Skate Canada 2022 Olympics selection criteria

[Rpg]

Um, what does the alleged locker room comment have to do with Olympic team selection? It doesn't bolster W/M's case for the team and just serves as a distraction bomb. Vanessa is mean, so innocent kids should go to the Olympics???

And they only scored 119 in the LP at nationals! People are talking as if they made some big case at this event, but not even breaking 120 at Nationals is just another knock against them considering their scores this season, IMO. Internationally, they couldn't break 60pts in the SP this season and their SB LP is 111.01.

The federation supported them enough to select them for Worlds (59.41 SP; 116.83 LP) and gave them international assignments. They have not scored well. I wish people wouldn't pump up these 2 with false praise and just openly say they hate J/R and leave it at that.

 

[Gris]

Um, what does the alleged locker room comment have to do with Olympic team selection? It doesn't bolster W/M's case for the team and just serves as a distraction bomb. Vanessa is mean, so innocent kids should go to the Olympics???

Not disagreeing with the Olympic selection, but I think the point here is that W/M don't seem to be treated with respect.

 

[On My Own]

Again, I agree with the selection and think it's non-controversial. But the more details surface, the less likable James/Radford seem.

 

[skategal]

I think the issue is that it very much looks like Skate Canada told/allowed J/R to withdraw and that their trip to Beijing was secure if they did because they wouldn’t have a loss to W\M on their record to go against the Olympic team deliberations.

The whole who hates/loves what skater and why is not relevant.

 

[mackiecat]

Just a thought. Did Skate Canada say ” we know you are sick, if you score “X” on the short, your spot is safe” Vanessa could have been on the phone to her family, after their score, when she said that her spot was secure.

 

[screech]

Earbuds are small, and with Vanessa's hair-length, easy to hide. She could have been talking to someone.
If not, it's definitely poor class to just say that comment in front of your competitors.

I understand why the decision is controversial, but I also understand why it's not. Yes, W/M skated well to win silver, but they didn't make a case for themselves all season. Yes, J/R skated poorly in the SP and WD, however they were the clear highest scorers all season. As is always said in Olympics lead-ups, it's not a guarantee that Canadians rankings will determine the team. I 100% feel for W/M and would have liked for them to get the chance to go, but based on the fall, it was always clear that the team would be J/R and one other team.

 

[4rkidz]

It has been posted on their website.

https://skatecanada.ca/high-performance/resources/international-selection-criteria/ (Direct link to PDF below)

https://skatecanada.ca/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/FSK-2022-Skate-Canada-INP-Olympic-Selection-Criteria.pdf

For the Olympics I don't ever recall them not going by rank order from nationals. Should be an interesting season!

I think people seem to have forgotten this with all the drama

 

[screech]

Is there any word yet on the alternate list/order of alternates?
I'm also wondering if SC has a plan for the alternates. I won't be surprised if at least one alternate is called up to compete, due to C0v!d. Will SC have them on some sort of stand-by? In a location easier to quickly get to Beijing?
Also, what's the plan for the skaters who compete in the team event, but don't have their individual event until more than a week later (or other sports with similar schedules)? I follow the British diver Tom Daley on social media, and IIRC for the Tokyo games, he had to stay in a completely different city in Japan in between his doubles diving event and his singles event, since they weren't allowed to stay in the athlete's village if they weren't currently competing.

 

[puglover]

Prior to Canadians, I recall there being discussions about skaters who were a "lock" to make the Olympic team. The ones I recall being mentioned were - Piper and Paul, Keegan and probably Madeline if Kaiya did not compete. I don't even remember KMT/MM as being included in that category regardless of being the current Canadian champions and J/R not being a part of that conversation. I felt they would have to skate for it like every one else. i realize they were ill but their mistakes in the short seemed similar to the ones they made previously in their very short history together. I get that SC included placement over the season as a criteria to choose one over another and they have every right and responsibility to use that but in this instance it is far from compelling to me. Hence - "the drama".

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

I dont have a horse in this race and am analyzing this just looking at scoring and potential scoring....and... I just dont see any uproar for J/R on the Oly team... Makes sense to me......

Higher GOEs for them too! I think the case for an uproar is the USA mens selection by MILES.

 

[Judy]

Nobody is going to medal at the Olympics in pairs so it’s just the hope of placing In the top 10.

 

[screech]

Nobody is going to medal at the Olympics in pairs so it’s just the hope of placing In the top 10.

I think Canada's focus is more on trying to get the bronze in the team event. If J/R were to compete there, they'd have a better chance at being helpful than W/M would.

Then again, I wonder what SC's strategy is going to be for the TE? Will they split any events? I can see justification for any of the 3 they're eligible for, but wonder which (if any) they'd choose.

 

[puglover]

I am still confused - if the best and fairest criteria is past scoring and scoring potential - why have a national championship at all? That sounds like it is predetermined and W/M had no chance regardless of how they or anyone else skated.

 

[mackiecat]

I think Canada's focus is more on trying to get the bronze in the team event. If J/R were to compete there, they'd have a better chance at being helpful than W/M would.

