Skate Canada won’t host Alberta events due to sports gender law

[Aaron MB Fan]

Skate Canada won’t host Alberta events due to sports gender law

Skate Canada says it won’t host national and international-level events in Alberta, citing provincial law that restricts transgender athletes from participating in female-only sport divisions.

www.cp24.com

Article says:
"Skate Canada says it won’t host national and international-level events in Alberta, citing provincial law that restricts transgender athletes from participating in female-only sports.

The organization said in a statement Tuesday that its decision was made following its assessment of Alberta’s Fairness and Safety in Sport Act.

The law, which came into effect Sept. 1, blocks transgender athletes from Alberta who are 12 and older from competing in female amateur sports."

 

[fsfann]

Biological males should not compete against females. If a boy decides to transition to a girl, fine.... but perhaps it's time for Skate Canada to have a 3rd division specifically for Transgender Athletes. Although I guess a trans girl would still have a significant advantage over a trans boy.

 

[caseyedwards]

Skate Canada is sick woke crazy!!! They actually did ban the words chocktow Mohawks and others for cultural appropriation and now they want men in womens sports too?! Why they so sick woke crazy? Who did this and why

 

[danafan]

Katherine Medland-Spence shared this news in her instagram story. She said:

Thank you Skate Canada for continuing to stand for trans inclusion in sports

She has been open about her support for trans inclusion in skating through her instagram for as long as I've been following her.

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[caseyedwards]

Katherine Medland-Spence shared this news in her instagram story. She said:



She has been open about her support for trans inclusion in skating through her instagram for as long as I've been following her.

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This is about men In the women’s division!

 

[manhn]

Skate Canada or Canadians has to be in BC, right? They already had one in SK, so we are now the only Western option. Western Alienation, what?

 

[lexeoe]

there's Manitoba too. Winnipeg hasn't hosted in a while.

 

[DE93]

there's Manitoba too. Winnipeg hasn't hosted in a while.

Winnipeg hosted Challenge for 3 years in a row (22, 23, & 24)!

 

[danafan]

Kaitlyn Weaver spoke about this on CBC. This is on her instagram: https://www.instagram.com/p/DSYncmyl97P/?img_index=1 There is more video in her story.

 

[Sylvia]

Kaitlyn Weaver spoke about this on CBC.

9-minute video yesterday - Weaver appears at the 4-min. mark: https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/video/9.7019001

 

[Excidra]

Skate Canada is sick woke crazy!!! They actually did ban the words chocktow Mohawks and others for cultural appropriation and now they want men in womens sports too?! Why they so sick woke crazy? Who did this and why

What is your definition of "woke?"

 

[Winnipeg]

In reality, what are the odds that a person would rise to the level of an elite figure skater while going through trans gender treatments?

 

[fsfann]

In reality, what are the odds that a person would rise to the level of an elite figure skater while going through trans gender treatments?

People who are transitioning can be at various stages. Someone - in theory - could decide that they want to transition to go from a man to a woman and still take part in competitions. ie: Think of male skaters who don't have quads or even a 3A, but if they competed against women they could be super competitive in this category. Will Skate Canada have some sort of a threshold to "how trans" you have to be? Because right now in this country a boy can decide he wants to identify as a girl and the next day the school is supposed to call them by their new name.

 

[caseyedwards]

In reality, what are the odds that a person would rise to the level of an elite figure skater while going through trans gender treatments?

Lol! Of course it’s already been said but obviously any male skater can just declare themselves a woman and be a woman to skate Canada

 

[MacMadame]

Biological males should not compete against females. If a boy decides to transition to a girl, fine.... but perhaps it's time for Skate Canada to have a 3rd division specifically for Transgender Athletes. Although I guess a trans girl would still have a significant advantage over a trans boy.

A trans woman will have an advantage over cis women in figure skating? That sport where female skaters are supposed to be delicate, flexible, graceful?

People who are transitioning can be at various stages. Someone - in theory - could decide that they want to transition to go from a man to a woman and still take part in competitions. ie: Think of male skaters who don't have quads or even a 3A, but if they competed against women they could be super competitive in this category. Will Skate Canada have some sort of a threshold to "how trans" you have to be? Because right now in this country a boy can decide he wants to identify as a girl and the next day the school is supposed to call them by their new name.

