U.S. Men 2019-20 season - news & updates

[acraven]

The ice coverage was very noticeable as I sat in the stands at Nationals, and I was down at the ice with not the best view of that aspect of his performance.

 

[vesperholly]

Maybe Tomoki is seen as having more Worlds opportunities going forward, and U.S. fed want to keep Vincent inspired and in-the-game. Plus, Vincent is defending World bronze medalist, which is more than just a notion.

Realistically though, this is Tomoki's only shot at Worlds until 2022. USFS will never send him to a pre-Olympics Worlds unless he does something like add two quads and/or win both his GPs this fall and medal at the GPF.

I also don't know that people realize Tomoki is actually older than Vincent by 9 months.

 

[jlai]

Realistically though, this is Tomoki's only shot at Worlds until 2022. USFS will never send him to a pre-Olympics Worlds unless he does something like add two quads and/or win both his GPs this fall and medal at the GPF.

I also don't know that people realize Tomoki is actually older than Vincent by 9 months.

Yes and that’s why I said it is such a shame he didn’t get sent. Chances are slimmer that he gets a shot next year unless Jason or Zhou really underperforms.

 

[aftershocks]

Realistically though, this is Tomoki's only shot at Worlds until 2022. USFS will never send him to a pre-Olympics Worlds unless he does something like add two quads and/or win both his GPs this fall and medal at the GPF.

I also don't know that people realize Tomoki is actually older than Vincent by 9 months.

Realistically Tomoki's only shot at Worlds till 2022? Maybe on paper. We can never predict what's going to happen from competition to competition. Ice is slippery. I do agree that politically and in terms of the depth among the current U.S. men's field, Tomoki is being viewed as an up-and-comer waiting in the wings.

As far as how old Tomoki is vs how old Vincent is, age really has not much to do with talent and how far or how fast that talent can take you in a career in figure skating. There are always a multitude of factors determining athletic success, particularly in figure skating. Not the least is determination and self-belief. Another is politics. Another is luck. Another is your coaching team and selecting the right material, etc., etc.

 

[vesperholly]

As far as how old Tomoki is vs how old Vincent is, age really has not much to do with talent and how far or how fast that talent can take you in a career in figure skating. There are always a multitude of factors determining athletic success, particularly in figure skating. Not the least is determination and self-belief. Another is politics. Another is luck. Another is your coaching team and selecting the right material, etc., etc.

My point for bringing that up is that I don't know how many people realize that Tomoki isn't some upstart 16-year-old with possibly 10 years of competitive skating ahead of him. If I had to guess, I would have said he was a year or two younger than Vincent.

 

[Lacey]

The ice coverage was very noticeable as I sat in the stands at Nationals, and I was down at the ice with not the best view of that aspect of his performance.

That was, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT, the best I have ever seen Jason skate, and ice coverage was a HUGE factor in my assesssment. He skated VERY BIG with such strength on each jump and movement. Absolutely gorgeous.

 

[olympic]

Jason Brown - 3rd after the SP behind Yuzu and Boyang. Good for him. The US men did remarkably well, but that level of competition was

 

[Marco]

Jason was brilliant as usual. But esp happy for Tomoki and Camden. Tomoki was wonderful and full of confidence. He should nail his free tomorrow. Camden showed such fight - USFS made the right choice to send him (IMO).

 

[aftershocks]

USFS made the right choice to send him...

But they would still have made the right choice in their estimation, regardless of Camden's results. It's really nice to see Camden fight it out. That was a tremendously great showing by most of the men in the final groups at 4CCs. It was fun to watch.

 

[misskarne]

Please excuse me while I lose my shit for a moment.

In the last two weeks, Jason has:

• stood up on a quad, one-footed, in competition.
• performed four clean, magnificent programs
• landed six clean, +GOE 3As
• received higher PCS than Chen from a US Nationals panel (aka the Chen-fest panel)
• received higher PCS than Yuzuru Hanyu from an international panel
• won a silver medal at US Nationals
• won a silver medal at the 4CC, beating multiple, multiple quadsters
• never given away an ounce of his performance in spite of being tired from two comps so close together
• (oh, and posed with a cute koala puppet for 4CC Sydney).

