Keeping Track of Criminal Cases & SafeSport Suspensions in Skating

[Wyliefan]

All this other stuff is of little consequence or concern

It's of great consequence and concern. I'm not downplaying the criminal investigation at all, but this other stuff is also very, very bad.

 

[Yyzskater]

Tsarevski is a native-born US citizen, so that wouldn’t apply, but I also have been thinking about his split from Flores since this news broke. I recalled that we only ever heard about the circumstances of the split from Flores’ perspective, and now it occurs to me that there may have been pressures on him that we were unaware of at the time.

If they truly are marrying off their skaters for citizenship, I can't imagine that is the only questionable actions the coaches are doing. I imagine for MIDA to take Tsarevski on, there must have been some legitimacy to him leaving the way he did.

 

[Spikefan]

How exactly is Desyatov a "former Soviet man"?
Wasn't he born quite a while after the Soviet Union was dissolved?

I meant it more as former Soviet countries to include places that are not just Russia. But yes, it is more a man problem from everywhere so it was definitely a knee jerk reaction to how US women have these men move over, often let them live with them, pay for a lot and then as it turns out become commodities in that they are offered up in marriage so the man can gain citizenship (coaches need to be investigated and parents should be ashamed). Then when things don’t turn out the man easily finds someone else and the woman is left high and dry.

And no, it would not include men born here for this above scenario as they don’t need citizenship. And yes, men from everywhere can be sexual predators.

 

[Karen-W]

All this other stuff is of little consequence or concern as the sexual misconduct is a much bigger crime than anything else and the victim should not be lost in the circus this whole situation had become.

Actually, the other stuff matters a LOT. Sexual misconduct or assault is a crime of control. In no way am I absolving him of responsibility with regard to that if it is proven true, but it certainly seems plausible that he was under some sort of psychological distress himself.

Think about it - there were all sorts of jokes at the time he was skating for Belarus about their skating fed basically buying/renting Russian skaters to represent them internationally. So, he went from one situation where he possibly felt imprisoned to another. And then it was suggested he marry the new girl? What choice did he have? What control did he have in his life? I cannot think of the stress & pressure he must have been under to not screw this up - especially since he clearly wanted to not wind up on the Ukrainian war front, which is part of what drove him to leave his Belarusian partner so precipitously.

Again, that doesn't absolve him of what he's been accused of, if it's true, but damn if it doesn't explain the psychology behind it.

 

[Yyzskater]

It's of great consequence and concern. I'm not downplaying the criminal investigation at all, but this other stuff is also very, very bad.

Oh, it's really really bad. But if he gets criminally charged and found guilty of sexual assault, that would be the biggest issue.

If he hasn't applied for citizenship and she was of legal age when they were married, as appalling as the reason may be, there isn't actually anything criminal about it. It would be no different than two drunk people getting married in Vegas. There isn't any actual consequences to the action. It's just a really really ugly situation. The only thing that would be criminal is if she was forced to get married, which doesn't look like that is the case.

 

[peibeck]

When Flores/Tsarevski split, everyone came down so hard on him. I am wondering now if the “marry your partner” idea was presented to him and he wanted no part of it so he took off. There is no way that someone just picks up and leaves, with so much at stake after years of training and sacrifice, unless something serious is going on…it didn’t make sense at the time, but it makes perfect sense now.

Well if this all ends up in a criminal investigation, we may find out as he may be asked to give a statement during the investigation. I think there is some difference though, as Tsarevski's family is also here, whereas Desyatov came to the US alone (or with his brother?). ETA: I see it posted now that he (Tsarevski) is a US citizen. This thread is moving FAST!

What seems puzzling is Flores apparently knew nothing about her husband's legal woes in the days leading up to SKAM? Or she was living in denial that it was going to come out?

Desyatov could also blow the lid off the dance academy's "marriages of convenience" (if that's what they are) in trying to work out an arrangement with authorities: i.e. "Yes, I abused so-and-so, but I can give you the dirt on a human trafficking ring...."

