Debi Thomas interview in NY Post

Yazmeen

All we are saying, is give peace a chance
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OK, not exactly the Times, but still.

As a fellow physician, I'm reading here about a woman who has been diagnosed as bipolar, now declaring herself to not need meds and who hasn't even had a real physical exam and overall medical care in 20 years. For the record, I've read enough about her tenure as a physician to realize she was damn near a nightmare to work with; basically, it was Debi's way or the highway.

But she's a "visionary." This is beyond sad.:(

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost...-olympian-lost-everything-even-her-medal/amp/
 
Did she have a different story about losing the medal the last time she was in the spotlight? (I swear she said she lost it in a move.)
 
OK, not exactly the Times, but still.

As a fellow physician, I'm reading here about a woman who has been diagnosed as bipolar, now declaring herself to not need meds and who hasn't even had a real physical exam and overall medical care in 20 years. For the record, I've read enough about her tenure as a physician to realize she was damn near a nightmare to work with; basically, it was Debi's way or the highway.

But she's a "visionary." This is beyond sad.:(

https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost...-olympian-lost-everything-even-her-medal/amp/

It is so hard for me to wrap my head around her life and choices. She spent so many years dedicated to become a world champion figure skater. And then finished medical school and a male-dominated specialty residency. She "should've" been set. But now she's a hypnotist and MLM-advocate, refusing to believe she has a disorder that can be mitigated by therapy and medication.

I'm a female ER attending who oversees our ER residency program. In the military no less. I think about how hard I worked in med school and how difficult my six years of residency and fellowship (though honestly the fellowship was great). I can't imagine throwing that away without a fight.
 
It is so hard for me to wrap my head around her life and choices. She spent so many years dedicated to become a world champion figure skater. And then finished medical school and a male-dominated specialty residency. She "should've" been set. But now she's a hypnotist and MLM-advocate, refusing to believe she has a disorder that can be mitigated by therapy and medication.

I'm a female ER attending who oversees our ER residency program. In the military no less. I think about how hard I worked in med school and how difficult my six years of residency and fellowship (though honestly the fellowship was great). I can't imagine throwing that away without a fight.

Untreated bipolar disorder can probably be as hard to live with as untreated major depression, schitzophrenia etc. No one would wonder why seriously depressed or psychotic person would quit succesful career. Plus bipolar disorder can have psychotic episodes as well. One can't make rational choices when the rational part of the brain is being hammered by a disease messing with your thought processes, similar to tumors.
 
As a fellow physician, I'm reading here about a woman who has been diagnosed as bipolar
The article says Debi Thomas has been diagnosed as bipolar, but Debi Thomas herself said in film footage a few years ago that she had been diagnosed with "mood disorder not otherwise specified." I'm inclined to believe Thomas rather than The New York Post on this one.
 
I fully appreciate what you're saying, and agree with it in principle. We can't make people take meds or go to therapy if they don't want to, as long as they are not a danger to themselves/others and are not gravely disabled.

I am thinking more specifically for Debi. Typical onset of bipolar is age 20-25. I'm just having trouble wrapping my head around training for the Olympics, university, medical school, and residency and somewhere in there the beginnings of bipolar behavior (or whatever mood disorder NOS she has).
 
Did anyone here see the Calgary 88 documentary? I saw in the preview that she described herself as an "all or nothing" type, and she admitted years ago that she gave up when she two-footed the second jump of her combination in the Olympic free skate because she knew she wouldn't have a perfect skate. Any insights from the documentary?
 
Did anyone here see the Calgary 88 documentary? I saw in the preview that she described herself as an "all or nothing" type, and she admitted years ago that she gave up when she two-footed the second jump of her combination in the Olympic free skate because she knew she wouldn't have a perfect skate. Any insights from the documentary?

There is a brief interview with Peggy Fleming where Debi said that at a certain point in her free skate, it wasn't fun any more, and all she wanted to do, was leave the ice.
 
I truly pray that she gets help. Bipolar is a disease that needs to be treated. It doesn't need to be neglected like that. My brother's ex-girlfriend had Mental Depression and was also Bipolar. Whenever she forgot to take her meds, she would just lie in bed and would say that she didn't care about living.