Forget everything you thought you knew. Jason is coming for 2022 like a fcuking steam train. What would his season have been like without the concussion? We'll never know, but holy hell, if this is anything to go by, it could have been glorious - and next season? Watch out world, because next season, I have no doubt, will be even better.

I actually think he could pull off a Worlds medal. If he stands up on a quad there - it could be enough. The judges just handed him a message that they will go with him if he's clean. Oh my god.

 

[carriecmu0503]

Please excuse me while I lose my shit for a moment.

In the last two weeks, Jason has:

• stood up on a quad, one-footed, in competition.
• performed four clean, magnificent programs
• landed six clean, +GOE 3As
• received higher PCS than Chen from a US Nationals panel (aka the Chen-fest panel)
• received higher PCS than Yuzuru Hanyu from an international panel
• won a silver medal at US Nationals
• won a silver medal at the 4CC, beating multiple, multiple quadsters
• never given away an ounce of his performance in spite of being tired from two comps so close together
• (oh, and posed with a cute koala puppet for 4CC Sydney).

Forget everything you thought you knew. Jason is coming for 2022 like a fcuking steam train. What would his season have been like without the concussion? We'll never know, but holy hell, if this is anything to go by, it could have been glorious - and next season? Watch out world, because next season, I have no doubt, will be even better.

I actually think he could pull off a Worlds medal. If he stands up on a quad there - it could be enough. The judges just handed him a message that they will go with him if he's clean. Oh my god.

Jason has NOT stood up one-footed on a quad. The one at Nationals was deemed under-rotated and was landed on two feet. He has yet to land a ratified quad in competition.

 

[misskarne]

Jason has NOT stood up one-footed on a quad. The one at Nationals was deemed under-rotated and was landed on two feet. He has yet to land a ratified quad in competition.

Of course it was downgrade. But he stood up. And it was one-footed. Watch the slo-mo again carefully. He never touches his free foot down.

And thankyou, captain obvious, of course we know he hasn't had a clean quad ratified yet.

 

[carriecmu0503]

Of course it was downgrade. But he stood up. And it was one-footed. Watch the slo-mo again carefully. He never touches his free foot down.

And thankyou, captain obvious, of course we know he hasn't had a clean quad ratified yet.

Then why did you state that he landed a quad?

 

[Tavi]

Then why did you state that he landed a quad?

Since the status of Jason’s quads is so obviously important to you, I’m sure you’ll be glad to know he landed a good one in the pre-comp morning practice:

Rita (simp 4 yuzu) on Twitter

“Jason 4T LANDED”

twitter.com

 

[Carolla5501]

I am I have always found the US judges were more than willing to give Jason outstanding scores. If he had a reliable quad he would have been in 2nd for several years. Chen's overall skating is excellent however so Jason can't defeat him with just one quad IMHO.

 

[skatingguy]

Please excuse me while I lose my shit for a moment.

In the last two weeks, Jason has:

• stood up on a quad, one-footed, in competition.
• performed four clean, magnificent programs
• landed six clean, +GOE 3As
• received higher PCS than Chen from a US Nationals panel (aka the Chen-fest panel)
• received higher PCS than Yuzuru Hanyu from an international panel
• won a silver medal at US Nationals
• won a silver medal at the 4CC, beating multiple, multiple quadsters
• never given away an ounce of his performance in spite of being tired from two comps so close together
• (oh, and posed with a cute koala puppet for 4CC Sydney).

Forget everything you thought you knew. Jason is coming for 2022 like a fcuking steam train. What would his season have been like without the concussion? We'll never know, but holy hell, if this is anything to go by, it could have been glorious - and next season? Watch out world, because next season, I have no doubt, will be even better.