 

[Wyliefan]

Oh, it's really really bad. But if he gets criminally charged and found guilty of sexual assault, that would be the biggest issue.

If he hasn't applied for citizenship and she was of legal age when they were married, as appalling as the reason may be, there isn't actually anything criminal about it. It would be no different than two drunk people getting married in Vegas. There isn't any actual consequences to the action. It's just a really really ugly situation. The only thing that would be criminal is if she was forced to get married, which doesn't look like that is the case.

Did you miss the part where this has happened three times at WASA? Not one teenage marriage to a foreign partner, three.

 

[her grace]

Imprisoned is a pretty strong word to convey a situation where an adult male skater is getting all his expenses paid for and a good chance of citizenship to boot. Was there anything preventing Desyatov from breaking up with Flores and picking a new partner for his all-expenses-paid lifestyle?

 

[Spiralgraph]

I can't even process all this right now. What a mess and it's hard to know for certain if the female skaters were misled or were they culpable too. Awful.

 

[Ananas Astra]

Isn't it quite ironic that Morozov's daughter profited from this scandal by getting the spot? Of all the people it had to be the daughter of the dude who is one of the biggest predators in figure skating (and keeps getting away with it).

 

[Karen-W]

Imprisoned is a pretty strong word to convey a situation where an adult male skater is getting all his expenses paid for and a good chance of citizenship to boot. Was there anything preventing Desyatov from breaking up with Flores and picking a new partner for his all-expenses-paid lifestyle?

Is it, though? He was a teenager when he began representing Belarus. We don't know what sort of psychological conditioning he has been subjected to that led him to being okay with where he found himself.

ETA - here's the ISU bio of his previous partnership - https://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00103963.htm

He and his partner began representing Belarus in 2017 when he was 16 years old.

 

[PRlady]

Isn't it quite ironic that Morozov's daughter profited from this scandal by getting the spot? Of all the people it had to be the daughter of the dude who is one of the biggest predators in figure skating (and keeps getting away with it).

While Annabelle is not responsible for her dad being a lech - and is a victim of it as she processed various stepmoms and girlfriends - it is nuts that the replacement couple is a country-shopper and someone also under investigation by SafeSport. Yikes.

 

[Yyzskater]

Did you miss the part where this has happened three times at WASA? Not one teenage marriage to a foreign partner, three.

Yes, but it's not criminal as long as they are over the age of 18. Disgusting but not criminal. It may very well end the careers of the coaches and close the school down but unless they forced them into the marriages, there isn't anything that can be done.

Sexual assault is criminal, regardless of any duress he may be under. The victim is the main concern here.

 

[Vagabond]

Re Aboian...

SafeSport needs to investigate the coaches and the whole training center.

I am not sure that there is anything about the coaches that SafeSport would have jurisdiction to investigate. The police, on the other hand....

 

[Hedwig]

If they truly are marrying off their skaters for citizenship, I can't imagine that is the only questionable actions the coaches are doing. I imagine for MIDA to take Tsarevski on, there must have been some legitimacy to him leaving the way he did.

I am not sure, to be honest. The way male partners in ice-dance and pairs are treated, they can get away with anything as long as they can tie their shoe laces.

There is a serious mindset problem in skating with regards to male partners.

 

[Orm Irian]

Yes, but it's not criminal as long as they are over the age of 18.

It is if it's part of an attempt at immigration fraud.

 

[Yyzskater]

I can't even process all this right now. What a mess and it's hard to know for certain if the female skaters were misled or were they culpable too. Awful.

 

[Karen-W]

I am not sure that there is anything about the coaches that SafeSport would have jurisdiction to investigate. The police, on the other hand....

Not sure you are correct about this...

From the SafeSport FAQ page - https://uscenterforsafesport.org/about/faqs/

Who is covered by the SafeSport Code?

