U.S. Men in 2018 - articles & latest news

[kwanfan1818]

Envelope money is based on prior year's results. GP spots are skater-specific.

He earned both.

 

[Carolla5501]

Seems people aren't looking at this critically. Nathan receives financial support from USFS. He takes the spot of other skaters. It's not just his decision.

If it wasn't for Yale we would be asking what's wrong. His solution includes coaching himself? Doesn't experience show skaters in elite academic programs rarely meet their skating goals? He wouldn't be the first 18 YO to make rash decisions.

(In the run up to Pyongchang he was quoted as saying he's not sure if he is up to another 4 years. Maybe he's had enough.)

Oh yes that support. Which they only give the skater after the parents have spent tons of money before the Federation started to give them any cash. And which most people admit is not enough to pay all the bills.


Actually what it seems like is the posters on here don’t agree with you. We are fans, we are not privy to all the information and considerations that were part of his decision process. Don’t forget it in your rush to judgement that this is a young man who had already suffered one bad hip injury. Perhaps his family knows his body can’t take four more years of this? Perhaps he believes he needs to look at the long-term future not short-term gains. Figure skating is not the financial windfall it used to be. And he’s a smart young man. Accusing him of making rash decisions just because you didn’t like the skate and one event only makes you look bad

 

[SkateFanBerlin]

Actually what it seems like is the posters on here don’t agree with you.

Don't base my opinions on what others agree with. Why would I?

 

[Carolla5501]

Don't base my opinions on what others agree with. Why would I?

No, but you seem upset that we aren't all saying you are correct. LOL!

 

[Sylvia]

Thanks to @Stephanie for bringing attention to the fact in the U.S. Ladies thread that USFS is using Golden Bear in Zagreb, Croatia as a developmental international again this year. The 2 men assigned are Ilia Malinin (his second international after he won the Adv. Boys gold at the Asian Open Trophy in Bangkok in early August) and 2018 U.S. Intermediate silver medalist Matthew Nielsen in Junior (he's been one of the top scoring Novices so far this season and won the Novice gold at NAS in Toronto in mid-August).

ETA:

The 2 men assigned to the final JGP in Yerevan, Armenia are Ryan Dunk who will turn 18 next week (6th in Bratislava with a very good total score of 188.91) and Nicholas Hsieh, who turned 16 last month (bronze at Asian Open Trophy with a low-ish score; this will be his 2nd JGP in 2 years).

 

[skateboy]

Re Nathan: can we put things in perspective, please? He had a rough skate but landed a solid 3Ax, his nemesis jump. He landed one clean quad. It was the Japan Open, the only man who skated a good program was Oda. Nathan will be fine.

 

[dinakt]

Re Nathan: can we put things in perspective, please? He had a rough skate but landed a solid 3Ax, his nemesis jump. He landed one clean quad. It was the Japan Open, the only man who skated a good program was Oda. Nathan will be fine.

This!
Also, what gets obscured in the anxiety over Nathan's quads (doesn't he usually fall early in the year, BTW?) is that he has a fabulous LP. His movement quality is uniquely his own, and it is beautiful.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

Congratulations to Camden, Tomoki and Andrew all officially advancing to the JGP Final!!

WELL DONE US Men!!!!

 

[wickedwitch]

I'm really pleased all three made the JGPF. I was hoping they would all qualify, and the uSFSA of course made their lives easier by spreading out their assignments, but they still had to skate well.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the junior world team this season. If Alexei K. doesn't want a spot, then it will be the same three. If he does, then I think he'll need to beat at least one of them at Nats unless he absolutely kills it on the GP.

Also congrats to Ryan Dunk on two great competitions! I'm really pleased by his improvement this season.

 

[RoseRed]

I'm really pleased all three made the JGPF. I was hoping they would all qualify, and the uSFSA of course made their lives easier by spreading out their assignments, but they still had to skate well.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the junior world team this season. If Alexei K. doesn't want a spot, then it will be the same three. If he does, then I think he'll need to beat at least one of them at Nats unless he absolutely kills it on the GP.