If you are talking about actual girls and boys, there are no strength differences before puberty so it's irrelevant which category they compete in from that perspective. Lots of sports are co-ed at this age like T-ball.

As for elite sports, they all have guidelines for who qualifies for the women's category, including testosterone levels. Figure skating is no different.

Some of these arguments remind me of the arguments against gay marriage.

 

[tony]

A trans woman will have an advantage over cis women in figure skating? That sport where female skaters are supposed to be delicate, flexible, graceful?

Neither here nor there, but because that's what the TES of the sport is asking for these days and all.....

 

[MacMadame]

Neither here nor there, but because that's what the TES of the sport is asking for these days and all.....

They'll dock their PCS and we know that's how they rank skaters no matter what the rules say.

 

[Allskate]

In reality, what are the odds that a person would rise to the level of an elite figure skater while going through trans gender treatments?

As for elite sports, they all have guidelines for who qualifies for the women's category, including testosterone levels. Figure skating is no different.

I don't think think the person has to go through transgender treatment or have testoterone tests to skate as a woman under Skate Canada's rules for domestic competitions:

"For participation in domestic events sanctioned by Skate Canada
• Skaters in domestic events sanctioned by Skate Canada who identify as trans are able to participate in the gender category in which they identify. Individuals who identify as a girl or woman are eligible to compete in singles, women, and/or any team events for such events. Individuals who identify as a boy or a man are eligible to compete in singles, or men and/or team events for such events. All identifications of gender identity by athletes are believed to be made in good faith and do not require further disclosure or documentation."

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://skatecanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2024/11/Trans-Inclusion-Protocol.pdf

In theory, I suppose you could have a skater who was assigned male at birth and has not transitioned but is competing against cisgender women at a senior elite level because their gender identity is female. I just don't think it's that likely. Kaitlyn says that she works with trans skaters, but I'm not aware of any of them competing in senior elite competition (and I have no idea about when, whether, or to what extent they have transitioned).

I think Kaitlyn is incorrect when she suggests that speed and jump height don't matter in figure skating or that there isn't evidence of a difference between men and women, at least with older skaters at the senior level. All you have to do is read the rules and compare the jumps and TES scores between the men and the women at Worlds. (But, there would likely to be some discrimination involved in PCS scores if a trans woman were to compete with cis women.) I think Kaitlyn might be more persuasive, or at least promote more empathy and understanding, if she were to just focus on the other reasons for inclusiveness. Unfortunately, I think that often is lost in the discussions about trans athletes.

 

[Former Lurve Goddess]

The chances of there actually ever being an elite trans skater are infinitesimally small (note - many nonbinary people consider themselves trans) and I'd guess that most trans skaters are adult competitors. Alberta's new law is causing the enrolment in girls' sports to drop overall because plenty of cis girls and their families are not interested in being part of the potential invasions of privacy that are part Alberta's (unconstitutional) law. So kudos to Skate Canada for actually doing something right for a change.

 

[manhn]

And what about novice competitions or adult competitions? It’s not just about elites.

 

[Karen-W]

And what about novice competitions or adult competitions? It’s not just about elites.

The way I see it, if it isn't an issue for kids before they hit puberty, then why not just require that all competitions below a certain level (novice, pre-novice?) be mixed-gender categories? Seems like that would be a lot easier on competition organizers - less judges/officials if you have 1 event instead of 2 per category/level.

 

[Kateri]

If anyone is interested in the evidence, this covers a lot of the issues: https://juliaserano.substack.com/p/trans-people-and-sports-everything

Regarding skating specifically, I'd think trans women who transitioned after puberty (who are inevitably the ones targeted and scapegoated in this cruel debate) would have, on average, a physical disadvantage in the women's field. Without testosterone to sustain muscle mass, you just end up with increased height, which makes jumps harder, not easier.

