report sensational news. When I recently heard the accusations and media reports, my first thought was this will be hard, maybe impossible for both the victim and John to recover from. Sensational media reports sometimes take away due process and influence decisions. Did that happen in this case? I don’t know. It is simply a tragic outcome all around.

Which is why we must have an inquiry in to how this case was handled and how it was reported on.

 

[DimaToe]

@dancefan17 maybe sensational isn’t the best word choice when the #metoo movement is also involved in your post. Admins maybe it is time to close this thread? Whatever the outcome there will be time to break this all down once we know more about the claims and whatever else comes out.

 

[centerpt1]

I have known John for many years. I do not know if the allegations are true, but agree that this situation is tragic for everyone. One wonders if USFS had pressure to take action given the state of U.S. gymnastics, #metoo, and ever-growing media tendencies to report sensational news.

They took action because Safesport issued an interim suspension.

 

[starrynight]

Dave has said nothing about this matter that USFSA and Safe Sport haven't confirmed. Dave isn't a villain here and he didn't kill anyone just because he vaguely criticized your favorite skaters once.

I kind of feel compelled to point out that Dave certainly launches targeted personal campaigns against skaters, but that's usually just over petty personal nonsense. While unrelated to Coughlin's situation, it would be worth TSL remembering that the skaters are real people.

But to get back on topic, it's all very sad. It's also very difficult to know what to think. We literally know nothing of the allegations against Coughlin. We don't even know what these allegations were. It could be a thousand different things from one spectrum of seriousness to the other. We don't know if the allegations are true. We just don't know anything.

In this day and age of social media and the 24 hour news cycle, trial by [social] media is a very real thing, though. All nuance gone and everything reduced to the word count of a tweet. Everyone is free to broadcast an opinion and in this case it's to a very small audience of a niche sport. Everyone sees everything. And people on social media can get vengeful. It's sort of like the modern day equivalent of a hoard of villagers with flaming torches.

What is different about this is once upon a time a newspaper would have the editor and a journalist consider what to publish. Now it's just a tweet that anyone can send (even the USA president) without any checks and balances.

It's been clear for sometime now that this subject matter is an area of interest for Christine Brennan and she has been digging a lot in respect of different individuals.

 

[Finsta]

Would people rather victims or people claiming abuse be ignored by media and pretend it not happen because some people really like person being filed on? Some are sounding like hypocrites here. It not TSL or Brennan’s fault for making public aware. Seems people in this board want to blame everyone but the person filed on. This is why victims don’t come forward, why people keeps silencing victims? I feels sad that he chose to end his life. Sad for victim. And now sad that TSL and Brennan are being harassed and blamed for trying to stop people from covering up abuse claim. Who is the hypocrites here? All of you blaming people but pretending to be so upset over what happened with gymnastics. Sick.

 

[LarrySK8]

Even if he had done whatever he was accused of doing, redemption was always possible. One or two or even 100 bad acts does not make a person irredeemable, and does not negate the good they've done.

This is true and raises a point, which is, what are the needs of the accused? Safe Sport, etc is all about the accusers, but the needs of the accused are never addressed.

 

[princeton123]

Would people rather victims or people claiming abuse be ignored by media and pretend it not happen because some people really like person being filed on? Some are sounding like hypocrites here. It not TSL or Brennan’s fault for making public aware. Seems people in this bird want to blame everyone but the person filed on. This is why victims don’t come forward, why people keeps silencing victims? I feels sad that he chose to end his life. Sad for victim. And now sad that TSL and Brennan are being harassed and blamed for trying to stop people from covering up abuse claim. Who is the hypocrites here? All of you blaming people but pretending to be so upset over what happened eith gymnastics. Sick.

Thank you.

Where is this 'sensational' media reporting everyone is referring to? I've read both Brennan and TSL's reporting on this case and all they did was provide cold hard facts. John was under investigation for sexual misconduct from SafeSport. He was suspended and banned from USFSA events. Those are facts. They did not imply he was guilty. They simply provided skaters, the fans, and the community with information they were entitled to in order to keep their athletes safe.

This is true and raises a point, which is, what are the needs of the accused? Safe Sport, etc is all about the accusers, but the needs of the accused are never addressed.

Maybe it's because the accusers are the victims here.

 

[CaliSteve]

I have known John for many years. I do not know if the allegations are true, but agree that this situation is tragic for everyone. One wonders if USFS had pressure to take action given the state of U.S. gymnastics, #metoo, and ever-growing media tendencies to report sensational news. When I recently heard the accusations and media reports, my first thought was this will be hard, maybe impossible for both the victim and John to recover from. Sensational media reports sometimes take away due process and influence decisions. Did that happen in this case? I don’t know. It is simply a tragic outcome all around.

I believe USFSA followed protocol based on SafeSports decision.

While I understand the jest of your statement, we also have to be careful not to always label news as "sensational" and to also take a step back and let the process continue.

 

[starrynight]

I read Christine Brennan's most recent article and I can't see the reference to the SafeSport's sexual misconduct allegations that TSL and Christine Brennan are talking about. Is there another press release? The only reference I can see is to just 'allegations of misconduct'.

 

[rfisher]

Which is why we must have an inquiry in to how this case was handled and how it was reported on.

And who exactly would conduct such an inquiry? The police? TSL broke no laws. Unless, John left a note that specifically stated he chose to end his life because TSL reported what was public knowledge, there is nothing to investigate. I don't follow TSL for many reasons, but they didn't commit homicide. You need to step away from the internet and grieve for the loss of John Coughlin.

 

[russell30]

Condolences to John's Family and Friends....

Getting away from the subject I think TSL and maybe CB should stick to talking about skating competition and NOT directly talking of skaters, lets just stick to the competition!! guys....I notice on TSL (particularly since Jenny's departure) so much catty talk and not getting to the actual competitions, I so much prefer Tony wheeler...

All i get with TSL excuse the pun 'I am just saying" with a raised eyebrow

 

[Frau Muller]

I read Christine Brennan's most recent article and I can't see the reference to the SafeSport's sexual misconduct allegations that TSL and Christine Brennan are talking about. Is there another press release?

Safesport situation is cited here:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ghlin-found-dead-after-suspension/2623792002/

 

[russell30]

John has just died everyone lets have some respect! and not go on about Safesport

 

[Finsta]

deleted because computer issue

 

[starrynight]

.

 

[CaliSteve]

This is true and raises a point, which is, what are the needs of the accused? Safe Sport, etc is all about the accusers, but the needs of the accused are never addressed.

Thats a question for all of society. I am a firm believer in Restorative Justice.

 

[Frau Muller]

John has just died everyone lets have some respect! and not go on about Safesport

Another thread was opened about his death:

https://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/threads/john-coughlin-has-died.105133/

However, the word “SafeSport” may appear in obituaries.

 

[maureenfarone]

I am so very sad to learn of John's passing. Prayers for his family and friends.

 

[SpeedySucks]

This is a tragic and powerful reminder that SafeSport needs to make appropriate resources available to both the victims and the accused when allegations are brought forward. There are accused who (supposedly) have found out about SafeSport suspensions from Twitter or the media. That is absolutely unacceptable - SafeSport should be communicating with the accused before putting out any information on their website or social media. The accused also have rights and should have appropriate access to mental health resources to help them deal with the accusations. I fully support SafeSport in publishing the names of people who have been suspended on an interim basis due to misconduct allegations - this is necessary to prevent further victims during the investigation process - but SafeSport should also be concerned for the wellbeing of both the victims and the accused throughout the process.

My thoughts are with John's family for this devastating loss.