War in Israel

[Andrey aka Pushkin]

Ok, a propos ways to help

Donate to Israel | Israel4Ukraine

www.israel4ukraine.org

This is a private charity ran by a friend of mine. He opened it when the Ukraine war started and found himself stuck in Kyiv. Upon arriving to Israel he opened this NGO that organised evacuation from Ukraine. And now, he provides the people from the South and soldiers with hot meals. So feel free I know him closely personally, so I trust where it goes, and between Israel and Ukraine, it's two birds with one stone. Funnily enough, I contacted him about my donation and casually mentioned Mr.Andrey doesn't have food at his base, and within 10 minutes he organised their lunch for tomorrow.

 

[becca]

Egypt is like “we don’t want those Palestinians here” and then it’s almost like Israel is trying to squeeze Gaza so much they just crush into Egypt

I am so sorry for anyone here who lost people and hope you are all okay. I am not going to get into the argument here.

It’s a little more complicated than that. Part of the other Arabs country is they don’t believe Israel will ever let the people back to their homes.

I've been kind of reading Egypt reddit

The Egyptians are saying we are poor already millions of refugees. We can barely feed Egyptians now.

And these people some will be Hamas what’s to stop them because they are mad.

And what’s to stop them from attacking Israel from here and then we will get labeled a terrorist nation.

They are also deeply afraid Israel will use it as an excuse to retake the Sinai.

Lots of them are saying 10 years from now Israel will take it from us if this happens and claim security. It’s a real source of concern.


They feel the root cause or the situation needs to be addressed. The Israel and Palestine issue and it shouldn’t be at Egypts expense

They are also tired of this Arabs have all this land talk. Arabs are not monolithic they did not all spring from the same place. They have a completely different dialect then the Palestinians.

Their country in actually is already cramped since so much of its desert.

Honestly Egypts position as not being a good long term refugee place is probably not incorrect. It’s an easy access point for Hamas or any militant group.

Palestinians here in the US there is some protests but there was no real issues.

All let’s just ethnically cleanse Palestinians does is push them to the next border. More angry then before.

They say you cannot bomb away ideas.

If they knew to the Palestinians could come back of course they would let them in.

 

[nylynnr]

The Egyptians are saying we are poor already millions of refugees. We can barely feed Egyptians now.

And these people some will be Hamas what’s to stop them because they are mad.

And what’s to stop them from attacking Israel from here and then we will get labeled a terrorist nation.

They are also deeply afraid Israel will use it as an excuse to retake the Sinai.

It's almost like, Egypt thinks it's a bad idea to open its borders to unvetted immigrants who could possibly be terrorists.

 

[TAHbKA]

11pm thoughts : should I take a shower now or the evening bombing began and I'd rather wait till like 3am and then take that shower?

 

[becca]

It's almost like, Egypt thinks it's a bad idea to open its borders to unvetted immigrants who could possibly be terrorists.

Yep. I think if they knew for sure it was temporary it would be different

 

[Buzz]

Someone is putting up posters of the missing around the city but as fast as they go up someone else is tearing them down.

 

[Allskate]

At a minimum, Egypt needs to allow non-Palestinians (including American citizens) to leave Gaza and help set up a corridor for humanitarian supplies. (Israel should be permitting food, water, and medicine in even if they need to also ensure that other things are not smuggled in and that the supplies actually go to the right people, though I realize it's not necessarily that easy.) There are varying reports about what the problem is at the Egyptian border. There were reports that the entry itself had been hit on the first day and was not operational but there also are reports that Hamas won't let people leave. It could be both.

It was a well planned op over a long period of time. Usually, they just fire a barrage of rockets. That's what I mean by more sophisticated.

This article talks about Hamas planning and training.

I have read about what they did with their planning and during the attack. I don't think that motorbikes, bulldozers, or paragliders are all that sophisticated. Their training grounds don't sound very sophisticated either. But, yes, this was more than their usual rocket fire and they planned it for longer. I just don't think Hamas necessarily needed others to help them with this planning. Hamas seemed to have a pretty clear strategy. Of course, that doesn't mean they didn't get help with the planning. And funding is whole other issue. What makes this all sadder is that they say that they used the appeal for jobs, money, and economic security for Palestinians as part of their strategy for the terrorism.

 

[MacMadame]

I wasn't being serious lol. As much as countries like those disgust me, the solution isn't supporting the opposition, destabilizing yet another country, and seeing even more civilians die.

Anyone who thinks that is an actual solution hasn't learned from history.

 

[becca]

Anyone who thinks that is an actual solution hasn't learned from history.

I think though Hamas kind of likely does have to be dealt with.