But this is an unfair debate that trans people can't ever win. I don't know any trans people who play sports at all - why put yourself through all that scrutiny, abuse, accusations and trauma, knowing that you can't have any success at all, without it getting a million times worse? The idea that it's a fun easy thing, that "men" are just happily wandering into "women's" sports categories, for easy wins and prizes? Ridiculous. It is a manufactured controversy, and the few trans people who love their sports enough to endure the horrors and try anyway get my utmost respect.

 

[Rukia]

It is a manufactured controversy, and the few trans people who love their sports enough to endure the horrors and try anyway get my utmost respect.

this says everything i want to say better than i could so i'll just quote it again for emphasis

 

[overedge]

And what about novice competitions or adult competitions? It’s not just about elites.

Wait until the anti-woke crowd discovers "similar pairs" and same-sex dance teams. Little girls doing the Dutch Waltz with other little girls, the horror, where will it end

 

[fsfann]

The way I see it, if it isn't an issue for kids before they hit puberty, then why not just require that all competitions below a certain level (novice, pre-novice?) be mixed-gender categories? Seems like that would be a lot easier on competition organizers - less judges/officials if you have 1 event instead of 2 per category/level.

Exactly.

 

[fsfann]

Wait until the anti-woke crowd discovers "similar pairs" and same-sex dance teams. Little girls doing the Dutch Waltz with other little girls, the horror, where will it end

Actually I don't have an issue with that. Same sex dance teams seems like fair game in many ways. Pairs could be interesting for sure.

 

[fsfann]

A trans woman will have an advantage over cis women in figure skating? That sport where female skaters are supposed to be delicate, flexible, graceful?


If you are talking about actual girls and boys, there are no strength differences before puberty so it's irrelevant which category they compete in from that perspective. Lots of sports are co-ed at this age like T-ball.

As for elite sports, they all have guidelines for who qualifies for the women's category, including testosterone levels. Figure skating is no different.

Some of these arguments remind me of the arguments against gay marriage.

Let's use this example as a discussion. Let's say that Anthony Paradis decides he wants to transition and become a woman or identify as non binary. His jumps are not up to the standard required with the top men, but he has lovely qualities to his skaitng and the jumps he can land, he can land well. A clean skate from Paradis would easily win this competition in my opinion. Is that fair?

 

[Allskate]

Let's use this example as a discussion. Let's say that Anthony Paradis decides he wants to transition and become a woman or identify as non binary. His jumps are not up to the standard required with the top men, but he has lovely qualities to his skaitng and the jumps he can land, he can land well. A clean skate from Paradis would easily win this competition in my opinion. Is that fair?

Unlike a lot of trans athletic rules, under Skate Canada's rules, such a person would not have to medically transition at all to compete with women in domestic competitions, so they would have a physical advantage. But, what are the odds of such a thing happening, especially if they want to qualify for international competitions where the rules are different?

And should the concern about your hypothetical sitiuation dictate everything when most trans skaters won't be in such a position? Should it really be all or nothing? Is that fair? Do we deny trans girls who have not gone through puberty and have not medically transitioned the opportunity to compete as girls even if it makes them feel even more distressed and excluded than they already feel? If there isn't a physical advantage pre-puberty, maybe the younger kids really should all just skate together - male and female - as has been suggested. What about the more recreational adults who aren't competing for funding and just want to enjoy the sport, be who they are, and feel welcome in figure skating? Why exclude trans women from that? Maybe there should just be just one singles category for them as well?

 

[made_in_canada]

I might be wrong, the new star levels came in after I quit coaching, but I believe the first levels are essentially coed. Skaters are evaluated and not necessarily competing against others until they’re older, or entering the competitive stream.

It’s all a big nothing burger anyway. In figure skating, if you want easier competition in developmental levels you’d want to be in a men’s category, not a ladies. Less competition, and the boys typically take awhile to catch up to the girls. Boys get away with shitty spin positions, and finger guns for choreography for a long time. Not that there’s a big problem in any sport with athletes picking a gender just so they can dominate the competition. There is a problem with adults being way too interested in the genitals of young athletes though.

 

[Kiki5375]

So if born female athletes take testosteron to increase their strength it's doping but if a man identifies himself as women he/she is acepted? Are there no rules about testosterone levels from WADA? Can a man's testosterone level be lowered enough by transgendering to match a woman's?