My brother didn't understand at all. Her doctor asked for my brother to come with her to her next appointment so he could explain a few things to him. Her doctor told my brother that both Mental Depression and being Bipolar were illnesses that had to be treated with medications that were taken on a regular basis. She also has Social Security Disability because of Depression and being Bipolar which is considered a disease or illness.

I don't know if Debi even realizes it, but she may qualify for Social Security Disability, and could get help through Medicare and even Medicaid to get the medicines she needs.
 
You need an excellent support system around a person with bipolar and without it success is not likely. It is not curable but is somewhat treatable but this guy she is not a good thing. She is likely not capable of making rational decisions which also likely led to the end of her medical career. I knew a teacher that came down with it later in life and even on meds he is not that stable. His marriage broke up so I am certain he is not taking the meds properly but it destroyed his career too. I am not saying this is always the case but she obviously was a talented skater and smart enough for a medical career so this is just very sad.
 
I think one of the things that makes Debi's story so sad is that she at one point seemed like a model for other skaters for how to accomplish a lot competitively but also set yourself up for a life after skating. She is the last person I expected to struggle so much - it's really heartbreaking.
 
My heart goes out to Debi.

I remembering Debi mentioning, maybe a decade ago, that one of the hardest realizations that she ever had was that it would have been more financially beneficial for her to skate than be an MD because of the reimbursement structure. However, by that time, the skating boom and her best show skating years were over.

Since Debi had no debt after Med School, I wish somebody had told her that, rather than push herself to the limit as any kind of surgeon, she could have dabbled in internal medicine and sports medicine for 40 years, working only 12 days a month, and been financially fine with little stress and an interesting panel of patients.

It is unfortunate that bipolar disorder started to express itself. This is not a condition easily fixed, and the support necessary is often socially and financially expensive.
 
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There are so many good ideas here.
If she can qualify for Social Security Disability, get her bipolar under control, maybe go back as a part-time doctor, or physician consultant, she can start to live a normal life again.
Better yet, if get help and fixes her problem, she could probably be a role model and celebrity all over again. For that, she will need a good agent and therapist on standby to make sure she didn't go off the rails again.
 
Thanks to @Sylvia for the link to the Calgary 88 documentary. Watched it over lunch today.

And it really told me a lot about Debi Thomas and how she ended up where she is. She truly was an all or nothing type. I know a lot of fans here never cared for her coach, but good grief, I honestly felt sorry for the guy at some points watching that. She simply was difficult, sometimes flat out unpleasant to be around, and wanted to do things her way, period.

One of the things I remember reading in more recent articles about her history in the medical profession is that she got fired at least twice and constantly butted heads with her medical colleagues - the doctor who offered her a prestigious fellowship described her as expecting to be treated like a star and arguing with everything he tried to get her to do - he finally said he could not work with her. Having been both in a medical practice and as a physician employee in a charitable-based hospital, the simple fact is that you cannot make it as a doctor if you don't make a concerted effort to work as part of the team - with other physicians, nurses/NPs, pharmacists, every other professional in the medical arena. Medicine is a multidisciplinary and interprofessional field - you could maybe go it alone as a country doctor decades ago, but with the explosion in technology and diagnostics and treatments, even if you maintain a solo practice, you have to be able to work with others to be successful and be happy. She picked a difficult, high tech field (that frankly was often hostile to women), and it seems like she expected everyone to do things her way from the moment go. Was she a good doctor? I'll bet she really was in the respect that she cared about her patients. But was she also a colossal pain in the ass? Looks that way, and I've seen really good physicians fired or "resign" based on their inability to play well with others, no matter how "visionary" they are. My own hospital fired a top surgeon after he threw a tray of tools, including sharps, at a nurse who angered him. He was one of the best minds and hands in his field, but no way were they putting up with that. Debi definitely had problems; per an earlier article on her, medical board records showed "concerns of an ongoing pattern of disciplinary and behavior issues and poor judgment."

