Skate Canada 2022 Olympics selection criteria

[overedge]

That's the whole point of an opinion piece to be allowed your opinion

I can say that my opinion of gravity is that it's a government plot to hold us all in our places. That's an opinion, but it's not a reasonable or fact-based opinion. In my opinion Rosie DiManno can talk about how appalling this situation is, but it's not an opinion columnist's job to pass judgement on whether bullying took place. That's Safe Sport's job (which hopefully it will do).

 

[puglover]

It seems reasonable to me that emotions are high. The sacrifices leading to being competitive for an Olympic spot are so significant that no wonder skaters, coaches and fans are vested in these choices. Skate Canada must have known this would be a controversial decision and this will likely not be the cohesive "friendly" Olympic team Canada usually sends and takes pride in. I personally do not think J/R have made nearly a strong enough case in this one wonky season to throw out the results of a National competition and think if SC were going to do this they should have done it for I/B who had much more potential. Sad to hear Ted and Meagan talk about the need to get more skaters into pairs with this drama in the backdrop. Anyway - decision made - all the best to the Canadian Olympic team!

 

[tony]

I knew earlier today that this was going to become a thing, and the issue that I have is who could Vanessa have been talking to? The wall in the locker room? I know of at least two people who were present aside from Evelyn, and it was said loudly enough that it was heard down the hall as well, which the article mentions. I'd say that's an odd choice of words to think out loud.

If Vanessa didn't know she was on the team yet, why would she have said anything like that.. let alone in the presence of the one skater who had a lead over her in the short program? Someone earlier in the thread also brought up the comment that she had at Skate Canada, something to the extent of knowing they will compete with the top skaters in the world if they are clean. Of course if they've had a strong push from the Federation from the start, it's not their fault. But for her to show up, say the Olympic team is already determined, and then withdraw is quite ballsy IMO, regardless of how anyone feels about Radford being 'older' and suffering two days of cold-like symptoms from CV.

 

[marbri]

I think focusing on the word bullying is distracting.

I think the takeaway is a possible explanation as to why some skaters have been vocal on social media ie... they know Vanessa walked into the change room after the SP and declared her spot secure anyway. Not to anyone in particular but loud enough so those in the change room (and apparently outside the door) heard it. I would guess mind games to psych out the competition.

 

[muffinplus]

The irony... Eric cited doing more shows as one reason he partnered with Vanessa. And unless they pull off a miracle at the Olys, they may have burned every bridge in the Canadian skating community and won't be getting those show offers regardless.

(From the description, "bullying" seems a little over the top, but obviously I wasn't there to see/hear it.)

What show opportunites are there in Canada anyways? Other than CSOI

 

[Karen-W]

Yes, it is bullying. https://www.dictionary.com/browse/bullying

noun, plural bul·lies.
a blustering, mean, or predatory person who, from a perceived position of relative power, intimidates, abuses, harasses, or coerces people, especially those considered unlikely to defend themselveslayground bullies targeting children with disabilities;a workplace bully who cuts me off when I speak.
Archaic. a man hired to do violence.
Obsolete. a pimp; procurer.
SEE MORE
verb (used with object), bul·lied, bul·ly·ing.
to act the bully toward; habitually intimidate, abuse, or harass:The boy next door constantly bullies the younger children in the neighborhood.
to coerce or compel by bullying:The salesman bullied me into upgrading the car's paint protection and rust-proofing.
verb (used without object), bul·lied, bul·ly·ing.
to act as a bullyeople who bully are often very insecure.

Vanessa was speaking from a perceived position of relative power in making that comment to Evelyn, who was powerless to defend herself within the context of changing the probable outcome. Vanessa was attempting to intimidate Evelyn and defeat any fight Evelyn had in her for the free skate. There is also at least one incident of rude and exclusionary behavior from, at minimum Vanessa's family (witnessed and reported by some fans), at prior events this fall, toward her Canadian pairs competitors, that could indicate there is a pattern of behavior there that, when added together with this latest report, absolutely fits the definition of bullying.

 

[marbri]

What show opportunites are there in Canada anyways

Stars on Ice?

 

[Cherub721]

I wish that J&R showed the personality on the ice that she did in that locker room.

 

[overedge]

What show opportunites are there in Canada anyways

Stars on Ice, the occasional tour like Rock the Nation, and club ice shows/carnivals. Plus guest skating at seminars, but no one is going to make a living from doing just those.

 

[rink_mom]

Rock the rink (if it returns)

 

[muffinplus]

Yes, it is bullying. https://www.dictionary.com/browse/bullying



Vanessa was speaking from a perceived position of relative power in making that comment to Evelyn, who was powerless to defend herself within the context of changing the probable outcome. Vanessa was attempting to intimidate Evelyn and defeat any fight Evelyn had in her for the free skate. There is also at least one incident of rude and exclusionary behavior from, at minimum Vanessa's family (witnessed and reported by some fans), at prior events this fall, toward her Canadian pairs competitors, that could indicate there is a pattern of behavior there that, when added together with this latest report, absolutely fits the definition of bullying.

Thought Evelyn said it was not directed at her? Kind of confusing TBH.

 

[marbri]

I wish that J&R showed the personality on the ice that she did in that locker room.

Someone needs to suggest to them they ditch their current music and skate to "I'm a Bitch" by Alanis Morrissette instead. Now that is a program I can get behind and using a Canadian artist could earn them back some precious points.

 

[flowerpower]

I think Eric was referring to shows in Europe. IIRC, he said that Vanessa had connections and opportunities for shows there.

