Can't Help Falling In Love ... with Hubbell & Donohue (fan thread #2)

[laviemn]

I think Madi & Zach's debut last season made more of an impact not because their programs were groundbreaking or a new style for them (they've had a sexy bluesy FD before), but because they exuded a new confidence and skated with an attack we've never seen so early in the season from them.

I think I was expecting the same kind of aggressivness from their debut this season, but maybe that super early, super intense level of preparation is too much to ask after an Olympic year. It was an exhausting, emotional season, and maybe they just need more time to build to the level we expect from them now. As long as they get there by March.

 

[kosjenka]

I'm not being facetious, I really want to understand. What envelope are they supposed to be pushing?

I think a World Silver medalist would have ambition and plan to compete for a gold medal in near future. The R&J program (as it is now) is very alike many programs that have been done in recent seasons and in my opinion, such program does not play to their strengths, that there are many of. It is not like they took the unlikely concept, and found a different spin about it. For instance, many years ago (but i think its a good example) Krylova and Ovsianikov skated to a very traditional dance, Masquerade in 1997 but in the program, they mirrored the music as when the music was faster, they went into a slow motion. It was very interesting way to portray the atmosphere and the characters they were playing. This was in old system, but it is a way a very general and often used piece can be done in a original way that can also be challenging to the skaters.

 

[blancanieves]

I think a World Silver medalist would have ambition and plan to compete for a gold medal in near future. The R&J program (as it is now) is very alike many programs that have been done in recent seasons and in my opinion, such program does not play to their strengths, that there are many of. It is not like they took the unlikely concept, and found a different spin about it. For instance, many years ago (but i think its a good example) Krylova and Ovsianikov skated to a very traditional dance, Masquerade in 1997 but in the program, they mirrored the music as when the music was faster, they went into a slow motion. It was very interesting way to portray the atmosphere and the characters they were playing. This was in old system, but it is a way a very general and often used piece can be done in a original way that can also be challenging to the skaters.

Okay, you speak of originality/creativity in the interpretation. I think H/D have proven they have that kind of creative ambition in them, throughout their career.

Also, differences in tone or choreography are sometimes very marked, and sometimes they can be subtle.

Basically, I'm not in a rush to forecast what this FD will be/do creatively/competitively. There's six months of season left.

 

[UMBS Go Blue]

ohhhhhhh yessssssss

https://www.instagram.com/p/BoaJ0mZnXjN/

 

[thvu]

Basically, I'm not in a rush to forecast what this FD will be/do creatively/competitively. There's six months of season left.

I want to be optimistic, but for this FD to work on the level their last two FDs did, it needs a total rework. H&D’s strength as performers isn’t subtlety, it’s raw emotion.

It reminds me of the rumors of V&M wanting to skate to Romeo and Juliet for the 2014 Oly season, and Zoueva said they were too old. Well, the same rings true for me about H&D.

 

[laviemn]

I want to be optimistic, but for this FD to work on the level their last two FDs did, it needs a total rework. H&D’s strength as performers isn’t subtlety, it’s raw emotion.

It reminds me of the rumors of V&M wanting to skate to Romeo and Juliet for the 2014 Oly season, and Zoueva said they were too old. Well, the same rings true for me about H&D.

R&J performed by older dancers or actors can work, it's just a different interpretation. The issue for me is that their interpretation is generic, and I wonder if the choregraphers at Gadbois have spread themselves too thin this season.

But, yes, there's 6 months left, and they've pulled off surprising reversals before. I remember all the predictions that their hip hop SD would hold them back that season.

 

[aftershocks]

Ice talk episode is up here (their interview starts around 25:30): Madi and Zach

I just came across the debut IceTalk episode interview with Madi and Zach. It's great listening to their articulate and straightforward assessments of last season, their off-season and their new programs. They have a cool and positive forward looking view of the next quad.

 

[hockeyplayer2]

Madison started a YouTube channel to share her make up tips...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pJZafR83snY&t=1139s

 

[blancanieves]

R&J performed by older dancers or actors can work, it's just a different interpretation. The issue for me is that their interpretation is generic, and I wonder if the choregraphers at Gadbois have spread themselves too thin this season.

This is my greatest concern as well. It's hard to imagine that every team will get the best (and non-similar) choreographic ideas out of the same group of individuals. P/C are consulting with Christopher Dean and Chock/Bates have Rohene Ward, but I don't think H/D can afford extra help. So it'll be very interesting to see how things unfold, but I don't want to underestimate anyone at this point. I'm hoping for the best.

 

[RoseRed]

This is my greatest concern as well. It's hard to imagine that every team will get the best (and non-similar) choreographic ideas out of the same group of individuals. P/C are consulting with Christopher Dean and Chock/Bates have Rohene Ward, but I don't think H/D can afford extra help. So it'll be very interesting to see how things unfold, but I don't want to underestimate anyone at this point. I'm hoping for the best.