I think the issue is that way to often the United States has gone in with no plan.

It’s been we can get rid of Saddam, Assad, Kadaffi, and all will be well all the problems in this countries will be magically fixed. Without understanding that the three were basically holding a lid on a simmering pots underneath them.

There have been occupations that did work but those occupations partially worked because the occupier convinced the people it was temporary and if they compiled life would get better for them.

Making life better for the Palestinians so they have a good life to actually lose should be the goal.

I actually don’t think you always do that with immediate democracy

 

[Allskate]

President Biden reportedly convinced Israeli officials to resume the water supply from Israel, especially to the southern part of the Gaza Strip.

Israel resumes water supply to southern Gaza after U.S. pressure

Israel's decision to completely stop the water supply to Gaza exacerbated the already dire humanitarian situation in Gaza.

www.axios.com

 

[Judy]

another update: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...e-updates-gaza-israel-humanitarian-rcna120479

 

[Allskate]

another update: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...e-updates-gaza-israel-humanitarian-rcna120479

Thank you. Lots of terrible news in there, but there is this:

• The Palestinian Embassy said that foreign national Palestinians will be able to cross the border into Egypt starting at 9 a.m. local time Monday, 2 a.m. ET, when humanitarian aid will also begin crossing into Gaza.

 

[Judy]

Thank you. Lots of terrible news in there, but there is this:

• The Palestinian Embassy said that foreign national Palestinians will be able to cross the border into Egypt starting at 9 a.m. local time Monday, 2 a.m. ET, when humanitarian aid will also begin crossing into Gaza.

I know! Apparently there is huge amounts of humanitarian aid that’s been piling up.

 

[TAHbKA]

And something tells me it will not reach the simple people but will sink in Hamas' hands giving them yet another way to manipulate

 

[Allskate]

And something tells me it will not reach the simple people but will sink in Hamas' hands giving them yet another way to manipulate

I have no doubt that will be true for a lot of it. But not letting any food or medication in at all simply is not an acceptable option. I wish there could be a secure way of getting it in and keeping it out of the hands of Hamas, at least in some parts Gaza.

 

[becca]

And something tells me it will not reach the simple people but will sink in Hamas' hands giving them yet another way to manipulate

I would never donate to a charity for the Palestinians because you cannot guarantee it’s not going to Hamas. Or some other group.

A we have a Palestinian group of Christians that come over to Churches and sell religious crafts made by Christians there to help the Christian communities. I always try to buy something from them. Their the only ones I feel comfortable with.

 

[Vagabond]

But not letting any food or medication in at all simply is not an acceptable option.

It might be acceptable to Hamas.

 

[TAHbKA]

A zoom team meeting that was supposed to take 20 minutes and ended up lasting for an hour. Why? well, we live in different parts of Israel and the guys had to run to the shelters at least twice during. I was the only one north enough just to sit in front of an empty screen, hear their sirens and well.. wait

 

[barbk]

A zoom team meeting that was supposed to take 20 minutes and ended up lasting for an hour. Why? well, we live in different parts of Israel and the guys had to run to the shelters at least twice during. I was the only one north enough just to sit in front of an empty screen, hear their sirens and well.. wait

I remember the days immediately following 9/11, and there was no way I could focus. Nothing else seemed important, and I lived thousands of miles away from NY/Washingtion/Pennsylvania and didn't think I knew anyone directly involved. I have no idea how anyone in Israel can focus on work right now.

Hugs.

 

[Debbie S]

Analyst: Israel's costly misunderstanding of Hamas' true aims: https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/15/opinions/israel-misunderstood-hamas-kobi-michael-bergen

 

[Frau Muller]

Amazing tales of heroism are being revealed. For example, the former-IDF leader from Tel Aviv (Noam Tibon, 62), who drove to an attacked kibbutz to save his children and grandchildren…saving others during his drive.

Retired Israeli general who rescued his family under siege from Hamas is being compared on social media to Liam Neeson's character in 'Taken'

An Israeli grandfather and retired IDF general who rescued his granddaughters from Hamas is being compared on social media to Liam Neeson in "Taken."

www.businessinsider.com

 

[Allskate]

Amazing tales of heroism are being revealed. For example, the former-IDF leader from Tel Aviv (Noam Tibon, 62), who drove to an attacked kibbutz to save his children and grandchildren…saving others during his drive.