 

[muffinplus]

Rock the rink (if it returns)

I thought Rock the Rink was there because of V&M first... ? I don't know what other opportunities for shows in Canada there would be. But yeah, I'm also curious what show opportunities Eric would have been talking about.

 

[marbri]

Thought Evelyn said it was not directed at her? Kind of confusing TBH.

I give you an A+ for effort.

 

[Karen-W]

Thought Evelyn said it was not directed at her? Kind of confusing TBH.

Hard to say without hearing more from Evelyn's full description of the incident. It could be that Evelyn is saying "no, she didn't look directly in my eyes and say "our spot is secured" but she knew I was in the locker room," or it could be that Evelyn is saying "oh, she just walked in and didn't pay attention to anyone and made the comment loudly enough for anyone to hear."

 

[Rock2]

A few short points:

• There are easy ways to disable paywalls (google it)
• Vanessa wasn't bullying - technically threats need to happen to meet the definition (ETA corrected/clarified later)
• Vanessa said much more than what was quoted. Purkiss suggested the comments were out of context - there was lots of context
• Several others were present for Vanessa's comments but were protected and kept off the record
• Evelyn is a very intelligent girl and not all about drama based on what I've been told. I would bet money she is not the type to put her name to an article like this without being very clear what she heard/was told. If she's not planning to leave the sport, that's pretty gutsy, I must say.

Skaters need to learn that their bid for the Olympic team starts in September - at the latest. You need to show your federation over and over again you deserve to be there.
I'm quite sure Vanessa was assured she'd go to the Olympics. The big disappointment would be if she was told long before Nationals.

 

[muffinplus]

I give you an A+ for effort.

I'm just quoting what she said in the article.

 

[overedge]

Someone might know that their spot is secure, but announcing it to a dressing room full of your competitors, loudly enough (allegedly) for people in the corridor outside to hear....there's some kind of purpose for doing that, whether it's directed at a specific person or not.

 

[Cherub721]

Someone needs to suggest to them they ditch their current music and skate to "I'm a Bitch" by Alanis Morrissette instead. Now that is a program I can get behind and using a Canadian artist could earn them back some precious points.

I don't know why I know this but the artist is actually Meredith Brooks. Sure sounds like Alanis though.

I thought Rock the Rink was there because of V&M first... ? I don't know what other opportunities for shows in Canada there would be. But yeah, I'm also curious what show opportunities Eric would have been talking about.

That was V&M's tour so I doubt it's happening again. I guess he was talking about European tours but I vaguely remember D&R did a bunch of shows in Germany anyway.

 

[skategal]

Someone might know that their spot is secure, but announcing it to a dressing room full of your competitors, loudly enough (allegedly) for people in the corridor outside to hear....there's some kind of purpose for doing that, whether it's directed at a specific person or not.

According to skate order the two competitors that could have been in there that hadn’t skated yet were KMT and Evelyn.

 

[Wyliefan]

No one in this little drama is looking particularly stellar…

Of all of them, I think Duhamel has surprised me most. Back in her competitive days, where she always seemed cheerful and chatty, I never figured her for the high-drama type.

 

[Karen-W]

• Vanessa wasn't bullying - technically threats need to happen to meet the definition

You are wrong. What she said absolutely meets the definition of bullying. A threat, implicit or explicit, does NOT need to occur for someone to bully another person. Bullying takes on many forms, but harassment and intimidation as well as reinforcing a sense of worthlessness are also included in the definition.

 

[overedge]

• Vanessa wasn't bullying - technically threats need to happen to meet the definition

There's no mention of threats in SC's definition of bullying. https://www.integritycounts.ca/api/...onduct Reporting and Resolution Procedure.pdf

bullying (and/or abusive behaviour) means unwanted physical, verbal or psychological
acts, or other objectional conduct (in person and/or online/cyberbullying) by a person,
deliberately or subconsciously, that is intended to ridicule, belittle, alienate or humiliate
another person, irrespective of the persons’ hierarchical position with relation to the
other person

 

[thvu]

Opinion | Second place is not enough for spot at the Olympics as Skate Canada seeks medals

“Our spot is secured,” Vanessa James proclaimed before she and partner Eric Radford pulled out of the pairs at the Canadian championships.

webcache.googleusercontent.com

Google cache for anyone interested.

Vanessa James and Eric Radford are on an ego trip to Beijing.

 

[muffinplus]

It's all pointless drama at this point ?

 

[musdancenow]

Vanessa never says anything to anyone about anything and then out of nowhere proclaims something like that? Sounds pretty far-fetched to me.

 

[marbri]

I don't know why I know this but the artist is actually Meredith Brooks. Sure sounds like Alanis though.

That was V&M's tour so I doubt it's happening again. I guess he was talking about European tours but I vaguely remember D&R did a bunch of shows in Germany anyway.

It has to be the version by a Canadian
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoA6HqLai-Q

 

[Cherub721]

intimidate Evelyn and defeat any fight Evelyn had in her for the free skate. There is also at least one incident of rude and exclusionary behavior from, at minimum Vanessa's family (witnessed and reported by some fans), at prior events this fall, toward her Canadian pairs competitors,

Vanessa said much more than what was quoted. Purkiss suggested the comments were out of context - there was lots of

I hope you both elaborate!

 

[Karen-W]

I hope you both elaborate!

Just a report from a fan in the stands at Finlandia about Vanessa's mom & sister taking pictures of and cheering for all of the NA teams competing there EXCEPT M-T/M and very deliberately ignoring/excluding them. It was apparently very obvious and .