I actually think he could pull off a Worlds medal. If he stands up on a quad there - it could be enough. The judges just handed him a message that they will go with him if he's clean. Oh my god.

This is his opportunity this year to win a medal at Worlds. No clear favourite for the bronze at Worlds and the judges have demonstrated they are willing to give him the scores, and with so many of the multi-quad skaters falling or popping multiple quads in a program he could just slip onto the podium.

 

[toddlj]

This is his opportunity this year to win a medal at Worlds. No clear favourite for the bronze at Worlds and the judges have demonstrated they are willing to give him the scores, and with so many of the multi-quad skaters falling or popping multiple quads in a program he could just slip onto the podium.

It's pretty crazy that the US has three medal contenders in the men's event at this coming worlds.

 

[olympic]

It's pretty crazy that the US has three medal contenders in the men's event at this coming worlds.

I am optimistic for the US men generally, but I think it's an outside shot at Bronze at best: First and foremost, Yuzu. Enough said. Shoma seems to be regaining form and if he is clean by Worlds, I think he is easily in 3rd place. Then, the Russian men can hit on any day of the year, even if that is 50-50, it still would be an obstacle.

 

[toddlj]

I am optimistic for the US men generally, but I think it's an outside shot at Bronze at best: First and foremost, Yuzu. Enough said. Shoma seems to be regaining form and if he is clean by Worlds, I think he is easily in 3rd place. Then, the Russian men can hit on any day of the year, even if that is 50-50, it still would be an obstacle.

Fair. But if all three US guys are in the top 7, that would be amazing.

 

[jlai]

Fair. But if all three US guys are in the top 7, that would be amazing.

Yes! The trick here is perhaps placing well enough to keep other feds from getting more spots (other than team Japan), or if the other feds end up with fewer spots -- if I were the US fed that is what I would be thinking.

 

[carriecmu0503]

Since the status of Jason’s quads is so obviously important to you, I’m sure you’ll be glad to know he landed a good one in the pre-comp morning practice:

Rita (simp 4 yuzu) on Twitter

“Jason 4T LANDED”

twitter.com

Um, it is not important to me. Not at all. I was merely correcting someone who said he landed one at nationals. It does not count if not actually rotated. Also, he can land as many as he wants in practice. That is not the same as landing one in the program in competition.

 

[misskarne]

Um, it is not important to me. Not at all. I was merely correcting someone who said he landed one at nationals. It does not count if not actually rotated. Also, he can land as many as he wants in practice. That is not the same as landing one in the program in competition.

I said stood up, not landed/rotated. Everyone else in this thread appears to have sufficient reading comprehension skills to understand what I meant, so it seems rather disingenuous for you to act like you didn't.

 

[Tavi]

Um, it is not important to me. Not at all. I was merely correcting someone who said he landed one at nationals. It does not count if not actually rotated. Also, he can land as many as he wants in practice. That is not the same as landing one in the program in competition.

Yeah, I see you missed the sarcasm, just like you missed the point of Karne’s initial post. You’ve been around here long enough to know she’s a long time Jason fan. Instead of allowing her to be thrilled about Jason’s success after a tough season that started with a serious injury and was full of inconsistent underperforming, you decided to pick on Jason’s quad, something which - by your own admission - isn’t important to you in the least. Was her post a bit hyperbolic? Yeah sure. But if you care so little about Jason and the state of his quad, it would have been nice of you to leave it be and just let Karne and the rest of us Jason fans enjoy his success.

 

[carriecmu0503]

I said stood up, not landed/rotated. Everyone else in this thread appears to have sufficient reading comprehension skills to understand what I meant, so it seems rather disingenuous for you to act like you didn't.

I think it is ridiculously rude and uncalled for to make that comment about my reading comprehension. I also think you and another poster are blowing this whole thing way out of proportion. You stated he stood up a quad. I merely said he did not, since it was not rotated. That means he did not stand up on a quad. My statement was correct, yours was not. You don't need to be so rude. With that, I am out of here, since you and another poster have decided to get personal and use personal insults against me, which is not okay.