They were interviewed on 60 Minutes last night:

Grandparents race to rescue family at Israeli kibbutz during Hamas attack | 60 Minutes

As Hamas attacked, grandparents raced to a kibbutz to save family members. The grandfather, a retired IDF major general, shares the harrowing rescue story.#n...

www.youtube.com

 

[Frau Muller]

They were interviewed on 60 Minutes last night:

Grandparents race to rescue family at Israeli kibbutz during Hamas attack | 60 Minutes

As Hamas attacked, grandparents raced to a kibbutz to save family members. The grandfather, a retired IDF major general, shares the harrowing rescue story.#n...

www.youtube.com

What a story. Well told by 60 Minutes.

 

[TAHbKA]

I remember the days immediately following 9/11, and there was no way I could focus. Nothing else seemed important, and I lived thousands of miles away from NY/Washingtion/Pennsylvania and didn't think I knew anyone directly involved. I have no idea how anyone in Israel can focus on work right now.

Hugs.

We can't. Either I focus and then forget about everything, but the attention span seems to be even shorter than usual or just... not

 

[Allskate]

Here is a report on a heroic Palestinian paramedic who is a reminder that a person does not have to lose his own humanity because his people are being oppressed. Sadly, it does not have a happy ending:

An Arab paramedic who treated Israelis injured by Hamas militants is remembered as a hero

When Hamas unleashed its attack on thousands of Jews attending a music festival in southern Israel earlier this month, an Israeli Arab paramedic insisted on staying at the scene to try to save lives.

apnews.com

It's very sad that this Canadian-Israeli peace activist is now a Hamas hostage. It's also sad that Israel reportedly is making it difficult to get humanitarian aid to people in Gaza, insisting that Hamas must release hostages first. (Hamas clearly is not concerned about the health and safety of Palestinian civilians, so such an approach is useless.)

This 74-year-old peace activist, grandmother, and friend is feared abducted by Hamas

Friends and family call Vivian Silver, who went missing during Saturday's attacks, a loving friend and grandmother and a tireless peacenik.

forward.com

 

[PRlady]

Several of the hostages worked for peace. Vivien is well-known. Others drove Palestinian kids from Gaza for medical treatment in Israel or were active in dialogue groups.

Of course the right-wingers here say they got what they deserved for being credulous fools. The left says locking people up without hope or resolution for 18 years gave us this situation. And so it goes.

 

[just tuned in]

Several of the hostages worked for peace. Vivien is well-known. Others drove Palestinian kids from Gaza for medical treatment in Israel or were active in dialogue groups.

Of course the right-wingers here say they got what they deserved for being credulous fools. The left says locking people up without hope or resolution for 18 years gave us this situation. And so it goes.

18, ch‘ai. Weird.

 

[Allskate]

Hamas appears to be trying to pit the U.S. against Israel. Richard Engel is reporting that Hamas says it is willing to release non-Israeli hostages "if field conditions are right." But, Hamas, in double-speak calls this an "unconditional" release. I hope this does not make Israeli officials more entrenched in their failure to do their part in ensuring that humanitarian aid gets in. Israel, of course, previously has said that it won't help with humanitarian conditions until the hostages are released, which Hamas isn't going to do.

Engel also reports that Hamas says it doesn't know how many hostages there are. They have some, but they say there were Palestinians who were not part of the Hamas operation who went on their own separate rampages in Israel on the day of the initial attack, getting in through the openings that Hamas created. They claim that some of them took hostages.

ETA: Engel is now reporting that "if field conditions are right" means Israel stopping airstrikes.

 

[Allskate]

Secretary Blinken announced that Biden is going to Israel and then go to Jordan to mean with Jordan's King Abdullah II, Egypt's President Abdel Fatah El-Sisi and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas. Blinken also announced that the U.S. and Israel will develop a plan "that will enable humanitarian aid from donor nations and multilateral organizations to reach civilians in Gaza and them alone, including the possibility of creating areas to help keep civilians out of harm's way." I really, really hope that happens, but it needs to be happening now.

President Biden to visit Israel on Wednesday: Sec. Blinken

Biden will visit Israel on Wednesday.

abcnews.go.com

ETA: WaPo is reporting that U.S. officials waited to announce Biden's travel to Israel until they received commitments from Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on a humanitarian package.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/10/16/biden-israel-visit/

 

[MsZem]

They were interviewed on 60 Minutes last night:

Grandparents race to rescue family at Israeli kibbutz during Hamas attack | 60 Minutes

As Hamas attacked, grandparents raced to a kibbutz to save family members. The grandfather, a retired IDF major general, shares the harrowing rescue story.#n...

www.youtube.com

I follow Amir Tibon on Twitter and was so relieved when he posted the evening of the 7th that they were safe. Sadly, others in Nahal Oz were not so fortunate

The kibbutz mentioned in the end - the one they were evacuated to - is the one I'm from. The entire community there has come together to help the guests from Nahal Oz (over 300 people).