The Heir, The Spare and the “Baby Brain” -The Prince Harry and Meghan show rumbles on…

It is just exhausting though being constantly told how sorry I must feel for a prince whose personal fortune is in the hundreds of millions.

Particularly when he seems to feel really entitled to limited public resources during a cost of living crisis.

He just needs to do what all the other insanely rich private individuals do and pay for his own security and get on with it.
 
once_upon said:
Some of you are impossible. It doesn't matter what you think is the perceived risk and how you think security should be expected.

AFAIK - none of us have been the 3rd in line to the Kingship. None of us had (AFAIK) 24/7/365 armed guards growing up and until entering military service. None of us (AFAIK) moved from being third in line to fourth, fifth, sixth in line to Kingship. None of us (again AFAIK) had our mother chased by paparazzi and killed.

So none of us (again AFAIK) can comprehend the danger perceived, real, or as some of you think non existent.
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Diana’s death isn’t just because of the paparazzi it’s because the driver of the vehicle was drunk and she wasn’t wearing a seatbelt. She also refused her security

Prince Edward has been fourth in line to the throne and he is a working royal and He and his family aren’t entitled to security.

Prince Andrew isn’t either.

Nor is Princess Anne.

I am quite sure that there are many celebrities who also face threats.
 
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kwanfan1818 said:
Having been in Afghanistan, I suspect he is the only one in the family who can understand the danger you're in, and for whom it is visceral, not theoretical.
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No, I'm sure he won't. He has military experience, not civilian. Living on a military base among the military is not the same as living at home and trying to live a familiar life, realizing that every air raid can end badly.
No one is saying that Harry's fears are made up. But he does his best to make sure we don't forget how much danger he's in and how much he needs protection. This is not the most constructive position in the modern world.
 
I agree that most (or all) of us won't be able to fully understand what the level of danger is and how much of this is based on Harry's own experience, or Meghan's for that matter.

What surprises me is that we (here and in the media) are constantly talking about it. In my experience with corporate and celebrity security, one of the base practices is not to talk about it publicly. The less you talk about security measures, the less chance that the bad guys can find ways to breach them. Sure, if you need to go the lawsuit route things are going to go on public record - but putting out statements about perceived dangers averted, and including details of what measures were taken, and knowing that others involved will feel the need to clarify their involvement publicly too? No.

And I very much agree that continually making statements and giving interviews and filing lawsuits and having lawyers send threatening letters - even if there is a real need for an elevated level of security - is just plain tone deaf. There are countless people in the world who face very real dangers on a daily basis - in their communities, in the workplace, in schools and in their own homes. They don't have the benefit of personal bodyguards, armed guards, gated communities, lawyers, public funding, personal wealth or police escorts to take them home from a party.

What Harry and Meghan need to do is carry on quietly, which aside from being much better security practice, would help shift the focus to the good work they are doing, or that they could be doing.
 
I would love for Harry and Meghan to carry on quietly, and do good works.... but that has never been on the agenda, at least from the evidence supporting their worldwide privacy tour.

And as for the kids visiting the UK, right now they're both under 5, hardly the age to take around visiting the sights. A whole week at say, Balmoral or Sandringham, visiting family, not just their grandfather, would not be out of order... you know, to establish some kind of relationship. There are cousins galore....
 
From reading SPARE, it seems that Harry is afraid that either the Taliban or the paparazzi will get him or his family. Those aren't irrational fears, but the part I don't understand is why he seems to need more security than his father or his brother, both of whom are in more high-profile and powerful roles than him. He doesn't seem to have a lot of confidence in the BRF's own security, so maybe he feels that whatever security he gets when he's staying at a royal residence isn't sufficient. As @Jenny says we don't know what threats the BRF receives and how credible those are, and we don't know what security is in place to address those or to provide "regular" coverage. But Harry's obsession with security seems out of proportion to whatever dangers he might face.