Also congrats to Ryan Dunk on two great competitions! I'm really pleased by his improvement this season.

I believe Alexei said he does want one. Well, I think he said he's hoping for either JW or 4CC. If he does really well and just makes the 4CC/Worlds team, he wouldn't do JW. Otherwise, like you said, he'd need to beat one of them at Nationals. I think they're all skating senior. Right now he has the lowest SB of the four of them, but he's also had only one comp and seniors are generally ready a bit later, plus the comeback from injury. But yes, he'd go to JW if they gave him a spot as of now.

If I had to guess now, I'd say I think he'll beat out Andrew for a JW spot (though of course lots can change in the next few months). But Andrew is the least consistent with his jumps of the top three US juniors, so the easiest bet for Alexei to beat.

 

[Sylvia]

Also congrats to Ryan Dunk on two great competitions! I'm really pleased by his improvement this season.

for Ryan!

According to USFS International Assignments page updated today, Camden Pulkinen will make his ISU Challenger Series debut at Inge Solar Memorial in Innsbruck, Austria, Nov. 13-17, 2018, and this will be Tomoki Hiwatashi's second CS competition (after 2016 Warsaw Cup). Both already have byes through Midwestern Sectionals the same week due to having qualified for the JGP Final.

 

[Sylvia]

Jimmy Ma article: https://usfigureskatingfanzone.com/...va-ma-brings-heat-and-finesse-to-everett.aspx

"Sure, I'm a little bit nervous about Skate America," Ma, a native New Yorker, said. "This is the first time I've been (assigned to) anything big, let alone a Grand Prix. I called Nikolai (Morozov) the other day, talked to him about it. And there's this 10-second pause, I thought he cut out. Then he said, 'So what? Who cares? Just go out there and take it one element at a time.'"
...
Ma is sticking with his Rachmaninoff free skate this season, after jettisoning an earlier program choreographed with Joshua Farris during a visit to Colorado Springs in June.
"I definitely love the program, music-wise," Ma said. "I (incorporated) a little bit of the choreography that Josh gave me, and changed the jumps around some…It was an easy hot fix."

ETA from the thread on the new "Skate Talk Online" YT channel:

Interview with Jimmy Ma is up! Enjoy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXHTtQszIk0

 

[clairecloutier]

New article from the Washington Post on Adam’s post-Olympic life: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-famous/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.3d2e5d65d42b

 

[gokcenx]

New Article about Nathan Chen:

https://olympics.nbcsports.com/2018/10/18/nathan-chen-skate-america/

 

[Firedancer]

Jackie Wong has quotes from the US Men on his twitter:
Nathan:

Nathan Chen on balancing school and skating: it’s been a process, things are definitely looking better than they were a few weeks ago [at Japan Open] ... I train about 1.5 hrs by myself, and then off campus with other people ... I do FaceTime with Raf sometimes

Nathan Chen on the most important topic, his hair: I was on the opposite end of that situation last year, but I’m seeing it how it goes ... but I like it

Nathan Chen: I got really really sick before Japan Open - I had a cold that turned into an infection ... so having that extra time has been good for me

Vincent:

practice was pretty good; working on some mental tools I can use for my programs ... I tend to overthink; my back is fully healed, no trouble with that anymore; part of being an athlete is being resilient

I hurt my back the day before I left for Worlds ... I wasn’t able to do full programs before SLC; I’m not in the getting-back-into-things shape like I was there

Jimmy:

I got my legs under me after SLC, got to recharge a bit ... [Daisuke Takahashi’s hip hop swan lake] was one of my favorite programs of all time, I tried to channel that ... to express the music and follow that model

Jimmy Ma on Daisuke Takahashi’s comeback: There’s a small opportunity that I might get to compete with him but I would be so so so excited for it. I’m not going to think that far.