Did Chock/Bates work with Rohene this year? They did in 2016-17, but not last year. They've worked with Christopher Dean the last couple of seasons on their FDs, but I don't think we've have any suggestion that they worked with him again this year.

Anyways, I think the bigger difference between this year and last year is that Madi and Zach don't seem as inspired this year (at least so far). Last year, they had music they really wanted to skate to and it made for a great FD. This year, didn't they say they picked R&J because they didn't have any other ideas and they liked the music? The Olympic season can take a lot out of skaters. They need to figure out what they really want this program to be.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ We should check the Programs spreadsheet in GSD re Chock/Bates. I don't think they are working with Rohene right now, but I'm not certain. ITA, as I mention below, that Madi/Zach seem creatively exhausted, and they even mentioned bing stumped in trying to find music for this season. Perhaps they need a break, but are unwilling to take one after finally achieving the podium success last season internationally that had been so elusive for them. I doubt they wish to lose any momentum, so they appear prepared to weather whatever they need to going forward. And they have continued to express their desire to compete another four years.

In terms of their new programs, Madi indicated that tango romantica is not their strong suit and that she had done that style only once before with her brother. They also seem to be somewhat emotionally and creatively exhausted by their past two richly creative, up-and-down, ultimately rewarding seasons. They both spoke about being stumped and having a hard time deciding what music to select for a fd. They eventually settled on Kissing You, as a song they had been previously interested in.

Madi/Zach have learned a lot and they are technically strong and artistically mature, so I have no doubt they will work things out over the course of the season. Still, I'm not blown away by either of their new programs. I just love watching them skate.

For that matter, I'm not impressed by either of Gilles/Poirier's choices this season. OTOH, I love the choices Weav/Po have made for this season. W/P are much improved and clearly more confident (I suppose particularly with V/M having left the scene).

 

[thvu]

This year, didn't they say they picked R&J because they didn't have any other ideas and they liked the music? The Olympic season can take a lot out of skaters. They need to figure out what they really want this program to be.

I definitely sent a great suggestion to Zach when he was asking for fan ideas on Instagram. I was so disappointed when they announced something so much more generic, and even more disappointed when the product matched the choice. Sigh... It’s hard to imagine R&J was their best idea/option, but here we are.

 

[aftershocks]

... It’s hard to imagine R&J was their best idea/option, but here we are.

I suppose it's early enough for them to make changes to their current choice, or go in another direction entirely.

 

[blancanieves]

Did Chock/Bates work with Rohene this year?

He was in Montreal in early September to work with them.

 

[laviemn]

This is my greatest concern as well. It's hard to imagine that every team will get the best (and non-similar) choreographic ideas out of the same group of individuals. P/C are consulting with Christopher Dean and Chock/Bates have Rohene Ward, but I don't think H/D can afford extra help. So it'll be very interesting to see how things unfold, but I don't want to underestimate anyone at this point. I'm hoping for the best.

My concern has grown every week with every Gadbois team's debut. I never agreed with the negative generalizations about Gadbois because I thought they did a good job of helping most of their teams (and not just the top teams) find their own styles and giving them rich choreography. But there's definitely more recycling this season. The Le Gacs' FD looks almost entirely assembled from their own previous programs.

H/D have never gone outside their own team for choreo that I know of and they're the only top team with a GoFundMe, so yeah, I think they are limited by finances. In that case, I think they should find material that is outside of Marie-France's comfort zone.

I don't want to seem pessimistic though as the Grand Prix hasn't even begun. I believe in their ability to develop their programs.

I definitely sent a great suggestion to Zach when he was asking for fan ideas on Instagram.

What did you suggest?

 

[kittysk8ts]

He was in Montreal in early September to work with them.

Yup. He was in TO at the Cricket Club with Jason Brown and then onto Gadbois.

https://www.instagram.com/p/BnkD9nEFT1Y/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=bhgf7vdehmj1

 

[kittysk8ts]

^^ We should check the Programs spreadsheet in GSD re Chock/Bates. I don't think they are working with Rohene right now, but I'm not certain. ITA, as I mention below, that Madi/Zach seem creatively exhausted, and they even mentioned bing stumped in trying to find music for this season. Perhaps they need a break, but are unwilling to take one after finally achieving the podium success last season internationally that had been so elusive for them. I doubt they wish to lose any momentum, so they appear prepared to weather whatever they need to going forward. And they have continued to express their desire to compete another four years.

In terms of their new programs, Madi indicated that tango romantica is not their strong suit and that she had done that style only once before with her brother. They also seem to be somewhat emotionally and creatively exhausted by their past two richly creative, up-and-down, ultimately rewarding seasons. They both spoke about being stumped and having a hard time deciding what music to select for a fd. They eventually settled on Kissing You, as a song they had been previously interested in.