I don't know for sure if she's bipolar but she really does appear to have at the least some form of personality disorder or other mental illness/mood disorder. And she basically is doing nothing about it, having now deemed the entire medical profession untrustworthy. And honestly, it's just a sad situation. One of the most heartbreaking things in that documentary was seeing her meet up with her son after one of his college football games, and she just hung on to him like he was a life preserver, whereas his reaction to her was very measured; not cold, but not very warm either. I hope she can be happy in her life, but right now she seems to be a duck on the water - trying to appear calm and cool on the surface, but paddling like mad underneath.
 
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I feel for Debi and hope she seeks professional help even though she feels she doesn't need it. On a side note, has anyone noticed her spouse/boyfriend's last name is Looney?
 
I'm surprised no one mentioned this from the interview:

“The difference between Olympians and average people is that we’re willing to do things that others aren’t,” she said. “We’re willing to look at something and do that work, no matter how long or hard.”

If that's really her attitude, I bet she was really condescending towards the people she worked with on top of everything else.
 
She always says she doesn't care what other people think, but I think she has a crippling fear of failure on top of her mental health problems.
I see this in a friend of mine who's suffered for at least a decade with personality disorders. I think that crippling fear of failure is what's truly holding my friend back from getting help and committing wholly to it - she's done therapy for years and I think it's helping to keep her afloat day-to-day. But I don't see a lot of long-term progress in her personal or professional life since I've known her (5 years now), and she's obsessed with being "successful" in both. So obsessed, that anything she perceives as a slight at work suddenly means everyone hates her and she has to quit after stewing for months in her fear and anger. (Sure toxic workplaces can happen, but if someone has been in the white-collar workforce for more than 5 years and has never been anywhere for longer than 3-4 months without being miserable.... :shuffle: ) And that if the guys interested in her (and there are quite a few who I've seen approach her first-hand) aren't rich and handsome, that they're "creepers" and she doesn't even acknowledge them when bemoaning her singleness. It's literally all or nothing.

It's really unfortunate when someone can't let go of that, when that fear of failure is holding them back from everything they might want. But it's really up to them to decide that they want it badly enough, that going after it might mean trying something and failing.

It's almost shocking to me, how far I'm come in 5 years with no experience to where I am now, and her circling the same place over again. (We're not going after the same jobs, but we're in the same general industry.) There have been multiple times where I've wanted to shake her and say, "I spent the weekend volunteering and making great professional connections, while you stewed in your anger about how nothing is going your way!" But I'm learning to let her go. She has to live her own life.

We have to assume that the friends and family around such people are doing their best, but they have to let go too. We can't make them want change.
 
I'm surprised no one mentioned this from the interview:

“The difference between Olympians and average people is that we’re willing to do things that others aren’t,” she said. “We’re willing to look at something and do that work, no matter how long or hard.”

If that's really her attitude, I bet she was really condescending towards the people she worked with on top of everything else.

Yeah, this is not an exclusive characteristic of someone that happened to play a sport that is included in the Olympics. I would think she encountered many on her way to becoming an MD with that characteristic that did not go to the Olympics because they had other interests.
 
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There are so many good ideas here.
If she can qualify for Social Security Disability, get her bipolar under control, maybe go back as a part-time doctor, or physician consultant, she can start to live a normal life again.
Better yet, if get help and fixes her problem, she could probably be a role model and celebrity all over again. For that, she will need a good agent and therapist on standby to make sure she didn't go off the rails again.
And she would qualify for Social Security Disability. She's 50 years old and has been diagnosed as being Bipolar. She worked for years as a medical physician. If she had Social Security Disablility, she would also be able to afford her meds and her doctor visits because she would either have Medicare, Medicaid or both. She could also get a Medicare Advantage Plan with Extra help and the Medicare Savings Plan that would practically pay the whole amount for prescription drugs. It may also pay her whole premium for Medicare Part B.

The thing is she's got to realize that she needs care and help with being Bipolar. She's got to realize that it's a disease that isn't going away. Maybe then she'll apply for Disability, but that may be a long time away since she doesn't think she needs help with it.
 

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