 

[Sylvia]

Yalie Nathan Chen Ready to Rumble at 2018 Skate America by Lynn Rutherford: https://usfigureskatingfanzone.com/...en-ready-to-rumble-at-2018-skate-america.aspx

 

[SkateFanBerlin]

New article from the Washington Post on Adam’s post-Olympic life: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-famous/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.3d2e5d65d42b

Wow, long. I love Adam as a competitor. I have admit and this is true of the Shibs too - I like the media stuff in conjunction with their skating. But on it's own it's tough. You really need a talent - comedic, Ru-Paul-personality, something. Adam was funny on Ellen - the first time. But, I haven't paid much attention since. The Shibs travel-logs aren't so interesting separate from their competitive lives. Maybe a year of media stuff can repay some of the huge costs of a skating career.

 

[concorde]

New article from the Washington Post on Adam’s post-Olympic life: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-famous/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.3d2e5d65d42b

I think I am one of those rare people that still get a daily newspaper, The Washington Post. On Saturday, we get Sunday's supplements.

Guess who is on the cover of the hard copy magazine? Adam.
I knew he was in town a couple of weeks back and this helps to explain the why.

 

[shady82]

Overall, a pretty decent showing for US men. Nathan Chen is not anywhere near his level last year jump-wise, but it's fine. He put out a solid program with nice presentation and needs time to adjust to his new academic demands. Vincent also skated well and would have been at least 2nd if not for the poor judging. Also a decent debut for Jimmy Ma -- scoring above 70 internationally is not bad when Dolensky, Krasnozhon, etc. are struggling to do so at this point.

 

[aftershocks]

Nathan Chen is not anywhere near his level last year jump-wise, but it's fine.

Actually, Nathan took a slow approach last year too with putting quads in his programs. And this year, Nathan has even more incentive to slow it down with putting in too many quads, especially earlier on until the dust settles with the new rules. Nathan's sp is simply boss! A great melding of program and personality! Shae Lynn Bourne is a genius choreographer.

Jimmy Ma is cool. Zhou wuzrobbed. The judges have got to not call things on assumptions. When it's very close and they don't have a good view, they got to give it to the skaters when it's that close and that clean. Maybe the quad flip was more obvious that Zhou's foot was a bit lazy getting around, but it was still close. The 3-axel was much more clearly a UR, especially on slo-mo. The 4-lutz is iffy to call UR.

Zhou and his coaches have got to find a way to make sure his under-rotation rep is countered PDQ. Fix that lazy foot on his landings!

 

[shady82]

Actually, Nathan took a slow approach last year too with putting quads in his programs. And this year, Nathan has even more incentive to slow it down with putting in too many quads, especially earlier on until the dust settles with the new rules. Nathan's sp is simply boss! A great melding of program and personality! Shae Lynn Bourne is a genius choreographer.

Would agree here. Nathan has no need to rush with the quads. He should take his time and not think about World placements right now. Especially since his spot on the World team, at this rate, seems pretty secure!

 

[misskarne]

Vincent also skated well and would have been at least 2nd if not for the poor judging.

Let me correct you. Vincent would have been at least 2nd if he rotated his jumps.

Zhou wuzrobbed. The judges have got to not call things on assumptions. When it's very close and they don't have a good view, they got to give it to the skaters when it's that close and that clean.

Uh, except it was super obvious that the jumps were UR. So they did call what they saw and did not make assumptions.

 

[aftershocks]

Uh, except it was super obvious that the jumps were UR. So they did call what they saw and did not make assumptions.

It wasn't 'super obvious' on the 4-lutz. Become a tech specialist if you're such an expert. And please, sharing our perceptions is not a black and white thing anyway. As I already said, it behooves Zhou and his coaches to make sure it's not that close. Zhou needs to change his UR reputation. He clearly does have a 'lazy' landing foot as your favorite, Johnny Weir, describes it.

 

[Willin]

Let me correct you. Vincent would have been at least 2nd if he rotated his jumps.

Uh, except it was super obvious that the jumps were UR. So they did call what they saw and did not make assumptions.

I know you probably didn't see the US Broadcast, but Tara and Johnny were complaining that the UR calls against Vincent were unfair and that the 4Lz in particular looked entirely clean to them. It was even more annoying because they were harping on the "if there's ice flying up it's probably underrotated." Cue tons of ice flying up on the 4F landing and them claiming they can't believe it was called UR. One wonders if they read the new rule about UR calls...