I also think about how when Meghan first joined the Royals, she had to go to "incident training" or whatever it's called, where she learned how to deal with a kidnapping attempt, a shooting attempt, and so on. I think Harry had to do the same sort of thing as part of his basic training in the Forces. But at one event Meghan closed her own door when she got out of the car, and was criticized because that's something the training tells you not to do - that the door should be left open in case you have to get back into the car quickly. Yet she spun this as her trying to be a regular person and running up against the silly Royal rules and conventions etc (I'm paraphrasing here). So I'm not sure that she and Harry have the same perceptions of how much danger they might be in.
 
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airgelaal said:
He and Megan were in the Netherlands and Germany last year.
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Harry and Meghan are not the entire family and from what I gather he is mostly afraid that something will happen to his immediate family members and not himself. And it does appear that he's not gone anywhere with the entire family where his bodyguards can't be or may not be armed. (I have no idea what the laws surrounding armed bodyguards are in Germany and the Netherlands).

overedge said:
From reading SPARE, it seems that Harry is afraid that either the Taliban or the paparazzi will get him or his family. Those aren't irrational fears,
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I think the former is and at the same time, isn't an irrational fear. It isn't because Harry was in Afghanistan and it's entirely possible they hold a grudge against him. On the other hand, he seems to be looking at it in an irrational way.
First, Malala seems to feel safe in the UK and I would be surprised if she isn't on the Taliban "hit list".
Second, the US provides them with the proof that guns don't equal safety more or less every single day. And while the thought to get shot at by security may make someone else hesitate as another poster said (although, celebrity assassins don't necessarily think rationally), the Taliban wouldn't care. So, should they be able to get close to them, they have a much easier time to get them in the US because they can just come here and buy a gun more or less straight off the airport.
Third, the Taliban are terrorists and that complicates travel and assassin plots because they're surveyed by intelligence services.

That is why you have specialists who are trained in assessing threats. But the fact that Harry seems to think he knows better than the specialists gives me the impression that his PTSD has led him to not trusting them. To live with that mistrust and fear doesn't seem healthy and goes back to what someone else said upthread: he would likely benefit from a new therapist.
 
liv said:
I would love for Harry and Meghan to carry on quietly, and do good works.... but that has never been on the agenda, at least from the evidence supporting their worldwide privacy tour.

And as for the kids visiting the UK, right now they're both under 5, hardly the age to take around visiting the sights. A whole week at say, Balmoral or Sandringham, visiting family, not just their grandfather, would not be out of order... you know, to establish some kind of relationship. There are cousins galore....
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Do you really think Will and Kate will let their children play with Archie and Lilibet? I don't see it at all. Given the frosty relationship between the parents, kids are usually barred from relationships too.
 
canbelto said:
Do you really think Will and Kate will let their children play with Archie and Lilibet? I don't see it at all. Given the frosty relationship between the parents, kids are usually barred from relationships too.
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It’s hard to know? I think when the kids are older they could. I think the problem is that I would be afraid the kids would sense the tension between the adults
 
canbelto said:
Do you really think Will and Kate will let their children play with Archie and Lilibet? I don't see it at all. Given the frosty relationship between the parents, kids are usually barred from relationships too.
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Yes, they would. They're family, and whatever the issues between the parents, I can't see Kate extending that to her kids.
 
canbelto said:
Do you really think Will and Kate will let their children play with Archie and Lilibet? I don't see it at all. Given the frosty relationship between the parents, kids are usually barred from relationships too.
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I know many examples when relationships between adults were not transferred to children.
By the way, why was there no doubt about Harry and Megan? So far, it is they who do not allow their children to communicate with cousins.
 
MsZem said:
Yes, they would. They're family, and whatever the issues between the parents, I can't see Kate extending that to her kids.
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I don’t think Kate would but I’m not sure she has final say in that matter.

It is William’s family and he most likely has final say on this issue.

So a better question is would William (and Harry) keep the cousins from interacting with each other?
 
MsZem said:
Yes, they would. They're family, and whatever the issues between the parents, I can't see Kate extending that to her kids.
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It's not up to Kate. It's up to Will because that's his family, not hers. And I can't imagine Will ever agreeing to it.
 
skategal said:
I don’t think Kate would but I’m not sure she has final say in that matter.