Then again, I wonder what SC's strategy is going to be for the TE? Will they split any events? I can see justification for any of the 3 they're eligible for, but wonder which (if any) they'd choose.

I’d say Men ( due to schedule) and Pairs ( due to the men’s backs)

 

[Judy]

I think Canada's focus is more on trying to get the bronze in the team event. If J/R were to compete there, they'd have a better chance at being helpful than W/M would.

Then again, I wonder what SC's strategy is going to be for the TE? Will they split any events? I can see justification for any of the 3 they're eligible for, but wonder which (if any) they'd choose.

Yes maybe the team event … really tough to say.

 

[Judy]

I am still confused - if the best and fairest criteria is past scoring and scoring potential - why have a national championship at all? That sounds like it is predetermined and W/M had no chance regardless of how they or anyone else skated.

The previous years with our skaters staying in it hasn’t been a noticeable issue. Nationals def will always play a part.

 

[sap5]

I am still confused - if the best and fairest criteria is past scoring and scoring potential - why have a national championship at all? That sounds like it is predetermined and W/M had no chance regardless of how they or anyone else skated.

Because Nats is more than just about the skaters trying to qualify for the Olympics? What about all the skaters for whom Nats is the biggest competition of the year? Or the skaters trying to qualify for 4CC assignments?

 

[screech]

I’d say Men ( due to schedule) and Pairs ( due to the men’s backs)

Men would make sense, but a mediocre Keegan generally scores better than a great Roman, so I'm guessing they're going to request Keegan do both, but give him the option of splitting. If they split it, I'm assuming it would be Keegan for the short and Roman for the long.

Pairs makes the most sense and is the likeliest to be split IMO. I'm assuming J/R for the short and MTM for the free

Dance - G/P is the best bet for both, but I also won't be surprised if FB/S do one of the programs. G/P will likely be ranked 2-3 in whichever segments they do (behind Russia if S/K do it, and potentially behind USA), and FB/S would likely be 3-4 (Russia, USA, Italy) so there's not much difference there in results.

 

[missing]

There are many, many skaters who look perfectly charming and personable on the ice but who are completely different off the ice. How someone acts in competition is not always an accurate reflection of how they act the rest of the time.

I believed this was possible about Mariah Bell when she was accused by a fellow skater of bullying a while back.

 

[honey]

Sorensen said here that two events will be split, but it doesn’t sound like they know which yet.

https://twitter.com/anythinggoe/status/1480243462771556357?s=21

To me, splitting the dance doesn’t make sense if Canada is even gunning for a small outside chance at bronze. You have G/P do both and maybe with a small error they could get past whichever USA dance team there is. But maybe Canada has just accepted that a medal in gone and will not have G/P do both events for the team to protect from any political fall out should they make mistakes there.

I think men’s will be split because of it being the first event. Whether they split dance or pairs is the question.

 

[4rkidz]

I am still confused - if the best and fairest criteria is past scoring and scoring potential - why have a national championship at all? That sounds like it is predetermined and W/M had no chance regardless of how they or anyone else skated.

if they had received high scores at their international events (or higher than other Canadian teams) they would have been in a much better position. It is just such lousy timing for them to have an 'off' year with injuries etc - it is sad.

 

[tony]

Sorensen said here that two events will be split, but it doesn’t sound like they know which yet.

https://twitter.com/anythinggoe/status/1480243462771556357?s=21

To me, splitting the dance doesn’t make sense if Canada is even gunning for a small outside chance at bronze. You have G/P do both and maybe with a small error they could get past whichever USA dance team there is. But maybe Canada has just accepted that a medal in gone and will not have G/P do both events for the team to protect from any political fall out should they make mistakes there.

I think men’s will be split because of it being the first event. Whether they split dance or pairs is the question.

I think Sorensen is just saying that up to 2 events can be split, but maybe they have officially been told that Skate Canada will choose 2. AFAIK, they haven't done that.

Canada has such a small chance of getting to the medals that I think it really doesn't matter, except with men because of the proximity to the individual event. Maybe Messing will say he'd like to do both segments. Maybe after day 1 they will be too far behind and realize it really doesn't matter who skates the LPs.

 

[Karen-W]

Sorensen said here that two events will be split, but it doesn’t sound like they know which yet.

https://twitter.com/anythinggoe/status/1480243462771556357?s=21

To me, splitting the dance doesn’t make sense if Canada is even gunning for a small outside chance at bronze. You have G/P do both and maybe with a small error they could get past whichever USA dance team there is. But maybe Canada has just accepted that a medal in gone and will not have G/P do both events for the team to protect from any political fall out should they make mistakes there.

I think men’s will be split because of it being the first event. Whether they split dance or pairs is the question.

It wouldn't destroy Canada's placement in the FD if they split it and used FB/S instead of G/P, especially if Russia puts DavSmo in like a lot of people are expecting. FB/S wouldn't beat the US team but G/P aren't likely to beat the US team in the FD either. I could see them splitting Men and Dance. At this point, with the way they've given such huge favor to J/R, I could honestly see Skate Canada burning MTM and only using J/R in Pairs, foolishly thinking they will get two good skates in a row out of J/R.

