2022 Four Continents Comes To Rude Euro Land (Relocation to Tallinn)

[MacMadame]

Ummm, didn't US Nationals in 2018 start before the New Year (ie in 2017)?

To correct what someone else said: They did have one Junior event in Dec.

But it was a weird time when USFS was trying to figure out what to do with Juvenile and Intermediate Nationals so I don't think we can use it as a precedent. They aren't starting in Dec. this year and haven't done it any other Olympic years since I've been paying attention ... which is several decades now.

 

[Karen-W]

Came across this article about the cancelation of 4CCs Speed Skating Championships (4CCs Short Track is still on the calendar because it's scheduled for SLC). Notice the last sentence - the ISU expects to have a new location for the figure skating 4CCs by Oct 1st - so, probably we can expect an announcement sometime next week.

Japan cancels Four Continents Speed Skating Championships

The figure skating Four Continents Championships are awaiting a new host city, while the long track speed skating version might not be held at all.

olympics.nbcsports.com

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

Came across this article about the cancelation of 4CCs Speed Skating Championships (4CCs Short Track is still on the calendar because it's scheduled for SLC). Notice the last sentence - the ISU expects to have a new location for the figure skating 4CCs by Oct 1st - so, probably we can expect an announcement sometime next week.

Japan cancels Four Continents Speed Skating Championships

The figure skating Four Continents Championships are awaiting a new host city, while the long track speed skating version might not be held at all.

olympics.nbcsports.com

Who-The-Heck-Knows-Where-Baijan FTW!

 

[Judy]

Canada has a hockey problem - teams won’t want to (and sometimes can’t) leave their arenas on short notice.

When figure skating events are held,
hockey teams have their schedules months in advance and have their games
Scheduled for on the road to allow the figure skating to take place.

It could be held in Hamilton since they don't have a NHL team.

 

[Seerek]

It could be held in Hamilton since they don't have a NHL team.

But The Hamilton Bulldogs of the Ontario Hockey League would have home games at FirstOntario Centre during January.

 

[Parsley Sage]

Hamilton is hosting the World Synchro Championships in April of 2022.

In addition to the Bulldogs, Hamilton also has the Toronto Rock lacrosse team and the Hamilton Honey Badgers of the Canadian Elite Basketball league.

 

[screech]

If it were to be in Canada, I don't foresee it being anywhere outside of Ontario or Quebec, since Canadians are in Ottawa the weekend of January 6, and I doubt SC wants their top skaters to deal with travelling across multiple time zones in such a short period.
If the schedule were able to be slightly tweaked, Paramount Fine Foods Centre in Mississauga would potentially be able to host. There's currently nothing on their schedule from Saturday, January 15 to Thursday, January 20 (there are OHL games on the surrounding Fridays).

With Canadians (and US nationals) that first weekend of January, 4CC originally scheduled the following weekend, and Olympics starting 2 weeks after that, I definitely don't anticipate that we'd see many of the top NA skaters travelling to different time zones leading up to the Olympics.

 

[Coco]

Bridgestone Arena, site of US Nationals, appears to have nothing scheduled from 1/23 - 1/31.

Original 4CC dates were 1/17 - 1/22.

Olympics technically start 2/2, but the opening ceremony is 2/4 with the first skating event (men's, dance & pairs short programs for team event) also on the 4th.

 

[Karen-W]

The ISU made it clear in their announcement of the cancelation that any member feds that wanted to submit an application to host needed to stick with the original dates so Nashville and Mississauga are not going to be offering to host.

Furthermore, for all the griping about skaters not wanting to do 4CCs during an Olympic year because of the short turnaround time between events, moving 4CCs to even closer to the Olympics would be an even greater dealbreaker than it is with it being 2 weeks prior.

I'm quite certain that the dates won't change and that we're going to see somewhere like SCoB or Colorado Springs or Taipei as the host.

 

[screech]

Bridgestone Arena, site of US Nationals, appears to have nothing scheduled from 1/23 - 1/31.

Original 4CC dates were 1/17 - 1/22.

Olympics technically start 2/2, but the opening ceremony is 2/4 with the first skating event (men's, dance & pairs short programs for team event) also on the 4th.

