Interesting point of view from a fan of both V/M & D/W.
Though how does your assessment of V/M’s Sochi SD points loss may be that of, in your words, “some of the arm movements in it was “too playful” and implied “that" is something that "only D/W could do very well" but not others be justified score wise? Where does the loss of technical or artistic element factor in this?
Way I saw it V/M were both strong technically (skate wise) & did have a great choreographed SD. (They danced to it in their usual V/M flair)
Timeline of surgery was speculated around start of new season 2010-11. Tessa by then had been training to skate differently too. They came into season late and competed at 4CC & Worlds. 4CC FD they withdrew, citing cramp middle of program and Worlds at Moscow they placed 2nd. I don't dispute their placement here because it was fair. They skated strong (not just artistically beautiful music & choreography but also their skating technique was very good ) for Tango Mir Dein Herz SD but not-so-polished-but enough FD.
But following season 2011-12, it’s over a year of post surgery. Tessa skated even better than she did pre-OG. Both of them still (i felt) outskated skaters in their field. It showed with Hopkins SD and Funny Face FD. It was only when we came to 2012-13 (2 years post surgery), Whether you want to admit or not, I did saw the subtle shift of flavor/favor.
Carmen - They were in strong form (technically actually) and artistically they ventured out of their usual lyrical style (which many complained about). Here is where conflicts began. They were too athletic (ding on their technical components), too vulgar (ding on their artistic components). Same in 2013-14. Seasons wasn’t “light” (or “too light” as you put it) for a team with V/M’s caliber. It was skated to their strengths.
Again back to my point earlier to Sochi’s SD, how’s that (i.e. if it’s something “wrong/lacking" with choreography/music/interpretation) relatable to loss of points?
Maybe for both (speculating) here as it was poor music choice (Season) - too heavy/boring. Carmen was warhorse but interpreted differently. Maybe Mahler was (and only best style to dance in competitions & Olympics). But to me, those things are superficial.
The one thing I saw was V/M’s consistency for BOTH programs (or any of V/M programs post-OG). Even with all that tinkering, they never lost their deep edges, use of whole ice coverage, power in skating, controlled speed, close hold, etc. come competing time. They were in fact sharper and better than I’ve seen pre-OG and actually increased difficulty of (beautiful) SD & FD lifts and twizzles. Artistically, they were still quite strong there too. Mind you, I’ve been watching them since 2007.
In my head, this is skating COMPETITION. If I can accept the fact, it’s politics then say so & so be it. But to continuously say like their skating skills were diminished (somehow by too much exercise or some obscure elements) or that their taste in dance style has gone down the drain (even evidence show they do try different things), is downright condescending.
Btw, I enjoy watching ice dance as a whole, not just for V/M. This includes D/W.P/B, W/P, Shibutanis, H/D, C/B, C/L, P/C and most recently, the Danes. I chose to focus my comments only on V/M (Skills or artistic flavour) here because this board is specific to V/M.
First, you should NEVER accept the fact that "it's politics" because this is wrong and frankly illegal. It kills the competition for nothing. So you're right about that.
Their skating skills haven't diminished the slightest between 2010 and 2014, it's the opposite really. And for their taste in dance style "going down the drain", well... it didn't go down for sure, because it surely didn't feel a hundred percent like them. And I insist that The Seasons really felt too light for me, and by "light" it has nothing to do with skills or performance, it felt emptier than the usual V/M. Maybe it's why it didn't felt like it wasn't a hundred percent ?
But then again, see the conversation in the Dance Thread about lifts. The very first lift was 52 shades of wrong and really gave me trouble. V/M are gifted in terms of skating skills and their Latch FD showed that they can do the seamless/flowing entrances in the lifts. The Malher FD has that too. Why would Marina stick with that until the very end ? D/W were working on lifts for years. I didn't feel like V/M needed those huge lifts to look amazing.
And this is where it gets trickier : V/M scored 0.70 lower in PCS for the FD in Sochi. I truly believe they are the most natural/talented skaters (Meryl said it herself that she wans't the most talented as V/M or Charlie but she worked so much to get to her level) and that it showed, yet for me D/W deserve to win on the FD. Why ? It's horrible to say that it comes down to the program because, yes, it shouldn't. But it did.
However : D/W twizzles and lifts were better, BUT in terms of edges, V/M seems better. They got the same score for the CiSt for example (but not for the DiSt).
Did reputation affect them : yes. Injuries too (but not in Sochi).
There is a reason why you should find the right vehicle/style/program for the Olympi season, especially in Ice Dance. That's why people are disappointed in the program choice for the season and that 50% are going back to a previous program. No time to play/experiment. Or you might get hammered on composition PCS.
There are 2 issues for me though :
D/W were working on their Sochi lifts for 3 years AND choose Scherazade themselves for the FD 2 years before. V/M weren't allowed Bride&Prejudice. I wondered if Marina did the same as Marie-France : strongly be against the music, then putting it on and see what they can do. Because that's the way to do it IMO.
At the end of the day, people are always going to complain about this situation and I totally understand. For me : V/M should be higher in skating skills PCS, and the gap shouldn't have been that high (especially on PCS). But I still believe D/W were the right winners. It was really incredibly clean, and them working on PCS all those years paid off and it showed.
(PS : I've been watching them since I discovered them in 2008 Worlds, during the FD. An incredible moment. At the end I said : Vancouver olympic champions, no doubt. It had all the feels.)
(PS2 : sorry for the long post)
I thought about North Amrican skaters I think... And when we say that It's USA or Canada usually. My bad !