It really hurts Vincent in every way. I hate to say it, but if he can't get those jumps clearly backwards and fix that landing foot Vincent's not the future of US Men's skating both because of the UR reputation he's already built for himself and the new UR rule.

 

[oleada]

I probably would've given him the 4Lz but I thought both the 4F and 3A looked questionable in real time and definitely under rotated in the replay.

I really love Nathan's short. Shaelyn Bourne gets him. I don't think any of the US men come close to him right now.

 

[misskarne]

Become a tech specialist if you're such an expert.

And how do you know I'm not?

I know you probably didn't see the US Broadcast, but Tara and Johnny were complaining that the UR calls against Vincent were unfair and that the 4Lz in particular looked entirely clean to them. It was even more annoying because they were harping on the "if there's ice flying up it's probably underrotated." Cue tons of ice flying up on the 4F landing and them claiming they can't believe it was called UR. One wonders if they read the new rule about UR calls...

I'm not surprised those two idiots got it wrong, but I'm more miffed about people who should know better, like his coaches and Jackie, joining the narrative that poor Vincent was robbed and the evil tech panel made things up.

 

[aftershocks]

And how do you know I'm not?

Heh, good for you if you are. If you are, hopefully you have better eyesight or better views than most.

 

[misskarne]

So, where are all those people who were freaking out about Nathan after Japan Open?

 

[skatingguy]

So, where are all those people who were freaking out about Nathan after Japan Open?

Still rocking themselves in the corner because he only attempted 4 quads in one competition - a fcuking disaster really.

 

[aftershocks]

Congrats to Nathan! He's the class of the field and unsurprisingly still a force to be reckoned with on the world stage. I think there has been too much going overboard about Nathan needing to improve artistically. Anyone who has followed this young man's career should know that he's always had artistic chops. He's just got great jumping ability too. And the sport itself, led by the ISU decided to over-reward quads! Nathan focused on following that directive and he ultimately surpassed the state of the art quad-wise, because he's simply that talented.

It should not have been a surprise to anyone that landing 5 and 6 quads in a fp limits a focus on presentation. Nathan was challenging hmiself and giving the sport what it was demanding and then some! Boyang Jin got on the World podium twice on the strength of quad-lutz triple combo and 4 quads in a fp, but without superior presentation skills, and even lacking in skating skills too, but that was okay then with the short-sighted ISU. Coming up behind Boyang, Nathan saw that he could maybe make international podiums by landing a lot of quads. The overscoring of quads allowed for it. That whole overscoring quads situation began with Patrick Chan pioneering quads combined with gorgeous artistry. The judges went wacko gung-ho and decided it was okay to reward attempted quads with falls as long as the rotations were made. That was always a dumb decision. And it wasn't Patrick Chan's fault either. The athletes should never be blamed. It's the people running the sport who have made bonehead decisions. And now they are trying for a course-correction.

Still, the point is: Nathan Chen has always had all the goods. Of course, he's improved presentation-wise over the past several years because he's maturing and continuing to work on fine-tuning all aspects of his skating. I just don't go along with the superficial line that Nathan was ever weak artistically. He was focusing on the jumps because that's what the sport was rewarding. So we have a young man here who is inadvertently changing the sport in many more ways than one.

Nathan has his own unique style and he's exciting to watch, and that's always been true. It's just that now hopefully more emphasis for the mens' discipline generally will be placed on rewarding complete programs. The new rules don't adversely affect Nathan because he's got technical and artistic skills out-the-wazoo. Good luck to Nathan on continuing to figure out what the future has in store for him. Steady as he goes. And thank the Lord for these magic moments. Nathan don't have to bring down the house with five or six quads in a clean performance, even though he's shown he can do that. It's surely more desirable though that he give us well-rounded excellence with a few quads, a balanced program, great program concept, and unique moves that bring out his cool personality.

That said, the new rules are a work-in-progress and may not negate the quad ante being picked up toward the end of the season. We'll see what happens. Best wishes to Nathan at Yale and on competition ice!