It is William’s family and he most likely has final say on this issue.
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canbelto said:
It's not up to Kate. It's up to Will because that's his family, not hers. And I can't imagine Will ever agreeing to it.
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William may one day be king, but he does not have unlimited power within his family. He's also had two decades to observe a functional family and how it works, and would want that for his kids.
 
MsZem said:
William may one day be king, but he does not have unlimited power within his family. He's also had two decades to observe a functional family and how it works, and would want that for his kids.
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Yes but all evidence points to him being a cruel and petty man. In that way, he's like Diana and Charles, both of whom could be incredibly petty.
I think Harry's also incredibly petty. The two brothers have a lot in common.
 
MsZem said:
William may one day be king, but he does not have unlimited power within his family. He's also had two decades to observe a functional family and how it works, and would want that for his kids.
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I’m sure he does want a functional family for his kids but does that include seeing cousins of a brother and sister in law you are in a feud with?

Why would Kate ever fight William on that?

The kids have lots of cousins on the Middleton side to have relationships with.

I wouldn’t touch that with a 10 foot pole if I was Kate.
 
MsZem said:
Any evidence that does not come from tabloids and/or Meghan and Harry stans?
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The racism thing is not really up for debate IMO. That disastrous Caribbean tour was all Will, and couldn't be blamed on tabloids or Meghan/Harry.
 
canbelto said:
The racism thing is not really up for debate IMO. That disastrous Caribbean tour was all Will, and couldn't be blamed on tabloids or Meghan/Harry.
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No, it was all the Home Office and the reports I read indicated Will was pretty pissed off with many aspects that reeked of colonialism and the old British Empire days.
 
Jenny said:
What Harry and Meghan need to do is carry on quietly, which aside from being much better security practice, would help shift the focus to the good work they are doing, or that they could be doing.
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Amen!!

kwanfan1818 said:
Having been in Afghanistan, I suspect he is the only one in the family who can understand the danger you're in, and for whom it is visceral, not theoretical.
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While true, if Harry fully understood the threat, why would he antagonize the Taliban by writing about how many he killed in "Spare"?

canbelto said:
That disastrous Caribbean tour was all Will, and couldn't be blamed on tabloids or Meghan/Harry.
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What was disastrous about the Caribbean tour?
 
Mugs said:
What was disastrous about the Caribbean tour?
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Hmm. Let me think ...
The disastrous parade with the Range Rover. The shaking hands through a chained fence. The clueless comments. The numerous pictures of Will looking terrified of black people.

www.theguardian.com

âPerfect stormâ: William and Kateâs awkward Caribbean tour

Calls for slavery reparations and Jamaica’s PM insisting country was ‘moving on’ signal sea change in relations with royals
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

www.vanityfair.com

How Kate Middleton and Prince Williamâs Caribbean Tour Became a P.R. Disaster

The royals have started to discuss the legacy of slavery, but without Meghan and Harry, their problems in the Commonwealth could still get even worse.
www.vanityfair.com www.vanityfair.com

www.nytimes.com

Gaffes and Miscues Mar a Royal Tour of a Republic-Minded Caribbean (Published 2022)

The trip by Prince William and his wife, Catherine, the duchess of Cambridge, dramatized how rapidly Queen Elizabeth II is losing her grip on distant dominions where she is still head of state.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
 
airgelaal said:
If someone wants to kill Harry and his family so badly, then why is he so sure of being safe in countries other than UK?
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How do you know he doesn't have the level of security he wants in other countries?

overedge said:
But at one event Meghan closed her own door when she got out of the car, and was criticized because that's something the training tells you not to do - that the door should be left open in case you have to get back into the car quickly. Yet she spun this as her trying to be a regular person and running up against the silly Royal rules and conventions etc (I'm paraphrasing here). So I'm not sure that she and Harry have the same perceptions of how much danger they might be in.
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That happened ages ago. These days we don't really know if she closes her own car door on a regular basis or what she thinks about security.
 
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