The Code applies to all individuals who participate in sport within the Olympic and Paralympic Movements. The SafeSport Code defines these individuals as “Participants.” This includes a wide range of individuals who participate in sport in various capacities, including members, license holders, or employees of a National Governing Body (NGB) or its Local Affiliated Organizations (LAO), as well as volunteers, trainers, coaches, athletes, or contracted individuals who have been “authorized, approved, or appointed by an NGB, LAO, or the USOPC to have regular contact with or authority over Minor Athletes.” Participants also include those who are otherwise considered to be “within the governance or disciplinary jurisdiction of an NGB, LAO, or the USOPC.” More information regarding the specific types of individuals who fall within an NGB’s jurisdiction can be found on the relevant NGB’s website.

So, at this point, the coaches, WASA, even the USFS could be subject to investigation here...

And...

In which categories does the Center have exclusive jurisdiction?
Within the U.S. Olympic and Paralympic Movement, the Center has exclusive jurisdiction to investigate and resolve reports of:

• Sexual Misconduct, including without limitation child sexual abuse and any misconduct that is reasonably related to an underlying allegation of Sexual Misconduct
• Criminal Charges or Dispositions involving Child Abuse or Sexual Misconduct
• Misconduct Related to Reporting, where the underlying allegation involves Child Abuse or Sexual Misconduct;
• Aiding and Abetting, when it relates to the Center’s process
• Misconduct Related to the Center’s Process
• Other Inappropriate Conduct, as defined herein

Given that Leah was a minor when she and Artem first partnered, there could be a credible argument made that she was a victim of child abuse - even if she did marry him after she turned 18, given the pattern of very young US female ice dancers being encouraged to marry their foreign-born male ice dance partners, she was being exposed to what could certainly fall under that last bullet point of "inappropriate conduct" I'm thinking.

 

[her grace]

Tsarevski is a native-born US citizen, so that wouldn’t apply, but I also have been thinking about his split from Flores since this news broke. I recalled that we only ever heard about the circumstances of the split from Flores’ perspective, and now it occurs to me that there may have been pressures on him that we were unaware of at the time.

Here's what Tsarevski has publicly stated about the split with Flores from a 2023 US Figure Skating Fanzone article.

But their partnership ended in December 2021 when Tsarevski took a break from the sport.

"I was a bit burned out and not quite happy at the time, so I needed a little bit of a break and just to chill," Tsarevski said of his decision.

He also stressed his good relationship with his family, likely because Flores insinuated that he was being held against his will.

For Tsarevski, the partnership [with Wolfkostin] meant leaving his home base in Colorado, where he comes from a large family of seven children. His family supported the decision to move.

"It's been a transition. My family and I are close-knit, and it's the first time living away from them," Tsarevski said. "It's all working out. I go back and visit every so often. It was a hard change, but not too hard."

 

[Yyzskater]

It is if it's part of an attempt at immigration fraud.

But only if they have actually applied for citizenship already. Otherwise, it's just seen as two young adults who got married.

I have no idea if any of the 3 teams in question have applied for citizenship or received citizenship. If the answer is yes, then immigration fraud would come into the picture.

 

[BrightSkates]

When Flores/Tsarevski split, everyone came down so hard on him. I am wondering now if the “marry your partner” idea was presented to him and he wanted no part of it so he took off. There is no way that someone just picks up and leaves, with so much at stake after years of training and sacrifice, unless something serious is going on…it didn’t make sense at the time, but it makes perfect sense now.

This whole situation is sick…

Tsarevski was born in the US though if the coach was doing this kind of stuff and presenting these ideas I'm sure it doesn't end at marriages and goes deeper with other safesport like conduct.

 

[Yyzskater]

Not sure you are correct about this...

From the SafeSport FAQ page - https://uscenterforsafesport.org/about/faqs/


So, at this point, the coaches, WASA, even the USFS could be subject to investigation here...

And...

Given that Leah was a minor when she and Artem first partnered, there could be a credible argument made that she was a victim of child abuse - even if she did marry him after she turned 18, given the pattern of very young US female ice dancers being encouraged to marry their foreign-born male ice dance partners, she was being exposed to what could certainly fall under that last bullet point of "inappropriate conduct" I'm thinking.

Good insight. If coercing marriage on the young female skaters is happening, I hope they have your take on it instead of backing off.

