Nobunari Oda: Harassment forced me to quit as Kansai University coach

[kwanfan1818]

In fact, I had a really good argument for why option #3 actually has Pros for clockwise skaters (and not just cons) but then I had to go a meeting and I forgot it.

Is this a pro for synchro, or is synchro always mirrored? I know for ballet corps, people tend to have sides they are assigned to, since so much is mirrored, but there are also times when they need to turn in the same direction, like when all the men do double tours, or the pirouettes at the end of Western Symphony.

I would also think that if you are a pro skater doing (mostly) group numbers, it might be an advantage for unison skating.

 

[MacMadame]

Is this a pro for synchro,

No, it was something about how it was better for them. I just don't remember what was better or why. It may come to me or it may not.

 

[VGThuy]

Here’s a incomplete list of some known clockwise skaters:

Amy's List of Clockwise Skaters

Note some world/Olympic medalists and champions and their countries. This discussion isn’t complete unless we get some clockwise skaters’ opinions noted on this subject.

 

[Tinami Amori]

No need to lower the hoops. If I recall correctly, there is a surgery that can make you a bit taller. It may be slightly uncomfortable/painful because it does involve breaking someone’s legs (and I don’t remember the details how the legs are suddenly made longer). But I guess, while the unlucky 10 will be in pain, the lucky 90 may end up paying for the surgery. On the positive note, the hoops can remain where they are!

Some people who feel they are given less than others by nature, have some weird ideas how "others" should be taxed. hint, one of those are "incels" (nerds who can't get a girl), i'll just post the link, the title does not cover all the proposals, the best ones are in the end...... read at your own risk..

Incels: We shouldn’t pay taxes because women’s bodies are a “public good” that we don’t get access to

By David Futrelle Pity the poor incels, who are not only oppressed by snooty women who refuse to have sex with them just because they’re “pretty sure this guy would murder me and use my…

www.wehuntedthemammoth.com

 

[Tinami Amori]

Another version of issues between Oda, Hamada and other coaches. It is split by issues, and how each party replied to each of the 3 points. Summed up by University.

http://www.kansai-u.ac.jp/mt/archives/pdf/191121_n_taioukeii.pdf

Oda’s Proposal 1: To move the current training time (held later in the day) to much earlier time, so that the students can go classes continuously, without interrupting for training.

Oda: “In February 2019 I reschedule (moved) the training time for primary and secondary level schoolers, from 13:30-15:00 to 6:30-8:30. But in April 2019 Hamada returned all to the original time without consulting with me.”

Hamada: “I received a proposal from Oda about moving the training time, and did so. Yet, Oda himself never came to practices at those times, even though it was his idea. Some of the students simply could not come on time, that early. After conducting a survey with parents and coaches, most of which were against the time change, I conducted a meeting (to which Oda did not show up) where a vote/decision was made to return the training to the original time.”

Other coaches: “The kids were late to their first classes, which made this change meaningless. As well, the kids (came on ice) barely awake (sleepy), which made the whole practice unproductive and dangerous. Hamada gave Oda advance notice about this meeting to move the training time back. He appeared displeased, but said “Ok, Ok”.

Oda’s proposal 2: Class/grade performance requirements.

Oda: After consulting with the University management/administration I attempted to change the rules in order to increase educational performance, but faced an opposition from Hamada (had to deal with resistance from Hamada). I don’t know why she objected to the new rules (why she stood against it).

Hamada: I received the proposal (for the new rules) from Oda on January 24 (2019), but questioned (had my doubts) that the Club has the right to decide for the students how to handle their schedules (how to allocate training vs. practice time).

Also I have doubts that punishing the skaters who are not doing well in school, by cutting their practice time, is not a good motivator for them to study better.

In spite of the promise from the assistant consultant that this new rule will not be implemented yet, until it is discussed at another trainers’ council, Oda made an announcement at the first gathering of all students in June, and promised to send a memo with full explanation to all coaches by July.

Other coaches: Nobody held a meeting to consult with us, and we never received any memos with explanations. At a meeting on 22nd of May the Club Consultant assured us that the new rule will not be implemented prior to a trainers’ council meeting, and will be given a transition period (adjustment time). But the following week all students were already discussing (talking about) the new rule. Worst yet (further more) Oda told one of the skaters that he/she is banned from training starting October because she/he is 1 credit short (in school work).

Oda’s proposal 3 – School Figures (Figures 8) training.

Oda: I witnessed (I saw) how 5 skaters of Hamada are drafting (drawing/wedging) Figures 8 into the ice, in spite of the safety rules that there should be no more than 3 skaters on the ice. I wanted Hamada of danger, but she ignored (dismissed) me.

Hamada: I was not at the rink at the time of this occurrence (incident).

 

[Meoima]

Me: What the hell is this mess?
I mean seriously... personally my feeling is that Hamada did abuse/ intimidate Nobu. Logically, there is no reason for a grown man like Oda to make a big fuss out of this. If he stayed quiet, just resigned and left to another rink to coach, he would still become a coach if he wants to, not putting his reputation on the line. It is hard for me to think that "Hamada is innocent" in all of this. Even if she has any legit reasons not to agree with Oda, she still has no rights to mentally abuse him. Unless she and her team want to prove that Oda had some mental issues and invented all of those stressful events by himself. I do not believe that Oda lied about being abused, he practically gained nothing from this.

 

[Tinami Amori]

Even if she has any legit reasons not to agree with Oda, she still has no rights to mentally abuse him.