 

[Vase]

I just can’t see this W/M drama doing anything in their favour with Skate Canada, may put a fire in them to put up higher marks.

 

[Alilou]

Because Nats is more than just about the skaters trying to qualify for the Olympics? What about all the skaters for whom Nats is the biggest competition of the year? Or the skaters trying to qualify for 4CC assignments?

Or skaters trying to get into the top 5 so they get funding.

 

[pointbleu]

I am still confused - if the best and fairest criteria is past scoring and scoring potential - why have a national championship at all? That sounds like it is predetermined and W/M had no chance regardless of how they or anyone else skated.

That’s why it’s called Canadian Nationals and not the Canadian Olympic trials…

 

[manhn]

And in the events with the words "Olympic Trials", sometimes athletes were nonetheless selected to the Olympic team despite their placement at the Olympic Trials. Didn't that happen in US Women's Gymnastics in 2016?

 

[Andora]

Not disagreeing with the Olympic selection, but I think the point here is that W/M don't seem to be treated with respect.

I think the issue is that it very much looks like Skate Canada told/allowed J/R to withdraw and that their trip to Beijing was secure if they did because they wouldn’t have a loss to W\M on their record to go against the Olympic team deliberations.

The whole who hates/loves what skater and why is not relevant.

This is fair - if it's true W&M weren't alerted by Skate Canada about the Olympic team, and if this comment by James in the locker room was malicious and ignored. It's not surprising Skate Canada is still a mess - they've been treading since the cupboards were emptied in 2018, and they didn't seem to handle the panini-curveball well. It's disappointing they're not treating a team that's medaled regularly better. It's further disappointing Vanessa James could potentially be so classless if she made the comment with malicious intent.

Still doesn't change that J&R are the more-correct team to send to the Olympics.

I think Canada's focus is more on trying to get the bronze in the team event. If J/R were to compete there, they'd have a better chance at being helpful than W/M would.

Then again, I wonder what SC's strategy is going to be for the TE? Will they split any events? I can see justification for any of the 3 they're eligible for, but wonder which (if any) they'd choose.

I don't envy this decision. MT&M skated a blinder at Nationals, but... that's the first time all season they've put it down. Can they be trusted with two programs at the Olympics?

I believed this was possible about Mariah Bell when she was accused by a fellow skater of bullying a while back.

I thought it was established that Mariah wasn't bullying Eunsoo Lim? It was, at worst, miscommunication. Or at nefarious-worst, a PR jab from Eunsoo's team that didn't play out.

The amount of vitriol Mariah & her family received online was completely out of line and nothing I'd seen before. Glad that hasn't happened in this situation.

 

[rink_mom]

That’s why it’s called Canadian Nationals and not the Canadian Olympic trials…

Yes and no - on one hand they posted the criteria listed at the beginning of this post and on the other a direct quote from their event page on their website:


"EVENT:

What are  the  2022  Canadian Tire National Skating Championships? 

Approximately 250 skaters in the women’s, men’s, pair and ice dance disciplines will compete at the senior, junior and novice levels at the Canadian Tire National Skating Championships. Athletes will vie for spots on the Skate Canada National Team and the teams that will compete at the 2022 Olympic Winter Games, the 2022 ISU World Figure Skating Championships, the 2022 ISU Four Continents Figure Skating Championships, and the 2022 ISU World Junior Figure Skating Championships."

 

[chantilly]

I have no horse in the race either.

I really think calling Vanessa’s comment in the locker room “bullying” is a stretch.

It could have been arrogance, insensitivity, catty-ness, assuring self talk in the heat of the moment etc. But “bullying” ,as has become a ridiculously over used term in today’s zeitgeist it is not, IMO.

I also agree that the stank of the pairing and how it went down is what is really ticking people off.

There may be more going on behind the scenes that we don’t know about, but it’s pretty clear based on the documents on the SC website posted above that J/R were likely going no matter what happened at Nationals.

I’m actually kind of disappointed in some of the skating alumni/ current competitors comments to be honest.

They should have been aware of the same documents/policies above as they are hardly new to the sport or Skate Canada.

Kurt Browning was given a medical by one, if not two seasons, for Worlds and Olympics if I recall correctly, and Elvis Stojko had to withdraw after attempting to skate due to injury one season at Canadians, if memory serves.

Both represented Canada at Olympics and Worlds.

We are in a global pandemic. Circumstances are new and hard to negotiate.

I’m sure Walsh and Michaud are lovely and hard working but I’ve never been very impressed by them and they are, if they are lucky, on a great day, a top 10 team at best.

I’m also unaware of how Skate Canada informed the team members. I always assumed it was a public announcement and not a private announcement. So I don’t know if Walsh should have expected a private meeting or call?

I don’t know Vanessa or Eric and I certainly side-eyed their choices in how they dealt with their former partners.

But I believe they earned their spot frankly.

But this drama is certainly entertaining!