 

[Dobre]

Congratulations to Jason!!

My point for bringing that up is that I don't know how many people realize that Tomoki isn't some upstart 16-year-old.

Am aware. Have been watching Tomoki compete since the 2015 Colorado Springs JGP.

Realistically though, this is Tomoki's only shot at Worlds until 2022.

I was told last season that he would never win Junior Worlds because it was too late. Forgive me while I ignore this statement.

He earned that new PB here.

We are blessed at the moment to have a lot of great guys. If they are all healthy enough to fight for an Olympic berth in 2022, I will be thrilled.

 

[misskarne]

I think it is ridiculously rude and uncalled for to make that comment about my reading comprehension. I also think you and another poster are blowing this whole thing way out of proportion. You stated he stood up a quad. I merely said he did not, since it was not rotated. That means he did not stand up on a quad. My statement was correct, yours was not. You don't need to be so rude. With that, I am out of here, since you and another poster have decided to get personal and use personal insults against me, which is not okay.

My statement was perfectly correct. He stood up on a quad. Did he rotate it? No. Did I say he did? No. Everyone else in the thread seemed to perfectly comprehend what I was saying. You, in your rush to shit on some genuine excitement that the world judges might finally be recognising Jason, and that he might be a threat on that world stage, decided to nitpick in the smallest way possible.

 

[Marco]

I have really underestimated Jason. What a beautifully skated competition and he actually received the PCS that he deserved (I might have gone even higher). With the skates he did at this comp he could possibly crack top 5 (Nathan, Yuzuru, Shoma, Dmitri being the other four, most likely)

Also very proud of Tomoki for landing all 3 quads at this comp. I think he needs to learn to show more personality to get the PCS. He is so nearly there and has shown some consistency across Nationals and 4CCs. His score here would have placed him 5th at Euros. I think he has established himself to be a solid 4th in the US and a notch above the likes of Andrew T, Alexei K and Camden.

Too bad Camden isn't able to carry over the fight he had in the short to the long. The long is quite a let down.

 

[olympic]

Here are the mean international scores for men this season:

1. Nathan Chen 310.52
2. Yuzuru Hanyu 299.51
3. Kevin Aymoz 260.69
4. Boyang Jin 252.79
5. Dmitri Aliev 251.88
6. Jason Brown 250.89
7. Keiji Tanaka 244.53
8. Yuma Kagiyama 244.48
9. Han Yan 244.43
10. Keegan Messing 244.16 (Not selected for CAN team after 4CCs)
11. Alexander Samarin 243.45 (Not selected for RUS team)
12. Nam Nguyen 242.60
13. Shoma Uno 241.10
14. Morisi Kvitelashvili 235.66
15. Junhwan Cha 234.45
16. Denis Vasiljevs 232.78
17. Matteo Rizzo 232.55
18. Vincent Zhou 231.95
19. Makar Ignatov 231.26
20. Andrei Mozalev 231.22

I think Aymoz's average score belies the fact that he didn't make it out of the SP at Euros. Jin, Aliev and Brown have more momentum than him, although Jin and Aliev are uneven in landing quads, and Brown does not have one. It was tweeted today that Han Yan cannot practice for Coronavirus related issues in China. That will probably effect his preparation.

I also think Shoma, Cha and Zhou will show a lot more by Worlds based on most recent competitions, and be much further up the rankings than is shown here.

 

[Tavi]

In a season where a lot of guys have had ups and downs due to both usual and unusual circumstances, I’m not sure how useful it is to look at average scores. Shoma, Jason, Vincent, and Kevin have all had unique (though very different) circumstances affecting their performance this season. So their average scores don’t necessarily tell us much about how they might perform at Worlds. While that’s true for every skater to some degree, I think it’s especially true for these guys right now.

 

[haribobo]

It's always somewhat useful and the work is appreciated