Only thing that worries me about it being so close, is that the skaters will likely want to be in China at least a week or so in advance, so they can adjust to the time zone, and there'll likely be a rink that they can access to practice.

And for some reason I didn't even look at the site of Canadians. TD place is currently completely free between Canadians and mid-February, so 4CC could be held there as well, following the original schedule.

 

[Colonel Green]

Canada hasn't bid on a 4CC (other than the Olympic test event) in almost twenty years, so I wouldn't expect them to start now.

 

[missing]

How much bidding is really going to be required?

It seems to me the ISU is the one in need, not any of the 4 Continents member nations.

 

[Vagabond]

I'm quite certain that the dates won't change and that we're going to see somewhere like SCoB or Colorado Springs or Taipei as the host.

And I would expect that Taipei would love to host the event. The propaganda value of being able to host an event on short notice that China could not, even after years of planning, would be tremendous.

 

[mackiecat]

Really with Covid, who needs large seating, you only need an Olympic Ice rink. In GTA that could be Milton, Downsview, Richmond Hill, Oakville, KW.
in the states there are lots of Olympic rinks too. Why not Ann Arbor? Cleveland, Detroit The place they have Mids every year.

 

[crzesk8dad]

Really with *********, who needs large seating, you only need an Olympic Ice rink. In GTA that could be Milton, Downsview, Richmond Hill, Oakville, KW.
in the states there are lots of Olympic rinks too. Why not Ann Arbor? Cleveland, Detroit The place they have Mids every year.

I don't believe an OLY sheet is required for 4CC. Anaheim hosted it on an NHL sheet, where the Ducks play.

 

[crzesk8dad]

Came across this article about the cancelation of 4CCs Speed Skating Championships (4CCs Short Track is still on the calendar because it's scheduled for SLC). Notice the last sentence - the ISU expects to have a new location for the figure skating 4CCs by Oct 1st - so, probably we can expect an announcement sometime next week.

Japan cancels Four Continents Speed Skating Championships

The figure skating Four Continents Championships are awaiting a new host city, while the long track speed skating version might not be held at all.

olympics.nbcsports.com

I wonder why Speed Skating 4CC isn't being held at the SLC oval? I doubt there would be a conflicting event.

 

[mackiecat]

I don't believe an OLY sheet is required for 4CC. Anaheim hosted it on an NHL sheet, where the Ducks play.

Great then there are way more options!

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

I don't believe an OLY sheet is required for 4CC. Anaheim hosted it on an NHL sheet, where the Ducks play.

Relieved that Midori Ito never skated on NHL ice when she competed as an eligible skater for obvious reasons in 1991.

Don't put baby in the lutz corner!

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

I'm still amazed that Moscow was able to host the 2011 World Championships with such a short turnaround time. They really put on a great event for everyone involved.

Four Continents is going to be a challenge. Especially in an Olympic year.

A lot of the top tier skaters scheduled to compete at the games, tend to skip it. Having to peak twice (or three times if they are in the OG team event) with what is essentially two weeks of competition back to back, and the extra amount of travel involved.

Now of course, quarantine restrictions would add an extra level of preparation for everyone going, too.

 

[On My Own]

And I would expect that Taipei would love to host the event. The propaganda value of being able to host an event on short notice that China could not, even after years of planning, would be tremendous.

While I want the 4CCs to stay in Asia... I really doubt they'd ditch any preventive measures they have in place for "propaganda value".

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

And I would expect that Taipei would love to host the event. The propaganda value of being able to host an event on short notice that China could not, even after years of planning, would be tremendous.

As beautiful as the facility looks, it's always a bit sad when that 25,000 seat venue seems to only attract about 300 spectators to the competition.

I think a more intimate space like the new Boston Ice Arena in Norwood or somewhere similar in size would have a much better atmosphere as well.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

While I want the 4CCs to stay in Asia... I really doubt they'd ditch any preventive measures they have in place for "propaganda value".

Exactly!

 

[screech]

Wherever it ends up, if they want to have the top North American skaters even consider participating, it'll either need to be in or near the same time zones as US Nationals/Canadians due to the quick turnaround, or it will need to be in or near the same time zone as the Olympics. Otherwise it will be the 'second tier' NA skaters.