I am not taking sides, yet.. But "mental abuse" is a general term, and can mean many things.
Oda gave some explanation what the issues were, it is stated in earlier pages:

• the (coaches) tried to ignored him (put him on ignore list.. )
• he would say hello to them, and they pretended they did not see/heard him (like ignoring a poster who speaks to you)
• they, to some extent, excluded him socially, acted as if he is not there (see sections in SS)
• gave him looks, smirked behind his back, and talked about him. (read comments in SS).

Oda was traumatized, he considers it "mental abuse" and quit. Others might have reacted differently, as in "f-u, you're not pushing me out" and enjoyed the challenge.

It all depends on what is legally "mental abuse" in Japan, and i don't know it.

There are husbands who claim that there is Alienation of affections if wife does not have sex with them 2x a day, and there are wives who claim the same because their husbands don't say "i love" every day... It's all subjective.

 

[gkelly]

There are husbands who claim that there is Alienation of affections if wife does not have sex with them 2x a day, and there are wives who claim the same because their husbands don't say "i love" every day... It's all subjective.

That's not what alienation of affections means.

 

[Tinami Amori]

That's not what alienation of affections means.

You're absolutely right about the legal term. But it has been used casually, or rather misused because of perceived "lack of desired sex" and "exhibition of love"... and i meant to use this term to demonstrate "misuse" (as i am not sure if "ignoring a co-worker socially really means mental abuse, given they don't ignore the work related issues).

An action for alienation of affection does not require proof of extramarital sex. An alienation claim is difficult to establish because it comprises several elements and there are several defenses.

To succeed on an alienation claim, the plaintiff has to show the following elements:

1. the marriage entailed love between the spouses in some degree;
2. the spousal love was alienated;
3. the defendant's malicious conduct contributed to or caused the loss of affection.

 

[gkelly]

The main point being that it's not something that one accuses one's spouse of, but rather a third party

 

[Meoima]

Can we not talk about marriage and sex life here? Not just because it is off-topic but...
Back to Oda, yes, I do agree that one could feel traumatized because of extreme alienation. But for Oda to act so extreme that way, I think the issues were more troublesome.

 

[MacMadame]

IOW, Jennifer Aniston could have sued Angelina Jolie for alienation of affections but she couldn't sue Brad Pitt for it.

 

[Japanfan]

Well, basically am explaining you why 90>10 and why investing in 10 rather than in 90 is not for anyone's benefit except for the said 10. But then you insist 10 are more important than 90. Beats me why, but erm...am done.

One of those 10 might be a Yuzu or a Yuna or a Mao. Obviously, it is ideal to offer athletes the opportunity to achieve optimal success.

 

[TAHbKA]

 

[Vagabond]

Amy's List of Clockwise Skaters

It says "Not Found." Did someone from the Japanese or Russian Federation hack the webpage?

 

[Tinami Amori]

Back to Oda, yes, I do agree that one could feel traumatized because of extreme alienation. But for Oda to act so extreme that way, I think the issues were more troublesome.

This is in odd situation, hopefully more information will become known. On one hand it is correct to ensure that school-age children have basic education and time to study, so Oda's idea in general is good. But the more i am reading, the more i am thinking that a) maybe it was a problem with "what and how" Oda tried to do it and b) was it really about education or was it his ego and/or a desire to do something "significant" or to "show how active he is"... and if a combination, then what were the immediate results.

 

[MacMadame]

Here's a link that works:

Amy's List of Clockwise Skaters

 

[Vagabond]

Here's a link that works:

Amy's List of Clockwise Skaters

I had to switch from Firefox to Bing to get this.

Thank you.

ETA: It appears to be quite an old list. Johnny Weir was a clockwise jumper too.

 

[MacMadame]

I use Chrome and it was fine. Except now it's not.

I got it by Googling.

 

[Sylvia]

THREE years later...

Oda and Mie Hamada faced off at the Osaka District Court on December 1, 2022 in Oda's lawsuit seeking 11 million yen in damages - presiding judge Akitoshi Matsumoto specified March 2, 2023 as the date of judgment:

【フィギュア】モラハラ訴訟主な食い違い　誹謗中傷「恐ろしい世界」浜田氏「する人悪い」織田氏 - フィギュア : 日刊スポーツ

フィギュアスケート男子で10年バンクーバー五輪代表の織田信成氏（35）が、陰口などのモラルハラスメントで精神的苦痛を受け、関大アイススケート部の監督辞任に追い… - 日刊スポーツ新聞社のニュースサイト、ニッカンスポーツ・コム（nikkansports.com）

www.nikkansports.com

and

【フィギュア】モラハラ訴訟　織田信成氏と浜田美栄氏全面対立で結審　判決期日は３月２日 - スポーツ : 日刊スポーツ

フィギュアスケート男子で10年バンクーバー五輪代表の織田信成氏（35）が、陰口などのモラルハラスメントで精神的苦痛を受け、関大アイススケート部の監督辞任に追い… - 日刊スポーツ新聞社のニュースサイト、ニッカンスポーツ・コム（nikkansports.com）

www.nikkansports.com

Summarized in English here (scroll down): https://featured.japan-forward.com/...-haul-at-junior-and-senior-grand-prix-finals/

 

[Willin]

Kinda shocking how similar this scandal is with US College sports scandals: despite witnesses and a solid fact (Nobunari getting kicked out) the college mysteriously protects their superstar coach. As if that's evidence of anything.

And the way Hamada is turning herself into the victim here: poor little old me being framed for something more than just he said I did. It's defamation!

 

[On My Own]

Is she being investigated for the hair-pulling or nah?

 

[kre56]

And then what about slapping Young You?
Is that being investigated?

 

[Frau Muller]

So there’ll be a decision by March 2, it seems.