 

[Vagabond]

It is if it's part of an attempt at immigration fraud.

Or if the woman is forced into marriage.

 

[her grace]

Is it, though? He was a teenager when he began representing Belarus. We don't know what sort of psychological conditioning he has been subjected to that led him to being okay with where he found himself.

ETA - here's the ISU bio of his previous partnership - https://www.isuresults.com/bios/isufs00103963.htm

He and his partner began representing Belarus in 2017 when he was 16 years old.

Really? Destyatov would have to be incredibly naive and unsavvy to not see that he could have other options as a male ice dancer.

For example, Spiridonov, a typical okay, but not great, male ice dancer said this about searching for a new partner after splitting with McNamara:

Of course being a male in ice dance, you’re put in an advantageous position when looking for a partner. Before I teamed up with Lorraine, not a lot of people really knew me, but being a boy in this sport, you’re in high demand and will always get offers from girls and their coaches. . . This time around, it was exceptionally simple and fast. Having took part in the Grand Prix circuit and competing/medaling at other international events, you’re quite a bit more in the spotlight. I’ve received an overwhelming amount of offers, many of them were very interesting.

 

[Wyliefan]

Anyone remember this discussion back when the Neset/Markelov engagement was announced? This poster claimed that they had already married, when Leah was 16. (I tried to just quote the post but couldn't get the quote function to work for some reason.)

U.S. Ice Dance 2023-24 news & updates

The IG post says they’re getting married this summer. Was there a sekret wedding already? Yeah the wedding “party” is coming up but they got married a while back

www.fsuniverse.net

 

[Coco]

Tsarevski is a native-born US citizen, so that wouldn’t apply, but I also have been thinking about his split from Flores since this news broke. I recalled that we only ever heard about the circumstances of the split from Flores’ perspective, and now it occurs to me that there may have been pressures on him that we were unaware of at the time.

I've seen this sentiment here and elsewhere, but what is the logic? As he didn't need citizenship, what pressure would he have been under by this scheme?

He never addressed her comments on their breakup, simply claimed that he was burnt out and needed to chill.

And since men in pairs/dance are in such demand, maybe the story didn't have to be any different than Flores claimed it was for another coaching group to take him on.

 

[Karen-W]

Really? Destyatov would have to be incredibly naive and unsavvy to not see that he could have other options as a male ice dancer.

I'm not saying he's totally innocent and without any agency, but the guy comes from the same toxic skating culture/environment that gave us Team Eteri. That's not to say that there isn't plenty of leverage that male ice dancers have, regardless of where they're from, and if he's guilty of what he's rumored to be linked to, then he should absolutely be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. All I'm saying, again, is that there's a LOT that's messed up about this situation and, psychologically, he's been conditioned to believe or accept a LOT. Some of that definitely benefited him financially/materially. But it also may have really damaged him psychologically and could have put him in a mindset where he didn't feel that he had any control over the situation.

 

[Kateri]

Really? Destyatov would have to be incredibly naive and unsavvy to not see that he could have other options as a male ice dancer.

As Karen says, this isn't to defend him from whatever he's done at all, but: they crowdfunded thousands to get him out of Belarus. Of course they might have had a financial hold over him, who knows what he agreed to? Maybe he was liable for the debt, if he split up with her, who knows?

 

[Rukia]

I just want to say that just because these young women were technically adults when they got married off, that doesn't make this any less abusive. Some amount of grooming has to go on to put them in a situation where they go along with this and it probably started young. I don't want to lessen the effect of what was done to these girls just because it seems "less bad" than the safesport issues.

 

[Karen-W]

I just want to say that just because these young women were technically adults when they got married off, that doesn't make this any less abusive. Some amount of grooming has to go on to put them in a situation where they go along with this and it probably started young. I don't want to lessen the effect of what was done to these girls just because it seems "less bad" than the safesport issues.

Actually, the grooming, as you point out, is abusive and that DOES put what's going on there under SafeSport's jurisdiction. It's all bad, in so many ways.