Madi/Zach have learned a lot and they are technically strong and artistically mature, so I have no doubt they will work things out over the course of the season. Still, I'm not blown away by either of their new programs. I just love watching them skate.

For that matter, I'm not impressed by either of Gilles/Poirier's choices this season. OTOH, I love the choices Weav/Po have made for this season. W/P are much improved and clearly more confident (I suppose particularly with V/M having left the scene).

I just enjoying watching them skate as well, @aftershocks. It’s just that simple for me, with them. I liked R&J before all the feedback and now I am second guessing whether I really do. Lol. But it doesn’t matter when the skating is so lovely. .

 

[Debbie S]

He was in Montreal in early September to work with them.

Yup. He was in TO at the Cricket Club with Jason Brown and then onto Gadbois.

Per social media, Rohene visited Montreal on the weekend, after his trip to Toronto. It looked like he was just visiting C/B and hanging out, not working with them at the rink.

 

[blancanieves]

Per social media, Rohene visited Montreal on the weekend, after his trip to Toronto. It looked like he was just visiting C/B and hanging out, not working with them at the rink.

I might have caught one of M Chock's Instagram stories. The word "work" was used.

 

[VGThuy]

If I recall correctly, after working with him on their programs for the 2016-17 season, Madison and Evan said they liked working with Rohene so much that he's going to be a member of their team, I take it even if it's on a consultant capacity.

 

[mysticchic]

HD does have issues with money. They can't work in Canada due to visas. Every donation goes to ice time, coaching, training, choreography, music and PT (no health insurance in Canada). Their Mom's work to help pay their fees. Their monthly cost is around 15k. Madi's mom makes the costumes. I think there are still Christmas stockings available that Madi and her Mom made. They made a little money from SOI and prize money, but nowhere close to covering the cost. Madi got a car lease donated and Zach has a borrowed car.
I still want to take another look at the programs. Every year the programs evolve. So all this Debbie downer stuff is premature.

 

[Bigbird]

HD does have issues with money. They can't work in Canada due to visas. Every donation goes to ice time, coaching, training, choreography, music and PT (no health insurance in Canada). Their Mom's work to help pay their fees. Their monthly cost is around 15k. Madi's mom makes the costumes. I think there are still Christmas stockings available that Madi and her Mom made. They made a little money from SOI and prize money, but nowhere close to covering the cost. Madi got a car lease donated and Zach has a borrowed car.
I still want to take another look at the programs. Every year the programs evolve. So all this Debbie downer stuff is premature.

I love their programs.

 

[laviemn]

HD does have issues with money. They can't work in Canada due to visas. Every donation goes to ice time, coaching, training, choreography, music and PT (no health insurance in Canada). Their Mom's work to help pay their fees. Their monthly cost is around 15k. Madi's mom makes the costumes. I think there are still Christmas stockings available that Madi and her Mom made. They made a little money from SOI and prize money, but nowhere close to covering the cost. Madi got a car lease donated and Zach has a borrowed car.
I still want to take another look at the programs. Every year the programs evolve. So all this Debbie downer stuff is premature.

This is why I never criticize their costumes, or any skater's costume when I know they're homemade or purchased with very limited budgets. And I wouldn't be surprised if the programs look new and fresh after an additional month of training.

 

[mysticchic]

New interview with Skate Talk Online with Madi and Zach https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wrguGH2n64

 

[laviemn]

Looking forward to seeing the changes to their program and Madi's new costume at SA. Interesting to get their perspective on how their personal and skating lives intersect; it doesn't seem like there's the kind of tension that shippers like to imagine. And Zach had a great response to being asked yet again about their training mates: "...you start to realize it's not about them." Good for him.

 

[blancanieves]

New interview with Skate Talk Online with Madi and Zach https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wrguGH2n64

Thank you for the interview! I especially loved seeing their doggies demand their own camera time

 

[blancanieves]

A new interview from HeraldNet.com:

Skate America: Former rivals now star ice dancing duo

 

[hockeyplayer2]

Skate America Rhythm Dance...78.43 (-2 deductions, "fall"/costume)
https://youtu.be/oCdgKNjEERU

 

[lmarie086]

I still think Romeo + Juliet is a weird theme choice for Madison and Zach, but the program is clearly improved from SLC. I just wish it was different music, and I think that's going to be the case for me throughout the season, even as/if the program grows on me more. For now, I'm going to hope they take out the voiceovers (please) and hope that they go for a nonromantic theme/something more modern next season.

Congrats on the win!

 

[cocotaffy]

Congrats on their win I do share your feeling about the FD though @lmarie086 Still they proved to be solid performers today. On with next week now that should be te battle facing G/P.