 

[Colonel Green]

Wherever it ends up, if they want to have the top North American skaters even consider participating, it'll either need to be in or near the same time zones as US Nationals/Canadians due to the quick turnaround, or it will need to be in or near the same time zone as the Olympics. Otherwise it will be the 'second tier' NA skaters.

I doubt that’s a consideration — they know the top North Americans won’t be going.

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

Wherever it ends up, if they want to have the top North American skaters even consider participating, it'll either need to be in or near the same time zones as US Nationals/Canadians due to the quick turnaround, or it will need to be in or near the same time zone as the Olympics. Otherwise it will be the 'second tier' NA skaters.

Looking at the entrants for 2018, 2014, and 2010, some of the bigger names scheduled to compete in that year's Olympics, skipped out.

 

[Vagabond]

While I want the 4CCs to stay in Asia... I really doubt they'd ditch any preventive measures they have in place for "propaganda value".

As far as I can tell, Taiwan's YKW restrictions are no more stringent than those in Canada and the U.S., yet no one hee is suggesting that those countries would need to "ditch" any preventive measures.

As beautiful as the facility looks, it's always a bit sad when that 25,000 seat venue seems to only attract about 300 spectators to the competition.

I think a more intimate space like the new Boston Ice Arena in Norwood or somewhere similar in size would have a much better atmosphere as well.

A 25,000-seat venue with about 300 spectators is safer than a more intimate space with that many spectators or more, no?

 

[On My Own]

As far as I can tell, Taiwan's YKW restrictions are no more stringent than those in Canada and the U.S., yet no one hee is suggesting that those countries would need to "ditch" any preventive measures.

That is on the people who suggested those countries. However, I do take exception to seeing an Asian country being used to make a point like this.

Why do you think Taiwan cares so little about its people that it will take this up to make a point and establish propaganda value?

Or are people next going to suggest Japan should take it up just to show it's better than China?

Or am I going to see the suggestion that the Americans who want the US for 4CCs also only want to one-up China, and don't care about Americans and what COVID has done to the US?

Or are only Asian countries filled with bickering, squabbling troglodytes, with no interest in their people in favour of some perceived nonsense about their politics?

 

[Vagabond]

Entire post

Chill out. I was just making an observation.

This thread has been full of posts about how the competition should be reassigned to a North American city to accommodate skaters based in North America, yet no one has discussed the inconvenience of such a change on skaters based in Asia. Why is that?

 

[Foolhardy Ham Lint]

As far as I can tell, Taiwan's YKW restrictions are no more stringent than those in Canada and the U.S., yet no one hee is suggesting that those countries would need to "ditch" any preventive measures.

A 25,000-seat venue with about 300 spectators is safer than a more intimate space with that many spectators or more, no?

Certainly in terms of COVID-19 distancing and safety, which is absolutely paramount.

But zero points for atmosphere.

 

[missing]

Chill out. I was just making an observation.

This thread has been full of posts about how the competition should be reassigned to a North American city to acccommodate skaters based in North , yet no one has discussed the inconvenience of such a change on skaters based in Asia. Why is that?

On the assumption that is not a rhetorical question, I can think of a couple of answers.

First of all this is a primarily English language message board with a large percentage of its members people who live in North America (presumably the members who live in Europe are less invested in this issue, since Europeans is a separate competition). On an Asian based figure skating message board, I'm sure the responses would be more heavily skewed to concerns about Asian skaters.

Secondly, it was an Asian country that created the problem. The most recent time that happened, a European country stepped in to volunteer holding the competition, but it's generally agreed that European countries are not the solution for a non-European skating event (although it might be amusing one year to hold Europeans in a 4 Continents country and 4 Continents in a European country just to see who complains the loudest).

One reason (not the only one) people root for certain athletes is because of shared nationality. If you root for an athlete, you want the best for them. 4 Continents is rarely the best for all its participating athletes so it's always the cause of much grousing. This year, an Olympic year, the desire for favored athletes to have the best possible conditions is even stronger, and the uncertainty caused by the need to change venues is felt even more deeply.